Mafiascum.net

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:03 am**

OK, I do not see a world where we have two millers.
I did get some nasty flashbacks from a game where I was a Town-Universal Backup though, and I fought the "claimed Miller"-lynch until the end..

I believe that same game had a Doc and other useful stuff as well, and I got slapped with a Miller-tag starting from N2.

Anyhoo, I guess we are ready for the lynch now?
Don't think much of anything useful will come from the scumteam anymore, now that one of them is already caught red-handed?

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:04 am**

Okay so I did some research, not a boat load, but I found one very helpful in my search for normal where 2 people claimed miller.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... it=millers

Now sadly both were town that game, which created a shit show to say the least, but I do not see the same issue here as in that game and thanks to one player in the game there doesn't look to be anything ever shown as 2 millers in a normal.
Now as a mod from days of old, I will say there is nothing unnormal about 2 millers in a normal game.
Is it WIFOM? Yup.
I'd lynch drew of manv if it was just the 2 of them, right now I'm on wait mode.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:08 am**

In post 125, UnaBombaH wrote:OK, I do not see a world where we have two millers.
I did get some nasty flashbacks from a game where I was a Town-Universal Backup though, and I fought the "claimed Miller"-lynch until the end..
I believe that same game had a Doc and other useful stuff as well, and I got slapped with a Miller-tag starting from N2.

Anyhoo, I guess we are ready for the lynch now?
Don't think much of anything useful will come from the scumteam anymore, now that one of them is already caught red-handed?

And Unabomb continues being a scum read.
Fun
Salad is on my scum list too. If I get this game solved by day 1, I'm going to be really smug in future games.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:21 am**

In post 113, Tanner wrote:Oh, 2 Miller claims. lol that's brilliant.

Though I'd say not to rush with the Day. Mavs, how come you didn't claim first post?

pedit: I'm not sure. 2 Millers isn't impossible, but I guess it's more likely one of them is lying.

I’ll preface this with I think you’re town, post 67 picks Persivul over Drew where I feel scum wouldn’t pick this battle or push against a vote for Drew.

By why didn’t you ask Drew-Sta why he didn’t claim miller first post rather than claim it in 79 which was his 8th post of the game? Just curious.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:25 am**

I mean just the fact that 2 town millers in a game can lead to 2 back to back town mislynches. That's just way too powerful for scum.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:27 am**

In post 129, Knightmare491 wrote:I mean just the fact that 2 town millers in a game can lead to 2 back to back town mislynches. That's just way too powerful for scum.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:47 am**

In post 128, mavsfan41 wrote:By why didn’t you ask Drew-Sta why he didn’t claim miller first post rather than claim it in 79 which was his 8th post of the game? Just curious.

Because (1) his claim was slightly convoluted (linking a quote from the wiki page instead of just flat out saying what he's claiming) and I wanted to make sure his claim is black on white out in the open, and (2) I was slightly taken aback by him implying that he'd be a mafia kill over a

literally mod confirmed innocent child

that simply I didn't think of asking him that.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:49 am**

In post 67, Tanner wrote:Una, could you elaborate on 26?

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:06 am**

While I'll admit I've only skimmed the game (been busy today), I'm of the view that there's no way there's two millers. Without the time to properly look at both players posts I can't say if I trust Drew over mavs, but I also don't see the logic in mavs fake claiming miller day one either as if we lynch Drew and he's actually a miller, we definitely lynch mavs right after, so would be an awful play just from a logic standpoint. Meaning just from that thought process it makes Drew almost guarenteed scum. (Pretty sure someone earlier pointed out they pushed for votes, but then didn't vote anyone, which is also rather scummy.

More than happy to see a Drew lynch today

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:09 am**

V/LA until Monday

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:37 am**

@Prana Devil: with a counter-claim, that means at least one is scum right? If I were scum and fake claiming Drew’s miller claim, that would effectively be trading one scum for the miller (drew flips miller and I’m lynched as a liar day 2). That’s such a horrible deal for scum and why would I fake claim a miller to force a mislynch of a miller? Drew fake claimed miller cause he thought he could get away with it. Or else he should just fake claim cop/nurse as a last resort. That way a counterclaim outs the cop/nurse. And he’s trading one scum for a townie power role. But to think scum!Mavs would fake counterclaim a miller to force a mislynch of miller!Drew is ludicrous.

Also, quick note: for Drew to fake claim miller, he needed everyone to post first (to see if they’d claim miller) before he could make the fake claim assuming no one was miller. He was not the last person to post, that honor belongs to Saladman27. So if Drew didn’t fake claim with his first couple of posts but only fake claimed AFTER Saladman27 posted, methinks Saladman27 is town. Drew was also the second to last person to post meaning Saladman27 was the ONLY person left to post after Drew had entered the game. In simple terms, Drew had his miller fake claim ready to start the game. Posted but didn’t claim miller in fear of a possibility that Saladman27 could potentially be a miller.

