Newbie 1381 Oakhaven is Overrun Game Over

[talah]

Your wish is granted.

VOTE: Grey

[jmo16mla]

Talah, why didnt you have him voted before? And why did you pick him instead of me?

Why would it suck that I'm scum my first time being IC? I don't mind playing either alignment so I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at there.

It's best we don't make associative tells, before we have a flip. That encourages ligning up mislynches down the road.

[talah]

As soon as either of you answer the questions put to you, I'm happy to answer more questions from either of you.

[jmo16mla]

Because that really changes the way I think about the game.

[RachMarie]

Searching for a replacement for Thane Fropome has 25 hrs more to respond to his prod or else he will be replaced.... Rach

[talah]

JMO,

Gah, THAT statement is highly ambiguous. At least use Sarcastica or Super Sarial font to convey tone (credit to Arj Barker), so it doesn't look like you're trying to set up an out.

I clicked through a bit of the meta you have linked in your signature. So if you have this playstyle in neither your scum games nor town games, what's THAT mean? You usually have more statements to make in both by the look. It may be wrong but it's the impression I get (believe me, interesting as I find you I'm not clicking through every single one).

Fun facts:

JMO total Scum reads: 1, (ThaneArvan, in RVS)
JMO total Town reads: 0, (granted not important as said he doesn't town read, playstyle)
Total reads 1,

total reasons for reads 1

(submitted in post #70, reason is generalised behaviour of new-scum)

Greywing total Scum reads: 3, (Mala, in RVS; Luigi, in RVS; talah, mothrax)
Greywing total Town reads: 3, (Honey bee, Malakittens, Fropome)
Total reads 6,

total reasons for reads 3

(Luigi, reason is flying under the radar in RVS; talah, using his vote to scumhunt; mothrax, 'gut feel' immediately after she flagged JMO as suspicious)

None of these reasons look legitimate or defensible to me.

JMO Unanswered questions: Several from various people. I'm not doing the work for you bub but at least a couple asking what you think of *me*, and I am super-uber interested in what you think of Grey right now. That's a question too. Answer it.

Grey Unanswered questions: I *think* you've only got the request for an opinion on JMO from me right now. There might be others outstanding but I'm not your mother - just do your homework. Answer my question please.

TL; DR:

Below is a script for your next post. It'll save you scrolling up three inches to rephrase my statements into questions. Obviously, break it into a few posts to cover your 'contribution' and keep your total post stats up.

Why is the statement ambiguous? What is Sarcastica font? I'm wondering if the

[insert tell about referencing comedians]

tell is in effect here.

Why does it what says who about me if I started using a certain playstyle recently mean? Why should I make more statements? Why would you get that impression? Why would you find me interesting? Are you coming on to me? Not sure what you're getting at here.

As I said, it's best we don't make associative reads until someone is lynched.

Why would you think that Grey Wand's reasons are indefensible?

[Insert another statement which blurs the line between IC and player regarding what we "do" or "don't" usually do, while failing to answer questions]

Thanks for the script talah, now I can do what I *really* want to do with my day.

(yep that's Arj again)

[jmo16mla]

Rach can you update the first post! I've lost track who everyone has replaced.

Also, my scum read, isn't an RVS reason. Where the hell did you get that from?

[Malakittens]

Man Talah is making me laugh. Stop giving me dilemmas I need to hop over

[jmo16mla]

I'm not seeing your questions...

[Honey bee]

Either way jmo still needs to post some actual opinions. Is "amished scumtell" all you really have to say about Talah? I want opinions on the rest of us.

[RachMarie]

First page has been edited... Still looking for a replacement for Thane, and it is looking like I will be looking for one for Fropome too... Rach

[RachMarie]

Gen_Wolf replaces ThaneAravan immediately, working on getting a replacement for Fropome now.... Rach

[Gen_Wolf]

/confirm

Hi All,

As stated I am a replacement. I'm classified as an SE but been over a year since I last played. Will do a catch up now.

