Micro 1003: Divide and Conquer - Game Over!

[Infinity 324]

Yes thats true

but as infomation changes and your reasons are addressed/answered... you change your vote no?

if you dont just hand wave it and keep voting the same person...

Hectic's reasons weren't addressed/answered though

[Infinity 324]

This is getting circular

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Hectic's reasons weren't addressed/answered though

Yes they were I'll quote them for you

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Pooky if you want the reasons why I think you could be scum and have been on the back of No Face's mind:

In the last coalition game you played as town, you were really excited about the prospect of a day 1 win and actively pushed hard for it. But while doing this you were also outting lots of reads are trying to win the game by finding town and scum

In this game, you acted similarly about the big day 1 win but did nothing to help it like giving reads or finding town/scum. It's like you're going through the motions but not doing the fieldwork I saw you were eager to do in that coalition game

:/

1. That coalition game was me and koba hydra'd and we were both spamming the game cuz when you put 2 alpha-shitposters in a hydra you get an alpha-shitposter squared.

2. my reads that game weren't very good - pretty much had a scum in my coalition the whole time, I was wrong about farren almost the entire way I think?

3. me taking over the thread that game actually stagnated the game state because once everyone was like "ok bear is obvtown and we will sheep them" - the game state slowed down dramatically and people stopped posting as much and we ended up getting bored and not having really an idea of what to do.

4. the only thing I thought I did successfully that game was abuse norwee enough to the point where he obvtown'd himself. I felt kind of bad about that afterwards and I think I'm better at reading him now so I don't think I need to resort to a full scale shitpush just to sort his slot anymore.

Okay

I just read Norwee by waiting for someone else to push him and seeing how he reacts 2_2

[Ydrasse]

Yes thats true

but as infomation changes and your reasons are addressed/answered... you change your vote no?

if you dont just hand wave it and keep voting the same person...

pooky this is an issue i have w you this game

why does someone have to change their vote just because they engage with you?

like, honestly you’re getting frustrated where i’m reconsidering if you are scum or not but you seem to be like... trying to make it out like he is /obligated/ to change his vote after talking to you and it’s scummy just because he doesn’t think your reasoning is towny

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

if you think person A is scummy because of ______ reason

and they address _____ reason,

and you think their explanation makes sense and _____ reason is no longer valid,

you would change your mind on person A

unless _____ reason was never important to you in the first place.

unless you don't actually care what person A's alignment is.

Thought formation in the head works two ways:


(1) Reason ____ -> Person A is scum.

and

(2) I want to kill Person A, what's a good excuse for doing it? How about Reason _____


(1) is a townie thought process, you see something suspicious and it leads you to a suspect and you want to push them for an explanation.

(2) is a scum thought process, you need a mis-elim and you are looking for reasons to justify your mis-elim push.


(2) is exclusively what Farkran used to push me in Mini 2200, he would make up a reason to suspect me, and when I addressed his reason, he would just move on to a new reason, never really stopping to re-evaluate my alignment.

It was only after I hardclaimed strong TPR that he stopped his push.

That's why I was so sure Farkran was scum, because (2) is used by scum to get mis-elims whereas (1) is a townie actually looking for bad guys.

[No Face]

Pooky, those coalition reasons were why you were nullscum rather than null at the time I voted you. I think I've made it very clear that I scumread you for entirely different reasons at this point:

-Characterizing my vote as driving a mislem/voting to kill, when it wasn't
-Saying I should reevaluate you because Bingle is also voting you and I have Bingle also in my PoE, when they were independent reads, not team ones
-skitter is acting very strange around you and I think you're partners

I just haven't felt like you're arguing in good faith whenever I've engaged with you, and I'm not sure why you expect me to change my mind or vote based on it :y

[No Face]

Pooky... Pooky.. Pooky... you're now trying to make it a big deal that I didn't reevaulate you after you addressed my coalition reasons I guess?

let me make it very clear:

>I vote you because I townread 4 others and you were nullscum for the coalition reasons
>You pushed back on me and I started scumreading that pushback
>You addressed those coliation reasons
>I continue voting you because I scumread you for stronger other reasons

Get it?.?

[Infinity 324]

Hectic's reasons weren't addressed/answered though

Yes they were I'll quote them for you

The PoE wasn't addressed though

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Hectic's reasons weren't addressed/answered though

Yes they were I'll quote them for you

The PoE wasn't addressed though

It's not even possible to address a PoE.

Am I supposed to find reasons that he should have for townreading me that he didn't see? He could just argue those reasons are NAI or performed by scum me to get townread.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

-Saying I should reevaluate you because Bingle is also voting you and I have Bingle also in my PoE, when they were independent reads, not team ones
-skitter is acting very strange around you and I think you're partners

This again is fitting the worldview to the mis-elim.

When presented with evidence that his read on the game doesn't fit with the elim he's driving at, he will just change his worldview to one that does fit with the elim he is driving at.

"oh bingle doesn't work with pooky as a scum partner? well let's use skitter then!"

[Infinity 324]

Hectic's reasons weren't addressed/answered though

Yes they were I'll quote them for you

The PoE wasn't addressed though

It's not even possible to address a PoE.

Am I supposed to find reasons that he should have for townreading me that he didn't see? He could just argue those reasons are NAI or performed by scum me to get townread.

