Reckamonic's Ocarina of Time Mafia..OVER! Was Hyrule saved?

[Ythan]

My mistake, Cupcake the fakeclaimer called my posts BS without actually backing it up and it was Lady LD that posted that particular bit of BS. By the way, lol at wagon votes by players who clearly didn't read. I'll oblige Al and summarize.

[jenniwren]

I'm working on my catch-up post, but watching the thread grow while I'm doing it. The page Ythan just linnked for verdant has a link (the second one, via the Golden Goddess entry). If you follow that link and scroll down, you get this information.

"As the Goddess of Wisdom, Nayru is associated with law and order. She is believed to be the Goddess of Time referred to in Majora's Mask due to her role in setting the realm in order and her association with the Oracle representing Time.

Through her oracle, Nayru is also associated with the flow of ages, string instruments, and singing. Nayru seems to be represented by water, ice, or love, as exemplified in the magic spell Nayru's Love, and the Great Fairy of Ice, holder of the Water Element, who resembles Nayru's Oracle and Goddess Statue.

The Light Spirit which is named after her, Lanayru, has the appearance of a serpent, and the unique feature of its province is the deep Lake Hylia. Nayru shares her symbol with the Tune of Ages."

http://www.zeldawiki.org/Golden_Goddesses

[Ythan]

Posts I consider relevant to the issues at hand. I'll go one page at a time.

905 Cupcake claims Nayru's Love.
916 Zwet claims non-verdant. This is the only reference to the term verdant and it refers to Barinade as non-verdant. Clearly unrelated to the forest.
917 Chess asks what a verdant race is.
919 I express 80%+ surety of Cupcake's scum alignment.
920 Nik is I believe the first to suggest that verdant refers to the Kokiri.
923 Cupcake claims Aquatic Goddess, which is incorrect, and votes me. This bare claim, compared to others in the thread, is composed entirely of role-based info we've seen in other claims and, where originality was necessary, a mistake about Nayru, who would not be described as an aquatic goddess. Also an omgus vote based on nothing.

[Ythan]

I'm working on my catch-up post, but watching the thread grow while I'm doing it. The page Ythan just linnked for verdant has a link (the second one, via the Golden Goddess entry). If you follow that link and scroll down, you get this information.

"As the Goddess of Wisdom, Nayru is associated with law and order. She is believed to be the Goddess of Time referred to in Majora's Mask due to her role in setting the realm in order and her association with the Oracle representing Time.

Through her oracle, Nayru is also associated with the flow of ages, string instruments, and singing. Nayru seems to be represented by water, ice, or love, as exemplified in the magic spell Nayru's Love, and the Great Fairy of Ice, holder of the Water Element, who resembles Nayru's Oracle and Goddess Statue.

The Light Spirit which is named after her, Lanayru, has the appearance of a serpent, and the unique feature of its province is the deep Lake Hylia. Nayru shares her symbol with the Tune of Ages."

http://www.zeldawiki.org/Golden_Goddesses

Some analysis with your information please.

[jenniwren]

Working on it...

[Ythan]

925 Cupcake googles Nayru and pulls the quote, posting it in the same exact format, from the top of the first page that comes up.
928 Cupcake spends most of her time posting attacking my case by insulting it rather than addressing content. Laughable, most fail, etc. Without backing it up because she's been flailing for pages (as of our time now).
932 Nikanor attempts to defend Cupcake. Of all the ways he could have done this that would have been believable he says that "Nayru is blue so she would be called aquatic." He says every player has to have a modifier (I don't) and so aquatic was tacked onto hers. He also attacks me because in the past I have said that the game will not be flavor-broken and now I am attacking a claim because of botched flavor. There's no contradiction there, he just wants me out of the game. Disappointed in him.
938 Nik wants me to come up with an alternative descriptor for Cupcake's fakeclaim even though it's a fakeclaim.
943 I forgot about this actually. I had said that everything EXCEPT the mistaken aquatic claim was drawn from other claims but even that came from the King Zora claim. So yeah, she grabbed a bunch of little pieces from other claims and put them together wrong.
947 Nik doesn't understand or ignores that the part of the case he is debating pertains to a messed up claim.
949 Lady LD arrives and starts her defense. It's not a good one. Nayru still isn't aquatic and her proxy-omgus vote against me is nominally based on my rejection of that poor claim.

[Ythan]

Working on it...

You posted it for a reason. You bolded that part for a reason. It's not hard.