[Gen_Wolf]

Read up to page 2. Just going to do it 2 pages at a time, otherwise I forget why I pcked specific posts out.

"...."

How is replacing someone suspicious? The original person never picked/confirmed their role PM. I really doubt that's shows any relevance to alignment.

Where is it said he didn't pick his role PM?

As I said, if anyone has any questions, feel free to ask me.

Clearly the person didn't want to be in the game for unknown reasons. I don't see how Luigi hopping on and voting someone for

that

reason is acceptable. FS has recently replaced out of an ongoing game (only time I'm going to mention it and not going into details) so as I said I don't think it's relevant to alignment.

Well, when Rach, went into the newbie game to get the replacement she never said "He didn't confirm" so that means he never picked it up.

Mala bit at the RVS bait very easily. Either Newb or just pushing very hard from early on.

Maybe my reasoning was deemed better? You think it was unfair that you were questioned, and not me?

Your reasoning was that you didn't like bees. I fail to see the logic. I don't consider it unfair, just... odd. I'm fine with it, really, I just think it's weird.

Look, I was putting up a joke vote, throwing it out there like the rest of us. Can we just drop it?

Luigi asking to drop it rather than answer seems suspicious. To much heat early on?

Well hello there fellows.

Glad to see that I missed the truly silly part of RVS and get to make some comments on what has happened so far.

I like the way Malakittens handled the Luigi vote and Jmo'a subsequent questioning. I think Luigii is just being a little overzealous in this Jmo conversation. I am a bit confused as to why Jmo seems to think the best answer to a vote with no explanation is ANOTHER vote with no explanation.

Also, a quick note to Jmo: I know you're an IC, so can you try to keep the double posts to a minimum?

The only other thing I have to comment on right now is #24. Mothrax seems to be coaching here, asking a question of grey and then giving him a road map of sorts to give the right answer to pull early attention off of him. So, I will semi-randomly yet still informed

Vote: Mothrax

I don't think Mothrax would openly coach Grey if they were scum team. So I do not think Mothrax/Grey combo but either could individually still be.

[Gen_Wolf]

Ok Up to page 4 now.

Correction: moth and mala town vibes, JMO a little less so.
Sorry for the double post

I disagree with this, up until this point I felt JMO had more town vibes than moth and mala.

/reminds herself I'm in a newbie game.

I really don't know if coaching is a decent argument in a newbie game as majority of everyone is new, but the IC/SEs. There is going to be a decent amount of 'coaching' which I would guess in the nature of where we are can, but at the same time can't be considered alignment indicative.

@Tybalt:

How is ThaneArvsn being neutral?

UNVOTE: Jmo

Agree. I feel coaching in newbie games is null tell.

ThaneArvan,

You are still side-lining though. You haven't placed a vote. Do you have any scum-suspects worthy enough for a vote?

Encouraging voting for quick lynch or just asking? Felt scummy when I read it but seems less scummy now I am explaining it but I will put it out there for the record.

I have played mafia in real life but never via forum, I am used to beig able to rely on expressions and tone. I'm not quite sure where I go from here with progressing advice. Can one of the ICs explain this to me? Also, I fail to see how it is anti town not to use a vote

I'm the one and only IC here(;

There aren't many 100% reliable scum reads if any.

It's all about someone's play. Scum can't scum hunt since they already know who town is and who their scum partner(s) are. Typically scum like to jump from wagon to wagon to he someone lynched. If someone is very passive and not taking a side, they could possibly be scum. This is a scum tell because scum don't want to be forced to choose one or the other, for the most part, they want to make everyone happy. Staying passive also keeps scum available to jump on any wagon, as they don't always have definite reads.

It takes a while, some faster than others to fully understand people's playstyles and develop good scum hunting skills.