No you have to address why the reasons for townreading other people are wrong. That's how a PoE works.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

>I vote you because I townread 4 others and you were nullscum for the coalition reasons
>You pushed back on me and I started scumreading that pushback
>You addressed those coliation reasons
>I continue voting you because I scumread you for stronger other reasons

You say you scumread me for my reaction and pushback.

But when I ask you for why my reaction/pushback make sense from a scum!pov, you say you don't know.

again not a real thought process or good faith on your part.

[No Face]

>I vote you because I townread 4 others and you were nullscum for the coalition reasons
>You pushed back on me and I started scumreading that pushback
>You addressed those coliation reasons
>I continue voting you because I scumread you for stronger other reasons

You say you scumread me for my reaction and pushback.

But when I ask you for why my reaction/pushback make sense from a scum!pov, you say you don't know.

again not a real thought process or good faith on your part.

It could be from scum!you for a few reasons, I said I don't know the exact reason and don't need to...

If you want possible reasons:
-You like 1v1s and feel comfortable in them
-You thought you could win this 1v1
-You assumed I or others would think that you wouldn't try and 1v1 me as scum
-You believed in your reasoning as scum and thought it would make you look towny, which is why you pursued this 1v1

It doesn't matter to me. It reads of bad faith .-.

[No Face]

-Saying I should reevaluate you because Bingle is also voting you and I have Bingle also in my PoE, when they were independent reads, not team ones
-skitter is acting very strange around you and I think you're partners

This again is fitting the worldview to the mis-elim.

When presented with evidence that his read on the game doesn't fit with the elim he's driving at, he will just change his worldview to one that does fit with the elim he is driving at.

"oh bingle doesn't work with pooky as a scum partner? well let's use skitter then!"

You're talking in big picture mode but not addressing my actual reasons on why skitter's behavior is really strange around you e_E

[No Face]

Sorry, I really think you're scum. Even the way you're acting in this 1v1 feels really different to me

You thought I was scum in Undertale when we 1v1ed there and you felt completely different - you were full of compassion, constantly worried you might wrong, and sad rather than frustrated

You feel like scum on the ropes here

:1

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

No you have to address why the reasons for townreading other people are wrong. That's how a PoE works.

you do realize that in practice all that does is recruit allies to his side and he can just dismiss my argument for why ___ is scum and that ___ will end up supporting him right?

This is why PoE pushes are good where you need to force a 1v1 in a 1-guranteed scum pool - you are recruiting allies and you can't really get deflected.

[Infinity 324]

I'm done with this argument

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

It could be from scum!you for a few reasons, I said I don't know the exact reason and don't need to...

If you want possible reasons:
-You like 1v1s and feel comfortable in them
-You thought you could win this 1v1
-You assumed I or others would think that you wouldn't try and 1v1 me as scum
-You believed in your reasoning as scum and thought it would make you look towny, which is why you pursued this 1v1

It doesn't matter to me. It reads of bad faith .-.

I've literally already addressed this

It doesn't matter in the Scum!Me world if I win this 1v1 or not.

Either (a) scum!me gets killed by you and I lose.

or

(b) I kill you, I die the next day, you say only skitter makes sense as my partner so she dies next and we lose?

Like why would I even put myself through that experience by pursuing a 1v1 with you? It's ridiculous you think I bother doing this when I'm going to lose at the end of it no matter what if I'm scum.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Sorry, I really think you're scum. Even the way you're acting in this 1v1 feels really different to me

You thought I was scum in Undertale when we 1v1ed there and you felt completely different - you were full of compassion, constantly worried you might wrong, and sad rather than frustrated

You feel like scum on the ropes here

:1

cuz I was a lot less sure of whether you were the last scum in that game so that was agonizing.

[No Face]

It could be from scum!you for a few reasons, I said I don't know the exact reason and don't need to...

If you want possible reasons:
-You like 1v1s and feel comfortable in them
-You thought you could win this 1v1
-You assumed I or others would think that you wouldn't try and 1v1 me as scum
-You believed in your reasoning as scum and thought it would make you look towny, which is why you pursued this 1v1

It doesn't matter to me. It reads of bad faith .-.

I've literally already addressed this

It doesn't matter in the Scum!Me world if I win this 1v1 or not.

Either (a) scum!me gets killed by you and I lose.

or

(b) I kill you, I die the next day, you say only skitter makes sense as my partner so she dies next and we lose?

Like why would I even put myself through that experience by pursuing a 1v1 with you? It's ridiculous you think I bother doing this when I'm going to lose at the end of it no matter what if I'm scum.

Well it looks that way now, but when this thing started, you probably didn't anticipate it'd be looking like this a few days down the line. Maybe you were hoping for it to be called a TvT by most, or that people thought your reasoning was towny so you were towny regardless :?

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I'm done with this argument

fine but just promise me you elim him next ok? I'm sick of talking about this thing that's so obvious that apparently nobody but me can see anyway

[No Face]

If you're actually town, then sure, I'd take the yeet next and join you for some salt memes in the dead thread lol

but I don't think so :2

[Infinity 324]

I'm done with this argument

fine but just promise me you elim him next ok? I'm sick of talking about this thing that's so obvious that apparently nobody but me can see anyway

I'll strongly consider it, I avenged you in jk9++ remember?

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Well it looks that way now, but when this thing started, you probably didn't anticipate it'd be looking like this a few days down the line. Maybe you were hoping for it to be called a TvT by most, or that people thought your reasoning was towny so you were towny regardless

so now I'm 1v1ing you in order to try to look town? is my reaction townie or scummy dude? like make up your mind