Mini 274: Lying Cheating Scumbag Mafia - GAME OVER


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Post Post #200 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 5:30 am

Post by Sotty7 »

Alrighty, in an effort to start some discussion (and get some help) I'm gonna go right ahead and claim.
Alexander wrote:
"Be sure not to reveal too much information, as the lines you are communicating through may be tapped."


Hmm, I wonder if the mod put a red herring for the mafia, or there really is a role that can 'tap' the communication lines. If there is one, I would appreciate him coming out with any info.
That be me, I am the phone bugger. I have equipment to tap into the mafias private phone lines but it's a one shot thing as I have a limited battery supply. Lucky for me, I chose to use this power night one. I say lucky for me because it seems the mafia didn't know each other and so the info I received is quiet useful. I managed to get two messages before my battery gave up on me
The Code Name Is Redfox
and
TRUST NO-ONE
The second message there is a little crazy as I started suspecting everyone who said “trust” in thread, but DP did use those words before being lynched yesterday.
Dragon Phoenix wrote:Thats's fair. I trust almost noone in this game.
As for the redfox code name, I taken that to mean that to mean that the mafia decided on night one that they would enter “redfox” into one of their messages by code, so they could figure who each other was and start PM'ing each other out of thread. So I went though day two to see if I could spy this code. I came up with three messages where the code “redfox” could be found. Yes I know three is one too many considering that we have only two scum left (according to DP's PM) so that's why I need help. I will fully admit to being very very poor at noticing any kind of code so I encourage people to look for themselves though their PM's too. Here are the three messages in question -
N_lich wrote: I think he's p
r
obably top of just about everyone's scumlist - but are we really going to hear anything else than "it was a mistake" -(which is probably true IMO). The way I see it the options ar
e
:

1. Ban
d
wagon to claim
2. Chalk it up as scummy but try to actually get some in
f
ormation via anything else. As Das said- a speedlynch isn't g
o
ing to give us much to work on in future.

I'd go for 2, at least until other avenues of conversation are definitely e
x
hausted.
Looking back on his posts he never really opposed the DP wagon but towards the end started to want “more discussion” before we lynched DP. To be fair though, more discussion was something we all wanted, so I'm not sure. Other than that he seems to be the logical voice though out, however he was not voting DP come the end of the day.
davidangelsummers wrote:Im wo
r
ried that everyone is posting outside the thread rather then inside. I find the people inside the thr
e
ad a little bit more trust worthy as they have nothing to hide. It must be worse for people who have ha
d
no pms at all they must feel out the loop.(assumeing there telling the truth)
Noone is helping matters by being coy. Lets at least all agree on all posting are thoughts thus far.
I
f
eel that DP may wll be scum but I dont like the way no-one is really pushing it. To me this game started like that and t
o
wn got lynched. I for one dont want to see thay happen again.The odds are going to be very short if we post minimal and and punish ma
x
ium..
Out of these three I am most suspicious of davidangelsummers. He never voted DP during day two even though he had done by far the most scummiest thing to date , and instead FOS's him. Also he started to even defend DP as it looked more likely he would be lynched
davidangelsummers wrote:
Sotty7 wrote:I am also pretty unconvinced as to DP's claim. A vig is very typically a scum claim and what happened with Green Liquid is still weighing heavily on my mind. Plus the fact he found machine's post the scummiest right before he gets replaced just seems a little too convenient.

Vote: Dragon Phoenix
Actually that’s why I am starting to believe DP ..It would have been far easier to place a vote or suspicion on a player that’s not being replaced.
Combine that with the fact he wasn't on the wagon come the end of the day (of course) makes me believe that he is scum.
Glork wrote:
....


How the c
r
ap does somebody get bandwagoned to death for a stupid reason on PAGE TWO??

It didn't take m
e
long to read over the thread, because there really isn't that much to read over. As some people have sai
d
, there appears to be more discussion out of thread than in-thread. And that doesn't help a replacement.... so if you
f
olks don't mind, I'd like some more talk in-thread. The PMs and whatnot are all fine and dandy, especially if you can trick some
o
ne into revealing scumminess. But seriously, I've got almost nothing to go by, so right now, I'm just going to sit back, rela
x,
and Unvote Machine's vote against DP.
Glork replaced Iammars and this is his first game related post. Iammars didn't post much at all during the game and his only post in day two was a weak FOS to DP. Glork on the other hand stuck his vote on DP and was involved in the discussion all the way up until he was lynched. This could be proof that he is innocent, or he had no idea DP was a scum partner, or he realized he was and wanted to lynch him anyway to use to help clear him later.

