#434: Communiqu├® Mafia - Done. No -- seriously.


Forum rules
User avatar
Eyceking
Eyceking
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Eyceking
Goon
Goon
Posts: 413
Joined: April 22, 2007
Location: London, England

Post Post #1850 (ISO) » Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:39 pm

Post by Eyceking »

?

That was almost 3 weeks after he died. So I don't think much of that communique any more. If you're at least telling the truth that he sent it to you, I think it was based on how he interpreted play for the 3 weeks following his death rather than any result he may or may not have received as a cop.
What are you pressing select for? You don't got time to make a profile!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1851 (ISO) » Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:52 pm

Post by Patrick »

How is it relevant that it's 3 weeks after he died? Why would he have to send his communique immediately after dying?
Eyceking wrote:If you're at least telling the truth that he sent it to you, I think it was based on how he interpreted play for the 3 weeks following his death rather than any result he may or may not have received as a cop.
Yeah, right. After Miztef, I'd say I was his top suspect, or at least his 2nd suspect. Your theory is that he looked at the posts I made in the first part of day 2, and got such a strong protown vibe off them that I suddenly went from being his top suspect to bottom suspect. Do you believe what you're saying?

In fact, if Phoebus investigated someone other than me, wouldn't it make more sense to message them? Or are you claiming he got such an enormous protown vibe from my posts that he trusted me over someone else who he had investigative evidence on?
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
MeMe
MeMe
Post or Perish
User avatar
User avatar
MeMe
Post or Perish
Post or Perish
Posts: 10710
Joined: October 6, 2002
Location: Missouri
Contact:

Post Post #1852 (ISO) » Thu Sep 27, 2007 5:33 am

Post by MeMe »

No current votes.
Remember...It's not a lie if you believe it. -- G. Costanza
User avatar
Eyceking
Eyceking
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Eyceking
Goon
Goon
Posts: 413
Joined: April 22, 2007
Location: London, England

Post Post #1853 (ISO) » Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:12 am

Post by Eyceking »

Everybody else seemed to get communiques from the dead players fairly immediately after morning broke, or during the night, or something. If Phoebus investigated you and got a result, why would he wait 3 weeks to send a communique to you? In that instance I would expect an immediate communique - not one 3 weeks later. That's why it's relevant.
What are you pressing select for? You don't got time to make a profile!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1854 (ISO) » Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:32 am

Post by Patrick »

(Shrug) I could give a semi educated guess for the delay -- Phoebus had exams for some of that period, same as I did. He also went on holiday for 4-5 days. (His communique to me arrived when he got back from that break). But in any case, I still don't see why the delay is so important. You say why would he wait a while, I say why not? Also, I'm still not clear on what you're saying happened then, do you think that Phoebus chose not to send anyone a final communique at all? Otherwise I'm not sure where you're going.
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1855 (ISO) » Sat Sep 29, 2007 6:57 am

Post by Patrick »

Feel free to reply btw
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1856 (ISO) » Sun Sep 30, 2007 3:00 pm

Post by Glork »

...just popping in to say I'm still alive. (The new job starts tomorrow. >.<) I'm still very undecided as to who I think is most likely to be scum. Sometime before the end of the week, I
hope
to be able to look this game over, but that's far from certain.
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1857 (ISO) » Mon Oct 01, 2007 5:25 am

Post by Patrick »

Come on Eyceking, I know you're out there. We don't want a deadline.
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Eyceking
Eyceking
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Eyceking
Goon
Goon
Posts: 413
Joined: April 22, 2007
Location: London, England

Post Post #1858 (ISO) » Mon Oct 01, 2007 8:58 pm

Post by Eyceking »

All I'm trying to do is sort out what doesn't make sense to me. Stoofer claiming to send a communique to a dead player didn't make sense. Simenon sending a "cult" communique didn't make sense. Phoebus waiting 3 weeks to send his communique to you AND your heal failing when we know there is an extremely powerful permanent roleblocker out there doesn't make sense. To me, anyway. I understand that you're trying to come up with hypothetical ideas to try and explain it, and the sheer disbelieving factor of them is in some weird way quite reassuring. But not convincing.
What are you pressing select for? You don't got time to make a profile!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1859 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:18 am

Post by Patrick »

Please actually answer the question though. Don't just repeat, "Phoebus waiting 3 weeks makes no sense to me".
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1860 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 10:08 am

Post by Glork »

I'm still trying to work out how or why the scums would have waited so long to allegedly permablock Mert, and why Patrick would have been regularly roleblocked on one single night.


