Mini 1348- Dragon Ball Z: Saiyan Saga Mafia (Game Over)


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Post Post #1075 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:13 am

Post by PeregrineV »

MagnaofIllusion wrote:
PeregrineV wrote:@MoI- What purpose did your snifit vote serve?


What is confusing about it? It served a two-fold purpose ...

1. Indicating my suspicion about his slot based on his Day 1 play and further evidenced by his post.
2. It allowed me to gauge the reaction of Yates given his reaction to me yesterday, which I detailed in my post with a vote for Yates.

What are your thoughts on Yates and Thor PV?


I don't think he posted day2 yet, so I'm murky on it's purpose of affecting snifit.

Yates is probably town. Along with Slandaar and probably mcqueen. No guarantees on any of them.

Thor I'm just watching. I like to autothink he's town, but even he has to draw scum sometime.
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Post Post #1076 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:15 am

Post by pappums rat »

Votecount 2.1

syndromeofadown - 1 (Thor665)
PeregrineV - 1 (Slandaar)
mcqueen - 1 (Yates)
Yates - 2 (MagnaofIllusion, BK201)
snifit - 1 (PeregrineV)

Not voting - (JohnnyFarrar, mcqueen, Toro, syndromeofadown, snifit)

MagnaofIllusion is V/LA until Monday.

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.

The deadline for Day 2 is 2 AM EST on July 27, 2012.
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Post Post #1077 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:19 am

Post by MagnaofIllusion »

PeregrineV wrote:I don't think he posted day2 yet, so I'm murky on it's purpose of affecting snifit.

Yates is probably town. Along with Slandaar and probably mcqueen. No guarantees on any of them.

Thor I'm just watching. I like to autothink he's town, but even he has to draw scum sometime.


What part about snifit not posting has anything to do with my voting him to show my suspicion? Did you even read my reply?

Why is Yates Town? Reasons would be great at this point because you seem to be disregarding the outcome of yesterday as if it never happened ...

Autothinking anyone is Town just because of their username is frankly terrible play. You probably should have outgrown that by now.
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Post Post #1078 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:33 am

Post by PeregrineV »

Which reply? I read your replies to Slandaar, Yates, mcqueen, and Thor.

I suppose Yates would be town for the same reaosn Slandaar is, VT claims.

I mostly have, therefore the reason why I don't have Thor as town.
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Post Post #1079 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:35 am

Post by MagnaofIllusion »

PeregrineV wrote:Which reply? I read your replies to Slandaar, Yates, mcqueen, and Thor.

I suppose Yates would be town for the same reaosn Slandaar is, VT claims.


The reply that you quoted that didn't indicate I was looking for input from Snifit ...

Claiming VT does not make someone Town. :igmeou:
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Post Post #1080 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:38 am

Post by PeregrineV »

MagnaofIllusion wrote:
PeregrineV wrote:Which reply? I read your replies to Slandaar, Yates, mcqueen, and Thor.

I suppose Yates would be town for the same reaosn Slandaar is, VT claims.


The reply that you quoted that didn't indicate I was looking for input from Snifit ...

Claiming VT does not make someone Town. :igmeou:


I know, but considering Aco, Slandaar, mcqueen and Yates all variously sat at L-2 and L-3 at some point of the day, I'm curious why his would be the standard to hold against the BenMage lynch.

I mean, if your going to look at stuff, you might as well look at all of it.
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Post Post #1081 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:45 am

Post by MagnaofIllusion »

PeregrineV wrote:I know, but considering Aco, Slandaar, mcqueen and Yates all variously sat at L-2 and L-3 at some point of the day, I'm curious why his would be the standard to hold against the BenMage lynch.

I mean, if your going to look at stuff, you might as well look at all of it.


You are failing to look at the context of the process. Acosmist had a claim that derailed his wagon. I'm not sure why Slandaar didn't get lynched with his VT claim other than Yates not wanting that 1v1 to bite him in the ass (this, note, is a theory based on my Slandaar and Yates reads currently). Not sure when McQueen was wagonned but I know it wasn't at the end of the day.

Yates on the other hand has at L-2 for a significant amount of time at the end of the Day as a claimed VT. Yet right before deadline a wagon suddenly occured to catapulted Benmage to L-2 in less than 24 hours IIRC. Again - there is little reason for scum to say "Hmmmm ... we have a Town mislynch sitting waiting to happen with deadline assuring Yates doesn't escape. Well screw that ... let's get yet another wagon going as we might get a fourth claim." They could have just kept their heads down with the knowledge that Yates as VT would get hammered to avoid the dreaded Day 1 No Lynch. The flow of the wagons says "Yates is scum getting bailed out".

