A Feast for Crows Mafia - Valar Morghulis.

[Eddard Stark]

Day 3, Votecount 6

MagnaofIllusion (2) - greenknight, Feysal

Shadow1psc (4) - MagnaofIllusion, Empking, Benmage, Wraith

Feysal (1) - Magua
Plum (3) - Mina, Cogito Ergo Sum, Shadow1psc
Wraith (1) - Mockingjaye

Not voting

(6) Bogre, Pine, Deity of Flame, Zdenek, Plum, Monday

With 17 votes in play it takes 9 to lynch.

• Deadline for Day 1
  : 9th of December at 17:05 (GMT)
  
• Countdown
  : (expired on 2011-12-09 13:05:25)
  
• Top.Of.The.Page.

[Pine]

Sup Wraith.

Can someone give me the Cliff notes of what's gone down so far, and where my vote ought to be?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Ludi's a tool, Mina's confirmed town, MoI and Plum are scum.

Mod

, fairly sure shadow's voting for the same Plum that Mina and I are voting for.

[Feysal]

22) Feysal (Gyles Rosby)

...

Green

= Town. Self-explanatory

I am surprised by this. Looking through your ISO I only found three mentions of my name, and the first two were that you had not noticed me being in the game, and that you had also missed me when listing players you had not heard much from. Then this. What looks particularly odd is that our reads don't really match at all. Of your three suspects, I listed CES as town, Shadow as leaning town and ABR as null. Why do you think I'm town, and a strong town read even?

By the way, the reason I've listed CES as town is for his questioning of Mina on day one. It looked like genuine probing to learn her alignment, and it worked too, at least I got a strong town read on Mina from her responses. I feel that the town confirmation was wasted on her.

Shadow makes a solid case on Plum in #1459. It indeed looks like she was caught, and not knowing how much Mina knew she revealed as much as she dared. Her post #1425 also reads to me as stalling for time, hoping for more information to be revealed so she can learn what she can get away with. I was in the same position recently myself, I remember clearly what it was like.

I find her claim that she did not kill anyone last night interesting. I forget who said it, but I've heard that our mods would not give scum a daykill unless it cost their kill the following night. Whoever killed Xalxe may have intended to make it look like a town-directed kill, but the absence of a credible scum kill last night makes it suspect to me. I'm considering the possibility that Plum in fact killed Xalxe, and told the truth about not killing anyone last night, because she couldn't. In that scenario she would be mafia.

There is of course the possibility that Plum is a serial killer, and a potential ally against the mafia, though the fact that she neglected to kill Ludi does not make her look trustworthy enough to help town. My, how different the world looks from the other side of the fence.

Unvote: MagnaofIllusion
Vote: Plum

[Wraith]

I'm still not exactly sure why we're lynching Plum. While a claimed Vig is an obvious cover for a Serial Killer, we don't really have proof she's lying beyond Mina saying she knows someone who knows...something.

[Bogre]

Bogre has failed to respond to his prod. Will also begin the search for a replacement for him

Noo, I'm almost caught up!

[Bogre]

Shadow, do you think Plum is scum who was given an additional kill?

I'm not sure. Plum could have been the expendable 'send in the kill' gal for being vanilla, and someone else could easily have had any other manner of kill. SK, strongman, whatever. I find the least amount of sense made in the scenario where scum would kill MoS (someone who had a lot of heat as it was) and not Hascow. On the other side of that coin, I could see Loras having some special kill. Maybe she lucked into the SK slot for that matter. Flavor/role not being indicative of alignment (for the most part) means anything could happen I guess.

Really, bad. Shadow gives possible kill results that seem random and baseless.

He has been probably my number 1 choice to lynch from my reread.

VOTE: Shadow

[Bogre]

Others who can hang, I'm not going to post a huge catchup wall:

Greenknight: He seems to do a lot of buddying, and his questions aren't very specific or clear in their purpose.
Empking: Doesn't read genuine at all.
Benmage: He really looks like he's trying too hard.
Monday: Seems to latch on to those who are already implicated by someone else.
Feysal: Arguments are weak, latching on to those who point suspicion her way.

[Plum]

Plum, 3 townreads

1 scum please.

You, Cogito (possibly), mockingjaye, greeknight (Mina obviously, I don't think you were asking that). Wraith scum (also Shadow!).

