Newbie 2047: Eggskalon - Game Over

[Paopao]

to catboi-

"If marcistar does end up coming up as scum, I believe that you are the most likely her partner, as you are the only person hard defending her, or really defending her in general. There is no one, from what I have read that has defended marcistar other than you."

It is because you are hard defending her?? I have kept restating that in my first paragraph so many times? How is that not explained? I'm not trying to throw away your explanation, but mafia tend to defend their partners, and if she ends up being town, my thoughts will most likely change towards you (sorry I didn't notice I didn't put that in my paragraph), as I believe Ninetales is the most scummiest player right now from my previous posts. I would rather vote for them, but I don't feel like the others will switch their votes onto Ninetales. Ninetales doesn't bother trying to help town out (u can read my previous post on why.) and the way they respond just doesn't seem like a town player.

Even though I know how marcistar usually plays, I am not going to bring in her past games that we played together. I don't want to use Meta, as the reason why I stopped playing discord mafia was due to meta gameplay.

[Paopao]

I also do wonder tho, why is catboi scum in any scenario of my flip to you pao? That looks like a bit of tunneling tbh.. you know, the thing you hate about the other mafia game we play together?

I'm not trying to tunnel onto catboi, but if you flip scum I will tunnel into him, as it's so scummy for defending scum? Is it not?

I would rather have a lynch onto Ninetales, but other then you and me, no one else is really talking about them.

[catboi]

It is because you are hard defending her?? I have kept restating that in my first paragraph so many times? How is that not explained? I'm not trying to throw away your explanation, but mafia tend to defend their partners, and if she ends up being town, my thoughts will most likely change towards you (sorry I didn't notice I didn't put that in my paragraph), as I believe Ninetales is the most scummiest player right now from my previous posts. I would rather vote for them, but I don't feel like the others will switch their votes onto Ninetales. Ninetales doesn't bother trying to help town out (u can read my previous post on why.) and the way they respond just doesn't seem like a town player.

Even though I know how marcistar usually plays, I am not going to bring in her past games that we played together. I don't want to use Meta, as the reason why I stopped playing discord mafia was due to meta gameplay.

Your post seemed to imply that I was scummy regardless of what marcistar flips. In 89 you wrote:

If Marcistar comes up town:
Catboi and Ninetales are together. (I personally belive those two are the most scummy)

. This seemed to imply some reason for scumreading me independent of marcistar. If it's based solely on the possibility of her being scum, okay. I'm willing to take the blame if she is scum, but right now I see that as fairly unlikely.

There are a lot of days left in this phase, you don't need to necessarily compromise just yet. If you think ninetales is still most likely to be scum, keep trying to push that. I don't really see that read either, but my disagreement isn't as strong, and I understand your suspicion there, at least.

I can understand not liking meta, some people here hate it (I don't mind it), but seeing as how some of the arguments were based on her own self-meta I thought it was fair game to ask for some verification. You also didn't answer all my questions with regard to the people voting marcistar:

I've provided plenty of reasoning for why I'm defending marcistar as well, but you seem to be ignoring that. Are all those people just supposed to be town just for providing reasoning? Scum can fake reasoning too, the game would be incredibly easy if only people who voted without reasoning were mafia. Do you agree with all of their reasoning? What about marcistar's response to their arguments? You two seem to have some familiarity with each other, is her own self-description of how she plays accurate? Are people being unfair or is she legitimately suspicious?

Like I said: do you like the reasoning they gave for voting her? Do you agree with it or not?

[Ninetales]

Townies appeal to emotion and get defeatist all the time. I find the statements from her far more likely to be defeatist newb-town than scum. You say you've played on MU but never seen a town player act defeatist?

I have but I find for newbies, scum do this more.

[Ninetales]

For the last time.

I noticed something strange from pao. I pointed it out because it is strange but considering this is a newbie game, I merely pointed it out for future reference. I never specifically called pao scum because I kept that in mind.

Then I voted someone else.

There is nothing wrong with what I did and repeatedly suggesting that there is something so terribly wrong with it is extremely annoying considering I have explained it multiple times.

The part that I'm unwilling to say doesn't really have much to do with anything because I never specifically "sussed" you in the first place.

