Newbie 1996: GAME OVER

[Kirari Momobami]

Was this a reaction test for Floof/yooh?

Sorta, that and I second guessed him for a second after his wall

[3bounty]

Yoooh is probably town. I think highest hit % is on the Alo wagon. The build up was too fast to be all town on there.

You have seen me post now. Post now.

What do you think of the rest of the wagon on alo then? You admit scum is within that pool and seem to think I am scum while Kirari is town. What about the rest? Throughout day 1 you had alo pinned as scum as well, so can you explain how the build up was "way to fast" for it all to be town there in your eyes?

What do you make about today's lynch given how fast it has build up?

Regarding todays wagon. I disagree with Yoohs vote that Kirari's hammer was scummy. I agree with Clidd and HEM votes and their point that the PR posts from Kirari are what baited out the PR:

When I say someone is masons with me, it means one of two things:
a) they're masons with me :3
b) I townread them strongly

Okay just to be sure, are you for real saying that you're mason or is that meme

and i just found this

It's not even an argument at this point so I won't go much into how who22 making sure and double checking the PR posts is clearly a PR reaction.

I am leaning on that it was unintentional and just memes from Kirari instead of out-right PR fishing from scum, because that'd be too high risk to trade a PR for scum member D1. What is a bit sketchy is the denial that he did not react/hint at PR (because of those posts) and that he got NK'd for other reasons.

I get Kirari not wanted to take responsibility for outing a PR. But if you yourself said you got PR vibes from his posts (I assume it was when he made posts like the one quoted above, which is directly a result of Kirari's cop/mason stuff) then why would you at the same time argue that IW22 was not killed for that?

[3bounty]

About yesterday's wagon being fast. If I recall correctly, I didn't have a very strong scum read. And was sheeping. The wagon I was sheeping dissolved and I went back to my scum read (which I admitted was weak, I was even willing to go with other's scum read of they made a decent case).

Then when I logged in again, my 1 vote on Alo was an L-1 wagon. That just seemed fast to me. And by probability if Alo is town most likely scum on the wagon.

[Kirari Momobami]

It's not even an argument at this point so I won't go much into how who22 making sure and double checking the PR posts is clearly a PR reaction.

It's absolutely an argument

I think only two people right now actually agree that it was a PR reaction from who; other people disagree with whether my play seemed like fishing or not but there's definitely a spectrum of interpretations

What is a bit sketchy is the denial that he did not react/hint at PR (because of those posts) and that he got NK'd for other reasons.

I mean there's two other good reasons for Who being the night kill and I strongly disagree that asking whether I was "really" claiming mason was PR-indicative. Any sort of lost town would be likely to ask the same question

[3bounty]

It's not even an argument at this point so I won't go much into how who22 making sure and double checking the PR posts is clearly a PR reaction.

It's absolutely an argument

I think only two people right now actually agree that it was a PR reaction from who; other people disagree with whether my play seemed like fishing or not but there's definitely a spectrum of interpretations

What is a bit sketchy is the denial that he did not react/hint at PR (because of those posts) and that he got NK'd for other reasons.

I mean there's two other good reasons for Who being the night kill and I strongly disagree that asking whether I was "really" claiming mason was PR-indicative. Any sort of lost town would be likely to ask the same question

I mean yeah you're right it technically is an argument. But even the one guy that agrees that your posts didnt get any PR hints, simultaneously says he himself got PR hints so.

[3bounty]

In fact I'll expand the question to the whole game.

Assuming Kirari is scum here, who is their partner given today's and day 1's interactions? 3b made since until he denied an out for Kirari.

Todays interactions. Definitely you.

D1 Kirari/Holden team doesnt make sense though.

[Kirari Momobami]

Uh, there's a significant difference in argument because "I got PR vibes from Who" and "Kirari rolefished Who"

Saying it's "not an argument" when someone is saying 1 and not 2 is... poor communication, I think

[3bounty]

Oh and the question about the rest of the wagon. I think LL out of the 4 others on the Alo wagon is most likely town. It makes sense to me that scum hopped on after he built all the momentum to it. Which is all scum needs, 1 townie to make that case. Admittedly I don't remember what that case was but it was a lot of posts and each post was huge. It could have been 1 or 2 scum not sure.

[HoldenGolden]

In fact I'll expand the question to the whole game.

Assuming Kirari is scum here, who is their partner given today's and day 1's interactions? 3b made since until he denied an out for Kirari.

Todays interactions. Definitely you.

D1 Kirari/Holden team doesnt make sense though.

How has my interactions today scream scum to you given I just started?

You were townreading Kirari until now where you are trying to team us together? What happen to your Kirari read?

[3bounty]

Uh, there's a significant difference in argument because "I got PR vibes from Who" and "Kirari rolefished Who"

Saying it's "not an argument" when someone is saying 1 and not 2 is... poor communication, I think

Yes I said assuming these vibes are from posts like the one quoted, which I mean, is a reasonable assumption. What other posts possibly hint at PR? Anyway it doesn't matter. No use wifoming over the intention of the NK, because that benefits scum imo.

