In post 1792, Nero Cain wrote:Can you quote Mastin's WKing of Talah. He had a scum read on him early but when he come back and "forgot" he had a scumread on Talah. Yeah, Mastinscum would know they are both town and "forget" his scumread and try for town cred but that's not whiteknighting.
In post 1734, mastin2 wrote:Talah and Luca are both town. Damon and anxiety are both scum.
In post 1553, Luca Blight wrote:To be honest I think I've made my bed with this one, it's my own fault if I get lynched, I take full responsibility.
I would be favourable to a quick-wagoning of Rach, but from the general perspective of the town either me or Talah (VT v VT claims) is going to be the best bet, and as I have already given my vote to Talah there isn't a lot more I can do!
In post 1554, Luca Blight wrote:I started the game lazily, but in a way where if I was another player, I would look at me and think "yeah, that guy must be town, he just doesn't give a f*ck!".
Clearly this tactic has backfired, but as others seem to agree I feel there is definitely some scum on my wagon, so when I'm gone go and hunt them down!
Okay, guys. This is insanely town. Why do you want it dead, exactly?
In post 1732, mastin2 wrote:(For the record--talah looks town for this post, too.)
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:45 am
by Snork
Oh I forgot to explain why DG is italicized in my updated list.
Towards the end of the day, his posts became much better, and I was seeing some subtle town things in the way he was saying things that I didn't think scum would think to adjust.
He's in the could be scum list only because of the flips. I'd like to actually talk with him a bit today and sort that out, but gut tells me he is the most likely to be town out of those listed in could be scum and scum.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:46 am
by Nero Cain
So having a town read=whiteknighting? lol no
No the only whiteknighting I've seen is from Rogers.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:48 am
by Snork
In post 1797, AngryPidgeon wrote:Fucking. Pisskop was scummy BEFORE the Zd kill. The Zd kill is more reason to vote him IMO, its not a fucking complete case on its own 2 legs.
This made me and I kinda think AP's town for the way he's pushing pisskop. Pisskop was sarcastic and rude, not scummy. I could see where he was coming from and in the end talah and luca both flipped town so any reads based on which of those anyone thought were scummy should be null and void.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:51 am
by AngryPidgeon
In post 1660, BipolarChemist wrote:I'm just past page 40 on my catch up now. I guess I'll give a quick update on thoughts now.
I'm copying a lot of these notes from my notebook. I won't be going into too much of a wall, people just skim those, so I'm open to any and all questions if you need me to elaborate.
First 500 Posts:
I found peregrine to be very town acting, helpful and overall decent. I found Mister Rogers the same way, I liked his reads and they feel honest, and he's very contributive. My interaction with Zdenek was interesting, I wanna throw him into the town pile, but I'm not quite ready to. Talah felt very flip floppy, one second inferring he doubts the Fake Vig stuff, but then, in the same post, says I'm most likely town.
This is just a bunch of scummy Information Instead of Analysis.
AngryPidgeon came out swingin' onto the quiet Pisskop, I like the idea of him getting lurkers to talk, not fully sure on him though. I did like Yates doubt of the Fake Vig thing, I found it to be a good perspective that wasn't mentioned yet, but his posts just became big one-shot walls of unhelpfulness, and
I quickly started to find him scummy
. Mastin is still null-scum, but I don't wanna comment until he's back and not dealing with shit.
This is non-committal to the extreme and doesn't really feel genuine?
DeasVeil hasn't posted too much, but I find him decently town. I don't like Thad's or Project Matt's liking of the Fake Vig, seems disgenuine and like they're trying to buy townie points, PM then was very on the fence, not taking a side on the matter.
Hes very much focused on the vig interaction, almost obsessively which is a pretty easy thing for scum to sideline on.
Posts up to about 1000:
Peregrine continued to seem town for the same reasons to me. Same with Rogers. DeasV seemed to drop right off here, I doubt it's scummy, but my town feel is going away. I now like Angry Pidgeon's pushing a lot more, looking more town. I find Pisskop to be decently town acting, not particularly contributive in volume, but he keeps some discussion going.
Snork's entrance into the game was big and seemingly town, as time went on I began to question some of his stuff, I want to put him in my town pile, but I just can't yet. Snow still has barely said anything enough to post on, same with aptil. Zdenek also seemed to go away...
Nothing here looks town? Hes just throwing reads at people and commenting on who is contributing and who isn't.
