Left 4 Dead Mafia - Day 6?

[Charlie]

Charlie thinks there are 3 scum left and therefore agrees with me that we are in mylo, but puts down a vote before we reach concensus. He also encourages Amished and myself to vote as if it's just any normal Day instead of mylo. Does not compute. Another black mark.

That vote garnered some discussion didn't it? Discussion is a good thing.

I really don't like Charlie's post 1686. Cutting out half the field is ridiculous when we only have 1 confirmed Townie. And I really don't like you trying to push yourself as cleared when you are nowhere near it.

Occam's razor, bob. Also why is asking that question "cutting out half the field"? It is merely selective questioning. I don't discount the other possibilities and I even answered your set of questions.

Anyways, my scummiest read right now is Charlie. I can collate a full case if necessary.
But frankly since I think we're in mylo, I still think a no-lynch is the right move. But if nobody else is gonna go for that, then my choice today would be Charlie. I would settle for bv, but he's not ideal.

Nope, you're wrong on both points. A no-lynch would just get our confirmed townie (Dizzy) killed, unless there is some protection mechanism in play. Unlikely, IMHO.

2) Your self-preservation is scum bullshit

In what way am I promoting my self-preservation?

For the longest time you've piggy-backed Glork and SPS (and IIRC partially Izzy at one point). I've finally figured out why I've been getting my bad vibes from this game and you: you've been the one attempting to frame me.

I also switch my suspicions to many others; doesn't that tell you something? Did I really press for your lynch? Doesn't that tell you something?

Instead I believe you're buddying to Starbuck (ISO 80 and ISO 85)

I trust my town reads more than the others.

To elaborate further as well: you've "conveniently" resisted looking at alternate explanations for the NK's because you don't want to give your own motivations away through discussion. You know that it can't hold up to intense scrutiny but you continue to push the weak reason that you've pushed all game. You're worse than SK in the fact that you haven't "caught up" insofar as you haven't produced the case that you've essentially been promising since you've first voted me (since you never really had anything ever).

You've overcomplicated things. I'm looking at it simple. Am I really pushing? No, not really.

Also, I want people to look back at his interactions with dramonic...<snip>

This is ridiculous, I throw your case out of the window. Think simple and you'll read me differently.

Overall, I think your case is based on me being complicated. I don't do complicated stuff. I'd prefer to keep things simple and that is reflected in my posts. Continue scumhunting.

I think we should lynch one of...
almightybob
Amished
SaintKerrigan

[Charlie]

crypto, besides bv, who else do you think is Infected?

[Amished]

@crypto: There's no way that bv is more scummy than Charlie. bv is second a ways back but not the most scummy.

@Charlie: Don't even give the line "oh, my vote was for discussion". That was not your intent when you put it down and you know it. Your unvote after seeing SK's opinion of your vote on me with what else you've said just today shows that you're very concerned with what (assuming you-scum) SK-town (because I don't see connections there between you) thinks of you. If one person puts you higher on their scum list for that you don't want to get lynched. Clear unvote for self-preservation.

My case winds back and forth, but it's really simple: You've killed people for a dual purpose early in the game, you've applied your "scumtell" unevenly (voting me all the way through over flipped scum even though after all you've said we were suspicious for the same reason. Then you haven't done anything else all game besides ride your argument (which you still haven't posted a case after voting me late on D1). You've never pushed for any lynch with any conviction.

[Charlie]

You want a case, I'll give you a case.

[The AI Director]

The Third Vote Count of Day 5

SaintKerrigan (1):

Starbuck

bv310 (1):

crypto

Charlie (1):

Amished

Not voting (5): almightybob, DizzyIzzyB13, bv310, SaintKerrigan, Charlie

With eight alive, it takes five to lynch. bv310 has been prodded. Deadline is in eight days.

[crypto]

crypto, besides bv, who else do you think is Infected?

Assuming there aren't just four, almightybob. I'm going to continue waffling on the last one. SK drives me up the wall but he's a mediocre lynch. Any lynch except for bv/almightybob is a mediocre lynch.

Also, Amished is town. Knock him off your list and I'm content.

[bv310]

Sorry guys, forgot I owed a post in here. I'll have my opinions on everybody left in a few minutes.

[Amished]

I've wanted a case from anybody for like 3 days now and haven't gotten shit. I'm sick of these retarded accusations.

[bv310]

And by a few minutes, I of course meant several hours. Yes, I tried to do this post entirely objective, and I agree that I've been playing horribly lurky this game. Lurky =/= scummy.

