Mafiascum.net

Lord Gurgi wrote:I'll be honest, keeping the double vote is scummy as heck.

Yes. Singersigner would not do that just to prove that SHE was town, which leads me to believe she's trying to protect someone ELSE by proving her role. Namely, ooba.

Lord Gurgi wrote:My problem at the moment is the same as I usually get at this stage in the game. The only lynch candidates that are up for serious contention are active players. Let's lynch someone who has dropped off considerably (FRIEND) at least, rather than a probably-not-recruiter.

I generally agree. I do not like the way people only consider for lynching, those who are actively posting. Obviously the recruiters would not want to take the spotlight. Which is one reason why I get lynched a lot, because I LOVE to cause havoc and create discussion!

So I agree with you on that point. But what do you think of my ooba/singersigner theory?

Lord Gurgi wrote:I have this awful feeling I'm being run around by a Yos-ooba-Erg0 team. While the other side has Andrius-RC lead by inHim/Friend.

You don't think there is a link between ooba and singersigner anywhere? I agree that Erg0 is scummy/skating under the radar. Yos I think should be considered scum by anyone and everyone. Possibly a recruiter but I'm not sure. I have this SUPER OMINOUS feeling about ooba or otherwise my vote would probably be on Yos2. Some of it has to do with ooba not including HIMSELF on the "possible recruiters" list, the rest can be summed up in my post #1815, for the most part.

ReaperCharlie wrote:Here's a quick info dump (with just the facts, not my opinions):

Mobsters still in the building...

(i.e. WHAT WE KNOW)

---

Andrius (claimed Enforcer before Furcolow flipped)
Chronopie (claimed Roleblocker, claimed being roleblocked on N2 -- POSSIBLE inference/confirmation within N2 mod flavor)
Erg0 ()
animorpherv1/Flameaxe ()
Friend ()
gandalf5166 ()
inHimshallibe ()
Lord Gurgi (investigated to be town by Andrius (night 2))
ooba (claimed Loose Cannon and claimed that he shot zwetschenasserbloke on (what night?))
Porochaz ()
ReaperCharlie (Investigated to be innocent by Andrius (what night?))
vezokpiraka/Robocopter87 ()
TheLonging/singersigner (also-claimed Loose Cannon, after ooba claimed. Has one (claimed) shot left to use.)
xvart ()
Yosarian2 ()

I am VERY likely missing something, as this is only from memory. Feel free to add on to this. That's the point of making this list, so we don't HAVE to rely on memory, and we can easily compare and contrast people's actions/claims/etc at a glance.

One thing I've learned from past games is that if we keep a running tally of what's happened and when, that a town win is MUCH more likely. For an example, check out Wisborg Asylum large theme. We literally CRUSHED the three scum factions, and had a 9-1 town endgame and nailed the final scum easily.

Also, I may be starting an alliance soon. As is becoming the usual, Andrius is tentatively invited.

I claimed before anyone else did.
I investigated you N0.
I also investigated ooba N1. You forget that?

Thanks for the tentative invite.

Alliances are dumb.

I cannot believe that people would be dumb enough to think of far fetched conspiracy theories to fit ooba-ss in. I can think of two scenarios:

a) - singersinger is recruited
- The opposite team has something - I'd guess a recruited result on singersinger
RC is recruited. xvart too.

Team 1: RC, xvart.

Team 2: N1: singersinger

b)- They have the scum roleblocker
- They did not roleblock Andrius N1, therefore think that an ambiguous result on me = "Other Recruiter" status ..

Either way an RC-xvart pairing looks likely. I'd still go with gandalf being head of the other recruiting team.

Um. ooba? If you believe gandalf is the head of the other recruiting team, why are you UNVOTING gandalf, to vote xvart?
Can you spell.... O-M-G-U-S?

Also, I don't think xvart is scum. Call it gut if you wanna.

Lord Gurgi wrote:Alliances are dumb.

Boo, you.

ReaperCharlie wrote:Um. ooba? If you believe gandalf is the head of the other recruiting team, why are you UNVOTING gandalf, to vote xvart?
Can you spell.... O-M-G-U-S?

Simple enough right .. I am more sure about the fact that my wagon has scum in it than the gut gandalf read ..

From a scum PoV, I won't real push a ooba wagon because my crumb, kill on zwet make it likely that I am what I claim to be. The only reason scum would push it, even in the face of the evidence and other unconvinced town, is because they think I am the opposite Godfather.

Mobsters still in the building...

