Mafiascum.net

Okay, I'm taking a break after page 30. This is the wall of questions/misc comments/posts of interests, will do a summary of where I'm at after.

In post 679, midwaybear wrote:Scum theater. But, I feel like I'm getting too conf biased (around your slot) because I really think you are scum. I'm starting to build a narrative that makes you scum regardless of other alignments(nsg/skitter), and I don't think that is very good. Maybe you are scum, but I don't want to tunnel at this point.

I didn't really like the hedging of a few of the reads, but this one stuck out. I was very curious about the narrative described here and why it was held so close to chest. Midway followed up and spoke about IV/Datisi but those aren't the interactions references here (nsg/skitter)

In post 574, catboi wrote:

PookyTheMagicalBear wrote:wait do you think scum skitter approaches you this way immediately?

That was the doubt I had but she keeps doing the thing where her reasons for suspecting me keep changing after they become invalid and so I'm tilting my head to the side and going "really"? at the stuff she's saying

Historically, how scum indicative is this behavior? I unfortunately feel like I see it as either alignment, there's the question of "Working backwards" that I consider strongly indicative, but there's vaguely negative feelings and slowly drilling down/reworking it to understand the feeling.

I didn't really like flow trap's wall on IV. I wouldn't mind a townlean but I think flow trap was very quick to call behaviors town and not really worried about being wrong.

I probably should stay out rather than bother to weigh in, but I have to say, pages 28-30, NSG, I respect trying to teach people that the majority of players will statistically be town and that you have to be extremely careful with inductive reasoning. It is a futile effort but I respect it.

Summary (circa page 30+random bits I've grabbed in checkins).

All tiers are ordered T->S

Lock Town
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-Andante: Entirely based off of flipping through Happy Face, where I found both her realtime interactions and actual reads very lacking. I could drill deeper and really lay out the differences but I don't really think I need to. I haven't read a single post and thought it was scummy, have read a million that sounded town, and her reads are much more proactive and complex even when I disagree.

Townish, I guess
========
-Something_Smart: Feel like he's generally a bit more performative as scum based off of my limited experience, also understands scum need to be active in current meta. Sure, townish.

-SirCakez: Chihuahua bark at bear. Chihuahua get mauled, long recovery. Chihuahua come back. Chihuahua bark anyway. Chihuahua town?

-innocentvillager: Every morning I wake up, read something of IV's, and 180 the read. I want to turbovote this slot for the massclaim suggestion and didn't like the followup (overly simplistic and ignored that town is completely dependent on correct blocking actions to salvage any town power, which may already belimited). For some reason I woke up and the slot was town. The way my coffee is sitting in my stomach leads me to say townish, so here he goes. Honestly I fucking hate having to read this dude for alignment, do not understand how his mind and reads work at all.

Nullish
=========
-skitter30: Her side of catboi interactions is fine but nothing she can't fake.

-northsidegal: Her first set of catchup posts were fine and she was in Townish. I then ISO'd her to remind myself what they were while typing this. I then said "This is stupid, don't see why she doesn't make these criticisms as scum" and moved her down to Nullish. Then I remembered I liked the Skygazer bit, and moved her back up. Now I'm like "Nah". FINAL VERDICT: NULLSIDEGAL

-Datisi: Sometimes I look at the thoughts and go "Oh yeah this seems town." Then I realize I have no fucking clue what Datisi looks like as scum and this doesn't share much with Chara's Folly nor a Mini Normal I played with him, and I sucked at reading this dude in 9:12. Null pile, son.

-Sleepless Assassin. The name is a lie he has been asleep all game.

-catboi: Reads seem bad until the cute grr posts or whatever but like most of the game, midway read made no sense to me. I'll gauge that more when I revisit midway.

Scummyish
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-PookytheMagicalBear: Not aggressive enough in SR on me; his stated takeaway from the one gameday he saw of me as scum was that he should have gone after me rather than chase after a partner. I took a similar approach to townreading him that game in reaction to his push as a bonus.

