Newbie 1436 ~ Game Over

[Bert]

I don't mind.

[Bert]

what the heck...

[Bert]

now I get it. Good I feel better about this now, although having you two as real cop and confirmed inno. was pretty cool too.

[Bert]

I didn't realize both were gambits until you did the tl;dr.

[Bert]

That's so risky though, if there's a real cop out there then you would cause a counterclaim

you did a crazy gambit dang

[Bert]

Or even a PR not in the matrix of a cop.

I'll put it aside yeah, but I still don't see how you two are conftown. After the gambits you've said you've done, I would have liked you as a cop better or a confirmed innocent to assuage me.

[Bert]

I feel a lot better about you two now, though.

[Bert]

innocent until proven guilty - I thought of tracker when I saw her do that, to be honest, but then I said NAH why would she do something like that, she's pulling my chain

because if you're a cop innocent, then you're a sane cop in this matrix

[Bert]

Why is notscience town now? Because of his reaction?

[Bert]

one more in {bert, agi, kaze}

you're overestimating my scumgame I think, lol

but I applaud you for not going through with that lynch on me on D1, I deserved it after freaking out like the true VI I am

[Bert]

*deserved to be lynched

[Bert]

NO. Bet a million trillion Sour Cream & Onion Potato Chips brought to you by SpongeBob Squarepants

[Bert]

Hope things go well, Kaze.

Vote: Kazekirimaru

[Bert]

That's so risky though, if there's a real cop out there then you would cause a counterclaim

Unless I am actually the cop.

As I said tl;dr. scum doesnt know whether I am gambiting or just using Cabd's gambit to continue hiding (nor does town) but that gives u 2 ppl that are most likely town from your PoV, from my PoV Cabd is conftown, feel free to speculate as to why that is

Good thing I'm town this game; that'll give scum a roller coaster ride yahooooooooooooo!

Kaze will be missed, but now we can speculate about meta to our heart's delight! <333333333

Who's with me, darlings!

[Bert]

brb have to re-meta every game you've ever played.

make sure to wear safety goggles...to be safe <3

my games ain't pretty

[Bert]

Bert you should chat with me about reads plox

Cabd has a history of crazy gambits as scum, from what I've heard. I bet Ffery knows all about the ones Cabd has done...

So I'm not treating them as conftown by any means. I don't like how they're acting like they're all conftown and stuff...brings back bad memories of Mara-qwints doing the same as "town lovers with a poisoning ability." Mara and qwints told us they were conftown in that game too...

[Bert]

Fixed that for ya.

Doesn't matter, still both of you aren't conftown. You could easily be luring us to mislynch twice easily within <Kaze, agi, notsci> and then game over. If you're town, you should be able to see from this POV.

[Bert]

I agree that the time for sorting the gambits is tomorrow.

I'm fine with this, actually.

[Bert]

I'm tempted to do one of those "here's every possible scum pairing and how it makes/doesn't make sense" posts just because I know ffery hates 'em.

Please do it?

I'll get on my knees and beg if you will do that!!!

[Bert]

But really the only scenario where sakura is scum here is if she's scum with ffery, and I don't see that being the case or anything soooooo...

I mean had ffery speed wagoned me yesterday I'd have called her town as I went down and she probably knows that.

You and Ffery as scum together would be interesting. I look forward to you analyzing that pairing and telling me why that's not possible <3

That would explain (just partly) why she didn't go after you yesterday

[Bert]

Ewww now I ~REALLY~ don't wanna do it.

I'll sheep you on any wagon today if you do it???

Like ANY wagon, even my own

how about that

[Bert]

Literally the only way Cabd can be scum is if he was scum with me and I know that's not possible.

Who's scum??????????? I'm in a bit of a lull week so I'm even less productive than usual (if that's even possible given my normal play)...

[Bert]

Holy shit you all love me. One post and instant explosion.

I'm thinking kaze slot gets some analysis now.

I love you <3333333

Yeah, this thread went dead for like a day...

I feel kinda motivated to go look into this game some tomorrow, actually...

P-edit: oh Cabd, I saw that game where Sakura was scum in 1428 (or was it 1426)? The one where Grimgroove finally got mislynched as town...I noticed you posted in it at the end too....nice beetlejuicing!! Sakura: "I bet Cabd is following this." Cabd "HEY IM HERE!"

lol...

[Bert]

She took a chance and fakeclaimed doc...so it definitely caught my eye, but I'm terrible at looking into past games, so I'll leave you all to that.

[Bert]

I advocated Kaze as scum for all of D1 so I can't play Devil's advocate...

and he/she buddied me weird too...

and the overreaction of WHAT THE FUCK DID I JUST READ, when I went all WIFOM/freakout/flail

didn't seem genuine

[Bert]

Yeah, just looked back, Ffery talked about Kaze's evolving game and how the waffling/hedging was the only thing bothering her about Kaze and keeping her/him from being a solid townread...

there's a replacement coming in soon probably though so.....

:/

[Bert]

Good point...

Hey Ffery, you should probably meta this scum game by me that just ended...

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=31267

[Bert]

Do moderators generally grant reasonable extensions for lost time due to putting the game on hold for a replacement?

[Bert]

What's the fuzzybutternut rule? Just curious.

[Bert]

notscience's paranoia feels legit in the past page or 2

Ffery's obviously seeing something I'm not regarding Cabd and Sakura's gambits, so I'm inclined to trust her read for now and take it she's not scum with one of Cabd/Sakura...

kaze/agi is by PoE, although Kaze has been more scummy than agi IMHO - Cabd's case is solid, why don't you all comment about that more and validate/invalidate it?

there's more room for error with agi102 because of the newb factor, but stuff like this with the caps lock etc. rings kinda contrived:

GM I FINALLY REMEMBERED WHY I ASKED

I WAS JUST CURIOUS

WAS THAT THE ANSWER YOU WERE LOOKING FOR

Double bus?
I WON'T BELIEVE IT
THIS ISN'T HAPPENING

My vote's still on Kaze, and it's a shame the (lack of a) replacement is holding us up.

[Bert]

Agi who do you "know" is town?

[Bert]

Well if agi is being truthful as town, that helps dispel my Sakura paranoia

That blatant pr crumbling investigator gambit was unbelievably paranoia-inducing

[Bert]

Agi might be gambit ting

Didn't he or she gambit earlier on d1

[Bert]

I sense He or she is better than she acts like and is no newb

[Bert]

Agi pretty much copied what Sakura's gambit was

Super blatant, and then "oops I soft claimed"

[Bert]

Cabd's not clear. If agi is cop then you're clear until proven otherwise

This is the most frustrating yet entertaining newbie I've been in

The rest have been uber boring

[Bert]

I still feel like we're handing this on a silver platter to Sakura and Cabd.

Yeah I feel like I may be being played but I can't do anything about it regardless if I'm being played or not

I have to play along

[Bert]

Also notscience seems town to me

So something is wrong

Someone's playing well

[Bert]

@agi102 if you see this please come back and claim

Otherwise I go to sleep tonight wondering what is going on

Love, Bert

P-edit: perhaps. A gambit, and then calling himself conftown that way.



He also isn't townreading me which is weird

[Bert]

MARIO

MARIO

MARIO

Where art thou?

Dónde está Mario???

[Bert]

DONDE ESTAAAAAAAAAAAA

<333333333333

[Bert]

UNOFFICIAL VOTECOUNT 2.1

With 7 alive it's 4 votes to lynch.

*Cabd - notscience [1]
*Fferyllt -
*Bert -
*Mario4 - Bert, Cabd, Sakura [3]
*agi102 -
*Sakura Hana -
*notscience -

Not voting: agi102, Fferyllt, Mario4 [3]

Day 2 ends in (expired on 2013-10-21 00:03:00)

[Bert]

Kaze's my only solid scumread...

I really don't have anything else to say other than I'm glad Sakura is kinda cleared, OKAY FINE she's clear pretty much.

The paranoia subsided which is really good, for someone who I can't gauge well. Same with Agi, I didn't know what to do to achieve a better read and gauge whether he/she is newbtown or not.

Which leaves <Ffery, Cabd, notscience, Kaze>

That is confusing and...

gut reads:

Cabd leaning town, but I feel the gambit might have been to get himself off the hot seat after being a leaning-scum read for several players... that's where my paranoia comes from, plus I can never trust him in a game, it's just he's very deceitful regardless of alignment

Ffery *probably* town, but yeah, read is town. It's always her cautiousness that gets me sometimes and makes me have second-thoughts, but I have a townread on her, although not quite as strong as before

notscience's trajectory and tunneling doesn't really makes sense from a town perspective, so... i don't remember him ever being so blatant with tunneling and all the bold yet empty accusations, and I almost want to say "surely scum can't be this blatant, right?"

notscience isn't flip-flopping as much as I'm used to, and it's like his reads are kinda stationary, not moving, stagnating, doesn't make sense - the trajectory. Vote is kinda parked at times, at least it feels that way.

<Kaze, notscience> does make sense.

[Bert]

Wow, it felt great to spew all that out. I should be able to skim and take some notes during the night (I still haven't done that all game, I feel pretty guilty tbh about being useless), and the good thing is everyone here knows me save for the replacement slot for Mario and agi102. So I feel pretty comfortable being virtually insane. <3

[Bert]

despite shaking it off thinking that it might just be that I am annoyed by his arrogance, it kept coming back.