[LoneMarkhor]

I think Not Mafia is the most likely to be mafia.He has been acting insane since the beginning. Its like'Let the town fight among themselves.'
Marcistar: You are voting me but you are ignoring Not_Mafia.What should I think of that?
Most likely partners are paopao or marcistar but I am not sure about that yet.

[LoneMarkhor]

Marcistar has been acting scummy but I think she might just be newb town.

[Pickles]

VOTE: Unvote
So I did that thing again where I forget I’m playing MS game..
I’m feeling overwhelmed by how the thread descended.
Thinking my best option here is to make a reads list.
Even though I have no idea if people to that around here.
I’m going to be ISO diving to do that.

For now, I’ll say this - I personally like the feel of catboi and marc.
And dislike the vibes of Nine and Chum.
But we’ll see if that changes after I dive into reads.
Should take me less than an hour?

[Chumbo]

I want to believe 12 was a legitimate question from a town player with pure intentions, and not something an inexperienced player would come up with on the spot as a trick to try to get townread.

I was thinking the same thing.

muh316, I agree with you on marcistar looking like she's rolefishing. I've been trying to figure out whether it's intentional or not. There was also the post she made where she was asking if the titles were the roles, which could easily make a newer player say something about their role. Nice catch with the contradiction.

Lol, haha, I get it, probably better not to right now, actually

It's not helping the town if you're hiding your thoughts.

I see catboi's post as damage prevention. Think about what Ninetails said and you'll see it goes along with your criticism of marci.

If I had to call a scumteam right now, I'd call it as marcistar and Ninetails. That's just a guess that's way too early though. I already thought marcistar looked scummy, but then Ninetails mentioning that his vote on marci was just an RVS vote made me think it could be distancing.
This is all very early speculation and I find it hard to believe that both scumplayers would try rolefishing.

I have a soft-town read on catboi, but that's just gut.

How do you go from one of these to the other here? This is just blatant opportunism, and I really don't like the reasoning. The idea that a newbie scum player is going to immediately attempt to rolefish is absurd, that's not a strategy most newer scum players are aware of, let alone one that most would attempt to do early. This is ascribing a buzzword wikitell to what is much more likely confused newbie town. Further, I don't really buy seeing a marci/ninetales team at all, newbscum rarely interact the way those two have. Most newbie scum tend to be very cautious about interacting with their partner, and there's none of that in how they speak to each other. I don't like this post at all.

VOTE: Chumbo

I read your first post quoted here as you being skeptical. "I want to believe" translated to me as you will be looking more closely at her in the future. I didn't think you meant you meant that you're just going to accept post 12 as definite newbtown. I apparently misunderstood you.

You do make a good point about new players probably not using rolefishing right away though. I still think that newer players might be hyper-aware of how much they talk to their partner though and that that could result in either not talking at all or overtalking.
What do you think of Ninetails?

[LoneMarkhor]

Marcistar is acting like she's never played mafia before,even though she said that she had played it before.

I have played mafia before, but never really in such a forum format.. all of the quotes and stuff on the forums here is very new to me. I hope im quoting not useless things here.

Why does everyone think im overplaying the newbie strat?

I just genuinely didnt know what ninetales cryptic thing about pao was meant to be.

No I wasn't talking about that.What ninetales was saying wasn't that hard to figure.I mean I have played no more than one game of FM but I figured it out.If you are town you should not be discussing that.I think he was talking about paopao being Power Role.You should not be discussing that because mafia would get information about PowerRole.

[Pickles]

Okay so I’m doing read according to post order.
Starting with who posted first progressively until last.
It’s pretty sweet how you can use the ISO on this site.
Far more mainstreamed than my normal site.
We’ve gotta go back to the OP for ISOs there..

