Open 708: Pick Your Poison - Game Over

[TesXX]

Vote Count 3.3

CultOfAthena

(4): Flubbernugget, Beefster, Maxous, Errantparabola

Errantparabola

(3): CultOfAthena, Klick, mozamis

Maxous

(1): Thor665

Not Voting

(0):

None.

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2018-02-22 18:44:22)

[Beefster]

A hammer drop would be great right about now.

[CultOfAthena]

Again, Athena's focus is overly narrow imo.
She focuses on Errant and only focuses on others when directly asked. Same behaviour on Day 2.

I'm okay with this lynch, I think it's the right choice.

Disagree. Today I'm simply stating where my main suspicions lie. Day 2 I undoubtably focused on more people than just EP – you should know this yourself, given my questioning of you.

Two questions naturally seem to stem up from this;

1. How is Max 'nonchalant' and EP is 'not nonchalant'? COuld I get a short list of who isn't being nonchalant and a description of how they're being nonchalant? (this feels like bogus reasoning to me so I want to understand it better or be able to showcase your inability to describe it in order to attack you)

It's just gut for Max, honestly. He's never seemed to express any sort of concern at his own loss or initiative to stop something from happening (namely, if he were scum, both of his partners getting lynched). It's not really something that I consider in my read on anyone else because it really only stands out for Max (although you could call EP's reaction when RC switched to tex an example of being "non-nonchalant").

2. I note you touting a number of examples of Max listing Tex and HWS as scumreads Day 1 as a reason not to scumread him.
I'll note that, despite these reads, he wasn't ever *voting* either of those slots. He was voting EP. How does that affect/not affect your read of him?

That kind of weakens my reasoning on max!town, honestly.

[CultOfAthena]

What kind of scum derails a mislynch to bus? That is the dumbest possible strategy.

You're not getting what I'm saying. EP wasn't "derailing" the texcat wagon to bus – he was hopping off of it to have his vote on a scumbuddy when the day ended (in the moz lynch). Nothing about it is a dumb strategy in the slightest – I'd say it's a fairly good strategy.

Why not just fence-sit the moz mislynch? Why would he be so aggressive toward texcat?

Your logic doesn't add up. Aggressive bussing is actually a terrible strategy. Going out of your way to make sure you have a vote on a scumpartner you don't intend to lynch is silly. Aggressive bussing usually comes back to bite you in the ass.

I still think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying. Go back and read day two – nothing about what EP did was "aggressive bussing". I'm saying that he

wanted

the moz wagon to go through and for nobody else to vote texcat except for him that day. Again, I don't see what's silly about it in the slightest – it was a play for better associatives and VCA.

I don't see how this scum!EP tex bus makes any sense. It's a dumb move because WIFOM and bussing almost always comes back to bite you in the butt. EP is clearly not this stupid... We could get into WIFOM here, but we have room for 2 mislynches and I'd say EP's third on the chopping block anyway.

More votes on COA.

"Because WIFOM"? I don't think you actually understood what I was saying.

The only reason to bus is because you think that nobody else would do it, when it's actually one of the first "sneaky" things people think of. Most people who bus do so badly. Most of the time it backfires at some point. Add to that the consequences of being down one mafioso and you realize that bussing isn't all that clever.

If scum!EP is employing WIFOM-based bussing, it will bite him in the ass before he has a chance to win.

It wasn't mean to be a bus, that's what I'm saying – read 1871. EP never intended for tex to get lynched from his vote on her.

[CultOfAthena]

@Thor, can I hear more from you on your Max read?

[Thor665]

@Thor, can I hear more from you on your Max read?

Like what?
I've explained it already and am not hiding deeper/better evidence for a surprise reveal later.

[Flubbernugget]

Nothing important is happening

[Beefster]

Nothing important is happening

That's why we need a hammer. We're not going to get anywhere at this point until we get a flip even if COA is town.

[Thor665]

Well, to both Beef and Flubber I offer these thoughts;

If nothing important is happening, maybe it's because a large number of the players in the game aren't trying to do much.
Maybe if, say, you really want a lynch to go through you should try engaging the people not voting in favor of the lynch to assess and/or dismantle their reads preventing them from hammering.
This would create action and intrigue aplenty.

Or, alternate thought, show up every 48 hours and whine about nothing happening, that may work also.