Yeah...I was thinking it might be his arrogance too, but it won't go away.

But the gambit thing making him "conftown" is what pings

[Bert]

Sakura, one of Bert/ffery is his buddy. Bert seems more likely.

Wrong, but ffery has seemed so town but...rather...isn't assertive but I guess that's what I expect after my last games with her.

Vote: Cabd

YAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

YAYYYYYYYYYY

[Bert]

Actually Sakura at the end of the day, I might just sheep you

[Bert]

It doesn't make him conftown at all. Think a little, there was a way to actually know that Sakura was not telling the truth about being a cop.

How could he have known? From agi's breadcrumb, or...

This is nice to know that there was a way for him to know...the way Cabd has been gloating about being conftown from that ridiculous gambit, and then people defending him, was very meh...

but your spot, Kaze, was so hedgy...I can't read you when you're scum, though, so.... (1402)

[Bert]

This game is pretty much won.

How???

[Bert]

To be fair, Sakura and ffery and I wanted Kaze/Mario gone without a replacement

Not just Cabd

[Bert]

Cabd/Ffery makes a lot more sense than Kaze/notsci

Phone posting here

[Bert]

Wisdom read the last two pages

And tell me who I'm voting...

[Bert]

@agi
You are a cop. There are two possible setups with a cop. Look at them, and think how Cabd could have known for a fact that Sakura was lying about being a cop and therefore exploit that to the pseudo-conftown status he has gotten.

I'd appreciate if you guys don't make me spell it out more than I have already.

I FINALLY UNDERSTAND!!!! YESHHHH

Yeah, I thought Sakura was breadcrumbing "tracker" with the blatant "Cabd's innocent until proven guilty" comments. That makes sense now that I think about it, if Cabd's scum and knows there's no tracker...hence the boldness to claim cop...aha

AHA EPIPHANY

YESSH

[Bert]

Basically, Cabd knows that there is no tracker and therefore Sakura's statement of "innocent until proven guilty" makes no sense for a real tracker due to him knowing the tracker setup is not possible, so he claims cop to get towncred. (sorry I'm confusing y'all I think).

[Bert]

Cabd, explain the "save her the replacement"-esque push on a possible doctor slot?

[Bert]

Bert already stated he might sheep you

I may have said I *might*, but then this morning while catching up I see Sakura saying Cabd is a strong townread...so yeah...thanks but no thanks

what does give me hesitance is that doc claim, and that being what Sakura just did in her last newbie which led to Grimmy being lynched in LYLO. So yeah, that does give me pause, don't get me wrong

but seriously, that "I'll self hammer in 2 days" thing is exactly what JasonWazza did as scum in 1415, Ffery, to try to get me to lay off him. Not cool, and makes you look worse

OK, catching up fully now

[Bert]

So ffery, what's the difference between town-flail and scum-flail? I've never quite understood how it's different or what you do to discern between the two... also, what do you think of Cabd's flailing thus far? Wisdom, you can answer too

My first impression is there's potential scum motivation as that kind of AtE (specifically, the style) is what superficially appeals to notscience, me, and Sakura (and agi102 who is new)

[Bert]

EBWOP: My last thought before I head out is that Cabd's reads on me have felt forced in this game, not following really a natural flow progressing in figuring me out. So there's that.

Really, the gambit for Cabd is not a plus for him, no matter how hard he tries to make it seem like it makes him town

There, now you know what I'm thinking.

[Bert]

Bert what's with the fencesitting? On one line you state you don't like Sakura's Cabd townread and in the other you say you don't like my claim. Clarify your stance.

pedit: I answered that already. Cabd is not an emotional player, the sole purpose is to appeal to Sakura who is an emotional player and flails similarly. Possibly to agi too, yes.

Your claim makes me paranoid. It's hard to shake that off when Sakura just did that in her last game. Same play, same scenario. Can you see that from my POV?

Sorry about my stance not being clear. VOTE is going CABD's way. NOT moving, never ever ever ever

That emotional manipulation is just too blatant and I don't trust him with a ten-foot pole. Add onto that his play in this game I can't see as town. The gambit, the weird tension-filled "reads" on me.

BUT, there is a part inside me that is paranoid about this being one of those fake doc claims. Also, I do not have confidence in reading you. You skated by in 1402 during my one day there. Add to that the fact that I haven't liked Kaze at all since Day 1 and was on that wagon.

But there was no momentum on Cabd and I didn't think it possible to lynch him, what with Sakura's hard-defending, etc., etc. and them saying that the game is an auto-win as Cabd, Sakura, agi102 are conftown. That stuff resonantes with me still.

I *think* Cabd is scum. And I think the AtE is a load of bull and should be disregarded.

Ffery/cabd as a team? ffery/kaze? What throws me off is she has come in expressing willingness to hammer *both.* I have had Ffery as town but I've also been paranoid because I haven't seen her as scum and she has fooled Cabd several times before.

[Bert]

So, in other words:

1) Telling us we will lose (manipulation)
2) self-hammering thing in 48 hours (which would end the day early)
3) telling us he will rub this in our face after the game (???)
4) gambit and him saying it makes him conftown (double ?????)
5) toeing the line by saying if avi bets were allowed, he would do so

The desperation doesn't seem genuine, coming from someone like him. That is all.

[Bert]

What I'm trying to say is, I felt in a rut where Kaze, notscience, and myself were the only lynch choices, and none of them felt *right.* Kaze was the scummiest out of all of them, but Kaze-notscience as a *team* if Ffery is really town, with Cabd-agi-Sakura claiming to be conftown with Ffery???

That was insinuating an easy "lynch two out of Bert-Kaze-notscience" in two days and cruise to a win. It had that written all over it. I can't shake off that feeling of hopelessness that if Kaze and notscience are town (I *think* ns's blatant aggressiveness tunnely thing is not being emulated) then we're in deep trouble.

[Bert]

I'm rubbing this townflip in your face postgame too, bert.

(BTW in case anyone hadn't noticed, I've already accepted my lynch and I'm just emotionally trolling everyone until notsci gets here)

Ffery and agi102 haven't decided yet. They're the factor now that determines whether you live...

not notscience, not me, not Wisdom

Sakura won't vote you, so it's up to you with only (2) votes at the moment to cast on others, to convince agi102 and Ffery

why are you giving up so easily??

[Bert]

I didnt say ffery was conftown, she's just a very strong townread of mine.

I see. my bad.

But Cabd and you were implying that you had three conftowns in you, Agi102, and cabd, and then Cabd said that Ffery can be added into the conftown (4) leading to an auto-win.

That kinda confidence scared me big-time. The "game's over, we got this." That does not sit well with me.

P-edit: Cabd, you're at LYNCH -1 and notscience is ALREADY voting you. Only Ffery and agi102 are likely to hammer, and we have several days left to discuss this. What is the rush, my good sir

[Bert]

The odds of mislynching today and then lynching me tomorrow are non-zero and I don't like those odds.

Thought you said Wisdom was definitely scum. Also, how sure are you that ns is scum?

Easy, we lynch scum today and tomorrow wont be LYLO, lynching you would guarantee LYLO tomorrow tho.

If ns is scum, who's his partner?? Trying to see this from your POV.

Now I'm gonna go look back at Kaze's play with the PR claim out now.

Oh, wait, Ffery, you're the one who said that Kaze's play gave you no vibes of PR, and that your PR-dar is very sensitive. Weird...

[Bert]

Ffery, if Kaze did crumb Doc at all, then that makes me feel a tad bit better.

[Bert]

I haven't found a crumb, but I'm not that good at spotting crumbs. I see behaviors, usually, not crumbs. In the environment where I learned mafia nobody crumbed roles, and results crumbs were subtle.

Re-reading through his ISO, the thing that kinda stands out is that he looked confident when people suspected him, like he wasn't worried about being lynched. To me, that's a pretty strong PR tell. Also, post 649 in retrospect, blowing up about a premature VT claim could be PR-motivated.

Oh, I never knew that confidence is a strong PR tell. 649 I felt was overreacting, but that may explain why he/she *seemed* so displeased with my claim, to say the least.

[Bert]

Wait, what is this shit? I replaced in to your scum team in Mismatched.

LOL

That is a brain fart. But that game doesn't count, because I didn't get to look in an objective lens and see if I can catch you, if that makes sense. It's just not the same, that's probably why I spouted that without thinking about it.

It's like how Wisdom was scum with me in Polygamist, but that doesn't count like in 1402 Newbie I had no idea what to expect. And same with Cabd, he was on my team in Mismatched, but as you see here I'm still uber-paranoid and don't know what exactly to expect.

[Bert]

There's something about confirmation bias that renders those games where I know exactly what is going on more blurry, it makes it much different when our alignments are unknown. If you're scum here, this is the first time I've seen you as scum while playing *against* you.

[Bert]

Ffery works better towards Cabd's philosophy, Bert is more scummy.

Wisdom asked you who, and you can't give one answer.

Why is that? Who is more likely, who do you *think* is scum with Cabd if Cabd's scum?

