Mafiascum.net

Brian here. From what it looks like, my predecessor did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING this game. So I'm just going to go ahead and claim.

I dare you scum-fucks to CC me.


In all seriousness, though:
29 Answered in thread.
30 I must be trippin' then.
31 Nice naked vote. You got a reason or are you just gonna shed responsibility by sheeping Nacho?
42 Why are you condoning this?
50 Why are you answering for someone else?
51 Oooh Reallyyyyyyy?
57 Why was the third vote more scummy?
61 I'm failing to see why GM deserved to be voted instead of Buck based on this logic.
63 What the hell are you goin' on about?
66 I disagree!
68 Now, if only "lynch all newb-lurkers" actually worked as a viable scum-tell. The first time I ever played Mafia, I rolled scum and I promise you I did not lurk. I took control of the town and lynched every person I wanted to.
70 Let's say you lynch a quiet player and they indeed flip town. Then what? You're back to the same boat but the player never gave you any information to work with. If you want a particular player to produce you content, take the initiative and engage them.
96 Not me I hope!
98 Instead of being worried about the sheeping, you should be more worried about the motivations behind the actions. Giffy wanted to see reactions, is this town-motivated or scum-motivated? Jmo decided to vote GM instead of you for who knows what reason. Is this town-motivated or scum-motivated?
115 How the hell did you get two completely different reactions meshed together like that?
120 1) I think people just find it suspicious when you try to direct blame onto a player for what they did in a previous game. 2) If you haven't seen her town-game, how can you discern? 3) It's just the play-style. He's mysterious and hard to read for me. Try not to get sucked in. 4) I don't think so. Not liking how some of the pressure got onto this slot.

Please forgive me for the large gap. I got rather bored having to sort through the giant mountain of content you produced for me. I guess it's time for me to

A LOT of those post show me creating discussion... typically indicative of town players..

ACTUALLY, tell me why you're voting me. I'd hate to assume something and get yelled at for "misrepping" after looking at your quotes you linked.

In post 175, Brian Skies wrote:30 I must be trippin' then.

Ooh, u SO trippin'
Also, have you come across the [post] tags? Much quicker than urls for this sort of list.

42 Why are you condoning this?

Why is who condoning naked votes?

98 Instead of being worried about the sheeping, you should be more worried about the motivations behind the actions. Giffy wanted to see reactions, is this town-motivated or scum-motivated? Jmo decided to vote GM instead of you for who knows what reason. Is this town-motivated or scum-motivated?

This might be the new towniest thing thus far.

So three summary-type things for Brian:
1. I have heard good things and hope they are true.
2. I hope you are Town.
3. Not sure if buddying or just good-natured.

In post 178, jmo16mla wrote:ACTUALLY, tell me why you're voting me. I'd hate to assume something and get yelled at for "misrepping" after looking at your quotes you linked.

In post 175, Brian Skies wrote:61 I'm failing to see why GM deserved to be voted instead of Buck based on this logic.

If I'm misrepping, you should let me know. I hate it when people do that.

In post 179, goodmorning wrote:Also, have you come across the [post] tags? Much quicker than urls for this sort of list.

Haven't tried them yet. I'm still new to forum based interactions and I'm still discovering new things. If they're much quicker, then I gotta try them out sometime. These walls I keep making are sooooo time-consuming.

In post 179, goodmorning wrote:Why is who condoning naked votes?

I was talking about Giffy condoning naked sheeping. It's Giffy though, and this is the first time I've seen him outside of a hydra or being a mod. Based on what's been said about him, it's just a 'meh' thing because I don't know how he plays.

In post 179, goodmorning wrote:So three summary-type things for Brian:
1. I have heard good things and hope they are true.
2. I hope you are Town.
3. Not sure if buddying or just good-natured.

1) These rumors...where are they coming from?
2) Well, I hope you are Town too.
3) Look at how the votes ended up on you. Nacho voted you for probably RVS/serious related reasons that I do not know (nor care about). Jmo sheeped Nacho instead of voting Buck. And Giffy was doing who knows what with that vote. Your general apathy towards the pressure reads town because there's no reason to get defensive over it.

Brian Skies wrote: Now, if only "lynch all newb-lurkers" actually worked as a viable scum-tell. The first time I ever played Mafia, I rolled scum and I promise you I did not lurk. I took control of the town and lynched every person I wanted to.