[Errantparabola]

Thor and Beef are doing all of my defending for me, mwahaha.

I think
VOTE: Maxous
is the play.

If this is a townflip then I think the lynch is actually between Athena and Thor.
Athena is correct in that I am not confident that her lynch ends the game.
Still willing to hammer her if someone L-1s and will do so when that happens.

[Thor665]

If you agree that Athena's core suspicion of you is correct then why do you think she's likely to be scum exactly?

[Thor665]

Also, just because you're the only one selling it - how do I look like scum?
Like, if I look like scum, then like Moz should look like scum too, yeah? Why do I and he doesn't - the logic for clearing one of us is the logic for clearing both of us, no?

[Thor665]

And actually the logic for me is even stronger, because I had the ability to mislynch Moz if I was scum and walked away, and he never got into that position with me.
So that makes your stance even more odd.

[Errantparabola]

er, yeah. you on the texcat lynch completely slipped my mind. You're with Beef. Sorry.

If you agree that Athena's core suspicion of you is correct then why do you think she's likely to be scum exactly?

??? Athena has expressed many reasons why I'm scum. Furthermore agreeing with her on this does not necessarily mean that she isn't scum? My reasons for that are independent of her case on me

[Maxous]

Are we getting cold feet on the Athena lynch?
She did nothing but double down on EP earlier in the day and now she just pretended to engage with Thor about a read on me because the Errant push has lost steam.
She should of been analysing my play at the start of the day like everyone else.

[Thor665]

er, yeah. you on the texcat lynch completely slipped my mind. You're with Beef. Sorry.

If you agree that Athena's core suspicion of you is correct then why do you think she's likely to be scum exactly?

??? Athena has expressed many reasons why I'm scum. Furthermore agreeing with her on this does not necessarily mean that she isn't scum? My reasons for that are independent of her case on me

She has expressed many reasons why you're scum.
None of them are actually scummy reasons - in fact, thinking you're scum is something a lot of people are doing.
Your case on her feels very thin to me (everyone's case on her feels very thin, frankly) can you describe why you think it's such a good case?

Are we getting cold feet on the Athena lynch?
She did nothing but double down on EP earlier in the day and now she just pretended to engage with Thor about a read on me because the Errant push has lost steam.
She should of been analysing my play at the start of the day like everyone else.

I can think of multiple people who handwaved you off as town.
Not sure why she's the scummy one of that particular subset.

What's scummy in doubling down on EP but then potentially deciding you might be scum exactly?
If you had the bigger wagon than EP, yeah, I'd get it - but your wagon is only little ol' me - what's her scum plan there exactly? To get off the easier to push wagon onto a harder one with less support?

[Maxous]

Because she only doubled on the EP tunnel and didn't even consider anyone else. I don't remember anyone else being so singular. Which at this stage of the game you should be weighing everyone against the dead scum and general reads. That's a blind tunnel at best..but I think it's just scummy.
EP wagon is dying and despite me having only one vote now, it's clear my lynch isn't off the table

[Beefster]

Thor and Beef are doing all of my defending for me, mwahaha.

I think
VOTE: Maxous
is the play.

If this is a townflip then I think the lynch is actually between Athena and Thor.
Athena is correct in that I am not confident that her lynch ends the game.
Still willing to hammer her if someone L-1s and will do so when that happens.

Okay... So why is Thor on the chopping block now?

This post pretty much flipped my read on EP 180 degrees.

VOTE: ErrantParabola
Athena and Maxous are next.

[Beefster]

That's L-1, BTW

[Errantparabola]

can't wait to be yelled at by the dead thread for playing like shit

[mozamis]

so Ep, once again, gets off the mislynch wagon and votes for someone who aint getting lynched. And I'm pretty sure I was his next suspect after Cult in his last big post? So the vote for Max is nonsense.
This guy is scum.
Someone hammer and we win.

[mozamis]

hang on, i may have slightly mispreppe dhim there. whethe rhe has actually got off a mislynch wagon and onto another safe wagon before, i'm not sure. I was thinking of how he safe bussed Tex and didnt move his vote.
Anyway, point still stands - he is running scared of Cult flipping town. And even if he DID have good reasons for changing his mind, logically he should have vote for me, not max.

[TesXX]

Klick has received his third prod and is now being replaced.

Vote Count coming soon.

[TesXX]

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[TesXX]

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