For this JMO explains scum usually jump from wagon to wagon. The lack of this in this game makes me think either experience (which is unlikely) or lack of activity. I.E. Luigi

I asked you a question, but no I never answered it.

Thane's first post was #10..
You voted him in #55..
He didn't provide anything.. Anything to be neutral.. You're basically voting a lurker who's not really being considered a lurker.
Now if second post came before your #55 then you might have a chance with that argument, but right now you're grasping at straws.

Sorry Tybalt, but I don't like your latest post. You seem to be tryin to find your footing, but it's really weak and really giving me a bad vibe. I can see new scum going for the lets vote a lurker card to try to avoid attention and look like they are helping.

VOTE: Tybalt

Agree with this.

Apologies for not having posted for a while, haven't really had much to say. Anyway, after a quick lookover...

VOTE: Thane

Still hasn't voted, and with a lot of discussion and accusations going around, even a couple in my direction, I can think of a few reasons, but the most prominent in my mind at the moment is unsure of who to put pressure on to get lynched. Which is mainly done as Mafia, in my experience.

Luigi not helping his case. Had a quick lookover, saw a few votes on Thane and thus followed the bandwagon.

[Gen_Wolf]

Why are you so concerned?

Short post, no content, silly question. Just trying to look active.

So also mothrax, in saying that you're not seeing the Mala case, does that mean that you *do* actually see a case for Thane?

Putting words in peoples mouths trying to create something that is not.

Not particularly no.

Grey is my top scumread ATM, but I need to reread the last couple of pages. I didn't like luigi and your case on mala seems reaching.

Agree with all 3 things mothrax says in this post.

Wait, you're voting me because I'm caring about your prior slot putting someone at L-2?

I'm not sure what type of response you are expecting from me in regards to this. I could suggest you meta me regarding this, but it's your call. I don't like early L-1/L-2 wagons because there's not much information to go off in-case of a quick lynch. If there's a flip (regardless of alignment) due to interactions with everyone it brings me one step closer to figuring out the scum from town members.

Well, no, I'm not voting for you to be lynched because of

your vote

on the previous slot exactly. I only know that the previous slot is now my slot, which is Town (and which Scum would know, and therefore be a target of). However, Luigi was abrasive so that's a very very weak tell for me to criticise you voting against.

I also admit I'm reaching by questioning the 'don't want you to flip scum' quote itself, but the answer was incoherent, if you don't mind me saying (which I'm sure you shouldn't):

I'm not, but I don't want you to flip scum looking for an easy target.

Reaching. If you know you are reaching then why do you pursue it??

Okay I see my predecessor had their vote on mothrax. just want to point out that I'm leaning town on moth and won't be putting that vote back.

Fropome seems town to me. Shmaaking his play!

I didn't even notice he had voted me. Lol

Are you voting me because I didn't have any votes?

Same as earlier. Not contributing much. Just posting for activity purposes.

Fropome, how would you react on Day 2, if you led the charge for a mislynch on Day 1 with a strong but incorrect read?

I am pretty sure he would feel shit. How is this question relevant though?

[Gen_Wolf]

*yawn*

prod Mr. Thanearvan please Mod or maybe replace him. He hasn't been any more active since the post where he said he would be.

Grey do you have any other reads other than Talah?

You are a very strange player, talah. First off, when I asked for reads I meant scum reads. I don't care about town reads either, I only see scumminess and lack there of. So far, I haven't really gotten an idea of what you find scummy. You back down from things, double-thinking, and a lot of strange side comments. Like right now you have your vote on Grey, but you call him a good questioner. Isn't him mostly questioning what got you suspicious of him? And doesn't this criticism apply to jmo too? I can not see consistent suspicions in your posts, and for all the discussion in the thread you should have a stance on something.

Why am I strong read? just cause I put effort into my posts does not make me town.

Are you admitting your scum?; Don't really see why you'd openly tell people to question whether your town or not town?