I take it you were not roleblocked in any way last night, Patrick?
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1861 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 10:20 am

Post by Patrick »

Glork wrote:I'm still trying to work out how or why the scums would have waited so long to allegedly permablock Mert, and why Patrick would have been regularly roleblocked on one single night.
I'm guessing some kind of restriction on perma roleblocks (and there's no allegedly about it). As for me, how do we know how many times I've been roleblocked?
Glork wrote:I take it you were not roleblocked in any way last night, Patrick?
Not permanently. As for normal roleblocking, I can't know.
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1862 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 10:30 am

Post by Glork »

Oh, I thought you said you had been regularly roleblocked on Night Five or whenever it was. (Edit: Oh, that's because you said you tried to protect Mert, isn't it? Okay, that makes sense.)

Also, it seems that the Mafia did not regularly roleblock each night, since Mert appears to have made successful protections. There were two nights without deaths, so Mert seemingly must have successfully protected
somebody
on those nights. Point is, I don't understand how, when, or under what conditions the Mafia could permablock. My theory of "when a mafia member dies, they nix a role" didn't work, since Eteo was permablocked before Stoof died, and I cannot come up with another reasonable explanation. But the "temporary" or "regular" roleblocking is what I find even more disconcerting. As little sense as the PermaBlocks make, Patrick allegedly being regularly blocked just makes zero sense whatsoever. There is no proof that what Patrick claims happened to him is true, and there is no explanation as to why the mafia would not have blocked Mert on previous nights.
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1863 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 10:40 am

Post by Patrick »

The perma roleblock is assured to have happened. If I was making that up then Mert would have simply contradicted me in his final communique. I can't understand why you're throwing doubt on that.

As for normal roleblocking, if it exists at all, why would the mafia have blocked Mert on previous nights necessarily? He didn't claim doctor until day 4. Why does it make "no sense whatsoever" for me to have been roleblocked?
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1864 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 1:21 pm

Post by Glork »

I think you're missing the point, Patrick.

I am not doubting the permablock -- I am merely wondering why it didn't take place sooner.

I am somewhat doubting the regular roleblock because
Mert was seemingly not blocked on Night Three or Night Four, when it seems like the mafia should have known about his role
. It is *possible* that they didn't know and just attempted to block elsewhere. I'm not really sure.




Point is, Patrick, there's a lot that I don't understand right now, and I'm trying to trudge my way through it all before coming to a decision. If either you or Eyce could provide any additional insight regarding what might have happened, I really would love to hear it.
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1865 (ISO) » Tue Oct 02, 2007 9:24 pm

Post by Patrick »

Glork wrote:I am not doubting the permablock -- I am merely wondering why it didn't take place sooner.
I suppose I just don't really see the point in worrying so much about this. Only the mafia knows what limitations they have on this perma roleblock, if any.
Glork wrote:I am somewhat doubting the regular roleblock because Mert was seemingly not blocked on Night Three or Night Four, when it seems like the mafia should have known about his role. It is *possible* that they didn't know and just attempted to block elsewhere. I'm not really sure.
Night 3, the only roles unknown to the mafia are those of mine and Mert. They probably think one or both of us is a powerole, and they roleblock me. Mert successfully saves Eteocles. Night 4, the mafia has probably guessed Mert is a doctor, so they try to kill him, once again roleblocking me. They forget the possibility that the doc can self protect because it's so rare. There's a possible scenario.
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
MeMe
MeMe
Post or Perish
User avatar
User avatar
MeMe
Post or Perish
Post or Perish
Posts: 10710
Joined: October 6, 2002
Location: Missouri
Contact:

Post Post #1866 (ISO) » Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:23 am

Post by MeMe »

I'd rather not resort to a deadline, boys.
Remember...It's not a lie if you believe it. -- G. Costanza
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1867 (ISO) » Thu Oct 04, 2007 3:00 am

Post by Patrick »

I'd rather not have MeMe resort to a deadline boys.

Eyceking, much as you'd like to, you aren't going to avoid answering my questions. I'll make them clear:

1) Why is it so strange that Phoebus should wait three weeks before sending his communique? I'm not looking for another vague answer. Actually explain why this is so unbelievable to you.

2) Following on from that, if you don't think the communique from Pheobus to me is genuine, then what do you think happened? Did he message nobody? Did I suddenly decide to fabricate this out of thin air?
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1868 (ISO) » Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:21 am

Post by Glork »

I'm posting daily and working on reading through the thread during spare time. I would say that this is far from an easy decsion, and I don't think a deadline is necessary.


