Raw, Unfiltered, UPICK Game Over !

[Grendel]

danfaur's

I have to admit that's a flavor of butchering I've never seen before

i may of had a few drinks before this haha

[Grendel]

Cass's role seems fake to me and i wanna shoot her tonight tbh. Or flip her today if we're gonna let flea do the thingy

Its just... Gamma has no EM presence afaik. He has mostly resided in forums like this one, or MU, or our HS. Ghoul is an EM role no?

Plus its definitely within the "killing role" PoE imo. (Cass/Dan)

[Grendel]

I guess Gray is also in killiing role PoE, but come on, he was pivotal in dessecting EoD2's craziness. Scum didnt have a reason to screw over titus when I was a prefectly justifiable flip at the time.

[Grendel]

Dont token VT's normally claim right out the gate in role maddnes on this site? Why didnt Mark do that?

[Grendel]

Pooky is town by virture of Grey confirming Pookie's ablity. I can't think of a role scum can use that visits dead players offhand. Also if so he might have apperhension fake claiming a town role w/ same/similar ablities under low pressure. Its a v fake sounding role w/o confirmation. Also pookie claimed befre gREY i believe.

Ok so we have

Grendel - confish town from their kills
GRICE | Pookie- mutually cleared from what GRICE saw last night
Cass | Dann - one of the 2 cleared via Mistyx's info that there is 3 killers
Flea - Allegedly has a proveable ability. Could be scum, but why would scum want to skip nights?
Me | mistyx - from other player's POVs nothing to clear us mechanically

So I reckon scum lies in that Cass/Dan bracket, probably cass, as her role might not even count as a killing role

Mistyx is not mech clear exactly. But actions taken relation to her role are super pro-town.

[Grendel]

Also, Grendel, you have now, as town, had a cop guilty claimed on you day 2, then had your role claim counterclaimed, and not only survived, but got two dead scum out of it.

I don't want to say "the first time in MafiaScum history" but I think you can be pretty proud of that one.

Really super nice of you to say, but i doubt any of it would of happened if i didnt have a confirmable role like vig. Otherwise i would have been the flip yesterday im sure. And Jessie/VGF probably would've made it into D3.

You and math were the mvp this game. (You better not turn out to be mafia! If you do i will retire from mafia agian.)

[Grendel]

My role is

ghoul

-- I target someone at night and if I were to die, my target dies instead.

I asked some clarifying questions of gamma d2, and this is, um, apparently infinite-use but I do not get notified if the ability is triggered or not. Which makes me functionally immortal at night as long as I use the ability or not.

N1 I targeted Kop, actually, which was a reason I was more suspicious of Grendel -- thought it might have been an opportunistic scum claim when they had tried to kill me instead? idk maybe i should have mentioned this last day but I thought claiming this role would essentially make it useless. and this theory still didn't explain where the second kill came from anyway. oh well too late now ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

N2 I targeted pooky who obviously didn't die

tbh we've got, what, 8 people alive with 1 mafia left? I think if we can get it down to PoE of 3 (Dann, Pooky, me?) we can eliminate all 3 in any order and still win, pretty easy (7v1 miselim -> 5v1 miselim -> 3v1 [or 2v1 i guess if grendel dies due to not killing anyone] -> last PoE = correct elim, town wins). unless we think there's a remote chance grendel is scum and shot his only remaining partner in an insane gambit, or something, I think it's pretty much a lock.

Cass saying that her role here fed into her suspicion of me yesterday seems like a stretch. Theres not a sorta "Gotcha" moment in her iso that a townie would have if they believed they cuaght an opportunistic scum cliam.

We just need to find out cassowary's answer and this is pretty much solved

Cassowary, do you transfer the kill (like kill that would kill you now kills your target)? Or kill your target directly?

I am pretty sure it transfers. Flavor is Misery from Cave Story, and flavor-wise it's framed as a result of teleportation powers, not any actual killing I do myself. (It also says if a kill is attempted on me that my target 'will die', not that I 'will kill them', so I think that also implies transference.)

you mean this answer? or is there another question we're waiting on me to answer

goul is just stright up a killing role. Her back tracking the semantics of her powers after mistx's claim dosent make it any less of a killing role.

Like if Cass's role theortically dosent count as a killing role by mod discretion then how does Dann count as a killing role? both them get a 1-shot if something that is normally out of their control occours. So if both players were truthful, and werent considered killing roles last night then Mistx would only have recieved two results last night, not three. Instead i prepose that both would be considered killing roles via mod's PoV, and one of these claims is fake becuase of it.

this game is lock (Cass/Dann) rn

VOTE: Cassowary

[Grendel]

Haha, that's the one.

I'm Judge Dredd, Tracker. If I track someone committing a kill, I kill them.

I tracked Pooky last night, so I can confirm that he did go to both of our dead players, and didn't kill either of them. Since there's zero way that result makes sense with any scum role whatsoever, I'm inclined to say the bear is town.

This seems more believable to me then Cass's claim. Plus Grey chose to backup/clear another player's claim whereas scum didnt need to do that. Without this result pooky would've been an easy flip from Scum!Grey PoV.

I understand that its possible that grey just decides to play an absurdly pro-town game as scum explictly b/c he hopes to get cleared by virture of it. But that world is so unlikely that im not open to considering it as long as im alive.

-/-/-/-

GN all, seeya tomarrow

[Grendel]

So I guess right now, my scumhunting comes down to two questions

Who was pushing the Grendel lim D2?
Whose role does not make sense in the setup as town?