Thad moved from scum to null for me, I found him to be quite a bit more useful and contributive. Rach still hasn't done much, coasting, unvoting even though she said she hadn't caught up. Nero moved right into my scum pile, unhelpful in kind of an annoying way. Talah's drunk posting was funny, but I still think he's scum. The Oracle claim feels weak, and I don't like it. Yates kept on doing what he does, not changing my opinion of him.
And he actually thought Talah was claiming something serious? The fuck? There is nothing town about this post, so why do you have this guy as lolmegatown?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:53 am
by Snork
lol... he's not lolmegatown. He's probably the most easily moved out of that section, but I like it. What do you want me to say? The flips hit me like a ton of bricks and I have a lot of shit to look over.
What are your updated reads right now, AP?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:04 am
by AngryPidgeon
Town: Nero, Peregrine, Anxiety, aptil (pretty town for vig claim)
Probably town, want to talk to them more: Yates, mastin
Town? Possibly stale reads, could be (probably is?) a scum here: Snork, PA, Snowstorm, Damon Gant
Meh: Pmatt, RM
Scummy: TheWayItEnds, Bipolar, ThAdmiral, DV
, aptil (pretty town for vig claim)
Probably town, want to talk to them more: Yates, mastin
Town? Possibly stale reads, could be (probably is?) a scum here: Snork, PA, Snowstorm, Damon Gant
Meh: Pmatt, RM
Scummy: TheWayItEnds, Bipolar, ThAdmiral,
DV
Ok cool. I disagree most with the bolded. The rest I either agree or I'm not sure enough to say (mostly, TWIE, PV, pmatt). Can you explain your PV town read?
And as far as stale reads, which of these were based on your talah read, do you remember?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:22 am
by projectmatt
Okay. I'll get to this soon.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:06 pm
by Damon_Gant
In post 1801, Snork wrote:Oh I forgot to explain why DG is italicized in my updated list.
Towards the end of the day, his posts became much better, and I was seeing some subtle town things in the way he was saying things that I didn't think scum would think to adjust.
He's in the could be scum list only because of the flips. I'd like to actually talk with him a bit today and sort that out, but gut tells me he is the most likely to be town out of those listed in could be scum and scum.
If you have anything in particular you'd like to ask then feel free.
The fact that Luca and talah were both town tells me that we as a town were way off the mark in Day 1. I'm very much trying to look at everything through new eyes. The people I think I most want to hear from are penguin_alien and TheWayItEnds, who come in as replacements of very mixed bag players. My suspicions of 4nx and aptil from yesterday still hold. ThAd is a player who I have very mixed feelings about and I need to reread his ISO. I'm not delighted with the multitude of town reads for mastin, who has done really nothing to convince me she's town. SnowStorm and RachMarie are players I need to see more of I think to know.
Unvote: RachMarie
I don't like having my vote on nobody, but I think for the second that's the only honest position, at least until I've done a thorough reread of a few ISOs and heard from penguin_alien and TheWayItEnds.
As a question to everyone and anyone: Does Zdenek's flip have any effect on your read of Bipolar's slot, considering the fake vig? And in WIFOM territory, does the fact that Zdenek was killed have any effect on your read of Bipolar?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:17 pm
by Snork
Gant, you actually answered part of what I wanted to know, which was where your reads currently sit. I am personally not sure what conclusions to make from Zd's flip or kill, so as far as making a connection between that and anyone else I don't really know. It's not something I know how to use, or even I don't know that it CAN be used. Right now I'm focusing on sorting the reads that I had in connection to my read on Talah.
I think Rach's behavior towards the two wagons yesterday, and her attempt to excuse it all away today are really, really scummy, and that's kind of the direction I'm going in now. Also, 4nxi3ty saying he much preferred the Luca wagon, but voting Talah as a "compromise" and then never going back to Luca, despite that being his preferred lynch is rather strange.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:34 pm
by Damon_Gant
In post 1809, Damon_Gant wrote:My suspicions of 4nx and aptil from yesterday still hold.
Yikes, I've been very negligent, and accidentally missed a page of reading. In light of aptil's claim my suspicion is very much off him. And yes, I've read all of that page now.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:41 pm
by Plessiez
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:05 pm
by 4nxi3ty
unvote: aptil
Mastin, still waiting for you to further explain your scumread, amigo.