Read legend-

Town Lean

NULL/mixed

Scum Lean

Reads so far

muh316

- They feel natural entering the thread. They pointed out a contradiction about how many games marc has played, this felt town motivated to me. I don’t believe the contradiction from marc was AI though, because they’ve played Discord Mafia which is a different type of Mafia (more fast paced). I really enjoyed most of the posts from muh316, they’re attempting to game solve and scum hunt. They also don’t want a quick vote to happen which makes me feel they would like to progress discussion further rather than shorten the day.

marcistar

- I felt like the post everyone is disagreeing about (#12) would be more indicative of town. The people who are SRing that post, do you believe marc was trying to get easy town cred? The worst the post would be is NAI because marc is new to the site. I just don’t see a scum even saying something like they did. Something I liked was their response 34 to the question Chumbo asked about hammer with time left in day. That response felt very town sided as far as thought process. When Ninetales showed up, I felt like marc was as confused as their friend pao and decided to voice that. It’s doubtful that’s going to come from a newb scum as they would just let it play out rather than draw attention. Next they tried to explain to Nine that they hope Nine becomes more townie, and I agree they haven’t been yet. All of these post felt very townie to me, and the following AtE could come from any alignment if we’re gonna be technical. Especially since there’s no way to gauge meta of new players.

catboi

- First post feels natural, but they’re SE so it should? Didn’t really like their opinion on NotMafia, mostly because I just disagree with an SE playing the way that NotMaf is playing as it’s not beneficial in teaching newer players the game. But I did like their next post about marc, I vibed with those feelings (shown above in marc read). The interrogation of Chumbo felt like it came from town perspective and I agreed with the reasoning against Chumbo flipping their stance so suddenly/opportunistically. This feels like they’re attempting to catch people acting out of the ordinary. They also voiced not wanting a quick vote to happen which indicated they would like day to continue for discussion. It’s honestly very early to be reaching a hammer. Also really liked post 102 in response to pao, they encourage pao to push on SRs and analyze the game which could only push the game forward. Side note- I do want to keep an eye on them though because of the possibility (tinfoil) WK because of TMI if marc is town.

Paopao

- When they posted their confusion about town/scum under names, it felt identical to the way marc did it. So for me it felt townie and at worst NAI. They seemed to share a genuine confusion and concern about their inquiry. I personally also like their question to Ninetales about their vote. It felt genuine and in search of explanation for reasoning behind a vote that would have felt more natural on Paopao than marc. Why would scum ever draw attention to

not

being voted??? Them asking Nine would come from a more townie perspective than scum. If they were scum wouldn’t they just not care that Nine voted marc instead of them? Pao as scum could have just ignored that rather than asking why the vote wasn’t for them instead. Ah, now I’ve reached the point in their ISO that pinged as slightly scummy. All of a sudden, Pao is now SRing marc during post 89 with absolutely no reasoning provided and not having SR marc prior. It almost felt like they just wanted to divert the attention off themselves and onto others (NotMaf/Nine/marc/catboi) which would be something scum has motivation to do. And this post came after a vote on Ninetales and was in response to LoneMarkhor voting NotMaf and SRing marc. This felt like it came at a convenient time for scum to make that play rather than from a townie trying to help out. Posts 94 and 100 in response to catboi felt like they were acknowledging their vote on marc was sheeping other people’s opinions and had very circular logic.I’ll have to keep trying to read those posts because they didn’t feel right. For all the mixed reasons, pao is null for now.

Not_Mafia

- They only have four very un-useful posts. As an SE I would expect a little more effort. I would just keep them at NULL but I don’t like that they’re not appearing to help town. They’re in the position of slight power by having more experience and they aren’t using it. I would like to see some content from them soon. Or I’ll assume they’re expecting newb players to just let them slide by with zero effort and that’s probably NAI, but it could also be opportunistic scum.

Chumbo

- They enter thread with a joke and then appeared to agree with catboi about post 12 during post 33 which also contained the question about hammering early. I’m not sure if the question itself can be viewed as AI or not, but answered could be. So I’ll count this as town motivated for now because it’s analyzing what other players mindsets are. Their next post 67 seemed to have a town perspective trying to gauge where Ninetales was coming from, but this could also be viewed as slight shade against Ninetales. When I first read their following posts about marc, I originally agreed with catboi about them, because it seemed they flipped their opinion very easily. But upon a second glance, they gave solid reasoning and had never actually TR marc and now has said they didn’t count it as a town slip from marc in the way that catboi did. So because I have reasons for feeling both alignments are possible here, I’m gonna keep this slot NULL for now.

[Pickles]

Welp.. hit submit instead of preview there.
The buttons are opposite what I’m used to for that.
Almost done with reads.
Two left.

