Nintendo Mafia (Game Over)

[esuriospiritus]

Also prodded! \o/

Not posting tonight. Will tomorrow. Going to bed soon.

[lewarcher82]

also prodded (????)

Also prodded! \o/

Not posting tonight. Will tomorrow. Going to bed soon.

esurio: this is the last damn day before deadline! What the hell!

I am perfectly happy with my vote on Ythan. He appears to be grasping at straws and pretending he had pro-town reasons to what he did, but he most evidently has none. If he were doc, he would have considered the options, and wondered about the reasons of the events. He also did not ISO jmj and posted inaccurate references to the death flavour. Moreover, I am still under the impression that his case on thil can be analysed as a scumslip, since it would make sense in a context in which scum had some specific informative role. I still sponsor and promote a wagon on him, and the offer (and my vote) remain(s) valid til before deadline. If necessary to avoid a no-lynch, I will then move my vote to Dana.

I also insist in considering unlikely for scum to kill hohum, because he was scummy, and I notie that no one seems to be willing to challenge this point. As Ythan's survival is pretty much based on the implications of a 2-scumkills reconstruction, it is crucial to see it through, and still he is as hasty in ignoring this point as he was in posting an aproximate and flawed analysis of the death flavors.

Finally, at this point I am highly suspicious of the members of the voting bloc. A mass of pro-town players do not waste time lurking while waiting for deadlines to expire. I invite whoever has investigative night-actions not to assume that an investigation on a voting-bloc member would be wasted.

[The Master Hand]

It was a massprod, guys. Read your PMs.

We're planning a joint-post and stuff, but I agree with alot of what lew said in the post above this one:
-Ythan is still scum
-The "voting bloc" is comprised of, and headed by, scum

-The Baker and The Toaster

[thil13]

We already passed the deadline guys, so it's now or never.

Right now the only feasible is Dana, so

VOTE: Dana

That is L-1 and I'm gonna ask for a name and role claim from Dana.

[Dekes]

We already passed the deadline guys, so it's now or never.

Right now the only feasible is Dana, so VOTE: Dana

That is L-1 and I'm gonna ask for a name and role claim from Dana.

The first time your are commanding and it fails. You acknowledge we have passed the deadline and you continue to vote not for the lynch, but for the claim. Which makes it clear, you are not following the thread at all. Dana has already claimed his name and role: Anju, VT.

Last time you mentioned dana (and the only time today) you said, he looks like he's posting without really adding anything. Can you give examples of that?

@mod:
Was the deadline in your latest vote count updated? The front page says the deadline has expired while the last vc indicates we have two more days left. Is this an extension?

Looking at the flips, it should be noted that Ythan's and dana's claim match with what we've seen so far while thil's doesn't. Of course, this is barring any fakeclaims scum probably have. I think we should consider mass nameclaiming tomorrow, since the game may be at least partially breakable.

With only one night of three kills, NK-speculation is too early to be useful. I can see hohum's death coming from any faction and even E_Lou Sivre doesn't have to be a clean vigshot, although it fits the mo of a vig.

Important:
I am responsible for no deaths N1. And no actions at all for that matter. I'm a JOAT, one of them was a mass block. I pretty much wasted all of my actions and the only informative thing is that PatB is a bit more likely town (which becomes a lot more likely looking at his recent play).

@lewarcher
Why do you keep dodging PatB inquiry on what you think of thil's play independently from Ythan's antics and thil's claim?

TMH is still wrong in oh so, many aspects. The amount of misrepping in his posts is astounding. And I have no idea why he's so scared of the voting block which hasn't acted like one pretty much since D2. It may have been comprised, pianist's town read is long gone and esurio - just like me - has to pick it up big time, but the block is no threat at all if it's not working like one.

@dana
Depending on what the mod has to say about the deadline, you should expand on your scum reads. Those could be your parting words because as of now you are the only lynch if one happens. We've seen your Kdub case and your list of nulls. Anything changed since then?

Back tonight.

[jmj3000]

Latest vote count also has the latest deadline. I forgot to put the extended deadline in the OP.

[Kdub]

Looking at the flips, it should be noted that Ythan's and dana's claim match with what we've seen so far while thil's doesn't. Of course, this is barring any fakeclaims scum probably have. I think we should consider mass nameclaiming tomorrow, since the game may be at least partially breakable.

Not sure what you mean here. What is wrong with thil's claim compared to the flips we've seen? And I highly doubt scum would not have safeclaims in this type of game.