-midwaybear: Opening was very lackluster to me, eliminating S/S is weak and I don't really get the meta number bit when the answer in question was 9 and one of the last picks. Think the "one of" statements is just a classic scumline and someone (northsidegal?) hit the nail on the head when they called him classically scummy. Want to revisit, I know he was a free read in Xenoblade 2.

-Mare: Very subjective, initial set of reads seemed like a forced push for something she thought she could defend rather than a sincere belief. I think she tends to be more proactive with interjections and reads as scum but honestly I'm bad at reading her in general and have burned what tells I did have a few times over. Think she played up the stubbornness and knows that it is very frustrating for players but winds up netting a townread.

Scum
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-flow trap: I did not expect to ever get a real read on this slot but I think that interaction with me regarding my main was egregious. I also did not like the wall on IV, see previous post.

I am tired, a bit under the weather, and I am taking a nap, Yeet, see y'all for round 2 (pages 30-60) later.

In post 1501, Faker wrote:-flow trap: I did not expect to ever get a real read on this slot but I think that interaction with me regarding my main was egregious.

Yeah I knew you would think that

Cakez bruh

In post 1500, Faker wrote:I was very curious about the narrative described here and why it was held so close to chest.

I felt like my Datisi read was biased and it began to bias other reads because of that (for example: datisi scum -> skitter town).

In post 1416, flow trap wrote:you were definitely not self-focused as scum and you were diplomatic

Can you elaborate on these characteristics a bit? From the standard definition, Faker seems relatively diplomatic this game (he even mentioned that it was basically the goal of the alt).

In post 1498, Andante wrote:

In post 1494, SirCakez wrote:Like there are some people who are low content and not really being townread by anyone
SS, midway, sleepless, etc

Sleepless is VLA till today, why are you including them here? like, obviously no one TRs someone with no content? but doesn't mean I'm voting them out now?
SS has some lines I like - "not really being TRed by anyone" is a lie there, I've voiced a slight tr earlier

and I still haven't read a single midway post so idk there


I don't like how another person is now "I'm sheeping IV here" like uhhh what?

You are totally missing the point of that post

In post 1498, Andante wrote:

In post 1494, SirCakez wrote:Like there are some people who are low content and not really being townread by anyone
SS, midway, sleepless, etc

Sleepless is VLA till today, why are you including them here? like, obviously no one TRs someone with no content? but doesn't mean I'm voting them out now?
SS has some lines I like - "not really being TRed by anyone" is a lie there, I've voiced a slight tr earlier

and I still haven't read a single midway post so idk there


I don't like how another person is now "I'm sheeping IV here" like uhhh what?

Faker we agree on most reads

Ignore that quote

In post 1465, catboi wrote:

In post 1450, skitter30 wrote:

In post 1418, catboi wrote:

In post 1407, skitter30 wrote:Not really, i'm bad a reading him
I do think he's low key scummy rn tho

why is that

This is kinda a gut read, idk. Hard to put into words. But dont super feel like he's town and he isnt really trying to solve anything (ehich can admittedly be nai but makes it hard to townread him too)

Was feeling something with regard to him not being obvious town but I know he's not high effort every game, but...maybe

Sorry, i'm not sure what you're saying here

In post 1467, Datisi wrote:

In post 1466, skitter30 wrote:Also, well: why is everyone else's opinion influencing your reads so much?

do you want a holistic "my reads weren't that strong in the first place so the things people said against them were enough to change my mind" or do you want me to go through the times where i changed my mind and specifically write what influenced those? because idk how else to answer it

i'm voting him bc iv present a case that looks good enough on the surface that makes me both townread iv and think it's worth pushing midway and seeing what happens

I mean ig the part i'm taking issue with is that 'your reads arent that strong in the first placr so the things people said against them were enough to change my mind' to begin with

Another case in point: you were scumreading iv as recently as yesterday, but now you want to townread and sheep him on midway?

In post 1473, innocentvillager wrote:

In post 1449, skitter30 wrote:- its not even the volume so much as what he is choosing to comment on is sort of weird; he feels very much on the sidelines and his comments are just kinda there but he isnt really interacting with people much or following up on things. Its not exactly iioa but like kinda similar and i'm bucketing in the same *type* of analysis as iioa. I think its easier for scum to interact with the thread this way

i feel like you're just saying what i said did u have this thought before me/read what i wrote?