Good for you, please post a link to the game in question. This is a highly dangerous strategy that never works against good players for more than a few rounds because you are either mafia killing town or a misguided town lynching the wrong people, nobody would then follow your reads after a certain point and if you further tried to lead town after failing everyone else would see you as highly suspicious. Furthermore once a town is lynched you can revisit all the motivations that led to that lynch and if you actually were the one going for it the chance you slipped is higher, especially if you are a new mafia player.

Brian Skies wrote:70 Let's say you lynch a quiet player and they indeed flip town. Then what? You're back to the same boat but the player never gave you any information to work with. If you want a particular player to produce you content, take the initiative and engage them.

Totally disagree with this, first you reduce the suspect pool because the quiet town was inherently suspicious as there is no way to get a read on him, second you avoid worring about a future mislynch at lylo, thirdly it's the players own fault if he gets lynched and he was town, there is no reason to "take the initiative" and make him produce content, he is responsible for showing the rest of us he is town and finally you know his alignment so you have more information than before the lynch which you can use to re-read previous posts of other people who actually produced content. This said, we tried prodding IamDr multiple times, since this game was going nowhere.

Brian Skies wrote:How the hell did you get two completely different reactions meshed together like that?

That was not a reaction, that's what I read about her post after analyizing it, I liked the part where she gave a town read, have to say by the way I'm liking it less and less since she has been giving town reads left right and centre, albeit well motivated, and I did not like the deflection so much, so I explained what could be behind it given both possible scenarios. I also find it important to always give my thought process when writing so everyone else who is town can get a read off of that and come back to it if they need to make a decision on my alignment in the future.

Brian Skies wrote: 120 1) I think people just find it suspicious when you try to direct blame onto a player for what they did in a previous game.

What they might have found suspicious is that I wrongly accused DC, saying that meta gaming is suspicious is just weird, of course you will compare a player to how he played and what he did in another game to see if it's his usual style. Take the GIF sheep for instance, the fact he stated in a previous game that sheeping is done at the start to put pressure on someone and see how they react makes it less likely he is mafia, if BW were to sheep someone in a future game that would be an insta-tell for me, given how he is reacting to people sheeping and his general play style.

Brian Skies wrote: 2) If you haven't seen her town-game, how can you discern?

Is there a need to discern when she was either mafia or bad town and a good lynch anyway?

So to sum this up, you produced a lot of content, most of it is questioning other people's plays and some of it is defending your slot, the first part is fine and what I would also do as new town coming into the game, the second part I don't buy at all but it's more IamDr's fault for putting you into this position than yours so I'll try to play as if she never did at least day 1.

I also see there are some murky reads hidden in the posts, which I would like you to make explicit, so here's my invitation: please give us your top mafia and top town reads.

Jmo16mla wrote:A LOT of those post show me creating discussion... typically indicative of town players..

I don't see that at all, a lot of his posts make you look suspicious.

I like where we are going now because I can clearly see two factions emerging with JM and Nacho (btw Nacho kindly answer the open questions we have for you) on one side and GM and BR on the other.

Chrisp must be a damn mastermind.

In post 181, CrisP wrote:

Brian Skies wrote: Now, if only "lynch all newb-lurkers" actually worked as a viable scum-tell. The first time I ever played Mafia, I rolled scum and I promise you I did not lurk. I took control of the town and lynched every person I wanted to.

Good for you, please post a link to the game in question. This is a highly dangerous strategy that never works against good players for more than a few rounds because you are either mafia killing town or a misguided town lynching the wrong people, nobody would then follow your reads after a certain point and if you further tried to lead town after failing everyone else would see you as highly suspicious. Furthermore once a town is lynched you can revisit all the motivations that led to that lynch and if you actually were the one going for it the chance you slipped is higher, especially if you are a new mafia player.

I realize this is a question for Brian, but I can back this up too. See N1305 for my first real Scum game, in which I posted as much as I possibly could, and MN1420 for my first SK game, in which I only killed Town, claimed Vig, was somehow believed, and won anyway.

Brian Skies wrote:70 Let's say you lynch a quiet player and they indeed flip town. Then what? You're back to the same boat but the player never gave you any information to work with. If you want a particular player to produce you content, take the initiative and engage them.