So,

almightybob

- Bob has been one of the most level-headed players so far. I agree with a lot of his posting so far, and I especially agree with his reasoning against Charlie. Town Read.

Amished

- I came into this post expecting to find him the scummiest and lay down a vote, but in ISO he comes across as exactly the opposite. Town read

DizzyIzzyB13

- Confirmed town.

bv310

- Active lurking personified in this game. His contributions have been negligible, which along with a lot of promised content makes him seem rather scummy. Has received an item though, and was blocked while trying to use it on the (flipped) godfather.

crypto

- My second-highest scumread as of this post. Started as my highest, but reading Charlie has changed that. His posting, besides his one catchup post, has been a lot of one-liners, item grabbing, and quick voting. If he is not scum, I will be surprised.

SaintKerrigan

- has been stalling on his catchup post, but I feel like I can sympathize having a low interest level for this game. His contributions have been low, but I don't find him all that scummy.

Charlie

- In light of the heat coming his way off of Bob and Amished, I reread him in iso. His early D1 posting seems to be scum trying to get the feel of the town, and his subsequent posting has been scummy in no small way. I never realized how much he pushed the nameclaim even after the drawbacks were made very clear. His nameclaim of Ellis really does nothing for me, especially given how eager he was to post it.

Starbuck

- I can never get a read on Star. So far, her posting has been relatively level, but that's how she always plays.


So if my reads are correct, and if the game really was a 3v3 setup, then the remaining scum are Crypto, Charlie, and either Starbuck or SK.

Unvote, Vote: Charlie

[Charlie]

Reading Amished in iso results in him starting of looking scummy, but ends progressively turns townish.

Amished - I came into this post expecting to find him the scummiest and lay down a vote, but in ISO he comes across as exactly the opposite. Town read

I'll admit it, I have to agree with that. However!

almightybob - Bob has been one of the most level-headed players so far. I agree with a lot of his posting so far, and I especially agree with his reasoning against Charlie. Town Read.

I disagree with this. Bob is playing sub par-ish in this game.

[Charlie]

Oh heck. There is one lead nobody thought to follow. Remember the pipe bomb? I deduce that crypto is in possession of it!

How about sharing what you have done/not done with it?

[almightybob]

I think 3/3 is more likely than one large scum group. I also don't think it matters. If it is 3/3

and

I'm voting town then

all three scum

will have a fucking hard time quick-hammering without getting intercepted.

I don't like that. Perhaps I'm being over-cautious, but on principle I disagree with placing a vote at all in mylo/lylo before a concensus is reached through discussion. Besides, it's not unheard of for scum to organise a time to all log in and quickhammer if possible.

That vote garnered some discussion didn't it? Discussion is a good thing.

I'm tempted to vote you just for that. "It started discussion" is the most pathetic cop-out reason, even more so by page 69. The only time we need votes to prompt discussion is during RVS, and emphatically

not

in mylo.

Occam's razor, bob.

I don't see how that applies to anything you said.

Also why is asking that question "cutting out half the field"? It is merely selective questioning. I don't discount the other possibilities and I even answered your set of questions.

Because you rule out people without any justification. The only person people should be saying "except for X..." is Izzy.

Nope, you're wrong on both points. A no-lynch would just get our confirmed townie (Dizzy) killed, unless there is some protection mechanism in play. Unlikely, IMHO.

I've already given the maths on how a no-lynch increases our odds of hitting scum, with no loss of lynch opportunities.
I see no reason to assume there's no protection abilities, and scum would surely have to weigh it up in their mind either way. We know from Socrates' flip that Townies can have pre-given PRs - a Doctor or similar role is not inconceivable.

Assuming there aren't just four, almightybob.

Why me? I seem to be in the same situation as Amished here - all bluster, no cases against me. How can I possibly defend myself against people just saying "almightybob is scummy"?



Guys, watch the interaction between bv and Charlie in posts 1733 and 1734. bv's suspicion of Charlie sounds a lot like bussing - "after other people have voiced it, I now find him suspicious too". And look at how Charlie practically 180s on Amished after bv gives him direction by saying he finds him very Town. Charlie has been suspicious of Amished this whole time IIRC, and now he agrees that Amished is Town? Come on.

Obvious scumbuddies are obvious.

[SaintKerrigan]

And look at how Charlie practically 180s on Amished after bv gives him direction by saying he finds him very Town. Charlie has been suspicious of Amished this whole time IIRC, and now he agrees that Amished is Town? Come on.

This I agree with. Going to drop my overall game-reading (at Page 22 atm) and look at Charlie in ISO. I might follow this up with a vote later today.