I am responsible for no deaths N1. And no actions at all for that matter. I'm a JOAT, one of them was a mass block. I pretty much wasted all of my actions and the only informative thing is that PatB is a bit more likely town (which becomes a lot more likely looking at his recent play).

Good to know. This claim is very likely true (otherwise any sort of investigative role with a N1 result could counterclaim it), and I don't see scum using this role and then waiting until late D3 to claim it for town credit.

[Pinky and the Brain]

Spoiler: @ thil (who is scum, read on)

However, I don't think Ythan would be the best lynch, sure he dies, but if he really is the doctor, that leaves me out in the firing line. I'm not entirely convinced that Ythan is scum, just completely arrogant.

Okay, who do we lynch? And why are you still not voting?

WHY HAVE YOU NOT VOTED ALL DAY?!

All you have been doing is pointing every last detail about my actions, call them scummy, and dismiss what I say and label it scummy posting. I would say YOU sir, are being disingenuous.

Honestly, I say both, because I would now say he is scum, and lying to kill off a PR. His severe tunneling and attacking of me is almost out of the blue, and the reasons against it he is completely ignoring. He has just been non-stop attacking me with points against me, and has almost entirely ignored my defense. The problem is,

he's succeeding.

I expect you to know the consequences of playing a deplorably scummy game.

And yet you don't want to lynch Ythan and also have not voted for him

ALL GAME

?


And thil, why you dodging this?

C, a counter claim should be outright and not just a small hint. Counter claiming is a big move that will show who is scum and who isn't. The fact that he sort of played around it didn't make me think he was cop.

Besides, I already AM the cop

.

Pine, it would be no surprise to me if there were more than one cop with the amount of people that signed up for this, so unless the mod wanted to put in every obscure role, he may have doubled roles, but that's just what I think. There very well could be another cop, or more than one doctor/vig/whatever.

thil, don't these contradict each other? Leaving aside the

way

in which Ythan would have been allegedly breadcrumbing/soft-CC'ing, you're saying that you are

the

[implying one and only]

cop

(as an additional reason for doubting a Ythan cop counter-claim), yet earlier you said you wouldn't be suprised with more than one cop.

Thanks for dodging, thil.

With a mass-prod I still hold out hope of the masses coming to this thread and realising how obvious scum thil is.

WE STILL HAVE TIME, PEOPLE.

Let me summarise thil's play today for you.

• "I'M NOT SCUM, I PINKY-SWEAR"
  
• "YTHAN YOU ARE SCUMMY"
  
• <notable absence of Ythan vote - any vote, in fact>
  
• "ACTUALLY LET'S NOT LYNCH YTHAN"

Added to this to take account of recent posts:

• <dodges PatB's persistent pushing of obvthilscum>
  
• <dodges PatB's persistent pushing of obvthilscum>

More to say but no time, need to get this in so people vote thil.

[Bunnylover]

Prodded. I've already made it clear that I will not support a Ythan or thil lynch today. Barring any major revelations, I'm sticking with a dana lynch.

Regarding the speculation on kill flavors and number of kills, I still do not see how that implies anything about thil's alignment, which is what this whole thing came out of. Beyond that, I suppose we'll find out more after seeing what happens tonight, but I don't think it's productive discuss it further right now.

What where your reason for not supporting a Ythan lynch again?

[Kdub]

I don't think he is acting scummy and I believe his claim.

[Dekes]

Not sure what you mean here. What is wrong with thil's claim compared to the flips we've seen? And I highly doubt scum would not have safeclaims in this type of game.

What have all flipped VTs and Goons in common that differs from the (mafia) PR? Now compare that to dana's, thil's and Ythan's claims (I take with Ythan's claim with a grain of salt, since I'm pretty sure, he'S picked up on it, too. But he is town regardless, so it's all good).

Actually,

Unvote; Vote: thil

I like PatB's case and outside of thil's claim, there's nothing that warrants a town read. If he is the cop and there's a mafia roleblocker, we won't get any info anyway and his day play can only be called a liability. If he is the mafia RB, yay for us!

Will settle for a dana lynch, since we'd only lose a VT there. Will not be voting Ythan today. But,

and this is important: people, who now post in the thread and don't have their vote on one of the wagons: Move your vote! We have less than two days before the extended deadline which was a gift from the mod.

[Bunnylover]

I don't think he is acting scummy and I believe his claim.