[Bert]

Don't bus unless you need to

Bert's waffling is extremely scummy, I know he waffles sometimes but looking a 1402 and 532 where we were together it seemed minimal compared to now

Did I waffle in Popcorn? How about masons and monks? You could read Mini 1489, which makes me think it even worse why Cabd thinks my waffling here is bad if he really did read that game and keep up in real-time. Like, him getting attacked and then saying my jump was "opportunistic and therefore I'm scum" does not sit well with me.

[Bert]

So since ns claimed VT can we just flashlynch him anyway and then his buddy of Bert/Wisdom?

Wisdom if he's the real doc he'll die tonight, because otherwise scum will have to shoot at someone else since the cop will be protected for sure, if the cop dies then wisdom is scum.

Doc if exists is roleblocked and Cop dies?

Doc if doesn't exist, Cop dies anyway?

Am I missing something?

[Bert]

Did Wisdom say who his predecessor protected N1?

[Bert]

Cabd, explain the "save her the replacement"-esque push on a possible doctor slot?

You missed:

Wisdom-Bert

[Bert]

Kay, so, ns is probably town.
So is Bert.
So is Fferyllt

I'll happily admit right now a lot of my townreads on these three are because we share similar reads. If I can see how people came to their conclusions, it gives me fuzzy warm town feels about them.

I can't read GM worth a damn. Had like one decent post to my knowledge but mostly idfk. Sorreh. Null.

agi102 is posting shit for content but I'm okay leaving this slot null leaning town

since noob. So much noob. It hurts. agi please post better <3

Why would Kaze protect agi102?? Weird...

I don't wish to rule out Agi for scum. Even though I feel as if he's been playing rather townish, he IS coasting.

That's an indisputable fact. And scum come in pairs, so it's possible he's just getting carried.

[Bert]

VT. Do it if you like. I have revised my reads slightly in that I've switched Cabd's and fffff's places.

If you don't mind waiting a bit I'd like to finish the T S O case while I can.

She did, actually..... Very odd...

Cabd didn't know that GM claimed VT, which could explain the kill.

(1) GM didn't suspect Cabd
(2) GM was a claimed VT but Cabd evidently had forgotten or was drunk/busy when the claim happened near deadline?

[Bert]

But ffery cannot be scum otherwise she'd have already hammered Cabd which means...

Uh......

OK, so I don't know who the last scum is... and believe me, I have thought this through and through to the point of overthinking.

Either my read on Ffery or ns (town) is and has been wrong, or my initial gutscum reads on Kaze were spot on and Wisdom isn't the doc.

That's how badly I'm doing in this game with regard to reads.

[Bert]

But ffery cannot be scum otherwise she'd have already hammered Cabd which means...

Which basically just means ffery is 100% town.

Please, not this again...

[Bert]

Why wouldnt ffery have hammered Cabd yet instead of trying to figure him out if she's scum but Cabd's Town. There's quite a lot of heat towards Cabd atm, and she's trying to reason it out.

A hammer that's made hastily if she's scum would make her look bad, whereas lots of deliberation and time taken to think it through before a hammer looks less suspicious. This is all hypotheticals, btw

[Bert]

I came into this game thinking you could read me, Cabd.

But if you're town, then it was all talk. I expected you to read me like a book, but you didn't and even pushed for my lynch D1. I still won't believe you're town until you flip.

And notscience and ffery both seem town. I'm obviously wrong about one of them at least.

[Bert]

Also I never do sigbets and never have, never will.

I have a feeling I'm lynched tomorrow, but even if I'm not, I don't know if ns or ffery is scum.

Wisdom *might* be lying, but who knows

I'm gonna vote Wisdom tomorrow.

[Bert]

'Dat talking down to me. I have no reason to troll you guys post hammer, bert.

Also what sakura said.

Odds on bert-wisdom?

You've told people you can tell when I'm fake.

Your confidence had me believing only scum-you would go after me like that.

You even keep a notebook. Also, your scumgame reputation you like to build up...

It's not me, I didn't feel it was notsci or Ffery

Only you and Kaze left, a claimed doctor who might be lying

[Bert]

Ffery I am phone posting, but

I think ffery and notsci are both town

And I don't believe I'm wrong on both

[Bert]

Also Kaze did not seem like a doc.

[Bert]

What are amished tells?

[Bert]

Dangit why did I have to replace into a scumslot?

I've kinda been following this before replacing in but I need to read all 42 pages again to actually get a clue on stuffs. I'll try to get to it tonight. No promises though.

Siv flipped town...

[Bert]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=31155

was notscience's play there different from here or his meta?

Because it would take great skill for him to emulate his town play so well. I don't think he has reached such levels yet. I could be wrong.

This makes no sense. Who are you talking about?? Emulating his town play?

[Bert]

Oh, I thought you were referring to Cabd. My bad.

Yeah, that's why I have thought notscience is town...

I don't know, but he did survive his scumgames in that latest Stacking the Deck and 1402 Newbie.

[Bert]

Ffery is emulating her town game very well if she's scum too

[Bert]

Cabd, You sure Ffery's town??

I woulda gone after GM had she been alive, probably, today. Or agi if not for the cop claim. I've been way off, apparently, which doesn't surprise me. Trying to stay positive despite the really bad odds and having to potentially face off with Ffery and/or notscience in a 3p LYLO. And that's assuming we even hit one scum tomorrow and force a 3p LYLO. It looks bleak.

[Bert]

Guess what I'm trying to say is Sakura/agi being revealed as conftown balances out out the chaos of mislynching and going into a LYLO. This could be a lot worse.

[Bert]

keep the faith.

[Bert]

I'm sorry Sakura.

And to rest who are paranoid about me, I really really let my personal IRL stuff get in the way at the end of D1, and I would never do that as scum. That's just out-of-bounds, and I was stressed IRL and sleep deprived that I let it drift into this game and saw myself freak out at being voted for. that's something I try to hone in, and I'd never do that as scum because to bring personal IRL issues in is just really dirty play and would make me feel dirty as heck.

Other than that, my play has sucked.

And I'm lost as to what to do because Ffery and notscience both seem town :/ And Wisdom seemed more town than Kaze, but after the flip Wisdom just looks really bad, plus the doctor claim has me really paranoid since Kaze was scum and ffery and notscience both seem town.

I calculated the odds if you don't lynch me tomorrow (if we get there) or today, and chance to win is (2/3) x (1/2) = (1/3) so the chance is still there, but look I wouldn't bring my friggin personal life into this, that's just way out of line for me as scum, this was a genuine freak out and that's all I wanted to say. I spent 48 hours thinking about what I wanted to say because this is a really dire situation

Bert

[Bert]

I meant Kaze was SCUMMY

I typed that really fast

[Bert]

EBWOP: I wanted to get it off my chest and now it's gone.

Everything I've done is worth getting paranoid about, but the IRL personal stuff getting in is what I'd never do as scum, that would be too dirty and that's just out-of-bounds. And that is NOT a slip, btw.

I used to type really fast, Ffery, enter typing contests, that's a long story. That was a typo, Kaze was SUPER scummy.

[Bert]

Why did you mention this today and not yesterday?

I did at teh end of D1 and beginning of D2....

many times, but it was mainly apologizing to Cabd

but I wanted to reiterate since it's LYLO

[Bert]

Also, wisdom and notscience cruised to a perfect win in my newbie 1402.

[Bert]

Also, I am here for the next 8 hours, I seriously just went to two plays today, watched a baseball game too, and my sleep schedule is extremely messed up. So you talk, ask me questinos, I am here all night baby

all night longggg (lionel richie song)........

[Bert]

Do you see similarities to their play in this game?

Notscience was more passive and not as loud and nervous jumpy.

Wisdom was less paranoid, knee-jerky in that game.

But it has been some time since that game. And Cabd told us at the end of D2 that notscience has improved his scum game and linked us to his modded Cash Cabd game.

I remember that Wisdom remarked in the scum QT that he did not want to buss notscience unless necessary.

It has been a while and as you know I'm not good at meta-ing and looking back. I'll link the game, one sec.

I do think that Wisdom's ploy was to claim doc because Kaze was the likeliest lynch target and Cabd was probably #2 on the list of scummiest if not for Wisdom's replace-in and claim. He was so pushy.

[Bert]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=29868

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/iBDvTT6jbtQST

[Bert]

So Bert, you think there's a chance ffery could be scum? otherwise scum for you should be obvious.

I have not ruled it out.

She's a competent scumplayer. Period.

She seems town, and I don't see how she has been scummy, but we are in LYLO now, and notscience has seemed townie too. Something has to give. Something's wrong.

I would like to know particularly what to look for with her.

My biggest worry on N2 was that if we ever get to a 3 person LYLO, then figuring out who between ns/ffery is scum, and also trying to avoid myself getting lynched, that is a steep mountain to climb.

[Bert]

So she seems town, but you're letting your paranoia eat your gut? WHat happened yesterday because of that?

If you really want to know, yesterday I REALLY REALLY at times wanted to flip flop on Cabd.

I really did, but Wisdom was really convincing. And it was a big disconnect with me and Cabd. Like I expected him to read me better, much like Ffery expected me to read her better in 1415.

I had so much paranoia built up because Cabd and I have talked outside this game prior to this game, and he talked about Castle after following it because his girlfriend Lynx was in 1482. And he followed 1489, said he knew my towngame, he followed Popcorn 243 Micro, came in and said that he could tell I was town there...rather easily that I was being genuine. He said my Castle fake paranoia was juts fake, although he was confbiased because Mala let it slip that I was scum in a Skype chat during D2.