Totally disagree with this, first you reduce the suspect pool because the quiet town was inherently suspicious as there is no way to get a read on him, second you avoid worring about a future mislynch at lylo, thirdly it's the players own fault if he gets lynched and he was town, there is no reason to "take the initiative" and make him produce content, he is responsible for showing the rest of us he is town and finally you know his alignment so you have more information than before the lynch which you can use to re-read previous posts of other people who actually produced content. This said, we tried prodding IamDr multiple times, since this game was going nowhere.

As far as theory goes on this one, these are pretty much the two sides to the argument.
It's usually pretty well accepted to lynch slots which are detrimental to Town before LyLo in many games. That said, this game is Micro-sized, so these sorts of lynches will happen less often.

Brian Skies wrote:How the hell did you get two completely different reactions meshed together like that?

That was not a reaction, that's what I read about her post after analyizing it, I liked the part where she gave a town read, have to say by the way I'm liking it less and less since she has been giving town reads left right and centre, albeit well motivated, and I did not like the deflection so much, so I explained what could be behind it given both possible scenarios. I also find it important to always give my thought process when writing so everyone else who is town can get a read off of that and come back to it if they need to make a decision on my alignment in the future.

A question for you: would giving lots of townreads make it easier for me if I were Scum, or harder?

Goodmorning wrote:I realize this is a question for Brian, but I can back this up too. See N1305 for my first real Scum game, in which I posted as much as I possibly could, and MN1420 for my first SK game, in which I only killed Town, claimed Vig, was somehow believed, and won anyway.

Thanks for the links, I'll check them out. Your description of the second game just shows how hard it is though, after killing town you had to make a PR claim to carry it out and that's always an iffy proposition at best, if mafia has to make plays to win then town is already in a better position compared to the everybody lurks and we RL scenario that a set of IamDr players would create.

While we are on the subject of meta and GM, if you are town and have a bit of time check out her other newbie game in progress, 1447.

Goodmorning wrote:As far as theory goes on this one, these are pretty much the two sides to the argument.
It's usually pretty well accepted to lynch slots which are detrimental to Town before LyLo in many games. That said, this game is Micro-sized, so these sorts of lynches will happen less often.

Where are the two sides, you just say it's pretty well accepted . Moreover, why would that be the case in a micro game, if anything having a small game requires you to get rid of potentially dangerous slots faster given how quickly you can get to lylo, whereas you can afford a random lynch in bigger games just to get more information.

Goodmorning wrote:A question for you: would giving lots of townreads make it easier for me if I were Scum, or harder?

Ultimately, like any other information you give, it makes it harder for you as mafia, but:

1. 3 town reads is not going overboard even as mafia.
2. Sometimes mafia say so and so is town based on their comments because they think everyone else will also pick up on how towny someone is being, forgetting that the rest of us don't know that person's alignment, so what for them is a clear tell for us is not at all.
3. It dilutes the importance of you giving that first read on GIF, if you are generally free with your town reads what could have been a tell is now a null for me.

In post 168, CrisP wrote:Nacho is that based on a gut read that he looks town by the way he talks or has it something to do with one of these reasonings:

It's the way he talks.

In post 170, goodmorning wrote:I hadn't thought of that. I suppose you could be, although this early in the game?

In post 175, Brian Skies wrote:Please forgive me for the large gap. I got rather bored having to sort through the giant mountain of content you produced for me. I guess it's time for me to

I can't say I come close to understanding why you voted JMO (#61? Why does that make him more likely to be scum?)/what your reads currently look like.

In post 179, goodmorning wrote:This might be the new towniest thing thus far.

Why?

@mod Mala it's past time you prodded DC, 6 days and counting from his last post.

I know about DC. I will be seeking a replacement in less than 2 hours. (Waiting for a timer to count-down)

Cris, why aren't you voting?

In post 184, CrisP wrote:

Goodmorning wrote:I realize this is a question for Brian, but I can back this up too. See N1305 for my first real Scum game, in which I posted as much as I possibly could, and MN1420 for my first SK game, in which I only killed Town, claimed Vig, was somehow believed, and won anyway.

Thanks for the links, I'll check them out. Your description of the second game just shows how hard it is though, after killing town you had to make a PR claim to carry it out and that's always an iffy proposition at best, if mafia has to make plays to win then town is already in a better position compared to the everybody lurks and we RL scenario that a set of IamDr players would create.

Well, the thing with the second game was that with 2 kills a night and no claimed vig they were going to start SK hunting and I was going to be the logical choice.
At any rate you're right that lurking is generally anti-Town.