(i.e. WHAT WE KNOW)

(now prettified for those of us with OCD)

---

Andrius

-claimed Enforcer (before Furcolow flipped Enforcer)
-investigated RC on N0 (result: town)
-investigated ooba on N1 (no result)
-investigated Lord Gurgi on N2 (result: town)

Chronopie

-claimed Roleblocker
-claimed being roleblocked on N2
-POSSIBLE inference/confirmation within N2 mod flavor

Erg0

(no info)

animorpherv1/Flameaxe

(no info)

Friend

(no info)

gandalf5166

(no info)

inHimshallibe

(no info)

Lord Gurgi

-investigated to be town by Andrius on N2

ooba

-Investigated by Andrius on N1: NO RESULT
-claimed Loose Cannon on D2 (with crumbs on D1)
-claimed that he shot zwetschenasserbloke on N1

Porochaz

(no info)

ReaperCharlie

-investigated to be town by Andrius on N0

vezokpiraka/Robocopter87

-claimed Cult Doc on D3
-Cult Doc'd

TheLonging/singersigner

-alsoclaimed Loose Cannon (after ooba claimed on D2)
-has one (claimed) shot left to use.)

xvart

(no info)

Yosarian2

(no info)

Andrius wrote:I claimed before anyone else did.
I investigated you N0.
I also investigated ooba N1. You forget that?

Thanks for the tentative invite.

Yeah, I forgot about it, lol. I remember now, obv. I also forgot Robo's cult doc claim ;x
Anyway... I've added them.

And you're welcome. I haven't decided who I want in it yet, though.

RC - just quickly (I will post in greater detail tonight) but Chrono soft claimed to RBing Yos and me N0 and N1 (I can't remember which was which though). This listing will help me tremendously.

xvart.

ooba wrote:From a scum PoV, I won't real push a ooba wagon because my crumb, kill on zwet make it likely that I am what I claim to be. The only reason scum would push it, even in the face of the evidence and other unconvinced town, is because they think I am the opposite Godfather.

That makes sense I guess.

But why would they push it if the rest of the town is unconvinced? That's like painting a target on their backs then, right?

To be honest, it just looks like you're OMGUSing. Trying to create a counter-wagon on a guy who (to my knowledge) hasn't been voted ONCE yet in the game, just to mix things up and get the attention off yourself.

And if you were REALLY a town loose cannon like you claim you are, why would Andrius get a NO RESULT when he tried to investigate you?

ooba (xvart, Andrius, Chronopie, ReaperCharlie)
Friend (Lord Gurgi, Flameaxe)
Gandalf (Porochaz)
singersigner (Friend)
xvart (ooba)

singersigner wrote:

Chronopie wrote:I thought that during the day it became a double vote?!?

It does. And that's exactly how I said I'd intend to use it, just not until the rest of the votes swing that way. Does that make sense?

Not..really, singer.

Do you really think a one shot doublevoter is more useful to the town then a one-shot vig, in a cult game where we have to kill the recruiters ASAP? I understand that night 1, you replaced in too late to have time to figure out who to kill, but why didn't you try to kill a likely recruiter last night? If you hit a recruiter, town is much better off, and if you hit someone who looked like a possible recruiter but wasn't, then at least that narrows down the list of suspects. Normally I'm a big fan of vigs holding back kills until later in the game, but in a game where there might be two cult recruiters recruiting multiple people every night, I don't see it.

This whole offer to use the double vote instead of a vig kill makes me feel like you're more interested in proving you're not a recruiter then in helping the town, which seems scummy to me.

OR you could say it like this, Yos2:

ReaperCharlie wrote:WHO THE @#$^ (AS A TOWN VIG) WOULD OPT TO WASTE THEIR ACTION BY DOUBLE-VOTING INSTEAD OF NIGHTKILLING? SUPER SCUM POINTS

This looks like feeble bussing. Yos and singersigner are probably in the same cult.

Reaper - I'm on board with your 1962. I think we are both barking up the same tree from different directions.

singersigner, 1967 wrote:

Chronopie wrote:I thought that during the day it became a double vote?!?

It does. And that's exactly how I said I'd intend to use it, just not until the rest of the votes swing that way. Does that make sense?

I'm not sure if I believe this, as the way you describe and talked about it you were talking as if it was a daykill. You even said L-1, which is standard practice for a daykill. If you had a double vote it would be L-2. I believe the double vote claim got mixed up somewhere along the way (wasn't it ooba who claimed the double vote, or was the TheLonging?). Regardless, everything singer said reads as if it was actually a daykill.