This is by no way concrete evidence or proof. I have drawn my own conclusions from the messages I received and for all I know they could be the wrong ones. The fact that I found the name “redfox” in three messages when there is only two scum remaining is not helpful. Also the way the code is found in the messages is pretty weak, there doesn't seem to be any kind of pattern to it. Unless there is one that I cannot see. I decided to come out with this information because if I die, it goes to the grave with me and that maybe other town members can pick out code better than me, who knows?

For now I'm going to
Vote: davidangelsummers
as from what I have seen, I think he is the most likely to be scum.

This should get everyone talking
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Post Post #201 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 5:42 am

Post by Alexander »

Very interesting, Sotty. I need some time to digest the info before I comment on it. For now, I'll only remind you that you're slightly mistaken and Glork replaced themachine. (I replaced Iammars)
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Post Post #202 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 5:55 am

Post by Sotty7 »

Gah Ok..too many replacements I lost track in my notes. Thanks for that Alex
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Post Post #203 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 6:24 am

Post by Glork »

Unvote


Well this is certainly news... I'm still curious as to why RotN felt that DP is innocent, but this certainly gives us something new to look at.

Also, I looked back over things and found another possible REDFOX code:
chaotic_diablo wrote:The way I see it, DP could eithe
r
really be this ignorant due to the consistency he has shown or DP is just pretending to be ignorant as an excuse to his seemingly scummy actions. I'm not quit
e
sure which is it.

I'
d
like to hear something that will actually help us
f
rom the people who haven't posted. Whenever they have posted, I see them either:
1. jumping on a bandwagon
2. agreeing with the majority
o
r
3. not reading the thread and commenting on past things

We haven't had much to discuss and I can only imagine it will carry over the ne
x
t day.

I'll probably go look over the thread again now that I've got this little tidbit of information, but I have to agree that davidangelsummers' bandwagoning of GreenLiquid, combined with his semi-defense of DP now puts him at the top of my list.
Vote: davidangelsummers
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Post Post #204 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 6:37 am

Post by Sotty7 »

Hmmm, I missed that one. Like I said I'm no good with hidden code sadly. Maybe those with PM's could check though them as well for the code?
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Post Post #205 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 6:43 am

Post by Glork »

*Shrugs*


Like I said, I've not sent any PMs all game, and I've only recieved one from Aelyn amounting to "I didn't talk to Machine" when I came into the game. Can't help ya there, I'm afraid.
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Post Post #206 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 7:46 am

Post by Alexander »

I also tried to find a 'redfox' codeword in various posts. I didn't have to go far. Apparently, I managed to find one in the very first post - the mod's intro. Which leads me to think that it's all random and we won't find anything useful this way.
Bacde wrote:Hello my good f
r
iend, and welcome to my realm. You, of course, know why I have called everyone here. There seems to be a conspiracy going on against m
e
, and every other innocent person who might be stan
d
ing in this room. Yes, you recieved my personal invitation because I suspect you, along with 11 others, of trying to bring me down. Of course I realize the majority of you are innocent, but one is much better safe than sorry, I should say, Hmm? Indeed, I'm no good at conspiracy theory mysel
f
, which is why I will leave the job of figuring out who the conspirators are, and killing them. Also, I'd prefer not t
o
have more than one killed this way each day perhaps? This may bring a tad bit of suspicion from the officials, which we all don't want. But, dear me! My tea is almost done, e
x
cuse me, you can start talking among yourselves.
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Post Post #207 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 7:49 am

Post by Alexander »

To clarify: I don't accuse Sotty of lying, but I think too many people have the letters r-e-d-f-o-x in their posts randomly for this avenue of investigation to be useful. Maybe if a post had those letters as the first/last letter of each sentence, we might have been onto something....
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Post Post #208 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:36 am

Post by chaotic_diablo »

I agree with Alexander. RedFox could just about mean anything. Wonder why scum would pick this particular code...