But he was so boastful about that, that I believed his notebook on me would give him the insights on me, and then he went after me d1, and then that gambit when he is known for gambits as both alignments...him saying he was conftown.

I could not shake that paranoia off. I expected Cabd to flip scum until twilight

[Bert]

So she seems town, but you're letting your paranoia eat your gut? WHat happened yesterday because of that?

Cabd flipped town, that's what happened. And now there are only 3 people other than you and two scum in them.

I'm wrong on notscience who seems JUST like his old town meta, or I'm wrong on Ffery, or I'm wrong on both.

Plus Wisdom claimed doctor which I don't buy at this point. Before that, I thought it couldn't be them, but now TSO died, agi is clear and died, GM died, Cabd died.

My 4 scumspects from d1, 3 are dead and flipped town, except Kaze. That's really really bad.

[Bert]

Did you not trust my read on him?

No because I was feeling really arrogant after what happened in 501 Stacking the Deck and you got manipulated by Tammy and Tierce.

And when Wisdom told us "don't let Cabd convince all of you to change your mind," a lot of paranoia built up in me when Wisdom kept telling you that yo uwere being easily manipulated.

[Bert]

Have you reread F16's meta analysis on me from the newbie game we recently played? He meta'd me to within an inch of my life in that game.

Here's a recent newbie scum game: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=29870

The rest of my recent scum games are hydra games, including all the completed Morph the Cat games.

I'll go skim F16's meta of you again, but I'm a meta-dodger myself so...sorry paranoid, but yes I will go look at that now.

And @Sakura, I'm so clueless today, make me sheep you because I have no idea in hell who's scum. Tomorrow I'll probably tell you I wanna make my own decision and block everyone else out, but that's my arrogant prick part of me speaking, make me remember this post and quote it if I think otherwise.

[Bert]

Bert, why dont you use your head and stop your paranoia just because someone is a good player and actually try to read them? We all saw with Cabd's flip what paranoia can do to a game.

P-Edit: Yeah but when i got manipulated by Tammy and Tierce i was still kind of a newbie to mafia you know.

My head? I'll go read the game, but I think it's notscience and Wisdom, from notscience's really tunnely play D1 where he juts avoided interactino other than CABD IS SCUM, HERE'S A CASE, TSO IS SCUM, HERE"S A CASE.

Head: Wisdom's claim was fake and last-minute he claimed while not even being at lynch -1, because he wants us to join the Cabd wagon and end the day ASAP. He literally went "IM THE DOC, GO LYNCH CABD NOW OR YOURE STUPID" It was lacking that passion that I usually see in him, that's an intuitive thing

P-edit: I didn't know you were a newbie then. You seemed to play fine in 497 Tit for Tat

[Bert]

Like ns was SO confident about his scumreads

I rarely see that from him

and from people who aren't THAT easy to read, he started on page 3 or 4 and started tunneling like heck.

[Bert]

Yeah sorry I'm back, but I got distracted cuz I just got asked to the homecoming formal tomorrow night. *sigh* never danced before ever or been to any dance of any kind, this is gonna be so disastrous LOL

Good night and sleep well!

[Bert]

Have you reread F16's meta analysis on me from the newbie game we recently played? He meta'd me to within an inch of my life in that game.

Found it:

Spoiler:

Analysis of ffery's meta

Town 1) BSG Mafia

Called passive by orcinus who says that she is less engaged with the game. Immediately put under pressure for most of the game with other players guessing that passiveness is caused due to being pressured. Posts lead up to suspicion on buldermar. In the end, voted buldermar while asking Orcinus who to lynch. Asks to be lynched that day rather than the following day since she is worried about buldermar setting her up to be an awesome townie and then FOSsing her next DP for not lynching scum day 1. As time goes on, starts to read Buldermar as town (despite the fact that he was scum). What is notable here is that she is already planning for the next day as to what will happen if she is lynched. She is also called extremely scummy for not fighting her lynch but this just seems to be the way she rolls. Her post 620 also tries to get town thinking about what will happen after she is lynched much as she is doing in this game.

Town 2) Newbie 1389

As IC. Gets accused of being defensive when she responds to an accusation to another player that giving townreads is scummy. Supports her meta style with links. Asks probing question about why a player feels that another is scum and comments a little when they provide their reasoning. When asked what her reads were, says that the person asking her is possible scum but that she needs more time to figure it out and that she could be rusty. Has a little uncertainty, likely because it is beginning of the game and reads haven’t developed yet. When a newbie prods her, she says “I am done waiting for reads” and starts posting ISOs. Does 3 ISOs and then votes her biggest scumread. Reads are not very well developed and there is no mention of trajectories. Explains how Bauss’s stance went from indirect to direct and that is what caused the change in her read. When Lynx votes for a player, ffery wants to chat with Lynx about that player and starts discussing reads. Parallels with her asking Mutt to talk to her. But in this game, her analysis is very detailed. With Mutt, not so much.

Town 3) Newbie 1364

Reads MsMarangal as scum for a “pretty bad looking” argument on dissonance. Asks very specific questions, says that she missed Nick’s lie. Gives her opinions about a case that nickthename made on Broseidon and says that MsMarangal was buddying him and not the other way around. Continues to FOS the same person that she had initially called scum. Disagrees with Marangal calling the progression of her scumreads’s posts “excellent.” The tone is slightly different and she is less wishy-washy. Uses strong words like “this is gold” or “left the case in shreds.” Also says that “these analyses look pretty damn town-motivated.” Shows a lot more conviction and less wishy-washyness. Continues asking very specific questions to a few players. Questions to MsMarangal are extremely detailed, specific, and probing. Is tonally very firm “I have no idea what your case on Nick was.” Does ISO’s on several players. Keeps pushing the lynch on MsM. Isn’t very uncertain or wishy-washy. Is reasonably certain of affiliation. Is suspicious of flexibility where the player unvotes and says he needs to do a re-read since scum want to be flexible to allow the town to chose a direction. 419 shows more specificity. Pro-actively scumhunts. Does a lot more than what was required of her. Picks up on too many dots and less connections when a player distinctly states that he forgot something and then explicitly mentions going after Nacho.
Note that the tediously exhaustive ISOs are not something she does as town. This could very well be a null tell.
A great tell: said she found conflict scummy. So, this is a null tell. However, the response to conflict was to do tons and tons of ISOs. A stark contrast from her scumgame where she merely states that she was confused and demands more cases from the town while being quite vague.
478 shows a lot of willingness to look for evidence. Wonders whether Chris invented those categories on the fly. Once she verifies it, she mentions that at least Dodgy was a technical term in Chris’s lexicon.

This is one game that undermines my townread because ffery in this game is nothing like what she was in that game. However, as a caveat, note that she seemed to be particularly hard-working and willing to dig into multiple ISOs in that game so it is a rather high standard to which to hold her now.

Scum 1) The popcorn mafia

Play is slightly different because she didn’t replace in but none of her initial posts had any content whatsoever. Says that she is bored and wants to gun. There is the general tendency to sit back and not be pro-active. 297 has a lot of very weak reads. No conviction in any of them. Posts very little content and is mostly very unsure. Barely ever justifies any of her reads. Never mentions anything about trajectory or anything else.

Scum 2) Newbie 1403

Mentions that the player who was lynched Day1 wanted to scrutinize a few others, asks how this is going. Provides reads: "

Zebe looked townish. KBW terrible but lynchbait, proceed with caution. TheGargantula is an improvement over predecessor but did notice something that was an amished tell.

" Says that she found the game contentious and that she found some of the cases difficult to follow. Notes in her wiki that town had some serious confirmation bias. Asks each person to lay out their cases against each other and against her scumpartner (thor). Asks Thor to lay out his case as well. Scum motive: let the town fight amongst themselves. In 604, attacks KBW asking “so you are discounting that huge towntell made earlier.” The tone of the post is accusatory since it assumes that the towntell existed and was huge and asked whether KBW discounted it. Mentions that she is bothered by Valius which is a really weak scumread. Switches reads and says that she wants to lynch between Valius, Zebe, and Thor. Valius was the leading wagon. Zebe read was switched from the initial weak non-reason. Thor is her buddy. Weird that she wants to lynch Thor despite Thor and Valius going hard against each other. Asks for links to games to substantiate a claim. Discusses with Thor as to where to place her votes.

- Says “

Gah. So many contradictory stances in this game

.” Wants to stay back and allow town to lynch themselves. Does not want to take part in the conflict when it doesn’t concern her. Does not hesitate in throwing out scumteam pairs. Says she has to rethink everything.
- Tries to keep her head out of the major conflicts.
- Had weak reads that she switched over (Mutt read here parallels Zebe read in that game) but only a little since she elaborates on Mutt read a little.

Scum 3) Newbie 1319

In 232, she does her first ISO as scum. The first thing to note that it wasn’t very detailed and doesn’t really dig into the motivations of players. At least, it is nowhere near as detailed as her multiple ISOs tracking down trajectories of other players. Keeps a reads list detailing all of her reads. Won't say too much more about this since it is apparently not her usual playstyle.

