DBZ: Cell Games [Over]

[Firebringer]

VOTE: Firebringer

IT ISNT A TRUE SHOW UNTIL WE SEE THE ALMIGHTY MOST TOUGHEST THE STRONGEST MAN ON THIS PLANET

[Perfect Cell]

Gamma Emerald has been nominated! He may no longer be voted for.

with 13 alive it takes 7 to nominate. Nomination Phase 2 ends in (expired on 2021-01-11 22:25:25).

Combatants

Dunnstral (0):
mastina (0):
Battle Mage (0):
Oil Tycoons (0):
Bell (0):
Superbowl9 (0):
Firebringer (1): Firebringer
kookiemonster (0):
Titus (0):
Flea The Magician (0):
Sugar Cain (0):
Guillotina (0):

Not Voting (0):


Superbowl is V/LA from January 5th to January 10th.

Spoiler: Nominated

1. Gamma Emerald

[mastina]

Mastina, when was the last time nacho pulled wool over your eye?

Depends. A

hydra

with Nacho in it? (Where it was, explicitly, the other head that I incorrectly townread.) I honestly legit think the last time was tales of you, where I incorrectly read bork as town but when Nacho took over I identified him as scum.

Misread Nacho himself when he was scum and I was town, with me convinced incorrectly that he was town?

...Have I ever?

I legit can't find a game of it, searching through Nacho's game history. Across micros, minis, normals, mini themes, and large themes. I genuinely don't think I have? I've spent the last 30 minutes searching Nacho's game history looking for games that I was in which he was in. In all of them, either:
-We were scum together,
-I was scum with him as town,
-We were both town,
-Or I correctly read him as scum when I was town.

I genuinely don't think I've ever misread Nacho before when he was scum, thinking he was town.

That having been said.
It's been literal years since I last played with Nacho. I think it was like 2018 when we last played? In that range, if not older. I am very much not familiar with him in his current form, especially not on a hydra. So who knows, this could be the first game where I misread his scum self as being town. He's a damn good scum player, and I am incredibly rusty at reading him to the point where I place zero faith in my ability to read him correctly. I genuinely think the last time I saw him as scum was circa 2015--literally 5, going on 6, years ago. To say my meta on him is outdated would be an understatement, so I wouldn't trust me to soulread Nacho here.

But I will say that, yes, I do genuinely think he's town here. He's a good player, he's probably not out of his scumrange, but I still townread him regardless.

[mastina]

Also:
VOTE: superbowl9

As memey as it'd be to send Firebringer into the arena, I'd prefer scum candidate vs scum candidate in the arena, when Firebringer isn't one to me.

[Firebringer]

how do i convince u i am a worthy candidate to get in?

[Dunnstral]

Sure, but Dunn this game isn't lurker-Dunn. Dunn is less active than like 10 players this game but he's not lurking. Do an iso of him and that's apparent enough.

I mean, I am lurking, but the notion that me lurking means I'm scum is incorrect

[Bell]

VOTE: Mastina

Normally I wouldn't justify a vote like this face first so to speak. But I also don't think pressure is the correct way to engage with Mastina.
In general I think their reads and opinions are very straightforward and easy to understand this game. There is an emphasis on being understood.
In the other games I've played with Mastina they were utterly domineering, generating their own opinions almost in a bubble. There was less emphasis in being clear and communicative than here, or maybe I should say her communication style is decidedly different.

I think her most recent post is strange, off or mildly difficult to be believable. Spending 30 minutes to check if they really ever have misread Nacho seems like a tremendous waste of time. Her emphasis on explaining her process over the result is also strange. I am well aware Mastina wall posts that they are usually not concise, but usually it's packed with opinion and meaning in a way that these posts aren't, they're less dense.

Yeah, I know. I really am just singling her out because she's posting different. Which sucks and isn't a great way to vote folk. But I also, I guess in the simplest terms, think she is off. Is the best way to describe it.

[Bell]

I think however that her reads make a lot of sense. Almost too much sense, I find myself nodding along to their reads, while recognizing that she's pretty much pushing at lurkers and not having genuine scum reads.
I find nothing or little to object to with her reasoning or opinions. To the point, it's actually strange in itself.

I am not articulating myself well here.

[Dunnstral]

How is this differant than the pooky vs fl treestump game?

[Bell]

Huh, that post sort of recontextualized some thoughts related to my differing perspective. It could just be that because I'm town and I don't know her alignment she comes off differently.

Still, *points directly to 1606* The differences as I see them are in the paragraph. If you disagree with my comparison or the statements made, say so.

[Flea The Magician]

So pretty much, I felt that Flea was spending too much time arguing their perspective of absolutism or objective reality that they were town and not enough scum hunting underlying it. They laid out how they would play in their playstyle and started to follow through on it in a way that actually points me more toward them being town. I have no clue why they spoilered 750 as it reinforced this point. I felt their votes and positions have been relatively opportunistic. Flea showed curiosity toward the people voting them that weren't directly voting or pushing their wagon. While their attitude and approach to me and BM felt different in how they approached us in terms of asking questions etc. It might just be their political stances or how they play socially/argue socially.

Their posting style in among us was significantly different to how they played in death curse. Their initial tone and approach in this game adhered more closely to their scum game from my limited experience. They've departed from that posting style. The first time I had given myself pause on their alignment was when they asked if I didn't like them, which I tend to associate with a somewhat subtle town thought process. Looking back I realized I missed a lot of posts where they were more consistent than I thought.
To be clear, this isn't a strong reversal into obv town flea. It's more of moving them from a scum read to a slight town read.

I do not like that I'm reading them in part or entirely based on emotional tells. But I feel I need to think more carefully about them and examine their analysis or somewhat lack thereof and stances in a better fashion.

