Mafiascum.net

In post 1111, unwnd wrote:I don't like

Dunnstral

right now. I fear this feeling however because the last game we played I didn't like him either. There was an intricate tell I provided with Dunn for the longest time and I think I forgot it. It seems that somewhere we both got bad at reading each other because we shared mutual scumreads. I have less of a confirmation bias feeling towards Dunn and more like an annoying twitch. That statement made about 'scum wanting to avoid conflict' did have truth to it, but I think that is not the full representation of the game, nor is it relevant. I think this game has been quite scrappy, even if they are just minor events (outside of the blatant obvious ones like Imperium v. Cakez) so for Dunn to say this to me seems like he's giving this game a cursory glance and nothing else. The pop-in from him after RLotus just furthered the agitation, and the only response he had to my complaints was 'well I responded 30 minutes after' as if the time responded matters? You could even say 'avoiding conflict' would be the most apt description of his play right now.

In post 1112, unwnd wrote:If he doesn't like being VT or not confident then like is it justified to give him a gun?

In post 1126, MUSHSHAGANA wrote:I'm going down for the night. One last question.

Where the hell is Dunnstral today?

In post 1104, Imperium wrote:

In post 1084, petapan wrote:i'm reading in real time but not taking notes or anything of the like since i'm disorganized. i can see there was mention of it previously but it was never really fleshed out

in general this game, i've liked a lot of what you've said and what you've been doing, like how you really seemed to want to interact with norfolk and actually get a read on him rather than just call for his head like half the players in the game, but if i had to raise a point of concern it seems like you've been difficult to pin down to a concrete stance for a lot of the game. that's not a crime necessarily, my reads tend to waver a lot which is why i hate committing myself to lists but in a setup like this, there's a lot of scum, i'd expect some strong scumreads because you can pretty much close your eyes and throw a dart and still hit scum.

so i want to ask, what's your opinion of norfolk after you interacted with him, or tried to? why's duchess a scumread for you? why's unwnd scum? why is MUSH your top townread?

(i'm still a few pages behind where i first subbed in in my readthrough so i may have missed some stuff, apologies if i'm making you repeat stuff, this is just the impression i'm geting)

It was never fleshed out, you're correct, but i find it not

notable

but odd that you didn't recognize that it was part of a conversation about players that had started at 710. Yes, he at that point said he was thinking lotus, and I restated my previously stated points - my little pings that I wanted to reread and flesh out, which I would have done regardless of who he said. We were in a conversation, one in which he had just stated not too long before that he wasn't going to be shooting right away. (Just double checked this; he said he wanted to give us a chance to get our thoughts out there the night before.) Anyway, there was no indication that he was shooting right then until after that point when he said he was shooting and gave his reads list. I get Dunnstral in the moment thinking it looked that way, but I guess I don't really understand how you don't recognize it for the conversation that it was.

For what it's worth, I didn't even think he was going to be shooting right that moment when he said he was informed they were shooting. I thought that we were still going to talk more. (I realize this part here is pretty meaningless from an outside pov who truly has the above thought, but.)

Nacho feels pretty good about norfolk being scum. I think he's pretty likely to be scum. I'm still trying to make sense of duchess, but I think my original theory on the people, like cakez, who had given reasoning I disliked on Norfolk being scum might have been wrong. unwnd mentioned that scum probably were more likely to slip norfolk into their scum reads if scum and dunnstral mentioned that scum probably don't want much conflict this game, and that has me shifting my assumptions some. I only played this setup once before at my homesite, and after giving the gun to the strongest player my team bussed the fuck out of me. It lost us one at the start of the game, but I spent day one working to make my partners not look like my partners and vice versa. We almost won the game that way; we would have but the last partner standing just flaked from lylo.

ANYWAY, I think my original thought on how scum would behave was based on my only experience, but dunnstral's no conflict point makes a lot of sense to me. And while I do think unwnd has a point, I'm not sure how much i want to agree with that because bad distancing is still an issue that will get someone shot. Does that make sense? This is a lot to say that I'm trying to reorganize my thoughts a bit, and I had to step away from the game before I unleashed.