General Notes

1) When she doesn’t understand a case, she tries to deconstruct it and question further as town. However, as scum, tries to stay on the sidelines and pick a case while fanning the flames. In this game, she definitely has attacked Jason upon replacing in and defended JKLM. As scum, I'd expect her to ask one of them to re-iterate their cases, ask clarification questions and as deadline approaches, settle for a lynch. However, she pretty much strong-armed the direction of the day phase and presented her reads very strongly. This aligns with her town meta much more than scum.
2) Has an incredible amount of attention to detail and is very specific about digging to the bottom of a player’s motivation. - This concerned me a little since she wasn't really paying attention to detail. But it is not enough to outweigh my townread.
3) Seems to be more sure and convicted as town but the game where she got lynched is evidence that this isn't a surefire tell and she can also be unsure and wishy-washy as town.

Thought process in this game:
Came in, thought bestwillcui was scummy with Jason a second scumread. A reread of bestwillcui’s ISO made her think he was town with Jason being scum. As she reads through Jason’s ISO, the read strengthened and she comments on every post that Jason has made. Townreads Muttley for not voting Jason since given ffery’s current stance, it ensures that Jason gets lynched today. Bert thinks Jason is town first. This point is important is another reason that undermines my townread. But overall, I won't lynch ffery today if I can help it and it is at all possible to convince any of you guys to lynch somebody else.

[Bert]

This is bullshit, notscience does this tunnely play as town and you know it.

Notsci did his usual town play in my mini normal. He was scum. Giving him a free meta pass is bad.

[Bert]

wtf is this? I softclaimed from my first posts and I expected everyone to figure it out but Sakura and agi (and even you, who talked about Trackers) kept not understanding it and wanted me to spell it out. What choice did I have?

You kept saying "possible Doctor slot"

I kept talking about Trackers because that's what I thought Sakura was when she was crumbing stuff before you replaced in

[Bert]

So Wisdom, why is Ffery scum?

[Bert]

This looks like Bert/ffery. Sakura stated she thinks it's notscience and me so Bert also tries to suspect notscience and me. Unless it's actually Bert/ns and Bert hopes I'll be the mislynch over ns.

No, I said my HEAD thinks it's you and ns, but I am not counting out Ffery. Stop that.

So Bert, you think there's a chance ffery could be scum? otherwise scum for you should be obvious.

I have not ruled it out.

She's a competent scumplayer. Period.

She seems town, and I don't see how she has been scummy, but we are in LYLO now, and notscience has seemed townie too. Something has to give. Something's wrong.

I would like to know particularly what to look for with her.

My biggest worry on N2 was that if we ever get to a 3 person LYLO, then figuring out who between ns/ffery is scum, and also trying to avoid myself getting lynched, that is a steep mountain to climb.

And I'm lost as to what to do because Ffery and notscience both seem town

Sakura is reading Ffery as super-town, and Sakura told me to use my head and not my gut, and so head is that you and ns are scum, Wisdom.

Gut isn't sure at all.

[Bert]

This looks like Bert/ffery. Sakura stated she thinks it's notscience and me so Bert also tries to suspect notscience and me. Unless it's actually Bert/ns and Bert hopes I'll be the mislynch over ns.

I'm not sure about any of you, but it's funny that I just "started" suspecting ns and you. That's not true. I suspected you yesterday, hence all my waffling on D2. I was voting for you until you came in and claimed doc and went after Cabd, and Cabd I found to be very scummy.

Notscience and ffery have both seemed town, I stand by that. And you are making me think you're scum right now, with the BS points you've brought up against me.

Seriously, I brought my friggin personal life into the mix at the end of D1, huge mistake, that is like liable for warnings or modkills, I'm still here, and I would never do that as scum. It's dirty dirty play for me to ever do something like that.

[Bert]

Bert looks like he opportunistically wants to push myself and notscience, even to the point of changing the context of my claim and misrepping notscience's meta.

I am not misrepping ns's meta. ns himself has said that he is changing his meta and meta-dodging. Are you ignoring this? I can quote what people have said in this thread about ns's meta. I just quoted cabd's quote

Wisdom/ns scumteam

or Wisdom/ffery, but I think it's Wisdom/ns GUT wise

Wisdom goes today for me,

Vote: Wisdom

Now time for me to sleep and prepare for my formal. I have no doubt you're scum by the way you just accused me, so I hope you get flashwagoned

buh-bye.

[Bert]

Anyway I can't judge from games I have not been in.

[Bert]

Eh I don't think his accusations have the intensity they do when he's town. He calls bullshit on what he thinks comes from scum and is loud about it, it seemed like he mostly wanted to make others vote Titus there.

Anyway I can't judge from games I have not been in.

Eh I don't think his accusations have the intensity they do when he's town. He calls bullshit on what he thinks comes from scum and is loud about it, it seemed like he mostly wanted to make others vote Titus there.

Anyway I can't judge from games I have not been in.

[Bert]

Anyways time to get ready for the homecoming formal and go to bed. Take care, scum. <3

[Bert]

And now a vote. Thanks for scumclaiming.

VOTE: Bert

That's not a scumclaim. I don't have the energy to really be strong and assertive with you and step it up so I might survive against scum-Wisdom, but I'm gonna hang in there. And I'm pretty confident you're scum. Also, remember how I fooled you in 1482 when you thought I was 500% town. I had several scum games before that too. Well, notscience's scum game has improved (if you were in Cash Cabd, you might believe Cabd's explanation). There's nothing like being in the same game. Notscience made it through Stacking the Deck as well. You're dismissing him so easily.

I'm leaning Bert over Wisdom but my reads have been such shit this game I don't even know (See: Top 3 scumreads all flippd town)

If there's any chance you're town (doubt it), please I can emulate a lot of things as scum, but one thing I don't do is bring my personal life into the mix and be possible warned or modkilled. That's like my #1 thing I always try to avoid and I let my feelings seep in at the end of D1 and lashed out at Cabd (and even Sakura). Please if you're town read back and see that it was genuine. That was a flailing that I cannot emulate.

[Bert]

Ffery I think you're the remaining townie right now with the way notscience is siding with Wisdom.

You've been scum with me (most recently) and seen me as town (very recent as well), so like just be careful with your vote and at least give me the time of day for a few days. I'm pretty confident you're town and <notscience, Wisdom> is the team.

You can ask me anything you want, this applies to not just you, I can reply as spontaneous as you like, I am willing to do anything right now, (1) because it's LYLO and (2) I'm being deathtunneled by Wisdom-scum and if you think it's fun to watch me flail like this, then I don't know what to tell you - it's not fun

but I will eventually come close to freaking out if I get super stressed out at some point, so you've been warned

[Bert]

Bert because the way he's going about today is really weird, especially considering someone who loves to sheep leading his own wagon, as well as first votes in lylo have the habit of being scum vying for towncred.

You've also never been in LYLO with me.

I'm not vying for towncred, if you look at my scum LYLOs, I've NEVER cast the first vote. Ever.

I'm not vying for towncred. Did I cast the first vote in Mismatched?? Nope, I waited for Guyett to vote, then I voted later on. In Castle? Waited for Mantis and waynegg to vote. Etc. etc.

The only way you're not scum is ffery/ns and I just don't see that as possible.

Well, if you're town (which you're not), then who's my partner if I'm scum then? Ffery??? Why's Ffery scum other than by PoE??

[Bert]

notscience has just seemed town but

I don't know at this point. I could be wrong.

I want to see what he's going to do now.

notscience's scum game has improved. Not to the point of emulating his town game, these 1v1 and this frustration when he feels people don't understand his scum reads.

These are some things that just cannot be faked by scum that easily.

You say you don't know at this point, you could be wrong, and then the second part where you state definitively you know his scum game is not that good??

???

[Bert]

Selfmeta Bert, really?

Wisdom I'm not sure, I'd have to reread.

PERSONAL LIFE does NOT get into my game as scum. I don't care what else I've done this game, that is something I NEVER do as scum, I'd replace out if I did that as scum before I'd continue on with such dirty play.

What was the scum motivation behind my flailing at the end of D1??

[Bert]

Bert I don't know how to apply Mismatched to this situation because you were in no danger of being bandwagoned on the final day when we were at 3-2. You were mostly townread by town players. Morph-me was far more likely to be wagoned.

It's not me!!! Going after Cabd like that when he can read me so well. That's crazy!!!

I was in danger of being bandwagoned in Castle!!! Like I have never been actually lynched before as scum, and there's a reason for that. Also you know me you know I know what people claim and you know I like to go after PRs in games, then threats, GM would never ever ever ever go when she can't read me, doesn't know my game well, so on adn so forth, and CLAIMED VT first and foremost

Cabd would be gone before the time of day on Day 2, it's not even funny with all his notebook and stuff, and this is all WIFOM but I'm reaching out to YOU because I think you're town and the other two are bullscum and it doesn't matter what I do now but Iw ill go crazy

if you want me to go crazy I will go crazy, all for you darling!!!