Sotty should have lied about the battery. There is no sense in letting scum know you can't tap it anymore, or mayb she is already lying? :?
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Post Post #209 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:49 am

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chaotic_diablo wrote:Sotty should have lied about the battery. There is no sense in letting scum know you can't tap it anymore, or mayb she is already lying? :?
...way to tip off the scumbags... I was hoping nobody would mention this on the off-chance that Sotty's ability can work multiple times, but now that seems to be blown. =/
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Post Post #210 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:00 am

Post by chaotic_diablo »

Glork wrote:
chaotic_diablo wrote:Sotty should have lied about the battery. There is no sense in letting scum know you can't tap it anymore, or mayb she is already lying? :?
...way to tip off the scumbags... I was hoping nobody would mention this on the off-chance that Sotty's ability can work multiple times, but now that seems to be blown. =/
Doesn't matter. We don't quite know for sure if sotty is the only wire tapper. O no! I gave that away! Then again, I could be lying. Messing with scum is certainly the way to go. :wink:
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Post Post #211 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:18 pm

Post by Glork »

Of course, if we hit another scumbag today, then there won't be any need for wiretapping. Why don't we focus on that instead, eh?
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Post Post #212 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:31 pm

Post by chaotic_diablo »

Glork wrote:Of course, if we hit another scumbag today, then there won't be any need for wiretapping. Why don't we focus on that instead, eh?
Perhaps, but you seem to forget that there are two kills a night. Wire tapping coudl be used for something else other than scum, that and a lot more.

I'm partially convinced of David's innocence. However, we should wait until he actually responds.
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Post Post #213 (ISO) » Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:13 pm

Post by davidangelsummers »

Sotty7 wrote:I am also p R etty unconvinced as to DP's claim. A vig is very typically a scum claim and what happen E d with Green Liquid is still weighing heavily on my min D. Plus the fact he found machine's post the scummiest right be F ore he gets replaced just seems a little too
c O nvenient

Vote: Dragon Phoeni X
That for starters......
Plus I have reason to belive at LEAST one more person on your list is fine..
I also thought the role your claiming is actually the role Inhim had ..
But as your role (as we all know now ) is limited il go with it for now.

To answer Glork about why I did not vote for DP was simple. I just did not think he could be that stupid day one.This is a great player less we forget.

Now I do have a few more thing to say but it can wait ..CUP FINAL DAY IS APON US.
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Post Post #214 (ISO) » Sun Feb 26, 2006 11:23 am

Post by Glork »

davidangelsummers wrote:To answer Glork about why I did not vote for DP was simple. I just did not
...I don't really buy it. That's metagaming in its worst form, IMHO.
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Post Post #215 (ISO) » Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:36 pm

Post by Sotty7 »

Alexander wrote:To clarify: I don't accuse Sotty of lying, but I think too many people have the letters r-e-d-f-o-x in their posts randomly for this avenue of investigation to be useful. Maybe if a post had those letters as the first/last letter of each sentence, we might have been onto something....
Dang, it seems that my role has done nothing but cause more confusion. Maybe REDFOX was a code given to the mafia by the mod? :?
davidangelsummers wrote:To answer Glork about why I did not vote for DP was simple. I just did not think he could be that stupid day one.This is a great player less we forget
No one is questioning how good of a player DP is and to be honest, that's a flimsy excuse at best as to why you did not vote for him.
CD wrote:Sotty should have lied about the battery. There is no sense in letting scum know you can't tap it anymore, or mayb she is already lying? :?
Why if I was scum would I come out like this? What possible benefits could the scum get? I think someone is panicking just a little here.
FOS: CD


As to why I didn't lie about the battery, what happens tomorrow when you turn to me looking for more information and I had none? It would look bad for me and LAL would certainly apply. Plus I didn't want to draw any possible doc protection when it wasn't needed.
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Post Post #216 (ISO) » Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:05 pm

Post by chaotic_diablo »

Sotty7 wrote:Why if I was scum would I come out like this? What possible benefits could the scum get? I think someone is panicking just a little here. FOS: CD
I think you misunderstood what I said. I almost completely believe that your a phone bugger, however, I'm implying that you should have lied about the battery to confuse scum. There is no suggestion in my post that you were scum at all.
sotty7 wrote:As to why I didn't lie about the battery, what happens tomorrow when you turn to me looking for more information and I had none? It would look bad for me and LAL would certainly apply. Plus I didn't want to draw any possible doc protection when it wasn't needed.
It would certainly not look bad for you. The best defense is that you tried to draw scum into targetting you. With the doc protecting you, you have effectively negated a scum kill. It's not 100% effective, but it's a viable excuse that works.
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Post Post #217 (ISO) » Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:54 pm