@Flea: requesting feedback, I tried to control for how I addressed you in this post. Did it meet standards? If I failed to address you appropriately let me know and I'll adjust until I get it right.

Looking good to me <3 thank you!
#750 was spoilered because it balances out my walls of doom against the rest of the game .

[Flea The Magician]

VOTE: bm until convinced otherwise.

[Guillotina]

VOTE: Mastina

Normally I wouldn't justify a vote like this face first so to speak. But I also don't think pressure is the correct way to engage with Mastina.
In general I think their reads and opinions are very straightforward and easy to understand this game. There is an emphasis on being understood.
In the other games I've played with Mastina they were utterly domineering, generating their own opinions almost in a bubble. There was less emphasis in being clear and communicative than here, or maybe I should say her communication style is decidedly different.

I think her most recent post is strange, off or mildly difficult to be believable. Spending 30 minutes to check if they really ever have misread Nacho seems like a tremendous waste of time. Her emphasis on explaining her process over the result is also strange. I am well aware Mastina wall posts that they are usually not concise, but usually it's packed with opinion and meaning in a way that these posts aren't, they're less dense.

Yeah, I know. I really am just singling her out because she's posting different. Which sucks and isn't a great way to vote folk. But I also, I guess in the simplest terms, think she is off. Is the best way to describe it.

Also:
VOTE: superbowl9

As memey as it'd be to send Firebringer into the arena, I'd prefer scum candidate vs scum candidate in the arena, when Firebringer isn't one to me.

VOTE: Superbowl9

I agree with you on Superbowl9, but I can’t read Firebringer and maybe you can help me with that. Why is Firebringer town?

[Guillotina]

@Bell You if i understand correctly. Mastina is usually opinionated with her read and you think she is off because she is not here?
Town!Mastina can’t legitimately be hesitant about her reads?

[Guillotina]

I think however that her reads make a lot of sense. Almost too much sense, I find myself nodding along to their reads, while recognizing that she's pretty much pushing at lurkers and not having genuine scum reads.
I find nothing or little to object to with her reasoning or opinions. To the point, it's actually strange in itself.

I am not articulating myself well here.

Could it be that you have expectation on how Mastina plays and she is not meeting them here and that’s why you think she is off?

[Sugar Cain]

Nora is town, flea is town, bell is probably town, I'm inclined to mastina and titus town this game. Mastina entrance and how she posts is town. Iirc she has a complete inability to play that was as scum, and I don't see titus flaunting around her potential PR in the way that she is as scum.

That leaves Dunn, FB, SB, BM, Oil, guillo, and gamma

This is the last thing I wrote before thread lock.

[Sugar Cain]

VOTE: FB

???

[Sugar Cain]

I'm getting a sense of FB wanting to be in the ring as indicative as something beyond alignment reasons

[Titus]

Dunn, would the game improve if you were conftown?

[Bell]

@Bell You if i understand correctly. Mastina is usually opinionated with her read and you think she is off because she is not here?
Town!Mastina can’t legitimately be hesitant about her reads?

This is very accurate. Or in the accurate ball park. The nuance is how she comes off.
Based on prior meta,

She doesn't show doubt until she is doubted to reassure others that she isn't tunneled or whatever complex thoughts and coping mechanisms are behind the habits of somebody playing mafia for 10x as long as I have.

It's silly because I'm basing this off, like 3 games and not properly compensating for not knowing her alignment this game. I think i'm just being overly confident because when you see somebody effort a lot as town three times and you see slight variation you know there's a difference. But I shouldn't feel this confidence about what it means, but I'm propping it up with some very basic empirical stuff that doesn't have anything to do with her posts underneath it (i'm not going to talk about the basic empirical stuff that just statistically makes someone more likely to be scum) Rather they're disassociated and, arguably one of them doesn't apply.

Also, my read of Sugar Cain just whip lashed from lean town to hard town bin to paranoia spiral based on their last 3 posts. They directly touched upon a lot of topics that are townie asf to touch on with townie asf reads.

[Guillotina]

Nora is town, flea is town, bell is probably town, I'm inclined to mastina and titus town this game. Mastina entrance and how she posts is town. Iirc she has a complete inability to play that was as scum, and I don't see titus flaunting around her potential PR in the way that she is as scum.

That leaves Dunn, FB, SB, BM, Oil, guillo, and gamma

This is the last thing I wrote before thread lock.

In what world I'm scum and I'm scum-reading and pushing gamma and superbowl to the arena, whom you scum read too?

I'll wait.

[Sugar Cain]

Do we have Superbowl as a scum read?

I have no opinion on that slot yet, and Nero didn't convey such a read to me.

What makes you think the left-overs= scum?

[Sugar Cain]

Gamma- I can imagine a world where Gamma could be scum and taking advantage of the heat on our slot to use as a reason to push our slot as scum but, as scum he could have just let Nora Tunnel the shit out of us while I wasn't around, and let her go on her scum-reading rampage. Largely underwhelming but I feel like he is sidelined, playing referee.

I am not feeling super good about the fact that he's playing advocate and was eager to get us into the arena even before I was even a presence in the game

[Guillotina]

Do we have Superbowl as a scum read?

I have no opinion on that slot yet, and Nero didn't convey such a read to me.

What makes you think the left-overs= scum?

I don't. I specifically said Gamma-Superbowl

Nero has been pushing SB as scum and you guys nominated Gamma to go to the arena.

[Sugar Cain]

Oil- I mainly want them in the arena because of the fact that lighting a fire under nachos behind is the best way to get him to show his alignment, and what better way than a forced 1v1.

I am keeping Mastinas review on they slot, and she did bring up a solid point regarding the heat they are taking.

What scum-team is willing to bus Nacho, especially this early on?