And I'm using Mismatched as an example because I don't care if this is self-meta so go away notscience but seriously

SERIOUSLY making the first move in LYLO Nacho always taught me as scum is VERY VERY BAD AND LIKELY TO MAKE PEOPLE PARANOID

And yet I did it in a heartbeat in the heast of the moment

because the way Wisdom went after me REEKS OF SCUM

[Bert]

Ok there's at least 1 scum guaranteed among Bert/Wisdom, otherwise there would've been a quickhammer for a win. Gonna actually read the pages were you were discussing now. (And yes, at least, coz i know wisdom is capable of busing his buddy)

We're going to lose because I freaked out D1 like this and you thought i was crazy and I killed your townread on me. Just saying.

But I still stand by that my personal IRL issues got into this game and I'm not that terrible of a person to put you all through that as scum.

[Bert]

Oh god I hate LYLO.

This comes off so sincere. Bert if you are playing me with this you're going on my paranoia forever list with you-know-who.

Like I am reaching out to you because I feel like I have given my BEST town effort. Like 500 popcorn level of effort. And you know what happened in the end of Popcorn??

Mara-scum went after me after I started going after her. That was a terrible time of day. I freaked out that game, and I gave 150% Day 1 here because I was IN IT TO WIN IT. You followed that game so this is relevant here. notscience and wisdom were in that game.

I am trying to be as spontaneous as possible because I think that is my only chance to combat all the existing paranoia about me. Some things I juts cannot emulate as scum and this is one of those things. Everyone's scum game has a hole. And I NEED you and Sakura to think I'm town. Like that's my only chance to keep us in this game.

I offer you every single quick answer you can get, hours of time to talk, I have nothing eles to offer other than that. Anything you want, you want showdowns, you ask me to pick posts apart, I will do everything and show you what cannot be faked.

Like I HAVE to step it up, LYLO is the time to do that, there's no sitting back, hoping I'm doing well enough to help everyone.

I KNOW Wisdom is scum now since there's no hammer and ns and both you are here.

So wisdom is scum. I can talk to him like a TRUE 100% scum person he is.

[Bert]

This reads like you did it on purpose exactly because you knew scum wouldn't do it.

And you're frustrated because it didn't work.

This is such BS!!!! I know you're scum now, so I understand why you think it's fine to tunnel me like this but whatever.

I did NOT do this on purpose!!!!!! Plain and simple. I did not.

And you insisting I'm scum just like that.

Yeah, I know you're scum now. YEAH WHAT NOW. Everything I say is BS, everything I say is misrepped, that is how it goes isn't it. that is the name of the game and what you do

I'm not frustrated because something you said I was trying to do didn't work,

I'm gonna prove I'm more town than you and just watch me. yall can ask me WHATEVER YOU WANT

WHATEVER YOU WANT and I will I will answer them fast, spontaneous, as truthful as possible, and you will see it. I may sound like broomhead did in 1462 (yall dont get the reference) but this is a reachout to ALL TOWNIES out there

[Bert]

I'm not you, and you can come up with examples from your own

There are examples of what everyone has done in their playbook and their arsenal

your using your own example to apply to me, it does not work that way I'm sorry to say

I understand everyone's paranoia on me (especially town's)

but at this point it's up to Ffery and Sakura to decide if I'm scum, not you and notscience's. Since you two are scum I'm 99.9999% sure right now. I'm kicking myself for going with Wisdom yesterday but Cabd paranoia was just too much, good job you got me yesterday

Good thing is both of them ahve seen me as scum in my last scumgame and they know me as town, so if there's any chance we can move this onto LYLO, I have to do everything in my power to will myself onto the next day.

I am against a strong threat in Wisdom you're a strong player, I have to step it up here and do me, do it right and have confidence that my town game is transparent enoguh and all of this hullabaloo I'm posting

I'm giving it 150% baby, eat that, scumbag!

[Bert]

Bert, you know that in Mismatched you and I passed up on the first opportunity to hammer VA, grabbed the towncred and waited for a point in the game where the town-on-town vote was likely to stay put for a while.

Why are you discounting that as a possibility here?

It's possible, but I juts don't believe you to be scum. I really don't.

I'm sorry gut feels that way. And if Wisdom's somehow in hell not scum (not possible the way he's going after me), I don't care I'm just so onto him nothign will change that.

It's something that's intuitive I can't explain ti to you. I know one of you and ns is scum.

I came into today knowing I woudl go after Wisdom and no matter what my gut is too strong with Cabd gone and the paranoia with no whre else to go

that plus Kaze being my only remaining of 4 confused reads on D1 and my only scumread I have had throughout the game with the exceptino of the end of D2

if not for that replacement Kaze would not be here now

[Bert]

IF Wisdom's somehow town, game's over and it's not possible I could ever let go of him, it's just not.

after the way he has tunneled me and made arguments that kinda ping?? and some are just stretching... I just can't see through how that kinda logic in LYLO is coming from town. I juts don't.

[Bert]

You're pretty skilled at scum, Bert, I'll give you that. But you won't convince anyone here.

see Wisdom is trying to bring me down and tell me nothing I do will work

You're pretty skilled at scum too, so what's your point

Yes I can convince people, you will not frustrate me scumbag

[Bert]

Well thisi s going around in circles now, 1850 and 1851 (1851 - you voted me after I voted you)

Since I gotta go to lunch now,

I just want to say that regardless of the outcome of today,

I am here also to prove that I don't always completely freak out as town when I'm engaged and under pressure,
so if I can stay not completely freaked out and not willing to run away (which i have done OK so far D3), then all in all this isn't all bad.

And if you win, good game and you did a great job replacing in. Sorry I just wanted to say that because I'm still ashamed of bringing IRL in.

And I want afterwards regardless of the outcome to be proud that I did not (ego-wise) give in and I did not back down. So I will do that much for myself here, what I failed to do in Popcorn. That's a reason I'm supposed to be here is what I'm saying. It's a chance to redeem myself. So far I'm doing ok so this isn't all bad, it proves that when I'm engaged whcih happens in like 10% of my games, that I don't always do this and bring myself to shame

trying to stay positive here Bert <333333

Love, Bert

[Bert]

^and if you make fun of that post or call it out, just do it and I don't really care at this point, I kinda expect it tbh

it's like desensitizing, it helps me I think for all the times I will be attacked until this day is over, and for the future it's helpful too, the better I can combat pressure from threats

[Bert]

you can say whatever you want but I'm not the kind of guy to bring in my IRL issues and use it against people as scum. I have a conscience, and you know when I roll scum I try to emulate my play best I can to give them a challenge to hunt.

But IRL issues I just cannot bring myself down to that level, I can't I would replace out before i ever did something as dirty as that. And Wisdom and ns I don't care if you bring me down for that. And that town flail D1 is as genuine as I can get, you had me no the ropes yall, I freaked out big time

Ffery and Sakura are my only chance now since they are town I believe that 100%

[Bert]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=31914

@Ffery this is the game where I was basically pleading with Falcon when he had the gun, and I also got fake-shot in that game as reaction test, but in the end of the game Cabd talks to us and tells Falcon how I was obvtown and he could tell I was town, yada yada yada. That's why I was so paranoid and so sure Cabd was scum, the way he talks as if he can read me easily.

Lucky was kinda obviously scum from an outside perspective fwiw.

I can ~usually~ tell when nacho is or is not faking sincerity, and or bert too; and their begging feirei to shoot them was legit. Given you were confirmed town, lucky was scum from POE

[Bert]

Add to that after Castle where

in dead QT where everyone was reading me as town, he was telling Mara stuff like:

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/crKsTBGcbEgA

like "Lol. Mara continues to be easily fooled I see." message 101

Mara: "I'm dying in Bert's townietowntownieness" message 106

Cabd 108: "Then the reports of your death were greatly overstated, mara."

Cabd read me like a book, or at least he claimed to, and yet here he goes after me. Then he gloats after the game about how he watched his gf die on N1 and that he followed the game because of that and knew I was scum.

And yet here he couldn't peg me as town, when he supposedly could in Micro popcorn 243, or Mini 1489.

[Bert]

Hmm. Now he continues appealing to ffery after I pointed it out. Maybe it's on purpose after all.

If you were town, you'd know this was on purpose. Yet you say "maybe"

lol....but you're scum, so....

and yet you say "maybe" and say you're town??

Ha, nice one

[Bert]

Cabd knew you are scum in that game when he made those QT posts

He told me in chat that my paranoia was super super super fake, post-game.

He also claimed to know tells that I can towntell or scumtell using, and even at the beginning of the game, he said I was town as fuck without stating why.

[Bert]

Bert is town as fuck so far, although he needs to learn to recognize drunkposting. He also replaced into a slot i townread.

This gave me the false impression that he could read me well, since I had just entered the game and he suddenly called me super town.

And then the later flip-flop and voting me just didn't make sense and made me really paranoid about him, sort of like Ffery-paranoia in 1415.

[Bert]

I feel like I'm being attacked for all of my posts, and some are being attacked for BS reasons. And now Wisdom is calling people who want to vote him stupid.

I already told you Wisdom that I brought IRL issues into this game, really personal stuff, and lashed out at Cabd with it, and I'm stil ashamed. If you think I'd do that as scum, I don't know what to tell you. Ivé said it time and time again that's super dirty play and I'd be blacklisted sitewide I know it

And I'd be lying if beneath my facade on D2 that I didn't waffle about Cabd, AtE really really gets to me and it's an effective tactic

I thought he was being manipulative and trying to manipulate Sakura and me with AtE since he knows how susceptible and how emotional touchy-feely I am

And part of it was big time just me not wanting to lose to Cabd and me knowing his reputation, and knowing that I could not live that down if he got by me because of AtE and that saved him and brought him to a perfect victory. The paranoia was beyond belief. And I tend to think Ffery's was legitimate too.