I would like to hear from Eyce, though. Eyce, could you state three reasons you think Patrick might be scum and three reasons I might be scum? Try to do something behavioral, something relating to the other known scums (Sim/Stoof), and anything else you can find on either of us.
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
User avatar
Eyceking
Eyceking
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Eyceking
Goon
Goon
Posts: 413
Joined: April 22, 2007
Location: London, England

Post Post #1869 (ISO) » Fri Oct 05, 2007 1:48 am

Post by Eyceking »

Give me the weekend to re-read the passage around where you said Phoebus PM'd you. Rather busy at work.

Glork - your request will take especially more time. Same request asked of you.
What are you pressing select for? You don't got time to make a profile!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1870 (ISO) » Sun Oct 07, 2007 3:37 am

Post by Patrick »

Meh. We're in danger of being deadlined, and that could be dangerous. Glork, I see from vacation thread you're moving into your new place this weekend. How's the reread going?

Looking forward to Eyceking's post.
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1871 (ISO) » Sun Oct 07, 2007 1:39 pm

Post by Glork »

Feh.

I didn't move into my new place because of some mixup; it will happen
next
weekend instead. I ended up spending the weekend out of town with some friends instead. The re-read will happen sometime this week.
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
User avatar
Eyceking
Eyceking
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Eyceking
Goon
Goon
Posts: 413
Joined: April 22, 2007
Location: London, England

Post Post #1872 (ISO) » Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:01 am

Post by Eyceking »

OK Patrick, look. You say Phoebus waited 3 weeks to tell you and the reason he told you was because his cop ability was triggered and he investigated you to find you pro-town. Well, I've already tried to say how that's weird and this hasn't stopped you continuously looking for further explanations.

Why would Phoebus, as a back up cop, send you a communique and not tell you he was the back up cop? That doesn't make sense either. He had no reason to not tell you if he investigated you and found you to be townie.

I'm not trying to say the communique was not genuine - and I have never made any point to this effect, even though you have tried to incinuate this is what I'm doing. My problem came with the 3 week gap - not with the existence of the communique itself. I am simply saying that the communique from Phoebus to you, with the assumption that he was the back up cop, is full of holes. It can make sense if he was simply a townie observing the game and making new decisions based on the play for those 3 weeks - but not if he was a back up cop with a pro-town result on you who didn't tell you he was the back up cop.
What are you pressing select for? You don't got time to make a profile!
User avatar
Patrick
Patrick
Rantbuddy
User avatar
User avatar
Patrick
Rantbuddy
Rantbuddy
Posts: 7475
Joined: May 3, 2006
Location: England

Post Post #1873 (ISO) » Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:34 am

Post by Patrick »

Eyceking wrote:Why would Phoebus, as a back up cop, send you a communique and not tell you he was the back up cop? That doesn't make sense either. He had no reason to not tell you if he investigated you and found you to be townie.
I agree that the wording is a bit funny, but he did actually say, "dead guy = backup cop". I don't see it as that strange that he didn't declare he had an innocent on me; afterall that wouldn't be telling me anything I didn't know about myself, and you can see he had alot to say in his communique (he went right up to the possible word limit). Although he was mistaken, it seems he thought he'd caught muse in a lie.
Eyceking wrote:I'm not trying to say the communique was not genuine - and I have never made any point to this effect, even though you have tried to incinuate this is what I'm doing. My problem came with the 3 week gap - not with the existence of the communique itself. I am simply saying that the communique from Phoebus to you, with the assumption that he was the back up cop, is full of holes. It can make sense if he was simply a townie observing the game and making new decisions based on the play for those 3 weeks - but not if he was a back up cop with a pro-town result on you who didn't tell you he was the back up cop.
Ok, I thought that you were trying to say I'd made the thing up entirely. I've already outlined why I don't find your theory plausible; Phoebus is generally a fairly stubborn player, and I just don't see how it's possible I could have gone from being a top suspect of his to being the guy he trusted the most, merely based on my posts in the first part of day 2 (which weren't exactly anything special). Also, if he wasn't a backup cop, then why would he put in his communique, "dead guy = backup cop" and "Miztef=cop"? That just wouldn't make sense at all if he was just a vanilla townie. Furthermore, if Phoebus was vanilla, my being scum would mean that the only town power in this game would be a cop and a doc, which would be ridiculously unbalanced. His message to me really doesn't make sense unless he's the backup cop.
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
User avatar
Glork
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
User avatar
User avatar
Glork
Burdened by Proficiency
Burdened by Proficiency
Posts: 14106
Joined: July 13, 2005
Location: Dance into the fire

Post Post #1874 (ISO) » Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:38 am

Post by Glork »

Eyce, I am still awaiting your analysis.


In other news, I think I'll have time to review most (if not all) of the thread on Thursday evening, my time.
Green Shirt Thursdays


Get to know a Glork!
Locked