If you disagree with my thoughts that's fine. I'm fairly sure at this point I'm correct. Maybe I'm wrong ... goofy things do happen in Mafia games.
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Post Post #1082 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:55 am

Post by PeregrineV »

Fair enough, in which case, if Yates is scum, which of his bussing buddies jumped ship to lynch BenMage instead?

mcqueen was as his former self, MattP
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Post Post #1083 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 10:43 am

Post by Yates »

MagnaofIllusion wrote:No, this really does not reflect the realities of what happened yesterday. After the Acosmist wagon disappated due to his claim you were the only wagon of any strength.
I suggest you go look at the vote counts [feel free to ISO Pappums] to see what really happened as you are completely wrong. Acosmist was the first wagon with legs and got to L-1 before I even posted. If I were scum, all I had to do was hammer with my first post and hey, free dead cop. So I guess the first thing you should answer if you want to continue on your Yates tunnel is this; why wouldn't I just hammer as scum? It's not like I bought any Town points by NOT hammering.

I got up to two or three as a counter wagon to Slandaar, I believe. Then he claimed and I remained as a counter wagon to a new Acosmist wagon that reformed.

MagnaofIllusion wrote:Then the Benmage wagon appeared grew in what … the last 72 hours of the day.
Actually it was closer to 24 hours. I voted Ben on Monday the 9th and you hammered him Tuesday the 10th. Thanks for saving me from a lynch.

MagnaofIllusion wrote:The wagon on Benmage has all the earmarks of a last desperate attempt to save you.
LOL - I'll respond to this with my response to 1081:

MagnaofIllusion wrote:...there is little reason for scum to say "Hmmmm ... we have a Town mislynch sitting waiting to happen with deadline assuring Yates doesn't escape. Well screw that ... let's get yet another wagon going as we might get a fourth claim." They could have just kept their heads down with the knowledge that Yates as VT would get hammered to avoid the dreaded Day 1 No Lynch. The flow of the wagons says "Yates is scum getting bailed out".
Again, are you of the opinion that ALL of the scum team jumped onto the Benmage wagon? That's the only way that scum can engineer a counter wagon last second. Unless, of course, you are arguing that it is in Town's best interest to always vote for the largest wagon at the end of the day, logic be damned? How did that work out for you?

Which also brings me to a direct question; why
did
YOU hammer Benmage? Did you even care if he was Town or not?

Also if you are going to drop bs arguments like that, you better be able to prove it. You should be able to see how the Benmage wagon formed. It happened quickly so you shouldn't have to look very hard. Explain to me how scum Yates got his scum buddies to build a counter wagon on Town Benmage in less than 24 hours. This is not rhetorical.

What's crazy is that you are basically strengthening *MY* theory without even realizing it. The only way this went down is if scum were on two TOWN wagons and didn't care which one got lynched. THIS is why I looked to the counter wagons for scum. There were fewer people on the counter wagons and more confirmed or obv Town people on it. It makes the suspect pool small and easy to identify. 50/50 is pretty awesome, if you ask me.

I'd lynch any of mcqueen/toro [preferred] or MoI at this point.
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Post Post #1084 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:02 am

Post by BK201 »

Yates wrote:
MagnaofIllusion wrote: If I were scum, all I had to do was hammer with my first post and hey, free dead cop. So I guess the first thing you should answer if you want to continue on your Yates tunnel is this; why wouldn't I just hammer as scum? It's not like I bought any Town points by NOT hammering.
1. You didn't know Acosmist was the cop. 2. You would have been lynched the next day for hammering town in a RVS wagon. 3. You did not have the ability to hammer unless you are lying scum. You are suggesting you had the ability to hammer. That is in contrast with your first post that claims you confirmed your role before you went to bed, and just woke up to see Acosmist at L-1. I had already switched my vote to Psyche before your first post. If you indeed had the ability to hammer, then you lied in your first post.
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Post Post #1085 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:02 am

Post by BK201 »

^ I messed up that quote. Yates said that not MoI.
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Post Post #1086 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:05 am

Post by BK201 »

Yates wrote:
MagnaofIllusion wrote:No, this really does not reflect the realities of what happened yesterday. After the Acosmist wagon disappated due to his claim you were the only wagon of any strength.
Acosmist was the first wagon with legs and got to L-1 before I even posted. If I were scum, all I had to do was hammer with my first post and hey, free dead cop. So I guess the first thing you should answer if you want to continue on your Yates tunnel is this; why wouldn't I just hammer as scum? It's not like I bought any Town points by NOT hammering.
1. You didn't know Acosmist was the cop.
2. You would have been lynched the next day for hammering town in a RVS wagon.
3. You did not have the ability to hammer unless you are lying scum. You are suggesting you had the ability to hammer. That is in contrast with your first post that claims you confirmed your role before you went to bed, and just woke up to see Acosmist at L-1. I had already switched my vote to Psyche before your first post. If you indeed had the ability to hammer, then you lied in your first post.
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Post Post #1087 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 12:02 pm

Post by snifit »

Yeah I'm regretting my decision yesterday. :/ My townread on Yates was pretty strong though, and Thor didn't look crazy and my townread on Benmage wasn't very strong.