The answer to the first is Pooky/Cass off the top of my head (Flea voted Grendel for a time too, but not with the same focus).

The answer to the second I am not so sure of - I've not played many games and most that I have played have been normals, so setup balance in role madness is not my strong area


--pedit @grice ntoed, let me have a think ref this. Obvs I'm, not keen to be limmed, but if we can break the setup to conf win then ofc I support that

Scratch the prevous question i had to Mark w/ regards why his didnt claim VT D1. If he dosnt play role maddnes often he wouldnt know that is considered typical play in MS role madness to claim token TV.

Yea, this games in autoslove w/ Cass and Dann i think

[cassowary]

Its just... Gamma has no EM presence afaik. He has mostly resided in forums like this one, or MU, or our HS. Ghoul is an EM role no?

Worth noting that in the recent homesite game where gamma and I were the two last mafia left, one of the people left standing near the end had this role and it was also called "ghoul," and as you may recall it very nearly would have made us lose if not for a clever kill by gamma as the last mafia. So maybe he took inspiration from there? Idk, I'm just telling you what I've got, but I recognize that it does sound kind of fake, lol.

[cassowary]

Like if Cass's role theortically dosent count as a killing role by mod discretion then how does Dann count as a killing role? both them get a 1-shot if something that is normally out of their control occours. So if both players were truthful, and werent considered killing roles last night then Mistx would only have recieved two results last night, not three. Instead i prepose that both would be considered killing roles via mod's PoV, and one of these claims is fake becuase of it.

I am not sure this logic holds up. Like I don't think me getting a flip that reveals I'm not lying implies the last scum HAS to be Dannflor. If Dannflor's role is written as a "gated vig," I can see the mods counting that as a killing role but excluding mine since mine is not coded that way -- it's expressed like a redirection role rather than a "you get to kill someone if this happens," which is different from Dannflor's. Anyway I think the 3 killing roles could totally be Grey, Dann, and you. If we flip me today I just don't think you should insta-flip Dann tomorrow.

[Flea The Magician]

I'm a night skipper, that means NO NIGHT ACTIONS CAN BE PERFORMED.

Anti-town utility, yes. Anti-scum utility, also yes. Town outweighs scum, therefore its more antitown in my working out I confirmed as a 1 night en masse roleblocker to gamma and he accepted that without question so I figured that was essentially the mechanic of it.

Once fired, after the first elimination the deadline would be reset and we'd carry one afaik. Day->Twilight->Day

[Grendel]

Honestly that's a great ablity to have in a situation like melo flea. It would net town an extra flip.

But with all the killing roles this game its hard to tell if we are heading to melo or elo

[Grendel]

UNVOTE:

I thought about it and best play is if I shot Cass tonight.

[Grendel]

What are players thoughts on Mary marks VT claim?

[Mistyx]

ok

cass and flea would not count towards the 3

so it's greyice, grendel, and dann - all three are confirmed to be killing roles

[Marky Mark]

Just catching up...

its best way to slove cass's slot is if i shoot her tonight?

If she fake then she die. If she real then she redirects the kill elsewhere

This is a bad idea. Cass could well have that ability but not be town-aligned (would make sense with the town killing roles around). Better to elim her. Shooting her would not solve her slot, even if it proved her ability was real.

[Marky Mark]

ok

cass and flea would not count towards the 3

so it's greyice, grendel, and dann - all three are confirmed to be killing roles

This from the mod I presume?

[Marky Mark]

GRICE's role doesn't stop them being scum tbf. A scum who could track town and killl town vigs if they caught them in the act is believeable. Like don't get me wrong I thought GRICE was pretty town d2 but I'm just saying, it's not a forgone conclusion that they are town becasue their ability has been confirmed through them tracking pookie and the killing roles thing

[Marky Mark]

GRICE's role doesn't stop them being scum tbf. A scum who could track town and killl town vigs if they caught them in the act is believeable. Like don't get me wrong I thought GRICE was pretty town d2 but I'm just saying, it's not a forgone conclusion that they are town becasue their ability has been confirmed through them tracking pookie and the killing roles thing

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

ok but why would GRice-scum stop me from getting elimmed? isnt it easier for him to just say nothing?

why would GRice-scum make that chart and stop Grendel from getting elimmed yesterday and instead swing the wagon onto Titus and get his other partner vigged?

like Grey Ice isn't a bad player - its pretty close to impossible IMO that he goes out of his way to play that hard against his own win con in order to wifom his way back into the finals

like just inconceivable to me.

as likely as the sky falling down

[Marky Mark]

I was way too hasty to conflate roles being confirmed with alignments being confirmed earlier today, I guess the same could be true of Dann too - it could be that he's scum and scum get an extra kill effectively if he guesses right.

Wide scumpool in terms of people who have a feasible mech chance of being scum rn would be Cass/Flea/Misty/GRICE/Dann afaik. Of those, the ones who tried to push grendel D2 are at the top of the scumlist

--pedit yeah I agree that GRICE seemed pretty town yesterday and there are far scummier players in the plist, the point was that I basically had them in my head as conftown as their role had been confirmed, which is clearly not accurate on reflection.

[Marky Mark]

I mean I would genuinely be surprised if the solve isn't within Cass/Dan

[Marky Mark]

I mean I would genuinely be surprised if the solve isn't within Cass/Dan

[Flea The Magician]

Honestly I feel Cass is the better elim based on the claims due to NK Immune.
Dan as the second elimination then its Grendel on ?

I can't mech break though so :/