Mina - my gravest apologies.

Plum: Why didn't you express any suspicion of Hascow in the thread (beyond the random call for him to be vigged) or otherwise attempt to get more reads on him?

Because it was a busy Day 1. I chose poorly from among the suspects I couldn't pin down well &c.

Alright, Monday morning and caught up. I'll answer MoI in just a second but... wtf Plum, really? I mean... really? Why, in the world would you shoot cow over Ludi? Or like, anyone else? Seriously, I read #1420, but like, what?! Let's back up a second... you want to say that in 24 players, 1 scum kill happened n1, because you decided to be a bad vig? No one else thinks this is really low, and that Plum has been caught? That MoS, for whatever reason, was a more logical scum kill than Cow?

Seriously?

I'm confused. Two kills went down Night 1. I'm presuming that the other kill - the MoS kill - was the Mafia kill. Frankly, if MoS was an illogical scumkill, Oversoul appears an equally illogical, nay, stupid scumkill. The reasons for such odd deaths may or may not be linked. It's not really worth speculating on that right now. Are you saying that two scumkills Night 1 is much more reasonable in a game of this size than one scumkill and one Vig kill? Forgive me for saying so, but that's a stupid, stupid argument.

1) 25% of Plum's post count is in response to a soft-claimed scan. This would be a better statistic if Plum had contributed more than 25 posts in a (nearly) 1500 post game thus far. It's day 3, this is the definition of lurking in plain sight.

I've been busy, and my activity has suffered. Occasionally my all-too-gracious backup Mod has ended up doing votecounts - even a lynch scene - because I wasn't prompt enough. Yeah, I haven't been posting much. That's me and another four players. The reasons aren't based in this game.

2) Plum's first four posts change votes 3 times. Two of which are clear bandwagon votes, the third of which was your first real 'case' on someone who turned up town. Oversoul turned up town, and I am town. You continued to hound Oversoul for that whole text color business, but unvote for the second half of day 1, then only show back up to ride the diddin train with no explanation or insight.

Figuring out which suspicions are worth following by voting on Day 1 is a perfectly reasonable scumhunting approach - do you really disagree? I had legitimate suspicions of you and of Oversoul, and over the course of the day revisited my opinions and weighed them against other developing suspicions. Yes, Oversoul turned up Town. You seem to forget - and misrepresent - my changed position on Oversoul. I did not 'hound' Oversoul for the text color business - just the opposite. Taking a cleaer view of what the color business could indicate, I concluded that it certainly did not imply Oversoul-scum and was possibly a weak Towntell on Oversoul's part - and I continued to discuss this with people, trying to understand where they were coming from, whether they could see what I saw, and whether they were giving a sincere look at Oversoul's blue text or were being opportunist. The diddin train is pretty damn self-explanatory. Cop claim Day 1, became an explicit 1 vs. 1 (obviously Ludi's bad gambit is an anomaly; one I've not yet encountered and hope never to again), and since Ludi brought it up, diddin was vastly more likely to be the liar. I didn't see much coming of me trying to justify or overexplain that vote. It was self-explanatory. What insight might I have had. 'Hey guys, I was reading diddin's posts and came to a fascinating point! Do you realize that despite the fact that Ludi claimed he investigated diddin and received 'Not Crown-Aligned' diddin actually claimed in his actual posts to

be aligned with the Town?!

3) You SHOT Hascow. There is not a single train of thought where this makes sense given the events of day 1 from a town perspective. Not one. And your little 'breadcrumb' is the very reason other people questioned me for not caring about who Hascow's potential target might have been. Admittedly, I missed you saying it completely because you've left no impact on this game whatsoever with your fluffy posting (see: MoS 'case', Oversoul discussions).

Hindsight's 20/20. If Hascow flipped scum, what then? But let's not get caught up in that - it was a stupid move. I agree. Sometimes powerroles make stupid choices (less damned stupid than Ludi's, but there you are). I don't see what you're saying about my breadcrumb. If you think you got accused because of my accurate breadcrumb (you seem to believe that whatever my alignment I really did kill Hascow) . . . are you asking me for an apology? If you want to attack my scumhunting efforts, at least have the courage to do it straight out. Your potshotting is a nice illustration of your own scumminess.