[3bounty]

In fact I'll expand the question to the whole game.

Assuming Kirari is scum here, who is their partner given today's and day 1's interactions? 3b made since until he denied an out for Kirari.

Todays interactions. Definitely you.

D1 Kirari/Holden team doesnt make sense though.

How has my interactions today scream scum to you given I just started?

You were townreading Kirari until now where you are trying to team us together? What happen to your Kirari read?

Where in D2 did I town Kirari?

Your first post you said scum benefits by lynching town Kirari. You said scum needs to defend scum Kirari.

You defended Kirari. Read your question above... the only answer is you. I don't agree with your first post in the first place so it's not a big deal. Just saying the answer to your question is you.

[HoldenGolden]

In fact I'll expand the question to the whole game.

Assuming Kirari is scum here, who is their partner given today's and day 1's interactions? 3b made since until he denied an out for Kirari.

Todays interactions. Definitely you.

D1 Kirari/Holden team doesnt make sense though.

How has my interactions today scream scum to you given I just started?

You were townreading Kirari until now where you are trying to team us together? What happen to your Kirari read?

Where in D2 did I town Kirari?

Your first post you said scum benefits by lynching town Kirari. You said scum needs to defend scum Kirari.

You defended Kirari. Read your question above... the only answer is you. I don't agree with your first post in the first place so it's not a big deal. Just saying the answer to your question is you.

I misread 905, but

In post 820 Alo said it himself, our best option was to hammer. His last scum reads were HEM/Clidd. But then sheeps HEM's vote on Kirari and asks for Clidd to join the wagon. HIS TWO SCUM READS.

Hammering after that was not at all scummy.

was a defense earlier for them. I retract it though since I misread 905.
------------------------
So you think scum me comes in and writes a post trying to derail the lynch on kirari where I am calling myself scum? If I am scum with her, then I could of easily coast to the end game by bussing them solving the issue I had of scum hardbussing needing an endgame. If I am not scum with her, while WIFOMy, I had an easy mislynch in them given my day 1 read.

I'm going to go ahead and assumed if I had voted or kept my Kirari suspicions you would of still scumread me for the opposite logic, so dive deeper. Explain to me the scum!motivation more that you see in that post. It feels you are trying to justify a scumread on me rather than actually judging what I am posting.

[HoldenGolden]

Because if you had:

Scum has a massive tempo advantage as they might now have no PR roles to worry about. Kirari was in a bad spot towards the end of day 1, but not nearly bad enough to warrent such a drastic measure as this.

While obviously the partner cannot white-knight scum!Kirari as that would throw away their lead if Kirari does flip here (as it be easier to associate the two together), no one really is cautiously supporting the wagon while providing reads on others to deflect the wagon off scum!kirari.

you would see why your logic of "your post says why your scum" does not quite work

[humaneatingmonkey]

i honestly dont understand the gamestate

[HoldenGolden]

How was 4/20 day HEM?

[HoldenGolden]

Do you agree or disagree with the points I raised about the thread sentiment?

[humaneatingmonkey]

i agree that with the way it's going, we should definitely be wary of the fast tracking of kirari's wagon. however, i dont understand why you think kirari is town for this. i also dont understand why you think 3b/kirari is impossible. i also agree that if kirari is scum, someone will try to counter push it.

either 1. it's you, and you're trying to counter push it. 2. 3b is trying to take a temperature of your opinion on 3b so he can know it's good to bus. 3. its not kirari, and im bad at this game.

these are my premature thoughts.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i just think the narrative that it's 3b and kirari is still highly probable. scum is capable of high-level plays. kirari is capable of high-level wifom-inducing shit.

[3bounty]

@Holden, like I said, I do not agree with your points in your first post. I just answered a question based on what was posted. Do you have an answer for your question then? Besides 3B and apparently besides you. So there is probably no answer besides "Kirari is town". Is that what you were going for with your question?

The problem is the 3 points are subjective and assumes too much about what the scum team and town team should and shouldnt and would and wouldnt do.

[3bounty]

Is there anyone that thinks D1 Alo wagon was all town?

[Kirari Momobami]

i just think the narrative that it's 3b and kirari is still highly probable. scum is capable of high-level plays. kirari is capable of high-level wifom-inducing shit.

Why "highly probable"? Why is us being s/s more likely than me being right that we're t/t or that I'm wrong and we're t/s?

I don't understand what high level wifom shit you think I would be making that would still make us highly probable s/s

I still think 3b getting to the point of wanting to lynch something yesterday in a stalled gamestate was townie. It's not impossible I'm wrong but I'd still say he's on the townier side all told

[Kirari Momobami]

I wouldn't hard rule out yooh/monkey tbh, although I don't know that'd be my top pick

[humaneatingmonkey]

okay i just dont think i have the energy for this game today. i will post tomorrow.

[Kirari Momobami]

3b what made you sure enough on me town d1 to sheep me that you dropped today?

[Kirari Momobami]

1041 is a little scummy