Mafiascum.net

Kast, if you aren't Chen, I think it's Crazy. Hell, Crazy is above you on my list. Then Pablito. Then BV.

@Crazy-
-Comparison of Saber and Zwet is nowhere near the same. Sly's number one pick as scum was Saber. This was constant until he finally made nominations and suddenly dropped his top pick with practically no reason.

Every suspect after Saber was wishy-washy and depended on what town as a whole posted; AM and Zwet were alternated several times as potential second choices, but both were well below the attention on Saber.

-Hewitt was a producer. He tried to buddy with me early, and when I called him on it he became extremely rude and began making irrational, AtE attacks on me. Hindsight is 20/20, it should be obvious now that he was just trying to discredit me since I had correctly named his entire team.

But then again it really wouldn't matter since only Kmd or me would be able to vote, and we'd most likely vote to evict each other over bv.

If I'm evicted in the Final Four, then I'd make bv HoH in hopes that he'd evict Kmd over pablito.

I don't want to lynch bv when Kmd says that he is confirmed town.

You realize this makes absolutely ZERO sense, yes?
You only trust BV as a result of trusting KMD. HOWEVER, you would rather lynch KMD over BV?

This stinks of a ploy to get Kast/KMD/BV lynched for a Crazy-Chenbot win.

-The last parts are provided as "defense" since Pablito requested one. There really isn't much defense I can give since there really isn't any "case" against me other than Hewitt's crying that I caught him. It shows that I have been effectively scumhunting and contributing to the town. It also points out that given KMD's and Crazy's irrational aversions to lynching BV (who is the most probable remaining scum), Pablito may want to vote in a manner that allows for BV's lynch (for that matter, if you are town, you should re-evaluate your confidence in KMD's pronunciation about BV).

If BV is scum, then it looks like things will go like this:
Kast lynched, Pablito HoH
Crazy lynched, BV or KMD HoH
Even if Crazy realizes that BV is probable scum after Kast flips town, it will be too late since Pablito cannot be HoH twice in a row, and KMD or BV would both keep BV alive.
Town loss

Kast wrote: You realize this makes absolutely ZERO sense, yes?
You only trust BV as a result of trusting KMD. HOWEVER, you would rather lynch KMD over BV?

This stinks of a ploy to get Kast/KMD/BV lynched for a Crazy-Chenbot win.

I trust bv as a result of trusting Kmd's judgment, not of trusting Kmd's alignment.

It doesn't make sense for Kmd-scum to lie about bv being confirmed, because then someone could probably figure out he was lying if they researched enough. And imagine taking that risk for someone that's not even on your scum-team! Ridiculous.

I trusting; however, in Kmd's confidence in that bv is town.

(Kast, if you're that worried that bv is scum, just make Kmd HoH instead of pablito when you die. That would solve the problem of "pablito-can't-be-HoH-twice-in-a-row.")

@Crazy-

It doesn't make sense for Kmd-scum to lie about bv being confirmed, because then someone could probably figure out he was lying if they researched enough. And imagine taking that risk for someone that's not even on your scum-team!

KMD-scum would know that BV is town. There is no risk. The rest of your "case" requires this.

(Kast, if you're that worried that bv is scum, just make Kmd HoH instead of pablito when you die. That would solve the problem of "pablito-can't-be-HoH-twice-in-a-row.")

KMD HoH noms Pablito and Crazy. BV votes Pablito. How is that a solution?

However, Mod's clarification is reassuring.

Kast wrote:KMD-scum would know that BV is town. There is no risk. The rest of your "case" requires this.

There is always risk to lying - and that's possibly being caught. Being caught in this case wouldn't be bv flipping scum; it would be someone searching through past games and then being able to say, "Kmd, you're totally lying; there's no possible game to confirm saber/bv!"

Kast wrote:KMD HoH noms Pablito and Crazy. BV votes Pablito. How is that a solution?

In that case bv would be obvscum.

it would be someone searching through past games and then being able to say, "Kmd, you're totally lying; there's no possible game to confirm saber/bv!"

Try reading that one again. I'll let you pretend you never posted something so mind bogglingly senseless.

Kast wrote:

it would be someone searching through past games and then being able to say, "Kmd, you're totally lying; there's no possible game to confirm saber/bv!"

Try reading that one again. I'll let you pretend you never posted something so mind bogglingly senseless.

So what's your point? That you think Kmd is lying about bv being confirmed?

Kast wrote:Try again.

Yeah, I was aware of that earlier post.

But in that case, you're arguing the wrong points right now. You were just disputing that Kmd is probably telling the truth about bv.