@MoI
Do you think Yates scum implicates Thor? I was more suspicious of the syndrome-Peregrine area of the wagon.
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Post Post #1088 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 12:26 pm

Post by Toro »

PeregrineV wrote:
@Toro- Sure.
1. Why no unvote.


Replaced in in a rush during that day just to confirm that I replaced in and that I was catching up, didn't realize a vote was down at that point and I hadn't gone through the thread yet to look.

2. Agent was personifying the scum ideal. What will you do to show that he/you are, in fact, not scum?


During my re-read I was flabbergasted on how ridiculously bad Agent_Ireland was playing, his votes without much reasoning didn't help us all. I didn't like his original vote on Yates and I didn't like his vote on Slandaar either. With me you will be getting a much more effective scum hunter than what AI gave you.

3. Town and scum reads so far, and why.


Town (Top means strongest vibe)


PeregrineV
- Actively participating and questioning, find nothing wrong with your postings.
Slandaar
- Had a positive read on him early on in my re-read, and his Goku VT claim seals him as town for me. Originally I was puzzled on Goku being a PR or not but then I couldn't quite chalk up a PR to Goku that made sense.
Thor665
- Most active member thus far, have a very strong feel that he is Town.
Snifit
- Leaning Town at the moment, his reads seem to co-incide with mine. I haven't seen him do anything that's setting off my Scum Sense yet.
Yates
- This primarily goes off of his Krillin VT claim and the lack of a CC. I can not imagine whatsoever a Saiyan Saga DBZ Mafia that did not have Krillin and him being a VT makes perfect sense. However, I feel that he is being quite aggressive for Town as of right now.
MoI
- He's doing a great job questioning thus far...however I feel that I'm going to need to re-analyze his post-war against Thor for a more definitive read.


Scum



Syndrome
- I know he's newb, but going through his posts again I hate 831 how he just plopped himself onto the Benmage wagon with the line
"Let's see where this goes"
as his justification. That just screams Scum. I also found his 943 to be funny when he acted offended over Snifit's 936 where he then proceeded to claim "
You can dick around and vote me because you think I'm a weak player and an easy lynch target but the rest of us will be out scumhunting."
When to that point he had done ZERO scumhunting.
McQueen
- Given his posts thus far I
really
didn't like his initial vote on Acosmist
"for fucking obvious reasons" "they're so obvious bro. This is one time I'll say this, but I'll say this but I really don't need to explain them."
I also feel as if he's extremely skittish thinking that Scum is trying to frame him for Acosmist's NK.
Johnny
- In my early read-through of the game I couldn't help but notice that it seemed most of his posts weren't scum-hunting much and he seemed to be sitting on the fence or posting mostly fluff. Fence-sitting's a big no-no from me. However, he is my weakest scum read at the moment.

--------------------------

In conclusion, VOTE: Syndrome.
Show
Overall Record: 4-4

Scum: 3-1
Town: 1-3
Indy: 0-0
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Post Post #1089 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:57 pm

Post by Yates »

BK201 wrote:1. You didn't know Acosmist was the cop.
2. You would have been lynched the next day for hammering town in a RVS wagon.
3. You did not have the ability to hammer unless you are lying scum. You are suggesting you had the ability to hammer. That is in contrast with your first post that claims you confirmed your role before you went to bed, and just woke up to see Acosmist at L-1. I had already switched my vote to Psyche before your first post. If you indeed had the ability to hammer, then you lied in your first post.

1. Does it matter what role he was? All I would have known is he isn't on my scum team.
2. Why? By that logic, MoI should be your lynch target for hammering your boyfriend.
3. What? I confirmed my role over email. Didn't you? All you have to do is look at my ISO - post 0 - to know I am not lying.