I was concerned that Norfolk's pop back in after the cakez/me thing was a bit appeasing of cakez. Cakez did misrep that point of Norfolk's so it was odd to me that he wrote him off as misguided town at that point. When he came back he had him as scum, which had me wondering if scum were going to kind of float cakez as scum to hopefully get him shot because if town the game losing shot is Cakez shooting us. (Part of me wonders if this is what Duchess was doing too) I've haven't really felt great about anything he's posted. Except I did have one little thing I wondered, but I think it's probably stupid. I used that questionnaire as support for him being either nervous town or scum at the beginning of the game, but he came in and corrected me. He told me he lied in that post, and he loves being scum and having a role - he finds VT boring. Now does scum point out the mistake I made, or does he let me continue thinking he'd be nervous regardless? I guess yes, because maybe he wants to point out how much he loves being scum. I also wondered about the shifting position to being ready to get the gun.

In post 622, Imperium wrote:

In post 613, Netflix and Chill wrote:Why does everyone townread Mush?

I should go to sleep. I saw the first part of your name and read nacho, and was about to remind you that I literally just explained that and my fears about it before realizing it was you guys.

I, in part, and town leaning her because some of the ways she questioned and talked to whemestar and me reminds me a lot of me as town a long time ago in a way that I couldn't really accomplish as scum. This is a dangerous reason to townread someone though I know because this has bit me in the ass before. Just because I have limitations in my ability to play scum because drawing scum sucks doesn't mean someone else will.

Other than that, I kind of liked the way she's described her play style and what she looks for. Does that make sense. I'm a sucker for self-meta though, so that probably won't be a strong reason for anyone else.

The little kind of setting traps? or little things that give her information, I've also kind of liked in a way.

It's not a strong read because I don't think my reasons are very solid. I didn't agree with her whemestar points or really part of the cake one about the voting.

OH wait I liked her reaction to ABR calling her obvtown. In the moment, it was a post that just felt good.

My MUSH read started there and just really kept continuing. I've pretty much liked the majority of her posts down to the descriptions of how she looks at the game. I liked the way she was certain and ready to go after STT, which literally moved at the same moment that Nacho started having doubts about STT. We might just be the next best synchronized skating team.

Nacho also thinks unwnd is more likely to be scum than I do, but I do suspect him. ABR didn't do anything that ABR usually does regardless of his alignment, so I didn't have a read there pre-unwnd at all. The problem I've had is the kind of mediator (sort of) play style he's adopted this game. But it doesn't even feel like that because at points it's felt like it was fanning the flames of me and cakez rather than actually mediate. Though as I just looked back for an example, I see that I misread his original point in 503 so hrm. And I think I misread 856 too. I thought he was saying that we were handwaving cakez, when it's felt the other way around, but I don't think that's what he was saying. Let me come back to this.

In post 1123, MUSHSHAGANA wrote:I have no particular issue with your Wheme or Dunn scumreads, I even agree with the substance of them, I just have some suspicions that I need to follow up on before I can sort them properly. Not giving too much away, but here's a riddle for you: who do they agree with? (Note: I do not know the answer to this yet.)

In post 1125, MUSHSHAGANA wrote:Yeah, I can agree with that. NM is a late game POE shot if ever.

In post 1047, petapan wrote:

In post 1004, ScrewTheTells wrote:At least Lotus should have some good targets.

what makes you say this

In post 1049, petapan wrote:the guy selfhammered as town in the game i played with him because he didn't feel he'd be able to get suspicion off his slot, play is entirely consistent with someone playing for the first time outside the newbie queue and is probably a bit overwhelmed, not really scummy

In post 192, Not_Mafia wrote:I think Norfolk is town

In post 1135, unwnd wrote:Not_Mafia as your strongest scumread? Why?

In post 1056, SirCakez wrote:

In post 1054, Duchess wrote:

In post 1042, SirCakez wrote:I will say I think Duchess drafting up this old argument between Imp and me and developing an "extremely confident" scumread after just having a mega fail on their Lotus read seems very unnatural

Should I slink away and give up on scumhunting after just one wrong read then? What is unnatural about it? What does a natural progression look like to you in this case? Did you want me to bumble around aimlessly for a bit before continuing to play the game?