And notscience is just not receptive to anything today other than that I'm scum, and the interactinos with wisdom he's having are awkward.

[Bert]

How was he obvtown? He was literally asking to be lynched. The difference is that both me and ns went after him because we genuinely thought he's scum, but look at how Bert pushed his lynch after he saw there was support.

I thought he was scum too...

I thought everything thought he was conftown, or at least a decent amount of people did or so it seemed

and so I gave up and had Kaze and Cabd as people I'm most suspicious of

I had ffery and notsci as pretty town, and agi102 who I was suspicious of as a newb passed person had just claimed cop and confirmed sakura

Kaze and Cabd were what I had left, and Kaze appealed AtE to me on D1 but had been a scumread

Cabd's going after me made no sense D1 and we had a huge discnonect. If you look back I clearly thought Cabd was scummy as hell and I felt pretty good taht he would flip scum.

[Bert]

*I thought the majority thought he was conftown or not someone anyone was willing to lynch* so I was stuck in a pickle, and I wanted to lynch kaze over notscience or ffery. that's where i was

[Bert]

Bert, you know that in Mismatched you and I passed up on the first opportunity to hammer VA, grabbed the towncred and waited for a point in the game where the town-on-town vote was likely to stay put for a while.

Why are you discounting that as a possibility here?

This felt SO loose and relaxed
IT felt so natural the way she had the gumption to ask me that why I'm not discounting that, whereas in Mismatched she did not make any comments like this when people were talking about how Ffery and I in 231 could not be scum together since we didn't hammer Saki.

Very very town

[Bert]

Selfmeta Bert, really?

Wisdom I'm not sure, I'd have to reread.

Yeah, I'm not buying that answer from Bert.

@Wis, I'm at Bert>Ffery=You

Bert because the way he's going about today is really weird, especially considering someone who loves to sheep leading his own wagon, as well as first votes in lylo have the habit of being scum vying for towncred.

Ffery=you because my reads have been so off this game I literally have fuckall

Oh and Sakura's still the godfather

I'm leaning Bert over Wisdom but my reads have been such shit this game I don't even know (See: Top 3 scumreads all flippd town)

And notscience's reads have felt so rigid this game, no flip flopping none of that knee jerk type

he has played very very well because he has fooled me, but I see Ffery as town and the way he isn't even trying to figure out me and is just *tunneled* on me like hell on earth, in LYLO

with Wisdom, who isn't a shabby player by ANY stretch of the imagination

like in my last game with notscience in 532, notscience's reads changed throughout the game, they followed a trajectory, from wanting the hammer on Wake88 on page 5 or 6, to wanting to vote Nacho and kill him, then going after Aptil, there was this progression is all I'm saying

this HEY VOTE CABD VOTE TSO thing just isn't right

[Bert]

hi my name is bert and I am super exhausted but I am willing to talk with anyone who may be here <3

if not, I'll be talking to ghosts all night...

[Bert]

Ffery's 1912 reads as very genuine, especially with how she reasons how Wisdom is just stamping "you are scum" onto his replies with me and not really listening to what I have to say anyway.

[Bert]

Oh hey! I just got back from that dance lol

Hope your work's going well! What do you wanna talk about or what do you want me to look at

[Bert]

No I haven't, except a very brief skim of notscience's posts. What do you suggest I look for specifically in it? Or do you want me to look broadly

[Bert]

Yay Ffery's drunk. <3

I'll go look for similarities

[Bert]

I skimmed notscience's iso, don't have the stamina to read/skim through that game fresh. I don't see anything that sticks out. It looks kinda spammy and full of short posts, very curt replies.

[Bert]

You're still not seeing this from scum PoV. It's far more important to Cabd to get the town cred that he got from that gambit (especially if he is the roleblocker) AND learn who the actual PRs are (if someone counterclaimed him, he could just argue he was gambitting, like he did when he dropped the gambit) than it is to simply push a lynch on you which wasn't even guaranteed to succeed. Even more so if the person he uses the gambit on is someone he can manipulate.

Oh nvm I got what you're saying. Still, how do you find it more likely that he would push you over doing a gambit that not only would give him strong towncred, but also help him figure out the actual PRs?

How do you not see it? They roleblocked you and he knew you're bluffing. It's exactly the kind of chance a scum player like cabd needed.

But the gambit thing making him "conftown" is what pings

It doesn't make him conftown at all. Think a little, there was a way to actually

know

that Sakura was not telling the truth about being a cop.

I keep thinking back to those above quotes I just quoted. He was so persuasive with that. And I thought it was because Cabd thought Sakura was a tracker and that was why Cabd as scum would do the fakecrumb or fakeclaim of cop.

And then I remember Wisdom telling me that "not exactly, but you get the picture"

Yeah, I thought Sakura was breadcrumbing "tracker" with the blatant "Cabd's innocent until proven guilty" comments. That makes sense now that I think about it, if Cabd's scum and knows there's no tracker...hence the boldness to claim cop...aha

Not exactly. But you have the right idea.

I feel like an idiot because I still don't understand Wisdom's thought processes there, although I thought I got the gist of what he was saying, I couldn't understand it on a non-intuitive level.

[Bert]

What I mean is Cabd knew there was no tracker and thus Sakura was not a tracker and thus Cabd-scum was safe to fakeclaim cop in order to gain towncred, but the logic doesn't really make sense. That was my initial revelation.

Basically, Cabd knows that there is no tracker and therefore Sakura's statement of "innocent until proven guilty" makes no sense for a real tracker due to him knowing the tracker setup is not possible, so he claims cop to get towncred. (sorry I'm confusing y'all I think).

My logic was really bad, though. And I still don't understand.

[Bert]

However I do agree that you shouldn't vote tonight.

Yup I agree. Sakura won't be here tomorrow most likely

He didnt claim cop to get towncred, he thought I was a cop with an inno on him,

yeah, it was just weird with how you said "innocent until proven guilty," that's all

[Bert]

I seriously seriously thought that was a tracker crumb. Because with 2 scum, a track neg result is not conclusive.

Yeah, exactly.

The innocent until proven guilty was an inference to

my plan on WKing him through D2 as well, and doing NKA with N1 and N2 together, and then i could decide whether he was town or not, and if i was NK'd then you could have concluded what I was going for

, the fact that he mistook my read for a cop crumb is what made him super town for me.

this never crossed my mind :/

[Bert]

Don't think about being wrong, think about being logical,

if we're wrong while being logical then scum played a good scum game, and we wouldn't have found them out without being lucky.

However I do agree that you shouldn't vote tonight.

I'd be really surprised if Ffery were to flip scum, her posts are incredible sincere and helpful. Meh.

notscience's reactions have been more fake-sounding and also more easily transferable between alignments, especially going into today. and the rigid reads too

It's one of those games where if Ffery's scum, it's just like BRAVO well done...

[Bert]

I guess what I'm trying to say is I'm not a very logical-based player, or rather sometimes I see people being really logical and hard to attack, and then they turn up scum. Nvm.

[Bert]

you were mentioned in that prolific player thread that ABR started up

[Bert]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=32262

I'm assuming this is legal as it's not even a game thread.

[Bert]

if it's not, sowwwwwwy <3333333

[Bert]

not sure

[Bert]

means you're really productive? there used to be an award on here many years ago called Most Prolific Player, peacebringer who was in 1489 won that many years ago

[Bert]

I just thought of something. Wasn't Cabd reading Ffery as pretty town? I'm gonna go look back at that, as D1 he was busy and kept saying he would eventually put in the effort to figure out the "paranoid chic" or something.

I *think* Cabd put her in that town block that was being made, but I will check (cuz that mighta been Sakura).

[Bert]

if he read her as pretty town, then that makes me feel a bit better, although he did say she fooled him before twice (I think??)

[Bert]

I mean had ffery speed wagoned me yesterday I'd have called her town as I went down and she probably knows that.

Fwiw ffery is probably town because she easily could have led bert on a crusade against me D1 in the end there and it would have gone through. Her play today however has to ignore that since she figured out ~things~ and couldn't push me if she wanted to as scum.

What's wrong, notsci? Freaking out that all your mislynch shots just vanished into a plume of smoke?

Guess so.

Kthnx bai

VOTE: notsci

[Bert]

I'm sorry I didn't mean for the last two quotes to both get in, I was saving those last two for myself.

[Bert]

Yeah, I'm not buying that answer from Bert.

@Wis, I'm at Bert>Ffery=You

Bert because the way he's going about today is really weird, especially considering someone who loves to sheep leading his own wagon, as well as first votes in lylo have the habit of being scum vying for towncred.

Ffery=you because my reads have been so off this game I literally have fuckall

Oh and Sakura's still the godfather

1) I said on d1 (I'll find this when I'm on a computer tomorrow) that I've been working on leading my own wagons since as a sheep if I'm being manipulated by scum playing well, then I add lots of swing to wagons

2) why is wisdom the most townie other than sakura?

[Bert]

Sleep time, no ones here. See y'all tomorrow!

[Bert]

I am awake now and just had lunch yay me who wants to talk about foodies

actually no, back to the game.