[Ythan]

951 Lady LD goes back to the Verdant=Kokiri argument. Still wrong.
953 Lady drops the wacky defense and proxy-omgus attacks Dekes for agreeing with the case against instead. This would be textbook omgus if she wasn't defending someone else, and it's still just as bad. Also she says someone claimed verdant. We've been over how wrong this is. This is a big piece of her defense of Cupcake's flavor mistake and it's based on Lady LD not reading closely enough.

An aside, here. Lady LD's defense of Cupcake is based on a verdant/fire/aquatic trinity connected to the Three Goddesses and their related races. Except the only one we've seen connected to either a race or a goddess outside Cupcake's fakeclaim is aquatic in the King Zora claim. We've been over, again, why verdant does not fit here.

963 Lady LD claims that Cupcake was defended by a blue forcefield, ie Nayru's Love. Too bad she's completely lying.
971 This is where she "explains" the aforementioned mistake.

[Ythan]

Although I think Ganadorf would be align with dark/shadow, but that isn't really important.

If we are going that route, then I can see Princess Zelda being aligned with light. Thats about all the elemental alignments I can think of.

Zelda would be light. If the Sheikah are involved then they would be shadow and the Gerudo would most likely be spirit. Whether Ganondorf would be spirit as well would most likely depend on whether he is part of a meaningful Gerudo faction, but if the Sheikah are present and are shadow then I doubt Ganondorf would be that or the synonymous "darkness" which is not actually an element ever used in the series.

[Ythan]

I'm going to note that all these miller claims would be what you consider dark elemental allignment.

So like, if Ganon were to suddenly be on the towns side, then that would be miller in this game (based of claims)

We've seen one fully-explained miller claim. I think my earlier boss-themed explanation is much more fitting than whatever it is you're attempting to do here.

[Ythan]

982 Lady LD misrepresents my vote to explain her proxy-omgus vote. This is before we got into any discussion of "elements" (aquatic is not an element in the Zelda universe, water is). My explanation before her vote was based on the fact that Nayru is not aquatic, which had in no way been turned into the later goddesses-sharing-elements-with-races discussion that came later. This explanation is a lie.

[Ythan]

Now let's take a moment to look at the recent terrible votes that found their way onto me in the wake of this argument.

unvote
vote ythan

for reason stated by LL
btw she is 100% right about what she's talking about

I can tell you that there are

at least

six different elemental(ish) alignments.

Fire | Water | Forest | Light | Shadow | Spirit

--

And I support LLD in this.

VOTE: Ythan

Zero content from either of these, and both are self-evident (wolf in) sheep('s clothing) votes.

[Ythan]

Quick, one person express an explanation for their vote against me. Hint, it isn't to your win condition to admit that you're scum.

[BrookylnConstruction]

Please, someone make a summary, it is impossible to go through all these pages. At least point me to some important posts, damn it, have some mercy.

This is truth. i started readin but everytime i take a break theres more pages to read and not much makes sense.

with this many people were almost better off lynching randomly

also instead of claiming i will simply show u why i have no motivation:

Vote: Mafuyu

Why don't you just self vote that way we can lynch randomly and lynch a lurker.

EBWOP: You're really defending him, is my point.

Argument A was presented by ythan against you, You defended with argument B. We vote you based on argument B.

[Ythan]

It's horribly ironic that Lady LD is attacking you for "defending" me considering what she's been doing lately. Poorly defending Cupcake based on lies.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Nice spam you got there Ythan. Just because you say something, doesn't make it true.

I PROVED that Nayru is an aquatic goddess.

This /SUMMARY/ is pure subjective nonsense.

You just told a lie. In your own statement.

982 Lady LD misrepresents my vote to explain her proxy-omgus vote.

This is before we got into any discussion of "elements"

(aquatic is not an element in the Zelda universe, water is).

My explanation before her vote was based on the fact that Nayru is not aquatic,

which had in no way been turned into the later goddesses-sharing-elements-with-races discussion that came later. This explanation is a lie.

The two bolded parts show the contradiction. If your vote was based of the Aquatic thing being a lie, how could it not relate to the elements theme?

I'm not the liar.

YOU ARE.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

And I'll note that you provide NO PROOF that I am lying. You just come out and say it. You flood the chat with meaningless drabble, just to make it look re-searched, when nothing in your statements is based on FACT.

You keep saying "I LIED". Prove it. Other wise, you are the liar.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Oh, and my flavor explanation is not WRONG. I proved it correct.