I had the thought prior to reading what you wrote

In post 1476, midwaybear wrote:I think I'm back to being a bit off put about catboi's early read on me (like skitter). 314 seems to me like he was exaggerating the townieness of my posts. "Serious mechanical minded discussion", meta numbers as a "flourish"? I appreciate it, but do you really believe that.

I mean why did you like his townread earlier ?

Or another way to describe midway's posting: it lacks *life* or *animated thought* its just dry and blah

In post 1501, Faker wrote:-Something_Smart: Feel like he's generally a bit more performative as scum based off of my limited experience, also understands scum need to be active in current meta. Sure, townish.

for how much we don't align i actually had a similar thought lol

but idk i don't feel like i weigh it as much as you do partly bc it's too easy for scum!SS to use that as a lazy excuse in a familiar plist

In post 1512, skitter30 wrote:Or another way to describe midway's posting: it lacks *life* or *animated thought* its just dry and blah

im glad we are seeing the same thing

In post 1501, Faker wrote:-Something_Smart: Feel like he's generally a bit more performative as scum based off of my limited experience, also understands scum need to be active in current meta. Sure, townish.

Not sure if this is a reason to townread him
I kinda read your readlist and went - meh ok
I dont really have strong feelings either way on it

In post 1510, skitter30 wrote:Another case in point: you were scumreading iv as recently as yesterday, but now you want to townread and sheep him on midway?

i was what? oh, you thought that 1203 and 1208 was going to hold any significant influence over his alignment in my mind? i didn't even remember that happened by today, that's how unimportant that was

"but datisi, how can you think iv is scum and then forget about--" that dude fucking *breathes* in a scummy way. if i could hear his keyboard clicking, i'd think it's clicking in a scummy way. if i were to take every single instance where i thought "hey, that was scummy from iv" i would've yeeted him like three times over in this game alone

i call him out for being scummy, partly because of the meme and partly because it leads to interactions with him which sometimes actually are properly readable, but it's not gonna actually stick in my mind as a worthwhile point against him because i know i'm very biased when it comes to reading him

he said he's seeing some ~meta stuff~ that indicates midway is scummy, i decided to sheep him on it to see what comes from it. then he wrote out an elaboration and i decided he's actually looking townie from it. so... yes?

In post 1514, innocentvillager wrote:

In post 1512, skitter30 wrote:Or another way to describe midway's posting: it lacks *life* or *animated thought* its just dry and blah

im glad we are seeing the same thing

What do u think of catboi btw?

I'll have a big post to dump tomorrow. If anyone is curious about my reads I'm pretty confident in Innocentvillager and Flow Trap being scum. I have Mare as townier than I'm sure most of you do. Faker/catboi/Midway might contain a scum. Andante probably town. I don't have Datisi as a strong scum read but I am surprised to see him getting votes. Skitter kind of townish. Anyone else is a weaker read than those.

And @dats was i supposed to recognize that yesterday's iv real wasnt a sticking read? We had a whole convo abt it yestersay where i didnt like the read and you were explaining pretty insistently why you were feeling that way >.>

Like yeah i guess i read your explanation and like i suppose but it kinda just fits into the broader pattern of ur play this game ...

Thanks sleepless, curious to see your big post tomorrow :)

In post 1208, Datisi wrote:the reason i say it doesn't count as a scumread is because i am aware that it's not outside of iv's townrange to do something like this and that i am pretty much wasting my time here. but my first thought *was* that it's scummy so i felt it was worthy calling it out anyway.

In post 1216, Datisi wrote:it's almost like... i acknowledged the read isn't strong and that i'm prone to bias there...

the *actual* irony in all of this is that this kinda read switching and hopping is actually very difficult for me to fake as scum but c'est la vie

In post 1518, Sleepless Assassin wrote:I'm pretty confident in Innocentvillager and Flow Trap being scum

incorrect

at the very least if you're scum, dats, this interaction has made p confident it's not with nsg