How do you feel on his whole "I protected the cop (thil) and since someone else died, Thil must be scum" action/reason?

[esuriospiritus]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Thil

Thil hasn't been on my town list for a while, and PatB brings up good points. In addition, I think Thil's flip would be a lot more informative than Dana's (and Dana I am feeling slightly better about since re-reading him and realizing he was an early Espeonage voter D2/3 + noting the "lynch me over Ythan" thing, which I believe is more likely coming from town than scum even though the logic is kinda weird).

@Mod:

Can you please edit the first post so that all replacements/originals are listed? ISOing is a pain when I don't know who replaced who half the time. Thanks!

[lewarcher82]

@dekes/patb: (they are pretty much acting like a tandem, as far as I see): I missed the question, thanks for pointing it out. Actually, if you ISO me you will see that I never believed the cases on thil, and I still do not. One can accuse him of posting very little content, but now that ythan's case on him revealed to be the creation of a mentally ill player, I defnitely think that:
1) thil's play is consistent with that of an unexperienced player who - being a PR - is unable to scumhunt and relies too much on mechanics;
2) being unexperienced, there is no way he would invent such a crazy claim;
3) pine did not overreact to the report, and he did it on purpose, to have people think thil was scum

PaTB's case on thil is generally based on thil's inability to post content and to handle questions. Imo he is a noob cop who found a guilty and he is being tunneled.

Also: I insist for the third time: hohum being a scum victim is unlikely, I oppose and contest the idea of assuming that there are only two killing parties: it is poorly motivated and, if there is a sk, it would help him a lot if we believe there is no sk. So it strategically stupid to start from that assumption. One of the players who insist on this theory is prolly a killing third party.

To conclude this post, I include an

unofficial vc

danakillsu - 4 - Kdub, GhostWriter, Ythan, Thil - (L-3)
Kdub - 1 - danakillsu - (L-6)
thil13 - 4 - Pinky and the Brain, Crazypianist1116, esuriospiritus, Dekes - (L-3)
Ythan - 3 - The Master Hand, lewarcher82, Bunnylover - (L-4)

Ironically Thil and Ythan are voting the same player. Kdub, are you really convinced both claimed PR are genuine and the whole war was about both being playing a very poor game? I don't, and I insist on the fact that Ythan's case on thil contains an unclear but pretty evident scumslip.

We have three viable wagons, not two. Please open your eyes and lynch Ythan already.

[lewarcher82]

mod: could you start posting the deadline in the form month/day/hour, please? I find your countdowns rather confusing

[Kdub]

What have all flipped VTs and Goons in common that differs from the (mafia) PR? Now compare that to dana's, thil's and Ythan's claims (I take with Ythan's claim with a grain of salt, since I'm pretty sure, he'S picked up on it, too. But he is town regardless, so it's all good).

Hmm...I

think

I see what you are talking about, although I am still not convinced. I haven't played any of jmj's games before, but I would think that any mod qualified to run a large theme would have taken steps to guard against what you are getting at. Your idea of a mass nameclaim tomorrow might be feasible, obviously depending on the flips today and tonight.

How do you feel on his whole "I protected the cop (thil) and since someone else died, Thil must be scum" action/reason?

That reasoning makes no sense, as I said before. It should be obvious that a claimed cop would very likely draw protection, so someone else dying says nothing about thil.

Ironically Thil and Ythan are voting the same player. Kdub, are you really convinced both claimed PR are genuine and the whole war was about both being playing a very poor game? I don't, and I insist on the fact that Ythan's case on thil contains an unclear but pretty evident scumslip.

Yes, I think both thil and Ythan are telling the truth. Both are uncounterclaimed despite claiming very common PRs. thil's claim led directly to a scum lynch. Ythan had absolutely no scum motivation to gambit and fakeclaim doc there (especially if there are multiple non-town factions).

Like I said, I would reconsider my stance on thil if new evidence were to come up against him, but right now, I think he is likely town.

[Ythan]

RC's death is slightly different than the other two energy burn deaths. This is most likely connected to some ability or mechanic that caused both kills in the same night.

[lewarcher82]

yes it is. yes t does. therefore assuming that both deaths come from the same party is not motivated. this makes my question to the mode superfluous, but I ask it anyway.

mod: is there any reason why you ignore our request of updating the flavour in smashbro's death? shall we assume that there is no flavour to be added?