The official mavs Potential scum teammates as of now are any of:
Riabi
George Bailey
Luca Blight
UnaBombaH
Prana Devil

Honorable mention:
Knightmare (Tanner does bring up a good point)

Thoughts?

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:47 am**

I like your analysis, however it assumes that scum!Drew had the Miller claim ready from the start. Which

could

be the case, but we can't know for certain. If he saw votes building up on him, it's possible he thought of the claim as a way to escape the votes or if a scummate told him to (provided scum has an Encryptor).

And of course, it all assumes Drew flips scum, and while it is my current bet, I wouldn't call it a 100% certainty.

I think at the moment I mostly agree with your list. Other than what I've already said about Knightmare (wasn't pushing Drew until the cc), I'm suspocious of him for somewhat unrelated reasons.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 10:33 am**

/sigh

I’ve just woken up. I am miller.

I will be a semi useful lynch. Do it, and make sure you use the info properly.

I classify this as a shit lynch by stand by my statement that a shit lynch will tell you something.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 10:34 am**

*but stand by, not by stand by.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 10:38 am**

In post 128, mavsfan41 wrote:
In post 113, Tanner wrote:Oh, 2 Miller claims. lol that's brilliant.

Though I'd say not to rush with the Day. Mavs, how come you didn't claim first post?

pedit: I'm not sure. 2 Millers isn't impossible, but I guess it's more likely one of them is lying.
I’ll preface this with I think you’re town, post 67 picks Persivul over Drew where I feel scum wouldn’t pick this battle or push against a vote for Drew.

By why didn’t you ask Drew-Sta why he didn’t claim miller first post rather than claim it in 79 which was his 8th post of the game? Just curious.

I didn’t role claim as I hadn’t checked the wiki until that point.

I’ve honestly never played a Miller before.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 10:40 am**

Okay, what will your shit lynch tell us then?

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 11:02 am**

In post 140, Tanner wrote:Okay, what will your shit lynch tell us then?

Luca being AFK is of interest. Seems a good way not to get his hands dirty in the lynch then claim ignorance / that the lynch was shit.

I agree with Farside that UnaBomber's posts are beginning to smell. Their not being open to the possibility of two millers appears to me to be them accepting an easy way to lynch me to get to night.

I believe mav is also a miller (no need to claim, it is ludicrous to consider he's doing so to cover himself as a scum player). Thus, you have three townies cleared in a 13 player game. That makes narrowing down easier, and I'd look at those who are simply 'floating along' at this point as potential mafia.

I'm reading through page five. I'd just like to note that, while I only claimed on post 8, mav only claimed on post 2 and it was in response to my claim. He's using the fact I was waiting to see who came online. Now, by that thought process, I was waiting for everyone so I could role claim. The reality is everyone had posted well before I role claimed. I wasn't waiting to see if anyone would role claim it at all. I simply didn't read the wiki very quickly. I recognise that seems like a shit excuse but hey, telling the truth makes you look like an idiot sometimes.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:06 pm**

@Drew-Sta: what’s your feelings on George Bailey?

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:23 pm**

In post 135, mavsfan41 wrote:@Prana Devil: with a counter-claim, that means at least one is scum right? If I were scum and fake claiming Drew’s miller claim, that would effectively be trading one scum for the miller (drew flips miller and I’m lynched as a liar day 2). That’s such a horrible deal for scum and why would I fake claim a miller to force a mislynch of a miller? Drew fake claimed miller cause he thought he could get away with it. Or else he should just fake claim cop/nurse as a last resort. That way a counterclaim outs the cop/nurse. And he’s trading one scum for a townie power role. But to think scum!Mavs would fake counterclaim a miller to force a mislynch of miller!Drew is ludicrous.

That's pretty much what I said.

Drew is saying there's two millers, and trying to suggest that means there is "3 townies" but... that only works if we assume double miller is a good setup, and I'm not so sure I buy that. It weakens town massively.

I will say though, if we have any millers at all, that means we must have a cop of some description, which means we should try not to announce to many "confirmed" town... mainly because on the off chance we did have two millers, well... scum have 3 town players they can avoid shooting if they're wanting to hit a cop.

That being said... and this may be a ludicrous idea, but it's in my head and I'd rather post it for others to chime in on. What if we don't have ANY millers? What if it's a double bluff from scum? We lynch one of them, the other coasts to victory under a "confirmed town" heading.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:27 pm**

In post 56, Saladman27 wrote:That's why scum would put someone at L-2, to avoid the sus of hammering town.

Honestly, I feel like Scum would be the hesitant voter, for fear of looking scummy.

In post 61, UnaBombaH wrote:I'd be interested in a thing I've never seen or done before.
Feel free to call me a dummy dumb-dumb if it suits you, but
what if we all agree that Wake doesn't vote for anyone today?