In post 1810, Snork wrote:Also, 4nxi3ty saying he much preferred the Luca wagon, but voting Talah as a "compromise" and then never going back to Luca, despite that being his preferred lynch is rather strange.
Never had a chance to go back. By the time I got back to thread Luca was already at L-1 and I wasn't going to hammer until I got something outta aptil, and possibly mastin.
There's been way too many people calling me scummy in this game <.< Dat "too early to tell" comment opened the door and now scum are gonna come walking in, I think.
(snork might be town for the "oops nvm you posted that today" - showed a genuine reaction imo along with taking time to look at a player and going back to look at the context)
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:08 pm
by AngryPidgeon
In post 1813, 4nxi3ty wrote:(snork might be town for the "oops nvm you posted that today" - showed a genuine reaction imo along with taking time to look at a player and going back to look at the context)
Really? I dont see how making a point on someone and then taking it back because its provably wrong is a town tell?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:11 pm
by AngryPidgeon
In post 1805, Snork wrote:lol... he's not lolmegatown. He's probably the most easily moved out of that section, but I like it. What do you want me to say? The flips hit me like a ton of bricks and I have a lot of shit to look over.
Using the flips as a wildcard excuse for reevaluating everything is a copout that Ive seen scum use before. I'd like you to say WHY it looks town? That was sort of the point of me engaging you about the post you said looked town.
In post 1813, 4nxi3ty wrote:(snork might be town for the "oops nvm you posted that today" - showed a genuine reaction imo along with taking time to look at a player and going back to look at the context)
Really? I dont see how making a point on someone and then taking it back because its provably wrong is a town tell?
that is the point, scum usually take the time to make sure their attacks line up. Obviously he could fake it, or was just being realllly lazyscum. But the whole exchange read genuine to me.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:21 pm
by Yates
@Snork
- I love post 1790 right up until the NKA. I see others have addressed this but yeah - NKA is p-much a wifom bomb.
I'm surprised to see Chemist in the Town list. Can you explain? Other than that, I like your Town list. [oh - bc of his return post? meh]
Also, pisskop slot [TheWayItEnds] is scum. I'm putting matt in the scum pile too.
I might come around on ThAd scum but I want him to be Town. I still have him in my "to be sorted" pile with mastin, Pere and Nero.
SnowStorm is playing a good game. I have him leaning Town but my confidence is shaky. When I start thinking I may be wrong, he responds with a strong post or good logic when pressed. I haven't played with him enough to know what this means but I don't remember him being this - logical? focused? organized? - in Rocky Horror.
I think PA is going to help me read the Rogers slot so I'm not voting there.
In post 1439, RachMarie wrote:how likely do ya all think it is that we have one large scum team or two scum teams and how likely do you think it is we have a SK?
I wouldn't rule out a limited shot SK or some kind of odd-night vs even-night scum team. But I'm inclined to believe Aptil. While I don't do NKA I also don't think scum would waste a shot on a potential easy mislynch. [then again - what an awesome play for an SK to earn an obv-Town read!] I'm playing as if we have one scum team because I don't think it matters.
I'm going to: VOTE: TheWayItEnds
Looking forward to seeing death or contribution from this slot.
In post 1813, 4nxi3ty wrote:(snork might be town for the "oops nvm you posted that today" - showed a genuine reaction imo along with taking time to look at a player and going back to look at the context)
Really? I dont see how making a point on someone and then taking it back because its provably wrong is a town tell?
I don't think it's an anything tell. I think it's me assuming (incorrectly) that you were ISOing people and pointed out something about 4nx from the previous day. The post you quoted wasn't significant when I came back to this thread so it didn't stand out until you quoted it. I assumed it was from before the lynch, so I commented on it. And I pushed that until 4nx responded that they both flipped town, which seemed an odd explanation for the quote, so I went back to check where that quote came from, and realized it was from today and not yesterday.
Not really sure what else there is to that but that.
In post 1805, Snork wrote:lol... he's not lolmegatown. He's probably the most easily moved out of that section, but I like it. What do you want me to say? The flips hit me like a ton of bricks and I have a lot of shit to look over.
Using the flips as a wildcard excuse for reevaluating everything is a copout that Ive seen scum use before. I'd like you to say WHY it looks town? That was sort of the point of me engaging you about the post you said looked town.
wut? Are you seriously accusing me of excusing my read on BPC when I've stated multiple times where it comes from? I am reevaluating everything
cuz I was dead fucking wrong on talah
and not only that but Luca flipping town
as well
throws a huge wrench into my methods.