@Crazy-
I provided a response to your argument:

I trust bv as a result of trusting Kmd's judgment, not of trusting Kmd's alignment.

It doesn't make sense for Kmd-scum to lie about bv being confirmed, because then someone could probably figure out he was lying if they researched enough. And imagine taking that risk for someone that's not even on your scum-team! Ridiculous.

I am trusting; however, in Kmd's confidence in that bv is town.

You begin with the claim that you trust BV as a result of trusting KMD's judgment and not his alignment.
You defend this point by arguing that KMD would never state trust of BV if KMD was scum.
You conclude that since KMD did state trust of BV, then you trust BV.

This is a flawed argument and I pointed out the flaw (KMD scum might state trust of BV).

It also isn't actually an argument for why KMD-town would be correct about BV.

-You have previously questioned KMD's judgment about BV after hearing KMD's reason for trusting Hewitt. You also expressed doubt about KMD's judgment in each instance that he shared it. I don't see any explanation for why you have confidence that his unshared meta judgments are any more reliable than all his other ones that you have already disagreed with.

Kast - why do you say kmd is obv town? He's actually my second suspect for chenbot atm.

Kmd seems to be wavering and isn't very steadfast, so I'm considering voting him, but I'm pretty sure this vote is more in bv's hands than mine.

@Pablito-
It's mostly meta-read on KMD. He is playing as he does as town. He had some opportunities that he could have capitalized on as scum (and I would expect he would have as scum), but did not.

I don't really have any idea how BV plans to vote since BV has been pretty quiet on his suspects in general.

If he is scum, then obviously self preservation says he should vote me. If he is town, then that's a lot less certain. I haven't heard his opinion of me, but he was previously suspicious of KMD.

If BV votes for KMD, then my guess is KMD picks BV as next HoH. After that, it's completely up in the air due to BV not really expressing his thoughts. I'm leaning to BV picks Kast and Pablito, letting Crazy evict Kast. At that point I could pick Pablito to evict BV. If BV is scum, town win, if Crazy is scum, town lose.

If that is how BV will actually play, then I'm willing to take that gamble (but then again, BV as town probably wouldn't take that since he should prefer Kast and Crazy being lynched).

You know, it's not very polite to talk about people who aren't here.

In this case, I think I'm going to hold off until a bit closer to deadline. I like Pablito's judgment so far, even though I didn't agree with some of his decisions earlier, but I think it's better to wait a bit before voting.

@BV-
It would be nice to hear what you think regarding myself, KMD, and Crazy.

Guys, the game ended. Read post 157 by Saber in this game

Saber in that game wrote: Luckily for me, I've got a town role in every single game I entered

I challenge you to find another game Saber joined around that time where he was scum. He was town there, here, <game that he died in that is ongoing>. I don't feel like looking up all his games with search down, but everything that I saw that Saber was in at that time, he was town. He should have been modkilled for that statement, but whatever.

I'm undecided in how I'm voting. I will not share much until bv posts something of substance.

Kast wrote:This is a flawed argument and I pointed out the flaw (

KMD scum might state trust of BV).

Uh, that wouldn't matter if Kmd was scum or not, as long as he had something that confirmed bv.

Kast wrote:It also isn't actually an argument for why KMD-town would be correct about BV.

Yes, in which case I was trusting his judgment, because he was showing extreme confidence. Calvin and Hobbes quote: "If you can't win by reason, go by volume."

As for now that it's revealed, yeah, I still agree that bv is almost surely town.

@KMD-
That's pretty compelling evidence.

@Crazy-
You posted an argument that KMD as scum would never say BV is town. This was in parallel with claiming that KMD as town would be trustworthy.

The former claim was false and I showed that it was false. This does not have anything to do with whether I believed KMD was actually lying or not.

Kast wrote:@Crazy-
You posted an argument that KMD as scum would never say BV is town. This was in parallel with claiming that KMD as town would be trustworthy.

The former claim was false and I showed that it was false. This does not have anything to do with whether I believed KMD was actually lying or not.

Actually, what I said was that Kmd, as scum, would not in order to confirm bv (as in, make up the whole fact of this "other game.")

Though, yeah, that really doesn't matter, since now seeing the evidence, you can agree that bv is most likely town.

I presume that makes me your top suspect, but I wouldn't blame you, because I'd think the same thing.

I'm not sure what to believe in the case of saberwolf's statement.

In any case, we need to hear bv say more, but I'm starting to figure out who I want to vote. And I'm starting to think that this game may end soon, finally