[Ythan]

What do you mean? The post? They're all updated on the front page.

[danakillsu]

Don't know why I was angrily prodded during my mentioned V/LA. But I'll be reading.

[danakillsu]

If you haven't seen vanilla town self-sacrifice to save a PR-claiming townread, then you've only seen stupid vanilla town in that position, imo.

No, I can't say I've seen that, and I doubt it is very common. I happen to think Ythan is town too, but if I were a VT, I would never sacrifice myself if it were between him and me. You know why? Because 1) I know that I am town whereas there is a chance, even if small, that he is scum, and 2) me getting lynched wouldn't remove pressure on him given the nature of the accusations he is facing. You're not going to convince anybody that sacrificing yourself is a reasonable town play, which is why it looks like a gambit to me.

1) Does not outweigh the fact that he is a PR and I am not.
2) Could be just as easily applied to me trying harder to defend myself. The same pressure is going to be on me tomorrow, so why would I try to get someone else lynched instead who I think is town? No, I want to at LEAST give Ythan another night of actions. If you're still wanting to lynch him tomorrow with whatever extra info you have, so be it. Doesn't mean I think it makes sense, though.

[The Master Hand]

So our ultimate consensus is that we're not lynching thil and we're not lynching dana, despite his pleas to do so. Vote stays on Ythan, and I don't think there is anything in the thil or dana case that will convince us otherwise.
-Toast

[jmj3000]

yes it is. yes t does. therefore assuming that both deaths come from the same party is not motivated. this makes my question to the mode superfluous, but I ask it anyway.

mod: is there any reason why you ignore our request of updating the flavour in smashbro's death? shall we assume that there is no flavour to be added?

What do you mean? I put SSBF's kill flavor in the death scene, and in the first post.

[lewarcher82]

yes it is. yes t does. therefore assuming that both deaths come from the same party is not motivated. this makes my question to the mode superfluous, but I ask it anyway.

mod: is there any reason why you ignore our request of updating the flavour in smashbro's death? shall we assume that there is no flavour to be added?

What do you mean? I put SSBF's kill flavor in the death scene, and in the first post.

oh, ok, I looked at the post in which he died, not at post 1... in ISO 34 you did not update it

allright, I like TMH's last post. I am not yet convinced that dana is town, because I have seen and done this I'm town lynch me gambit before, but what strikes me funny is that both thil and ythan are voting him... and I am convinced ythan is scum, while half the world seems to be convinced that thil is... the likelihood of a bus in the present condition is not neglectable, but it is not big either...

ythan is scum. ythan slipped in assuming a correlation between night actions that town players cannot see. ythan is not even defending. a doc who claimed for no reason would feel terribly, and would at least try to scumhunt and to avoid being lynched, to lynch another scum, to stay active one more night... is this what he is doing? He just posts one-liners discussing minor details... he wasn't even able to suggest an original case... after his plan to get thil lynched (hopefully) failed, all he could do was basically quitting posting content and moving the vote to a safe wagon.

you know what he is currently thinking? He hopes that you lynch the cop, and he is not on the wagon, so that he will be able to wifom his way out of day5 once we wake up and he is still alive tomorrow.

[The Master Hand]

Addendum: Last night Toast asked me if I thought I could shift a wagon onto one of our scumreads and push it to a lynch. Looking at where we're headed now, I don't think we're going to get anywhere close to a Dekes or pianist lynch, and a Ythan lynch is the only one I see plausible at this point.

Vote stays on Ythan. dana's sacrificial play is town. Thil is cop.

ythan is scum. ythan slipped in assuming a correlation between night actions that town players cannot see. ythan is not even defending. a doc who claimed for no reason would feel terribly, and would at least try to scumhunt and to avoid being lynched, to lynch another scum, to stay active one more night... is this what he is doing? He just posts one-liners discussing minor details... he wasn't even able to suggest an original case... after his plan to get thil lynched (hopefully) failed, all he could do was basically quitting posting content and moving the vote to a safe wagon.

you know what he is currently thinking? He hopes that you lynch the cop, and he is not on the wagon, so that he will be able to wifom his way out of day5 once we wake up and he is still alive tomorrow.

lew is right- no scum will buss their buddy now when they could just lurk for a no lynch. esurio's non-commitance right now /lack of posting is highly suspect.
Also, Dekes' claim is believeable, as N1 was N1 and had no result and blocked kills and crap like that.
YET, I think its just as likely to be scum as town.

-A