Mini 2266: GnG's Upick Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Frozen Angel]

mastina you really can just be already a werewolf forced to say you're town. like how your vote and unvote are replaced. it would a be a role design about lies. so this is just pure wifom that you keep saying this makes you town.

like everyone and you should know that it doesn't and this weird defensiveness about your role being only "town" is actually worrying.

pedit: that ...

[jjh927]

I'm baffled that you could still try to argue that your fake E-1 had literally any game effect whatsoever, honestly

We've explained it enough times that it really doesn't

Part of the reason you're so clearly scum here to me is that I actually respect your ability to parse logic to the point where I can't believe you would still, at this point, genuinely be making the argument that you conftowned your entire hood with that

[jjh927]

You know what else would get you to fakeclaim your role as scum?

A mafia role that enforced that you had to fakeclaim, given in response to the pick of "I never fakeclaim as scum."

[Yume]

UNVOTE:

I am having second thoughts.

[mastina]

I'm town.

I don't recall that happening. What actually happened was a vote fairly quickly afterwards and the day ending.

Oh, sure--but that wasn't my doing or Dwlee's doing, now, was it?

It doesn't matter what

actually

happened;
What matters

for the Dwlee clearing the sneak Neighborhod point

was the

intent

and

theory

behind what was

intended

to happen.

If LLD had not hammered, then everything I said was true. If Dwlee left their self-vote on while it'd deny us one member on the wagon, it'd allow for the entire rest of the wagon to be what the town chose it to be. Since Dwlee couldn't cast a hammer vote while already self-voting, that meant the only way for the day to end was if the town chose to let the day end and have a wagon composition they were satisfied with.

In other words, Dwlee casting the self-vote without it being an actual hammer was incredibly pro-town because it would let the town choose the other five names on the wagon freely.

LLD did hammer though, so presumably to LLD she was town that let the day end satisfied with the wagon composition. Since LLD is town, I would assume that she wouldn't have hammered otherwise.

you're justifying it very badly post-hoc.

That's

you

, by ignoring how LLD's hammer vote was out of my control and not something that I had taken into account.

You're justifying something that was something that could not have been something I could have foreseen, something that I could not have controlled.

I have no sway over LLD. If anything, I have the opposite of sway over LLD. So LLD hammering after I did what I did is, regardless of my alignment: something I would never have foreseen as having happened.

And you saying "the wagon ended with that composition right then and there", while ignoring the cause of that was something I had no input on, is again: disingenuous as fuck from you.

Because I don't think anyone wanted you to be on the wagon and that would look bad for you.

Name a single time I've given a fuck about something like that; I'll wait.

I have literally never seen a multi-tasking commuter.

Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean that's not how the role interaction works.

A scumteam with multitasking with one of the scum having commuter, would have the commuter be able to kill;
A scumteam with a multitasking commuter would have the commuter able to kill.

Commuter is a role that explicitly cannot act when it activates.

And where does it say that? Certainly not the Normal section of guidelines I as a NRG member would use.

Normal Guidelines
A Commuter is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. If a Commuter is commuting, it is untargettable that night by any means, not even Strongman, Roleblocker or Ninja. Any role that attempts to target a commuting Commuter should be treated as though they are blocked (e.g. receive a "No Result" pm if they are investigative).

There is absolutely zero mention of the commuter themselves being unable to act, because there is nothing inherent in a commuter that makes them unable to act per Normal game mechanics. The only limiting factor on Commuter is that Commuting is an active night action--meaning that when you are commuting, you are using a night action.

IF there is no multitasking, yes, commuting is a clear.

But if there IS multitasking, commuting is absolutely not.

And again, you pretending that isn't the case is disingenuous as fuck.

[mastina]

I'm town, yes, so bloody eliminate jjh for his shitpush on me.

[mastina]

I'm town.

I mean, your role is built around you being a liar.

Wrong. My

role title

and my "active" ability are themed around that, yes.

My

passive

ability is themed around

the impossibility of me being scum

.

And I feel the need to reiterate: you are trying to attack the

weakest

parts of my arguments ignoring that there are many stronger reasons that you're not addressing because

you can't

, because you fucking know that I am town.

[mastina]

I'm town, yes, so bloody eliminate jjh for his shitpush on me after.

[Enchant]

Aren't everyone who is not scum can't be scum because they are not scum...

[jjh927]

Okay, if you want to pretend you have persuasive reasons I haven't countered, name your single strongest reason right now

[mastina]

mastina you really can just be already a werewolf forced to say you're town.

Sure, it's fully possible I

could

be a werewolf! I'm not, and the fact that I've upheld my posting restriction will mean that when I flip, you'll have indisputable undeniable irrefutable proof that I'm town.

But while it's

possible

for me to be a werewolf (I'm not, I'm town), it's

not

possible for me to be

mafia

.

Yaknow.

The scum faction that Gypyx and Dwlee were members of and which jjh and Pooky are accusing me of being part of.

like everyone and you should know that it doesn't and this weird defensiveness about your role being only "town" is actually worrying.

FA, your namesake is accurate in that you are an angel so I don't want to insult you so please don't take this the wrong way but frankly?