• Furcolow (
  Niccolò,

  Unrecruited Enforcer
  ), was taken down Day One. -
  LYNCH
  
  
• dramonic (
  Dante,

  Unrecruited Bodyguard
  ), was murdered Night One. -
  LIKELY CULT KILL, BG OF ANDY
  
  
• zwetschenwasser (
  Gianni,

  Unrecruited Loose Cannon
  ), was executed Night One. -
  OOBA CLAIMED KILL
  
  
• Faraday (
  Martino,

  Unrecruited Goon
  ), was shot down Day Two. -
  LYNCH
  
  
• Seraphim
  Me=Weird (
  Ignazio,

  Recruited Goon
  ), was assassinated Night Two. -
  LACK OF TOWN CLAIMING KILL = LIKELY CULT KILL?

I'm inclined to believe that the flavor of the kills does not bode well for ooba, although if ooba is recruiter this theory is unsubstantiated since all the NKs are likely cult kills. Murdered, executed, and assassinated?

ooba has also done a fair share of setup speculation, which I am inclined to believe he is attempting to fish out reactions since he knows how the recruiting mechanism works. Probably trying to fish out someone who reacts to his speculation to find the other recruiter. Here (saying cults killing or recruiting is wrong) with follow up here and here (suggesting that cults starting with a loose canon makes sense).

Furthermore, here you specifically point out that TheLonging is a loose cannon (as a breadcrumb for you), which just so happens to turn out to actually be true... Maybe you breadcrumbed it so you could call role cop later on but then decided it would confirm you better as a loose canon.

xvart.

ReaperCharlie, 1987 wrote:OR you could say it like this, Yos2:

ReaperCharlie wrote:WHO THE @#$^ (AS A TOWN VIG) WOULD OPT TO WASTE THEIR ACTION BY DOUBLE-VOTING INSTEAD OF NIGHTKILLING? SUPER SCUM POINTS

This looks like feeble bussing. Yos and singersigner are probably in the same cult.

Especially since I already said that exact same thing, too (with less words).

xvart.

Yosarian2 wrote:

singersigner wrote:

Chronopie wrote:I thought that during the day it became a double vote?!?

It does. And that's exactly how I said I'd intend to use it, just not until the rest of the votes swing that way. Does that make sense?

Not..really, singer.

Do you really think a one shot doublevoter is more useful to the town then a one-shot vig, in a cult game where we have to kill the recruiters ASAP? I understand that night 1, you replaced in too late to have time to figure out who to kill, but why didn't you try to kill a likely recruiter last night? If you hit a recruiter, town is much better off, and if you hit someone who looked like a possible recruiter but wasn't, then at least that narrows down the list of suspects. Normally I'm a big fan of vigs holding back kills until later in the game, but in a game where there might be two cult recruiters recruiting multiple people every night, I don't see it.

This whole offer to use the double vote instead of a vig kill makes me feel like you're more interested in proving you're not a recruiter then in helping the town, which seems scummy to me.

Ok, so when you say it doesn't make sense, what you really mean is that you don't agree with it. Saying it doesn't make sense when it does only makes you look less intelligent. Just saying.

In any case, yeah, I could use it tonight before anyone has the chance to recruit me. But you're right, I was trying to prove I wasn't recruited because if I'm wrong tonight (or I was wrong last night), you guys will waste time tomorrow focusing on someone who wasn't recruited and isn't a recruiter.

To me, it sounds like you think I should've used it last night regardless of who I hit. If I was wrong last night, I kill town. If I'm recruited tonight, I kill town anyway. What's the difference? This is to avoid a whole load of crap that could've ensued because of it.

I could always just kill Ooba tonight and get this speculation over with, yeah? That way if I don't kill him, you guys will know I've been recruited to "save my buddy," and if I do, killing him will confirm whether or not he's been recruited, knowing that we won't be wasting a town's extra shot since he already used it. Now you guys can go about your business and focus on someone else. Commence.

Or, we could just lynch ooba , and you could kill tonight...

ReaperCharlie wrote:Or, we could just lynch ooba

today

, and you could kill

yourself

tonight...

Now that doesn't seem very nice...

RC:
You might want to add vezok/Robo's NP actions, just so we have them.

Hang on a second.
Robo, how about you nameclaim, and claim what you'll do after the town wins. Also, is your rolename really "Cult Doctor"? Because I'm a Cop but called "Enforcer".
We need more credibility.

Also, Chronopie could consider doing the same. We know he's a "Whore", so.

singersigner wrote:

Yosarian2 wrote:

singersigner wrote:

Chronopie wrote:I thought that during the day it became a double vote?!?