While we are on the subject of meta and GM, if you are town and have a bit of time check out her other newbie game in progress, 1447.

But don't talk about it because site rules.

Goodmorning wrote:As far as theory goes on this one, these are pretty much the two sides to the argument.
It's usually pretty well accepted to lynch slots which are detrimental to Town before LyLo in many games. That said, this game is Micro-sized, so these sorts of lynches will happen less often.

Where are the two sides, you just say it's pretty well accepted . Moreover, why would that be the case in a micro game, if anything having a small game requires you to get rid of potentially dangerous slots faster given how quickly you can get to lylo, whereas you can afford a random lynch in bigger games just to get more information.

The side that Brian put forth and the side that you put forth, I meant.
You pretty much said it yourself: random lynches are more affordable in larger games (particularly ones with multiple killing roles, but that's a topic for another time).

Goodmorning wrote:A question for you: would giving lots of townreads make it easier for me if I were Scum, or harder?

Ultimately, like any other information you give, it makes it harder for you as mafia, but:

1. 3 town reads is not going overboard even as mafia.
2. Sometimes mafia say so and so is town based on their comments because they think everyone else will also pick up on how towny someone is being, forgetting that the rest of us don't know that person's alignment, so what for them is a clear tell for us is not at all.
3. It dilutes the importance of you giving that first read on GIF, if you are generally free with your town reads what could have been a tell is now a null for me.

1. True.
2. Perhaps to an extent, but sometimes a tell is a tell is a tell.
3. Well, GIF is a special case. Normally I'd be pretty reticent in the early stages of a newbie game.

In post 185, Nachomamma8 wrote:

In post 170, goodmorning wrote:I hadn't thought of that. I suppose you could be, although this early in the game?

Are you saying he looks to you like the kind of person who would early bus?

In post 179, goodmorning wrote:This might be the new towniest thing thus far.

Why?

Are you kidding me? That question and the thought processes that it's coming from (that you can even see being worked out in the latter half of the question) come from a very towny place.

ArcAngel9 replaces Diamondcrash.

Ill edit OP at home

In post 189, goodmorning wrote:Are you saying he looks to you like the kind of person who would early bus?

The answer I expected was something along the lines of "of course I'm not going to assume that you're bussing me because I'm town, what the hell are you thinking?".

In post 189, goodmorning wrote:Are you kidding me? That question and the thought processes that it's coming from (that you can even see being worked out in the latter half of the question) come from a very towny place.

I want real reasoning :/
Don't just tell me it's coming from a townie place, I could infer that already. Tell me why it's coming from a townie place.

[quote="Nachomamma8]Cris, why aren't you voting?[/quote]

I am waiting for some people to post

sorry mala I keep forgetting the second " when I'm using mobile devices

hello folks
i ll be able to post from monday...let me catch up!!!

In post 192, CrisP wrote:[quote="Nachomamma8]Cris, why aren't you voting?

I am waiting for some people to post[/quote][/quote]
Why wait for them to post? You do have a scumread in the people who have posted, right?

Why are you pressuring me for my vote, are you getting nervous?

I do have a series of scenarios each with their own scumreads, the posts I am waiting for should help to narrow it down before it's time to commit my vote.

It's anti town to not use your vote...

jmo16mla wrote: It's anti town to not use your vote...

who said anything about not using it, I said I'm going to give it after a few key people post. Why are you misrepresenting?

Throwing in 4 ISOs I've done, I'll take a look at the rest tomorrow.

Crisp: Strong town. post 46 appears town like, I definitely agree with his beliefs on lurkers. Yes irony, I know.
Post 113 is great. In general Crisp is playing like pro-town, similar to what he was doing last game.

GM: Starts off attacking me for my post then jumps to crisp, both null moves. He gets an early townread on both GIF and DC. Both of them were voting me at the time, yet GM does not vote me?
He votes JMO next. Post 154 has a town feel. Leaning town, and definitely should not get lynched today as he is one of the more useful players creating discussion. My worry is a possible scum GM-GIF team as both seem like town leaders right now.

JMO: Sheeps nacho initially and then tunnels GM for 2/3 of the day. Has a short scuffle with me over voting, then continue to make short quips here and there. Null.

Nacho: Jumps from GIF, to GM to Dr.robot. all part of his scum hunting that I've seen before. He becomes quiet for a bit but then bursts out again with good posts. 148 is a great analysis and I agree with most of it except for his GIF read. Definitely town.