Hear me out - we obviously want his input and reads throughout the day as much as possible, simply because he is the only conf.town in the game so far.
But we won't be able to lynch scum 100% of the time D1 anyway, even if we had three conf.townies.
So my point is, that
whoever we end up lynching D1, and whatever their flip might end up being, the wagon will only consist of unconfirmed players.

Does that make sense for anyone?

I can see why this sounds good on paper, but the fact that a confirmed town wont be spearheading the lynch makes the push less valuable. I think the whole point of the IC is that their word is much more valuable than a regular player.

In post 102, Knightmare491 wrote:Any reason why you chose to question farside and not PD? He unvoted first.

Because PD gave a brief reason for doing so, as Farside's was a naked vote.

In post 118, mavsfan41 wrote:Drew’s miller claim had to come after everyone had a chance to post assuming the miller would claim with their first post. If he’s got scum mates, then he KNOWS they’re not the miller and MUST ONLY wait for the townies to post without a claim to snatch up that role.

But Mavs, you pretty much did the same thing. You counter claimed him like 5 pages in. And It's not impossible to have two millers in the game. I don't really think that's a scum-trait. Plus, Drew even said there's probably gonna be a vig that shoots him. It's probably a better bet to let that happen tonight.

VOTE: Saladman

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:31 pm**

In post 142, mavsfan41 wrote:@Drew-Sta: what’s your feelings on George Bailey?

I’m curious about his posts TBH. Which is why I made a huff about Tanner’s posts about him. It appears like buddying. Which would be very obvious if it was.

Georges posts from 1-5 were normal for game start.

6-8 appeared like he was justifying trains, as a form of pressure. I’m not against votes and while bad lynched aren’t good, they do tell us stuff. However, he seemed a little more blasé on it than I’d like.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:35 pm**

In post 144, GeorgeBailey wrote:
In post 56, Saladman27 wrote:That's why scum would put someone at L-2, to avoid the sus of hammering town.
Honestly, I feel like Scum would be the hesitant voter, for fear of looking scummy.

In post 61, UnaBombaH wrote:I'd be interested in a thing I've never seen or done before.
Feel free to call me a dummy dumb-dumb if it suits you, but
what if we all agree that Wake doesn't vote for anyone today?

Hear me out - we obviously want his input and reads throughout the day as much as possible, simply because he is the only conf.town in the game so far.
But we won't be able to lynch scum 100% of the time D1 anyway, even if we had three conf.townies.
So my point is, that
whoever we end up lynching D1, and whatever their flip might end up being, the wagon will only consist of unconfirmed players.

Does that make sense for anyone?
I can see why this sounds good on paper, but the fact that a confirmed town wont be spearheading the lynch makes the push less valuable. I think the whole point of the IC is that their word is much more valuable than a regular player.

In post 102, Knightmare491 wrote:Any reason why you chose to question farside and not PD? He unvoted first.
Because PD gave a brief reason for doing so, as Farside's was a naked vote.

In post 118, mavsfan41 wrote:Drew’s miller claim had to come after everyone had a chance to post assuming the miller would claim with their first post. If he’s got scum mates, then he KNOWS they’re not the miller and MUST ONLY wait for the townies to post without a claim to snatch up that role.
But Mavs, you pretty much did the same thing. You counter claimed him like 5 pages in. And It's not impossible to have two millers in the game. I don't really think that's a scum-trait. Plus, Drew even said there's probably gonna be a vig that shoots him. It's probably a better bet to let that happen tonight.

VOTE: Saladman

That’s a better post.

I would encourage the vig to shoot me straight up. It removes doubt, is a safe kill (you won’t hit another townie you might need) and allows you to better analyse the day where I have been alive.

IC is far better to keep alive as you always have a neutral and trusted voice.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:38 pm**

In post 145, Drew-Sta wrote: 6-8 appeared like he was justifying trains, as a form of pressure. I’m not against votes and while bad lynched aren’t good, they do tell us stuff. However, he seemed a little more blasé on it than I’d like.

I understand, since I haven't commented on Persivul's slot. I think 68 is probably his towniest post so far, which brings him out of null for me.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:40 pm**

In post 144, GeorgeBailey wrote:
Plus, Drew even said there's probably gonna be a vig that shoots him.
It's probably a better bet to let that happen tonight.

Sorry, what? When did that happen?

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:47 pm**

@George Bailey: so you’d rather let scum!Drew-Sta off the hook and lynch someone who might be town rather than someone extremely likely to be scum? I think you should’ve just bus’ed him rather than try this damage control plan.

George Bailey/Drew-Sta and anyone have a guess on the third?

Also who said anything about a vig? We might not even have a vig in the game. One of you guys hasta be scum bulletproof for you to believe there’s a vig.

@PranaDevil: I had never considered a double scum miller fake claim. Damn!!!! Next time I’m scum I’m stealing that one. That’s brilliant! Alas, not clever enough to have thought of that for this to be the case here though

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