[Pickles]

Last Two Reads

LoneMarkhor

- They joked around a lot early game, possibly nervous, possibly meming. The first post that felt real was 82 which felt like another townie trying to keep discussion alive longer than a couple IRL days for day one. Post 105and106 felt kind of strange and off putting with them saying in the first post that NotMaf is scum with marc ignoring that fact so they’re partners. Then in the same post saying marc and pao are more likely partners for reasons they also don’t know. Then in the next post they backtrack and say marc is likely newb town which could be as a fallback for when she flips town. Possible TMI. Then claims if you’re town you would know what Ninetales was hinting and that you shouldn’t press the matter. Then goes on to describe it had to do with roll fishing. Now, I’ve played a lot of games off site and I had NO IDEA it started as a roll fishing situation because no town power roles were even mentioned. Just town/scum. I was as confused about what Nine was implying as marc and pao were, I just wasn’t here to comment on it. I don’t like these vibes right now so I’m gonna go with gut here.

Ninetales

- The progression they don’t have really hurts my head. They seem to be all over the place as soon as they arrive. Very chaotic. They SR pao and think marc is NAI, but vote marc saying it’s a RVS vote. Then as things progress, they’re vote becomes a legit one with SR on marc for unknown reasons? Then they backtrack on the SR for pao and claim they never said they actually SR them just made observation. The whole ISO is very fence sitting, can’t actually make any true opinions. I haven’t seen anything that indicates town from their posts. I’ll go as far as to say this is my highest SR currently.

[Not_Mafia]

VOTE: muh316

[LoneMarkhor]

Why I think Marcistar is scum partner with not_mafia is because she voted me for not being so active but ignored not_mafia.Pao because of the post where he said he doesn't believe no_mafia is scum.But then I remembered that many other players are also not noticing not_mafia so I realized I was wrong.

[LoneMarkhor]

N_M why vote muh316?

[LoneMarkhor]

LoneMarkhor

- They joked around a lot early game, possibly nervous, possibly meming.

I know I am a bad joker but I just can't stop trying.

[LoneMarkhor]

I feel we should sort out not_mafia first if that's his play style or something.Idk if he'll get any serious. I think scum use D1
for townies to get eliminated as in the end only they get suspected because the scum are just trying to not get suspected.

[Ninetales]

Okay so I’m doing read according to post order.
Starting with who posted first progressively until last.
It’s pretty sweet how you can use the ISO on this site.
Far more mainstreamed than my normal site.
We’ve gotta go back to the OP for ISOs there..

Read legend-

Town Lean

NULL/mixed

Scum Lean

Reads so far

muh316

- They feel natural entering the thread. They pointed out a contradiction about how many games marc has played, this felt town motivated to me. I don’t believe the contradiction from marc was AI though, because they’ve played Discord Mafia which is a different type of Mafia (more fast paced). I really enjoyed most of the posts from muh316, they’re attempting to game solve and scum hunt. They also don’t want a quick vote to happen which makes me feel they would like to progress discussion further rather than shorten the day.

marcistar

- I felt like the post everyone is disagreeing about (#12) would be more indicative of town. The people who are SRing that post, do you believe marc was trying to get easy town cred? The worst the post would be is NAI because marc is new to the site. I just don’t see a scum even saying something like they did. Something I liked was their response 34 to the question Chumbo asked about hammer with time left in day. That response felt very town sided as far as thought process. When Ninetales showed up, I felt like marc was as confused as their friend pao and decided to voice that. It’s doubtful that’s going to come from a newb scum as they would just let it play out rather than draw attention. Next they tried to explain to Nine that they hope Nine becomes more townie, and I agree they haven’t been yet. All of these post felt very townie to me, and the following AtE could come from any alignment if we’re gonna be technical. Especially since there’s no way to gauge meta of new players.

catboi

- First post feels natural, but they’re SE so it should? Didn’t really like their opinion on NotMafia, mostly because I just disagree with an SE playing the way that NotMaf is playing as it’s not beneficial in teaching newer players the game. But I did like their next post about marc, I vibed with those feelings (shown above in marc read). The interrogation of Chumbo felt like it came from town perspective and I agreed with the reasoning against Chumbo flipping their stance so suddenly/opportunistically. This feels like they’re attempting to catch people acting out of the ordinary. They also voiced not wanting a quick vote to happen which indicated they would like day to continue for discussion. It’s honestly very early to be reaching a hammer. Also really liked post 102 in response to pao, they encourage pao to push on SRs and analyze the game which could only push the game forward. Side note- I do want to keep an eye on them though because of the possibility (tinfoil) WK because of TMI if marc is town.