[SaintKerrigan]

Bah, didn't finish my Charlie ISO. I have to leave soon, however.

V/LA from playing games from today until early Saturday morning. I'll still be around for modding, but that's it.

[Charlie]

The game has (was?) stagnated, bob.

Because you rule out people without any justification.

Perhaps a little. I'll try to be more careful about that next time.

Guys, watch the interaction between bv and Charlie in posts 1733 and 1734. bv's suspicion of Charlie sounds a lot like bussing

There is no connection between me and anybody else. If you think you see one then it is just incidental.

[almightybob]

Apologies in advance, but this post is a long one to reinforce my point.

On a more serious matter: I support an Amished lynch today! Based on vote pattern.

vote: Amished

Guys, vote Amished?

my top suspect is still Amished based on yesterday's wagon

Vote: Amished

Anyway, there are other reasons Amished is behaving suspiciously. The reasons for the votes does not seem genuine as he picks out parts of people's post as scummy only.

Can we get a dramonic or Amished or ReaperCharlie lynch today?

Forgive me if I sound naive, but I'm using the simplest explanation: Amished is scum and killed people who suspected him.

unvote
vote: Amished

And,

vote: Amished

just in case the day really IS 3 days long. No more of this no-lynching business.

My suspects include Amished, dramonic and almightybob.

Good. We have a confirmed. Now let's lynch Amished.

unvote
vote: Amished

So, can we please lynch either Amished, dramonic, or almightybob now?

The remaining bad guys are...oh I don't know, Amished, almightybob and bv310 I guess.

The case

[against Amished]

lies with the dead townines.

I don't think Amished is town because townies who suspected him ended up dead

Vote: Amished

[when asked on what grounds he is voting Amished]

That he is scum?

I think we should lynch one of...
almightybob
Amished
SaintKerrigan

Amished

- I came into this post expecting to find him the scummiest and lay down a vote, but in ISO he comes across as exactly the opposite. Town read

Reading Amished in iso results in him starting of looking scummy, but ends progressively turns townish.

Amished - I came into this post expecting to find him the scummiest and lay down a vote, but in ISO he comes across as exactly the opposite. Town read

I'll admit it, I have to agree with that.

This is the most blatant 180 I've ever seen. Within the space of 9 posts (1725 to 1734) you completely change your tune.
Tell me again there's no connection here with bv.


I am happy to lynch Charlie today.

[crypto]

Oh heck. There is one lead nobody thought to follow. Remember the pipe bomb? I deduce that crypto is in possession of it!

Was. I used it on Tarhalindur night 2. It was a one-shot roleblock that I could use on any of the three nights immediately after I got it.

Yawn. This is getting irksome. Charlie is town. Amished is town. Bv310 is continually ignored even with a new splash of scumminess with post 1733. His reads on SaintKerrigan, Charlie, and Starbuck are all blatantly set up for waffling and his FOS of me is crap. Quick voting, really?

[bv310]

Yes really. Posting like your ISO 48, 51, 66, and ESPECIALLY ISO 7 have all been votes with little to no reasoning, mostly either bandwagoning or saying "X is scum, lynch him" with no case. ISO 7 is especially scummy. You come in, grab for a Shotgun and vote with no reasoning whatsoever.

[Starbuck]

Bob, thank you for posting Charlie's posts in quick succession.

Unvote
Vote: Charlie

That is a strange turn.

[Amished]

Oh heck. There is one lead nobody thought to follow. Remember the pipe bomb? I deduce that crypto is in possession of it!

Was. I used it on Tarhalindur night 2. It was a one-shot roleblock that I could use on any of the three nights immediately after I got it.

Why did you choose Tar?

[crypto]

Nelly was scummy. Tarhalindur's last catchup post had several scummy points and his lurking was OOC.

[Amished]

How can you still have a town read on Charlie after all the evidence that's been brought against him though?

[Charlie]

Pretty convincing facts there, bob. But that is just the truth: I did find his iso change from scummy to townish progressively. Sadly it looks like a 180. Your conclusion that it was scummy makes no difference in my suspicion on you.

If Amished is not scum then it is between almightybob, bv310, crypto and SaintKerrigan. Starbuck is quite town I think.

[almightybob]

You're welcome Starbuck.

That's L-1 (Amished, bv310, Starbuck). Since we've already had Charlie's claim, I'll give people a chance to say anything else they want before Night and then I'll place the hammer in a few hours.

[Charlie]

No, I'm at L-2, bob. It takes 5 to lynch. I wouldn't recommend a premature hammer since we have yet to hear more stuff from SK and (admittedly) myself.

I'll give an analysis in a few hours time.