You're to blame for that.

jjh was being wagoned prior to you coming in.

This is, explicitly, what I have argued is the correct move, because genuinely, the only possible players for the third mafia-scum are {Enchant, Yume, jjh}.
We were even pointing out how Yume had no source of protection N3, too! And how the vig there was weird. Making it more likely that the last scum was {Yume, jjh}.

Your (false) guilty on me literally derailed the thread into this because it gave the scum an opportunity for them to jump onto me and derail the town from wagoning jjh. The guilty on jjh might've been inaccurate itself, but it was Right for the Wrong Reasons, in that jjh is scum so the pressure on jjh there was the direction things

should

have gone.

And then you claimed a wrong guilty on me, and allowed the scum to make the game about me.

Which they are continuing to do, and I have continued to highlight why it's scum from jjh and honorary-scum from Pooky.

Yes, I understand that you thought you had a guilty--but the fact that it

wasn't

a guilty has put me on the defensive when by all rights

I shouldn't fucking need to be

.

But no fucking shit I get on the defensive when there's people piling votes on me which start off of a false guilty.

[mastina]

I'm town, yes, so bloody eliminate jjh for his shitpush on me after, please.

[Frozen Angel]

So yeah I have no guilty on mastina anymore

I know that she attempted to kill someone positively. But they claimed they tried to vig yume N2 with warrior skill so there is that

Mod confirmed that my check was for all phases not just the last night phase

and no that doesn't mean I'll vote JJH. He clearly should not be wagoned for another fake guilty.

[jjh927]

I was being wagoned on day start by literally just you and Pooky because Roden claimed a guilty which then turned out to not be a guilty

Note that Shiro's immediate reaction was to vote Roden because my alignment is near confirmed to Shiro

[Frozen Angel]

JJH was getting wagoned cause roden recieved no result which got explained instantly. why on earth would you want to blame my result on your slot for that shit wagon getting dissolved?

If you have a scum read on JJH properly case him. till then:

the main suspect of mine right now is roden himself for his lies yesterday about dunnestral being not town and him not being viggable - both were lies proven that I shot him and here he is a with a town flip. and his response to me questioning it in last page was dodgy as hell

VOTE: Roden

[Enchant]

Mod answered me that it's not public knowledge.

[Frozen Angel]

Mod answered me that it's not public knowledge.

So we have no idea what LLD and poky are right now. and we should solve those slots like normal slots all over again.

[jjh927]

Roden could well be the correct lim here tbh

I kinda thought he might be town that was playing in an anti-town way because of a 3p side wincon, but that ship has sailed or he'd have claimed that was why he was being anti-town

[mastina]

I'm baffled that you could still try to argue that your fake E-1 had literally any game effect whatsoever, honestly
We've explained it enough times that it really doesn't

And I've pointed out why your explanations are shit and why it did.

Just because you

said

it didn't have an effect, doesn't mean it

didn't

.

It had a very tangible one.

It literally confirmed the entirety of the Sneak Hood to not be scum with Dwlee.

Part of the reason you're so clearly scum here to me is that I actually respect your ability to parse logic to the point where I can't believe you would still, at this point, genuinely be making the argument that you conftowned your entire hood with that

And the reason YOU are scum is that YOU have a

very good ability

to parse

mastina-logic

. You are one of the

go-to translators

for mastina-logic into normal-logic. YOU can see more or less what I am thinking, and translate it from unusual-mastina-wording into more standard grounded points.

You are good at figuring out what I am saying, why I am saying it, why I believe it, and analyzing it, pointing out the merits behind it and the flaws behind it, and then translating that into useful takes from it.

But that's absent here because instead of an attempt to understand it and translate it, you are reverse-engineering it. You are coming from the perspective of it being scum and not making sense; you are coming from the perspective of it being false, not putting the effort into reading why I would, as town, believe it. Something you as town SHOULD have the ability to do.

I refuse to believe a town-jjh is so incompetent at translating me this game that he cannot see how a town-mastina would think she had an "a-HA! Gotcha!!!" moment on Dwlee.

That doesn't even mean that the moment need be valid! You can disagree with it being valid! A town-jjh can see mastina-logic and then disagree with it being accurate.

A town-jjh would NOT be unable to see it altogether though and you saying you can't is

literally a scumclaim from you

.

[Yume]

I have some things to share.

[Roden]

Roden could well be the correct lim here tbh

I kinda thought he might be town that was playing in an anti-town way because of a 3p side wincon, but that ship has sailed or he'd have claimed that was why he was being anti-town

I...literally claimed that?

I'm sorry but did everyone forget everything I said yesterday and that I hard pushed both scum while trying to stop town mis-elims

[Roden]

one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four Pooky you're right this town sucks lol

[mastina]

I'm town, yes, so bloody eliminate jjh for his shitpush on me after, please, thx.

[jjh927]

The dead aren't gonna have changed alignment just by being resurrected. If they've turned scum it's a result of an alignment changing mechanic of some kind, which would probably be the 4th tier ability on a scum-only skill tree

[Enchant]

Probably this statement will be disregarded as silly.

But.

I think Roden is jester.