You can't deny my claim on this one. Sorry.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

923 Cupcake claims Aquatic Goddess,

which is incorrect

, and votes me. This bare claim, compared to others in the thread, is composed entirely of role-based info we've seen in other claims and, where originality was necessary, a mistake about Nayru, who would not be described as an aquatic goddess. Also an omgus vote based on nothing.

Stop posting bullshit.

PROVE THE BOLDED POINT, OR STFU.

[Ythan]

My summary in a smaller nutshell. This is the outline of the argument itself, eschewing the scummy behaviors and rampant omgus of those involved. I won't be getting into Nik either, Cupcake or Lady are top priority atm.

Cupcake hobbled together a fakeclaim based on scraps from other claims. Adds a quote from the top of the first google result for "Nayru", in the same format. She hasn't given any more since. Lady L makes the argument that Nayru must be aquatic because the Zora are, and Kokiri are verdant. Except the Kokiri are not verdant and the only reference we have seen to that word is that Barinade, a jellyfish, is not, as part of a miller claim. Verdant clearly means what it always means in the Zelda universe, and not forest-related. So Lady's defense of the fakeclaim is built on air. When Lady comes back to the defense after dropping it to omgus for a bit she gets into how Cupcake used a blue forcefield, Nayru's Love. Except she never did this. Lie.

Le Cupcake or Lady Lambdadelta today.

[Ythan]

Nice spam you got there Ythan. Just because you say something, doesn't make it true.

I know you can't factually dispute the case but constantly whining about it instead makes you look like a sore loser.

I PROVED that Nayru is an aquatic goddess.

No you didn't.

This /SUMMARY/ is pure subjective nonsense.

Then dispute it.

You just told a lie. In your own statement.

982 Lady LD misrepresents my vote to explain her proxy-omgus vote.

This is before we got into any discussion of "elements"

(aquatic is not an element in the Zelda universe, water is).

My explanation before her vote was based on the fact that Nayru is not aquatic,

which had in no way been turned into the later goddesses-sharing-elements-with-races discussion that came later. This explanation is a lie.

The two bolded parts show the contradiction. If your vote was based of the Aquatic thing being a lie, how could it not relate to the elements theme?

I'm not the liar.

YOU ARE.

I explained the distinction between aquatic as it was used at that time to simply describe the Zora, an aquatic race, and the element of water you

attempetd

to conflate it with. I did it

in that quote

. Lol try harder.

[Ythan]

And I'll note that you provide NO PROOF that I am lying. You just come out and say it. You flood the chat with meaningless drabble, just to make it look re-searched, when nothing in your statements is based on FACT.

You keep saying "I LIED". Prove it. Other wise, you are the liar.

I'm

explaining

why you're a liar. You don't need to make three posts in a row to complain about it.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Why is it everytime someone makes a valid point, you refute it with "No." "Lol try harder" or "I'm right, the end".

What you are doing is not logic.

I will show you why Aquatic is accepted.

POINT A: KING ZORA IS CLAIMED AS AQUATIC. NOT "WATER" BUT AQUATIC. WE CAN ASSUME ALL WATER CREATURES WILL BE "AQUATIC".
POINT B: NAYRU IS CLAIMED AS AQUATIC. THIS POINT IS DISPUTED.
POINT C: IT IS PROVEN THAT NAYRU IS THE GODDESS OF THE SEAS, WATER AND THE ZORA'S. THIS ASSOCIATES HER WITH WATER/ZORA'S.
POINT D: ZORA IS AQUATIC. WE CAN ASSUME WATER IS CALLED AQUATIC (thanks to chesskid).

ERGO, NAYRU IS AN /AQUATIC/ GODDESS.

CHECKMATE.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

And I'll note that you provide NO PROOF that I am lying. You just come out and say it. You flood the chat with meaningless drabble, just to make it look re-searched, when nothing in your statements is based on FACT.

You keep saying "I LIED". Prove it. Other wise, you are the liar.

I'm

explaining

why you're a liar. You don't need to make three posts in a row to complain about it.

Your explanation shows no "proof".

All you say is "You're lying" or "I'm right, stop complaining".

Prove it, scum. Defend yourself with logic, or be ignored. Honestly.

[Ythan]

You're not making valid points. If you think you are then defend them instead of constantly bitching about me disputing them.

And that's not proof you gigantic fool. She claimed aquatic because she saw it on the Zora claim. Have you seriously not picked that up after all this time.