It's more difficult being an IC you know, being my first time and all, even harder. Most people on site don't like other people going to your posts and seeing if they are posting in other games. I'm one of them. I post when I feel like I can contribute to the game. Otherwise, I post fluff. Fluff isn't good for town. Plus, using other ongoing games as evidence is breaking the main rule on MS and could result in a modkill.

Quality>quantity.

Classic excuse. Awful excuse. For someone who doesn't like a lot of fluff you have done very well at providing us with a lot.

I'm an easy lynch is never ever ever a good thing to say. Making excuses for poor play is a bad habit.

Agree

I'm an easy lynch is never ever ever a good thing to say. Making excuses for poor play is a bad habit.

whos scum?

More fluff kindly sponsored by JMO

Grey do you have any other reads other than Talah?

Scum-wise? Nobody that really sets off alarm bells like Talah does. I'm pretty confident that you are Town, and I'm getting Town reads on Mala and Fro. Besides the three of you, I can't say with confidence.

If I had to pick a second scum right now, I'd go with Moth. Something just seems off to me when I read his posts. My case here is predominantly gut though.

You shitting me? Moth is the most town player right now?

Your wish is granted.

VOTE: Grey

And, Talah does it again. I am pretty sure Talah is scum.

Alright here are my reads up until this point.

Town:

mothrax

Null:

Fropome - came in with a bang but hasnt done much since
Honey bee - good posts but just seems to be in the sidelines
Malakittens - Ah about but not much to go on, one or two small errors but nothing that screams scum.
tybalt - bordering scum section but made some good points

Scum vibes:

talah - I thought luigi was scum and you haven't done anything to change that
Greywing - Your reads are bizarre, voting as well.
jmo16mla - Posted a bunch of fluff after saying you hate fluff, used IC as an excuse, and haven't made an effort to push the game on. No real scum hunting and you are meant to be the most experienced player. The list goes on but you sir seem very scummy.

unvote

- I will be voting for JMO but I want to see the vote count before I do it to see what L- he is on. The second Rach posts a vote count I will place my vote.

[jmo16mla]

That sounds like scum.

Why don't you go up there and look at the last VC and go from there instea of trying to gain town credit by saying you'll wait?

[Gen_Wolf]

Because I can't be arsed to go look at the last vote count andwork out who's voted and unvoted. Its not my job. Thus I asked the admin and I will wait thank you.

[Honey bee]

What's so "not defensible" about greywing's reads, talah? Luigi's early posts were bad and he said that he only suspected mothrax on gut reasons. The mala thing he changed his mind on and that WASN'T a random vote. Otherwise I wouldn't have voted him. His questions are at least useful and he's picking up on posts which should be questioned. So while I find your sharp banter amusing, I'm not getting what your case is against him. Instead you should look over tybalt and maybe vote him.

Jmo I just don't get you. I feel like you're just testing my patience.

Are you admitting your scum?; Don't really see why you'd openly tell people to question whether your town or not town?

*roll eyes* yes, that is

exactly

what I was doing.
Go back and read again. Talah called me a strong town read, and there's really no good reason for it. When people put strong town reads on me I get suspicious, and I need to know why.

Greywing - Your reads are bizarre, voting as well.

No. This is not scummy. Just because you have a town read on mothrax and he has a bad feeling about mothrax does not make him scummy. You are wrong.

Jmo only has one vote on him from tybalt.

That sounds like scum.

Great analysis.

[jmo16mla]

But f you're that concerned about it, why wouldn't you go look? You seemed pretty adamant about voting me.

[jmo16mla]

Honey bee, i questioned him because with my reason for calling him scummy. You missed that?

[Honey bee]

No, that reason just feels null in my opinion.

[jmo16mla]

If you saw it, why did you discount it as no analysis?

[Honey bee]

Because it's a stretch. You've had your vote on that slot for a while for poor reasons, and to declare it as scum over something small like "town cred" disagrees with me. Do you have anything else to say about gen_wolf?