You
should
be reevaluating as well, yet you question ME about doing so?
Obviously I don't have a good answer for my BPC read. I never said it was rock solid, and even when you asked about him and DV together it should have been pretty clear based on the answer I gave you that it was a gut read, yet you are acting like this is news.
SnowStorm is playing a good game. I have him leaning Town but my confidence is shaky. When I start thinking I may be wrong, he responds with a strong post or good logic when pressed.
I haven't played with him enough to know what this means but I don't remember him being this - logical? focused? organized? - in Rocky Horror.
The bold is exactly the problem I am having with him. His posts are good but his votes are not. Was he scum or town in Rocky Horror?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:46 pm
by Snork
And to add to that, AP, the only reason I even mentioned the flips is because continuing my ISOs will likely change my list. I already explained he's the weakest read in that section, and I have yet to ISO him.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:53 pm
by AngryPidgeon
In post 1818, Snork wrote:wut? Are you seriously accusing me of excusing my read on BPC when I've stated multiple times where it comes from? I am reevaluating everything cuz I was dead fucking wrong on talah and not only that but Luca flipping town as well throws a huge wrench into my methods.
You should be reevaluating as well, yet you question ME about doing so? Obviously I don't have a good answer for my BPC read. I never said it was rock solid, and even when you asked about him and DV together it should have been pretty clear based on the answer I gave you that it was a gut read, yet you are acting like this is news.
It was a more general statement, you aren't the only person doing it. I picked apart the post you said looked town (it doesn't look town) and you are refusing to talk about your superstrong top-tier sudden townread on Bipolar which is apparently also based on Talah/Luca being town? I dont get it. And yes reads shouldnt be static, but I find the whole "OMG my scumread flipped town, BETTER REREAD THE WHOLE THREAD AND REEVALUATE EVERYTHING" to be excessive/unnatural.
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:27 pm
by Snork
That is not at all how I'm acting. In fact, you're asking me questions about my reads, and I'm answering in the context of my reread. How can you then say that I'm excessively talking about reevaluating when you're the one who keeps asking me about it?
Second, I never said he was a super strong townread. I even mentioned it yesterday when he posted that, that I liked the post and thought it made him town. I also never said it was based on talah or luca being town. I don't know if you are just not understanding what I'm saying if you are purposely trying to twist it to fit your agenda, but in either case, I'm not "refusing to talk" about it. That's all I've been doing.
It's not a strong read. There aren't a million details I can point to be all like "LOOK HOW TOWNIE HE IS" cuz it's not there.
I don't really know how many times I can answer the same question - IT'S A GUT READ BASED ON HIS RETURNING POST. IT SOUNDED GOOD TO ME. I LIKED THE THOUGHT PROCESSES, I LIKED THE RESPONSES.
I mean.. what the fuck do you want? Why are you all of a sudden so hung up on BPC? If you think he's scum, fucking push him.
I'd like this vote more if it was made by someone other than Nero.
In post 1758, AngryPidgeon wrote:Im saying Pisskop was Zd's favorite lynch for a long time. And Zd got scum-killed. Pisskop was a scummy person in the first place.
I mean, other than the part where Zd stopped pushing for a PK lynch somewhere near page 27 this all seems solid...
We had a Doc and a Cop (Doc died N 1), Cop was a newbie (Burn 209) who did not cop correctly. Instead of waiting til he got a guilty, he claimed cop on D 2 with an inno read on Notty, and lied that he had a cop clear on Luca. 3 person LYLO was Luca, myself, and Jake.
So yeah there was cause to see Luca as a scumspect on D 1 here in this game.
What is the point of this post?
In post 1784, aptil wrote:I used my 1-shot vig abilities to kill Talah . That is why i did not care about who it was at the end of the day because we were very close to the deadline and i had made up my mind to shoot the survivor if the person lynced out was town .
and I kinda think AP's town for the way he's pushing pisskop. Pisskop was sarcastic and rude, not scummy. I could see where he was coming from and in the end talah and luca both flipped town so any reads based on which of those anyone thought were scummy should be null and void.
Obviously I don't have a good answer for my BPC read. I never said it was rock solid, and even when you asked about him and DV together it should have been pretty clear based on the answer I gave you that it was a gut read, yet you are acting like this is news.