BK201 wrote:I had already switched my vote to Psyche before your first post.
That... is a good point.
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Post Post #1090 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:22 pm

Post by syndromeofadown »

mcqueen is trolling. I remember worst roles mafia and that was the game where we almost won but then mcqueen fakeclaimed and got herself lynched right before lylo... yeah good job guessing all the scum right and failing at the entire rest of the game when we had an easy win lined up. Mcqueen is trying really hard to counterclaim me now, its the only explanation.
/rant

okay I'm done sheeping thor. I loaned the power of my vote to you and you abused it. I hope you enjoyed it while it lasted because your reads right now are frankly just idiotic inconsistent garbage. I'm going to vote your precious yates out of spite.

VOTE: Yates
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Post Post #1091 (ISO) » Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:40 pm

Post by syndromeofadown »

@Toro

look at my registration date and now look at yours. tell me again who the nOOb is.

PS I already explained myself and now you're really grasping at straws for a reason to vote me. You're telling me I'm your biggest scumread right now because of one throwaway comment? Out of all the pages you supposedly read? LOL go die too
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Post Post #1092 (ISO) » Sat Jul 14, 2012 12:05 am

Post by Slandaar »

PeregrineV wrote:Fair enough, in which case, if Yates is scum, which of his bussing buddies jumped ship to lynch BenMage instead?

Why does someone have to have been bussing?
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Post Post #1093 (ISO) » Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:01 am

Post by Yates »

Slandaar wrote:
PeregrineV wrote:Fair enough, in which case, if Yates is scum, which of his bussing buddies jumped ship to lynch BenMage instead?

Why does someone have to have been bussing?
scum Yates probably wouldn't have gotten to L-2 and CERTAINLY wouldn't have gotten to L-1 [for 3 minutes or however long BK was voting me] without at least one of my scum buddies on my wagon.
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Post Post #1094 (ISO) » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:09 am

Post by Slandaar »

Do you think thats the reasoning PV was using Yates?
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Post Post #1095 (ISO) » Sat Jul 14, 2012 4:36 am

Post by mcqueen »

syndromeofadown wrote:mcqueen is trolling. I remember worst roles mafia and that was the game where we almost won but then mcqueen fakeclaimed and got herself lynched right before lylo... yeah good job guessing all the scum right and failing at the entire rest of the game when we had an easy win lined up. Mcqueen is trying really hard to counterclaim me now, its the only explanation.
/rant

okay I'm done sheeping thor. I loaned the power of my vote to you and you abused it. I hope you enjoyed it while it lasted because your reads right now are frankly just idiotic inconsistent garbage. I'm going to vote your precious yates out of spite.

VOTE: Yates

Sigh. I'm a guy. I do not wished to be addressed by "herself," rather with "himself."

And, I'm not trolling. Your only defense to my theory is to say that I am trolling. Well, what if you are wrong, well, now you don't have any defense. Now you're just flopping around.

And, to be honest, after Worst Role Mafia, I may troll in the first few pages of a game, but the later in the game I get, I try to avoid doing stupid things -- like I did in Worst Role Mafia -- to help me improve my play. And, so far, I've actually led a scumteam to victory, whether you believe it or not. (Well, the Mod made an error, by ending one of the most crucial days for us early, which did help us, as we won that night, but even the Mod said, don't base our win off of that, as we did very well throughout the game, and deserved the win. In his Mod Notes, he even predicted me to be a huge liability to scum, but in the end, he noted how wrong he was about me.)

So don't just assume I'm trolling.
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Post Post #1096 (ISO) » Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:36 pm

Post by JohnnyFarrar »

Sooo, I haven't said anything since the day started because I'm too lazy to read. Sorry.

Anyways, before I get to any questions I have let me say this: My townread on Yates remains, but it is considerably weaker. For now I'm okay with assuming the ben wagon was town inspired.

Be back soon with more stuff to say.
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Post Post #1097 (ISO) » Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:05 pm

Post by snifit »

My reads are a soppy mess and I am frustrated.

MattP was my strongest scumread, but mcqueen is pretty clearly town. The bit about scum framing him by killing the cop is just...too bizarre to come from scum.
I was leaning town on iDanyboy, but syndrome is trying his hardest to be a useless sack. Do you actually think Yates is scum, syndrome, or are you really just voting him out of spite?
I was fairly comfortable with my townread on Thor but his sounded too close to gloating about my Benmage vote and now I just get nervous when I read his posts.
I had a decent townread on PeregrineV but he's starting to look predatory. The focus on me would be a convenient thing for a third scum member to do assuming Yates/Benmage-wagoner are the other two. Ugh I'm frustrated just typing that out.
My scumread on Agent_Ireland was mostly based on the fact I thought he jumped on Yates' wagon for shit reasons, but with Yates as town looking less likely it just makes A_I look like a derp. Toro's entrance was solid. Not really suspicious of this slot now, I guess.