Paopao

- When they posted their confusion about town/scum under names, it felt identical to the way marc did it. So for me it felt townie and at worst NAI. They seemed to share a genuine confusion and concern about their inquiry. I personally also like their question to Ninetales about their vote. It felt genuine and in search of explanation for reasoning behind a vote that would have felt more natural on Paopao than marc. Why would scum ever draw attention to

not

being voted??? Them asking Nine would come from a more townie perspective than scum. If they were scum wouldn’t they just not care that Nine voted marc instead of them? Pao as scum could have just ignored that rather than asking why the vote wasn’t for them instead. Ah, now I’ve reached the point in their ISO that pinged as slightly scummy. All of a sudden, Pao is now SRing marc during post 89 with absolutely no reasoning provided and not having SR marc prior. It almost felt like they just wanted to divert the attention off themselves and onto others (NotMaf/Nine/marc/catboi) which would be something scum has motivation to do. And this post came after a vote on Ninetales and was in response to LoneMarkhor voting NotMaf and SRing marc. This felt like it came at a convenient time for scum to make that play rather than from a townie trying to help out. Posts 94 and 100 in response to catboi felt like they were acknowledging their vote on marc was sheeping other people’s opinions and had very circular logic.I’ll have to keep trying to read those posts because they didn’t feel right. For all the mixed reasons, pao is null for now.

Not_Mafia

- They only have four very un-useful posts. As an SE I would expect a little more effort. I would just keep them at NULL but I don’t like that they’re not appearing to help town. They’re in the position of slight power by having more experience and they aren’t using it. I would like to see some content from them soon. Or I’ll assume they’re expecting newb players to just let them slide by with zero effort and that’s probably NAI, but it could also be opportunistic scum.

Chumbo

- They enter thread with a joke and then appeared to agree with catboi about post 12 during post 33 which also contained the question about hammering early. I’m not sure if the question itself can be viewed as AI or not, but answered could be. So I’ll count this as town motivated for now because it’s analyzing what other players mindsets are. Their next post 67 seemed to have a town perspective trying to gauge where Ninetales was coming from, but this could also be viewed as slight shade against Ninetales. When I first read their following posts about marc, I originally agreed with catboi about them, because it seemed they flipped their opinion very easily. But upon a second glance, they gave solid reasoning and had never actually TR marc and now has said they didn’t count it as a town slip from marc in the way that catboi did. So because I have reasons for feeling both alignments are possible here, I’m gonna keep this slot NULL for now.

Last Two Reads

LoneMarkhor

- They joked around a lot early game, possibly nervous, possibly meming. The first post that felt real was 82 which felt like another townie trying to keep discussion alive longer than a couple IRL days for day one. Post 105and106 felt kind of strange and off putting with them saying in the first post that NotMaf is scum with marc ignoring that fact so they’re partners. Then in the same post saying marc and pao are more likely partners for reasons they also don’t know. Then in the next post they backtrack and say marc is likely newb town which could be as a fallback for when she flips town. Possible TMI. Then claims if you’re town you would know what Ninetales was hinting and that you shouldn’t press the matter. Then goes on to describe it had to do with roll fishing. Now, I’ve played a lot of games off site and I had NO IDEA it started as a roll fishing situation because no town power roles were even mentioned. Just town/scum. I was as confused about what Nine was implying as marc and pao were, I just wasn’t here to comment on it. I don’t like these vibes right now so I’m gonna go with gut here.

Ninetales

- The progression they don’t have really hurts my head. They seem to be all over the place as soon as they arrive. Very chaotic. They SR pao and think marc is NAI, but vote marc saying it’s a RVS vote. Then as things progress, they’re vote becomes a legit one with SR on marc for unknown reasons? Then they backtrack on the SR for pao and claim they never said they actually SR them just made observation. The whole ISO is very fence sitting, can’t actually make any true opinions. I haven’t seen anything that indicates town from their posts. I’ll go as far as to say this is my highest SR currently.