4) Day 2. I pointed this out already, but your 'intent to vote Ludi' comment did exactly what I said it would. THAT WAS THE LAST POST YOU MADE ALL DAY, and the first thing you come in and do is crumble automatically to a soft claim with wild tales of why you (someone who's been here quite awhile, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, but a competent player) thinks it's not only ok to vig night 1, but to vig someone that I don't think anyone believed was outright scummy. Maybe not obvious town, but there was a much bigger pool to work with, and you could have saved us an entire day with the Ludi crap.

A softclaim from confirmed Town deserves to be dealt with ASAP. Not doing so is unduly distracting. Should I not have 'crumbled'? I won't apologize for adopting the least damaging response after my misguided Vig kill. Others did imply Hascow was scummy - but a Vig need only follow her own heart. I try to be a competent player, and I do Vig Night 1 and there are circumstances where I would again.

I could have saved you an entire day with the Ludi crap? In retrospect, yes. If this is an argument to the stupidity of my choice, it is excellent. If this is an argument that I'm scum, it's miserable and manages to imply I may be Town. Nice job.

For these reasons, I have no doubt that you should be hung today. This is me showing my work to the class, because MoI has a bee in his bonnet that my previous scum hunting efforts weren't loud enough.

You're such an obedient scared little scumbag, no? VOTE: Shadow

@Plum:

Given that everyone you've found outright scummy so far is now dead, who do you find scummy now?

Shadow. Wraith, for heavens' sakes! Others I suppose. When I reread.

Also, concerning Plum:

Crumb that I was going to kill him? No. I'm never sure who I'll Vig till I submit the kill.

What's this then?

Probably I'm a much better scumhunter when it's just me and a gun with no Town to talk at.
PREVIEW EDIT: FOURSEENCIRCUMSTANCE, PLAY THE GAME OR DIE.

Feysal - If we weren't lynching MoS today, I'd probably go with hascow, Magister Ludi, Shadow. But seriously HASCOW, dude. Ludi's a bit inconclusive. Pray we have a Vig, for now.

I did make an oblique Vig crumb, but didn't recall it being in conjunction with any direct crumb for intent to kill Hascow. Probably it was on my mind as a distinct possibility. I didn't intend it as a direct kill target crumb. Your point?

I'm still not exactly sure why we're lynching Plum. While a claimed Vig is an obvious cover for a Serial Killer, we don't really have proof she's lying beyond Mina saying she knows someone who knows...something.

Mina knows I'm not lying/haven't contradicted anything she knows.

Edit: Feysal is also a tad bit on the scummish side. May be prejudice there.

[Zdenek]

Shadow's case on Plum is mediocre, and I don't want to lynch a claimed vig today.

Ooba was useless and Bogre's reads on Shadow and Feysal are convenient and his reads on Empking, Benmage and Monday are contrived.

Vote Bogre

[Benmage]

^Somehow Bogre isn't the lynch.

Be mad at the mods.

[Benmage]

Plums weak crumb could've been a safe crumb incase of a watch/track... knowing then that she wasn't sent to mafia kill N2.

I dont like leaving killers alive. Fullclaim from Plum imo.

[Benmage]

Err actually let me think.. its late Im tired.

[Magua]

Shadow's case on Plum is mediocre, and I don't want to lynch a claimed vig today.

Ooba was useless and Bogre's reads on Shadow and Feysal are convenient and his reads on Empking, Benmage and Monday are contrived.

Vote Bogre

I agree with Zdenek.

I'm not feeling Shadow-scum. I don't have a townread on him that I had on diddin, but I also don't see scum.

As for Plum: If you're of the opinion that she should be lynched, she should fullclaim now. But I would rather have a directed killer, even if it's a possible SK, than a possible dead vig (or, at this point in the game, even a dead SK). I can only see Plum-mafia if this is a multiscum game, and so far there's no information that it is.

Feysal should die. I'm ok with Wraith dying. I'm ok with Bogre dying, regardless of what Benmage says. I'm also ok with Pine dying if he doesn't dig himself out of the information-void that was ABR's slot.

[Pine]

Kindly fuck off, Magua. I've been here less than a day with a 60-page deficit and other responsibilities, both on this site and in real life. No one that's ever played with me before would say that I fail to post enough. If I'm still not producing content in a few days, then you can talk about information-voids and such.

[Faraday]

Guys the activity here is fucking shit. No posts since November? I'll get on prods ASAP.