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....nevertheless, C_D, you advocated that a townie lie to the town. Even if it appears as though it'd be beneficial, LAL tends to prevail - and you just told a townie (at least, I'm assuming Sotty's town... I don't yet see any reason to disbelieve the claim) to lie to the town. I think that's why Sotty was FoSing you, and it's why I'm going to add an
FoS: chaotic_diablo
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Post Post #218 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:56 am

Post by davidangelsummers »

Glork wrote:
davidangelsummers wrote:To answer Glork about why I did not vote for DP was simple. I just did not
...I don't really buy it. That's metagaming in its worst form, IMHO.
To elaborate, the risk of lynching a power role on the information given was to high. That information never changed. If I had have voted for him after already deciding to wait for more information and that information never came. Well to me that would be scummy to me.

Sotty will you explain why you have a RED FOX in your post please.(see my previous post)

I don’t see the harm in CD merely trying to point out the possibility of Sooty Lying. What are we expected to do take everyone’s word as truth?
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Post Post #219 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:44 am

Post by Glork »

davidangelsummers wrote:
Glork wrote:
davidangelsummers wrote:To answer Glork about why I did not vote for DP was simple. I just did not
...I don't really buy it. That's metagaming in its worst form, IMHO.
To elaborate, the risk of lynching a power role on the information given was to high. That information never changed. If I had have voted for him after already deciding to wait for more information and that information never came. Well to me that would be scummy to me.
I'd hardly call "one-shot vig" a power role... but I do see what you're saying regarding the "well completely switching gears would've been seen as scummy." I think you just got yourself in a "screwed if you do, and screwed if you don't" situation.
davidangelsummers wrote:I don’t see the harm in CD merely trying to point out the possibility of Sooty Lying. What are we expected to do take everyone’s word as truth?
He wasn't pointing out the possibilityof Sotty lying.... he was telling Sotty that she *SHOULD HAVE* lied to the town. Those are two very different things.
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Post Post #220 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:51 am

Post by davidangelsummers »

In a mini, I would say an alive one shot vig on day 2 is a power role..

Regarding the Battery situation how is ok to be agressive to other players but quite shocked when other apply the same tactics?
Not that I think CD was being argessive but you see my point..( I hope)
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Post Post #221 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:17 am

Post by Sotty7 »

davidangelsummers wrote:Sotty will you explain why you have a RED FOX in your post please.(see my previous post)
To be honest I can't. I guess it shows how weak this information actually is, and the fact having "redfox" as a code on a day when most people were voting Dragon Phoeni
x
kinda blows.
chaotic_diablo wrote:
sotty7 wrote:As to why I didn't lie about the battery, what happens tomorrow when you turn to me looking for more information and I had none? It would look bad for me and LAL would certainly apply. Plus I didn't want to draw any possible doc protection when it wasn't needed.
It would certainly not look bad for you. The best defense is that you tried to draw scum into targetting you. With the doc protecting you, you have effectively negated a scum kill. It's not 100% effective, but it's a viable excuse that works.
LAL. If someone lied to the town and took a doc protect when it wasn't needed I wouldn't hesitate to vote them. I can't see how that would be pro town play at all.

Where is N_lich?
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Post Post #222 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 8:02 am

Post by Glork »

Sinking into the shadows while we focus on C_D and David?

Unvote, Vote: N_Lich
for "pressure to post" reasons.
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Post Post #223 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 8:39 am

Post by Alexander »

Glork wrote:Sinking into the shadows while we focus on C_D and David?

Unvote, Vote: N_Lich
for "pressure to post" reasons.
Uhm, why N_Lich and not RotN? The latter hasn't posted at all since the day started...
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Post Post #224 (ISO) » Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:44 am

Post by Glork »

RotN doesn't have REDFOX against him. I know it may be incidental/accidental, but I think it's still a red flag (even if only a small one) against each of those implicated (yes, myself included).
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