It does. And that's exactly how I said I'd intend to use it, just not until the rest of the votes swing that way. Does that make sense?

Not..really, singer.

Do you really think a one shot doublevoter is more useful to the town then a one-shot vig, in a cult game where we have to kill the recruiters ASAP? I understand that night 1, you replaced in too late to have time to figure out who to kill, but why didn't you try to kill a likely recruiter last night? If you hit a recruiter, town is much better off, and if you hit someone who looked like a possible recruiter but wasn't, then at least that narrows down the list of suspects. Normally I'm a big fan of vigs holding back kills until later in the game, but in a game where there might be two cult recruiters recruiting multiple people every night, I don't see it.

This whole offer to use the double vote instead of a vig kill makes me feel like you're more interested in proving you're not a recruiter then in helping the town, which seems scummy to me.

Ok, so when you say it doesn't make sense, what you really mean is that you don't agree with it. Saying it doesn't make sense when it does only makes you look less intelligent. Just saying.

I'm saying that your move dosn't really make sense if you're town, and makes better sense if you're recruited scum.

In any case, yeah, I could use it tonight before anyone has the chance to recruit me. But you're right, I was trying to prove I wasn't recruited because if I'm wrong tonight (or I was wrong last night), you guys will waste time tomorrow focusing on someone who wasn't recruited and isn't a recruiter.

To me, it sounds like you think I should've used it last night regardless of who I hit. If I was wrong last night, I kill town. If I'm recruited tonight, I kill town anyway. What's the difference? This is to avoid a whole load of crap that could've ensued because of it.

There's a huge difference between "vig that tries to kill a scum, and either hits or misses and kills a scummy looking townie" and "recruited vig that either shoots a claimed pro-town power role or else holds onto the kill until endgame when an extra kill might win the scum the game."

That being said, I actually do want you to use your double-vote today; if you haven't been recruited yet, then using it now means scum won't bother to recruit you, and if you have, then I don't want you to be able to use your kill later. I'm just not really understanding why you, as town, wouldn't have killed; I'd been assuming the kill last night was made by you.

I could always just kill Ooba tonight and get this speculation over with, yeah? That way if I don't kill him, you guys will know I've been recruited to "save my buddy," and if I do, killing him will confirm whether or not he's been recruited, knowing that we won't be wasting a town's extra shot since he already used it.

I...don't know how that works that works. if you actually haven't been recruited yet, then if you send in the kill, and the cult sends in a recruit order on you, I'm not sure which comes first; my gut would be that both would happen at the same time, and you would kill and then be recruited afterwards, but I'm not sure.

In any case: I don't think you're the recruiter, and I do think you should use your double vote; doing so will 100% prove you're not the recruiter, I think. I do have suspicions that you might have been recruited by now, but even if so, I don't want to lynch you now.

Definitely getting a strong recruited vibe from singer atm. Wasting your ability in order to confirm your role is both self-interested and futile. Not so sure that it's ooba doing the recruiting, though - there are a few too many leaps of logic required for that to make sense.

To me, it sounds like you think I should've used it last night regardless of who I hit. If I was wrong last night, I kill town. If I'm recruited tonight, I kill town anyway. What's the difference? This is to avoid a whole load of crap that could've ensued because of it.

If you're recruited then you'll probably be shooting for opposing scum anyhow. Obviously you couldn't kill the claimed cop (for instance) and still look clean tomorrow.

Question about the double vote (hopefully I haven't missed this somewhere): is it activated in-thread, or do you PM your choice to Mr Flay?

singersigner wrote:I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

This is a guaranteed lie. This is not P2W.

gandalf5166 wrote:

singersigner wrote:I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

This is a guaranteed lie. This is not P2W.

EBWOP: It should've said "if I'm a recruit prospective." If I use it before they recruit me, then they see no point in recruiting me, yeah?

Erg0 wrote:Question about the double vote (hopefully I haven't missed this somewhere): is it activated in-thread, or do you PM your choice to Mr Flay?

I'm honestly not sure. I would assume I could say something like "double-aim." Or just PM him myself...?

Andrius wrote: Hang on a second.
Robo, how about you nameclaim, and claim what you'll do after the town wins. Also, is your rolename really "Cult Doctor"? Because I'm a Cop but called "Enforcer".
We need more credibility.

Yo bro, remember this?

Robocopter87 wrote:I'm a Consigiliere (I hope I spelled that right lol) and my Italian name is Salvatore.

I read through the whole ruleset to make sure I was allowed to do this.