You seem extremely confident for someone who just completely missed on another read you were very confident on
I'd expect you to take a step back and reevaluate because obviously you were off-track
Instead you just moved on to the next SR in your old pool.

In post 1059, petapan wrote:

In post 601, Duchess wrote:

In post 526, RLotus wrote:

In post 523, Duchess wrote:You are missing what I am saying. I saw your explanation. I am not near satisfied. Read my words. You called him LAMIST. I called it an act. These are the same thing. This makes me scummy, and it makes you...?

These are not the same thing at all. I said that the things that he said are what I would consider LAMIST, but not that he had scummy intentions behind them or that he is being deceitful in some way. You said that he is specifically saying these things as if he is faking something. I seriously doubt that you can't see a difference after I already explained.

If that's so then I think that is an incredibly scummy early stance to take on a player with as much LHF potential as Wheme. I also think your incredulity at my disapproval towards your answers is completely overblown.

???

In post 1062, unwnd wrote:Listen.

I really do think Cakez is town. The argumentative process he gets in with people is at such a slight that I can't imagine he wouldn't at least be self-aware as scum. The lack of care in that department makes me think he's a townie who is just strongly defiant, getting into a back+forth like Imperium because of his beliefs. Even the minor squabble with Duchess/MUSH as well. I struggle to see ulterior motive with pushing the issue so incessantly that Tammycho breaks out

THIS TEXT

and tells him to stop misrepping. I mean, at that point..what have you exactly won? What does Cakez gain as scum to keep pushing and pushing and pushing at this point. The read he has on Imperium feels almost personable at this point. Like it's gone beyond merely 'I scumread you' and more like Cakez wanting to convince Imperium that they're scum lol. A foolhardy choice, but this itself makes me think the intent is pure. Let me get it clear: I don't think Cakez is incapable of faking this or even building a narrative around his own absurdity. I just believe he'd be more precise with it and if it

did

come at the expense of himself (and how others read him), he'd be using that to greater effect. We've seen it before and I've seen a defiant scum cakez, where as scum the issue is not disagreement of (read), rather disagreement of (himself).

In post 1088, ScrewTheTells wrote: -- Duchess. There's something there but my most confident takes on Duchess isn't that confident unfortunately. I think the biggest tell is that their activity seems to suspiciously coincide with what other players want. When other players cast suspicion on them, they make a flurry of posts. Otherwise they don't say much. At least that's the impression of the timing I get. When Imperium called them out vocally they responded and made a huge wall. I don't see any strong indicators in the content of the wall itself. No great towntells anyway. But the manner and timing of delivering what people asked just seems like scum covering their ass. This goes with what Lotus said before about Duchess seeming to regurgitate other people's reads. It would be a similar mentality.

In post 1060, petapan wrote:

In post 617, Imperium wrote:

In post 616, SirCakez wrote:

In post 603, Imperium wrote:Luckily I'm pretty sure town!Cakez is the only person in this playerlist bad enough to shoot us and I'm not yet entirely convinced town!Cakez is a thing.

Also c'mon I know you're above insulting me like this as town
Not good AtE

I'm not a perfect person

THERE'S MANY THINGS I WISH I DIDN'T DO

In post 1022, MUSHSHAGANA wrote:If it helps, it's a pretty vanilla take-away from a post talking about how they have the power of Bayesian reasoning and probabilities on their side so they are so good at this that you shouldn't even try them.

Imperium wrote: This post helped my emotional state.
You are my rock and you are a wonderful person. If you are scum then you are a heartless sociopath and you will not be invited to the barbeque.

Not_Mafia wrote:I'm shooting Cakez if I get the gun

In post 1129, Dunnstral wrote:

In post 1126, MUSHSHAGANA wrote:I'm going down for the night. One last question.

Where the hell is Dunnstral today?

What do you mean?

In post 1145, Not_Mafia wrote:No

In post 1124, SirCakez wrote:Another reason not to shoot NM - we probably just lose if he's town lmao

In post 1137, SirCakez wrote:Other then Mush I like your stack a lot STT