This feels extremely fake and try hard for page 5. If this is normal here, feel free to ignore me but I have never seen such detailed reads on page 5 and just a single glance at them makes me feel like they are forced.

[marcistar]

I also do wonder tho, why is catboi scum in any scenario of my flip to you pao? That looks like a bit of tunneling tbh.. you know, the thing you hate about the other mafia game we play together?

I'm not trying to tunnel onto catboi, but if you flip scum I will tunnel into him, as it's so scummy for defending scum? Is it not?

I would rather have a lynch onto Ninetales, but other then you and me, no one else is really talking about them.

oh am i just confused then? i thought u meant hes scum no matter what..
if i do flip scum yeah he would be scummy, but im not scum soo

Marcistar: You are voting me but you are ignoring Not_Mafia.What should I think of that?

im ignoring not_mafia rn because of their jestery playstyle. im more inclined to believe that thats town, tho i believe if it goes on for too long that hes either scum or just useless for town. (basically im willing to let it slide for now, if he comes back with better shit )

Most likely partners are paopao or marcistar but I am not sure about that yet.

its fine if you see this, its a bit hard for me to not super buddy him i feel like my bias for my friend could be a detriment, but so far i haven't seen anything super scummy from him. i feel like i would be able to tell if hes scum.. eventually maybe? but its so hard rn for me.

my read on him is neutral.

No I wasn't talking about that.What ninetales was saying wasn't that hard to figure.I mean I have played no more than one game of FM but I figured it out.If you are town you should not be discussing that.I think he was talking about paopao being Power Role.You should not be discussing that because mafia would get information about PowerRole.

i thought there was a possibility of ninetales meaning pr.. but i honestly dont see how they would've got to that conclusion if it hasnt been night phase at all yet. i dont think there should be any hints about specific roles without a night phase at all.. that seems too careless.. so i was super confused.

pickles

i have a question for u..
"(tinfoil) WK because of TMI if marc is town."
what does tinfoil and wk mean? i've never heard these terms before OH AND ALSO ISO... theres a button at the top next to the post # that says iso is that what u mean?

Why I think Marcistar is scum partner with not_mafia is because she voted me for not being so active but ignored not_mafia.Pao because of the post where he said he doesn't believe no_mafia is scum.But then I remembered that many other players are also not noticing not_mafia so I realized I was wrong.

i thought hes just actually a jester like player who only plays to troll and ruin games? dont let jesters rule the world

I feel we should sort out not_mafia first if that's his play style or something.Idk if he'll get any serious. I think scum use D1
for townies to get eliminated as in the end only they get suspected because the scum are just trying to not get suspected.

ah maybe maybe, but idk if this is how he usually plays..? if he continues not being helpful i think he'll be a good vote because even if hes town, not helpful town hurts too..

This feels extremely fake and try hard for page 5. If this is normal here, feel free to ignore me but I have never seen such detailed reads on page 5 and just a single glance at them makes me feel like they are forced.

is it not normal? i thought pickles was trying to make up for their lack of activity by analyzing the players so far.

[Pickles]

Alright well if you think my reads are fake then I’m not gonna play on this site.
Because why bother?

[Pickles]

pickles i have a question for u..
"(tinfoil) WK because of TMI if marc is town."
what does tinfoil and wk mean? i've never heard these terms before OH AND ALSO ISO... theres a button at the top next to the post # that says iso is that what u mean?

A tinfoil is an idea that’s likely not true but possible.
WK - white knight, coming to the defense of a player.
And the ISO is post isolation of each player.
There’s each persons in every individual post as well as the activity log.
The activity log has every ISO and is at bottom of every page.

[Pickles]

And posting reads is something we do on ToS forums if we’re stuck.
Sorry for even bothering here.
It took me longer than it was worth if nobody appreciated it.

[Not_Mafia]

Readslists are a normal thing

[Pickles]

Well if reads lists are normal around here then it feels like Ninetales wanted to shade me and devalue my read that they’re scum. Does anybody else feel like that’s what happened?
VOTE: Ninetales