@Slandaar
I dig the PV vote. I'm not sure I entirely understand your reasoning though. Are you suspicious of PV specifically because he didn't weigh in on Yates and joined the Benmage wagon? Didn't syndrome do the same thing?

@Johnny
You think Yates is town AND Benmage's wagon was largely town? That would mean there were a couple of scum on Yates' wagon--and we already have two town flips from it. Who's the scum there?
___

I regret voting for Benmage. I even knew voting Yates was the "correct" play and intended to do it, but Yates' hit all the right chords and I couldn't bring myself to lynch someone I was getting such strong town vibes off of. Which, now that I go back and read it, raises a question.
Yates, why are you more suspicious of mcqueen than Toro? You don't even mention MattP/mcqueen on your scumchart, but AI/Toro was right at the top. I was suspicious of his lurk through the end of the day too, but a search of his posts elsewhere corroborates his story that he lost computer access.

Still trying to iron out the conflict between the strong townread I had on Yates and the implications of Benmage's flashwagon + flip.

Soppy. Fucking. Mess.
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Post Post #1098 (ISO) » Sun Jul 15, 2012 3:58 am

Post by Yates »

BK201 wrote:3. You did not have the ability to hammer unless you are lying scum. You are suggesting you had the ability to hammer. That is in contrast with your first post that claims you confirmed your role before you went to bed, and just woke up to see Acosmist at L-1. I had already switched my vote to Psyche before your first post.
Yeah. So this was a good correction but I don't think it weakens my argument
that
much. Actually, it may help my primary argument from today.

While I didn't have the ability to hammer, I could have put Acosmist back at L-2 without raising suspicion, then, right? At that point [8:50 am on Thursday morning] these are the people that were still on the Acosmist wagon [fact checked rather than relying on memory]: dicknose/sniffit, Benmage, Thor, MattP/mcqueen

As scum, I'd be in a pretty awesome position to vote park as I wouldn't be the one putting Acos at L-1 AND I wouldn't have to answer for hammering. Then all I would have had to do is let one of my scum buddies put Acosmist at L-1 or just stay parked there and let Town get frustrated and hop on the wagon. OR I could have waited for one of my scum buddies to put Acosmist at L-1 and let Town hammer. All this is true assuming that you agree that the Acosmist wagon didn't already have my entire scum team on it. Benmage flipped Town. So, you would have to think that two or three of sniffit, Thor, and/or mcqueen are scum in order for my scenario above to not be true.

Now, when you compare that list to the Yates counterwagon from late in the day yesterday? The only name on BOTH lists is mcqueen. So if you are going to buy that ONE scum was voting for Acosmist and stayed on for a bit, he's the suspect that stands out.

Out of curiosity, why did you vote Psyche after his unvote? Was it for unvoting with the reason "in case someone gets too frisky?" I ask this b/c I think I know the answer but I want you to put yourself back in the mindset of early game.

Slandaar wrote:Do you think thats the reasoning PV was using Yates?
I think so? If that didn't address his concern, PV could tell me as much.

snifit wrote:Yates, why are you more suspicious of mcqueen than Toro? You don't even mention MattP/mcqueen on your scumchart, but AI/Toro was right at the top. I was suspicious of his lurk through the end of the day too, but a search of his posts elsewhere corroborates his story that he lost computer access.
Initially, it was simply a matter of Toro having just replaced in and wanting to get a read on him before just voting his slot. I think you will agree that AI was awful. I want to see if he was awful because he was scum or just playing this game terribly. That left mcqueen as my other suspect. I had him as "Maybe null to null Town?" The flip and subsequent information garnered from that flip [via vc's, interactions, etc.] are what sealed the deal there. As far as the internet access thing, that post didn't come until an hour and a half [roughly] after my vote. It is a plausible explanation but I'd like him to answer some outstanding questions.

I remain convinced that at least one of mcqueen/toro is scum. I guess the rest of the day will determine which.
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Post Post #1099 (ISO) » Sun Jul 15, 2012 4:12 am

Post by Slandaar »

Synd replaced in his predecessor had taken a stance (voted Yates) and so the slot as a whole didn't ignore the wagon.

PV is scum because he as scum gained the most from yesterday; Didn't vote Yates then hops on ben late.

If Yates is scum PV is probably a buddy
If Yates is town, PVscum wants to avoid lynching Yates or I and lynch random other townie in this case Ben. Which leaves us in the same situation today as yesterday technically.
If PV were town, he should have voted Yates, last second votes on Ben are scummy because the Yates wagon was good and provided a lot more info + the wagon on Ben was absolutely terrible and by keeping both Yates and I alive he should recognise the most likely outcome today is more Yates v Sland which gets us nowhere.

So we lynch PV.
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