BOOM BOOM POWA

Speaking of motivations, Wisdom is reminding me of how advertisers try to get people in the long run to buy their shit. Well, I don't buy his shit right now. And I ain't gonna. Lalalalala

lalalalalala that's me with my ears wifom wifom wifom repeat after me lol

Ffery I'm more worried about you being scum over notscience (But it's strictly paranoia, I do think notscience is scum).

so since my mind is clear and headache hasn't approached yet what would you all like to ask me right now <3

[Bert]

And I was joking, I am listening to y'all btw, and Ffery seems really town today. Especially with the:

"I feel pretty damn sure i'm right" - I don't see that assertiveness from her, and it came from her and I was impressed by it's town soundingness

[Bert]

I feel like there will be a tomorrow, but I'm not looking forward to it. If you're town, you won't be the only one dragging around tons of paranoia.

for the record, your paranoia about Cabd looked real as heck

so I *think* you're town

notscience's posts today aren't that tunnely, they're actually kinda passive, that's how it feels...

you know like how I'm scum, sometimes I get really tight? well you can tell sort of from ns's tone that he feels tense/tight/not relaxed

idk if that makes sense, tell me if it doesn't

[Bert]

how when I'm scum*

it's like in LYLO of Castle you can tell my nervous jitters

well I feel ns's jitters itnuitively (I know this is BS, but whatever Wisdom juts go ahead and attack me)

<3

[Bert]

oh and ffery your "this post was so sincere. if you're pulling thsi one on me, you're going on my paranoia lsit with you-know who"

that rang so freakin sincere, that post of yours. like...ugh im in deep trouble if youre scum basically cuz i aint ever voting u

[Bert]

And now, when you know that your lynch is all but sealed with my intent,

you switch tactics from ending the game today to positioning your team for tomorrow.

Your play has been way too tactical for it to be coming from a town-trying-to-figure-things-out perspective.

and now it's like he's spreading wifom by attacking ffery (you) a lot, and also starting to interact (semi-distance) from ns more

and then basically nailed the coffin shut with your claim. Sakura is absolutely right that scum would know if there's a doc in this setup once agi claimed doc.

this is spot on with the "nail the coffin shut" I got that impression too, with "I'm doc, now go vote cabd now ffs" type manner

[Bert]

I'm biased cuz I know he's spreading WIFOM, but seriously WIFOM does mess with my head once I know someone's scum so it's hard for me to exercise selective listening... and stay unbiased

[Bert]

I don't really see why you're using Ffery's passiveness against her. The "passive reading/thinking" thing had me read her as scum in 1415, and you having more experience than I do with her, should know that it's not alignment indicative.

She took all the time in the world to find out what was going on and sort things out, and I pressured her and created a disconnect and that cost us that Day 3. She didn't even vote till the very end when she was about to be lynched, even after announcing scumreads in JasonWazza very early on.

[Bert]

What I'm saying is that her waiting very long to wait to hammer isn't a scumtell for her. She hasn't ever struck me as a rushy player, not one to be influenced to make speedy decisions which might lead to regret later for haste.

[Bert]

Why claim if you can sway the lynch off you without claiming? You didn't have to claim in order to dismantle you wagon. You had to claim in order to rush Cabd's lynch through.

Exactly. It feels just like Majiffy pressuring me to mislynch SalmonellaDoctor in Open 527 Hard Boiled. "why isn't SD dead yet, someone hammer" and hours later "SD's scum, what are we waiting for"

except this time he wanted to accelerate the lynch by claiming and going on with "now vote cabd ffs."

cannot believe the stupidity of this town.

I'm the fucking doctor, do you still not get it? I know they have a roleblocker.

Fucking lynch Cabd before he manages to convince the town, he is capable of it.

cannot believe the stupidity of this town.

I'm the fucking doctor, do you still not get it? I know they have a roleblocker.

Fucking lynch Cabd before he manages to convince the town, he is capable of it.

[Bert]

So you get disengaged at LyLo?

(1) You're not stepping it up today, rather you're taking a step back

(2) You're just talking around me sorta, just making general comments about who's scum, your reads don't seem to be well-thought out. And talking as if Sakura won't change her mind, so therefore you shouldn't try, is such a cop-out.

(3) If you think there's any chance your reads are wrong or you want to firm your reads up, now is the time to be prodding around in the chance that there is a LYLO.

That's the impression I get from you, and your answers to Wisdom and others aren't very definitive, not much conviction. Have a headache now so can't skim now, but will be back late tonight as usual to talk to everyone.

[Bert]

So you get disengaged at LyLo?

Answer this, ns. And "remorse for post-game ns" is not a valid excuse

Look at it from my perspective and consider that I might be town, despite you thinking I'm scum.

I am trying to make sure my read on ffery is right and that she is really town, and I'm REALLY REALLY confident in that read. Wouldn't I want YOU to try to step it up today so I can have a better grasp of your motivations/play through your Day 3 (LYLO!) play? Or rather, if you're town and you see Ffery being universally read, why are you being so passive and just sitting around waiting for things to come to you and pressure to come to you?

That's what I'm trying to convey.

[Bert]

^both 2032 and 2033 are directed at notscience, btw.

[Bert]

hobby

I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here, but how does remorse factor into you disengaging in LYLO? Help me understand that?

[Bert]

You can view my Wiki where it says why I am here.

But really, it's because I get to experience being a different persona than I am in real life and I think that's really cool.

[Bert]

Either way I don't really understand why you're sitting back sorta, you're just sort of waiting to see what decisions other people make, that's just how it feels

[Bert]

EBWOP: seeing where the tide is turning, etc.

[Bert]

It's a byproduct of probably luck and due to other town players doing a great job and me not hindering them too much.

And notscience your play reminds me of my own scumplay in Castle Day 3 where I sat all day on the fence and never placed real emphasis on my reads. My read on who was scum between Desp and Mantis wasn't made with much conviction, and eventually Mantis did catch on.

That's what bothers me right now. We both have kinda spammy styles, and you had a strong start in this game with regard to playing up your town meta, and then when LYLO comes all of a sudden it's like you're not making quite the impact you once were

sorry if that makes bad sense

[Bert]

How are you in the dark? And yes, for fun

I did not call you a jerk

and what do you mean with your last question, I don't understand what you're trying to get at

HEY MY READS have been WRONG This game except for Kaze, and I even LET GO of my vote on Kaze/Wisdom D2. So I've been wrong on 3 out of my 4 "confused" reads

keep plugging along if you're town, seriously, we all are wrong sometimes and just play your game

[Bert]

To add in with this- Look at the dead QT of Syry's open and maf QT of Cabd's mini. That'll help clear it up.

Clear WHAT up? I can't just "read" that easily, tell me the gist of it and I will skim later when I get the chance to

I don't rememberm uch about you in the QT of Syry's open, but Cabd's mini you were scum...

[Bert]

OK reads list please notscience

in order

I answered questions of yours and I am still answering yours

mine is:

Wisdom scum


SCUM
Wisdom (confscum to me)
notscience
ffery
Sakura (conftown)
TOWN

and say why too please, if you want to start being helpful, now's the time

[Bert]

you will not sit on the fence anymore, either you take a side or stop using some BS excuses about why you don't wanna scumhunt today

[Bert]

Allow me to sum it up for you.

Dead QT of Syry's game, I get called a shit player.

In the mafia QT, I reference the needing a win.

Bert, you aren't consistently off like me. You don't get consistently voted for bullshit reasons, you don't get the lylo fuckups I've had.

I'm gonna say something that Mollie tells me when I get this way

TAKE OFF THE NEGATIVE LENS

In Syry's game, Mara had harsh words for me in QT like "Nacho can do w/e the fuck he wants with Bert, he's not a threat"

Or Popcorn where she was like "Bert's not too good at scumhunting anad gets antitown as fuck quickly D1"

We all get mislynched, heck even Ffery got mislynched in 1415. My reads are often off, ask Sakura LOL my gut reads.

What does "needing a win" mean to you in your reference ? Like I said I will look at the QT later

So why are you not trying this LYLO, or if you're scum keep doing this and evading scumhunting

[Bert]

And ns, you have not gotten voted much in this game, players here are familiar with your play and meta, what is hindering your progressions??

and I'm no scumhunter either btw, and just because you don't think you "make cases" doesn't mean you don't contribute, we have been in many games together and I have seen you post with much more conviction than this and be right

let me see, GOODMORNING 514 Masons? Titus 513?? Just to name a few... Shooting Mara in Popcorn? Do I need to go on...

[Bert]

reads please??

/in before you say you gotta re-read or i need to answer more questions

OK reads list please notscience

in order

I answered questions of yours and I am still answering yours

mine is:

Wisdom scum


SCUM
Wisdom (confscum to me)
notscience
ffery
Sakura (conftown)
TOWN

and say why too please, if you want to start being helpful, now's the time

[Bert]

This sounds like sincere demotivation.

I don't think demotivation is alignment indicative, though. :/

I'm a sucker for sincerity.

It's not, I've used how my sucking is an excuse to not do much in prior scumgames. I can grab lots of examples from other players too

The demotivation part may be sincere, but it's not alignment indicative

[Bert]

I actually know I'll be in most LYLOs as either town or scum. It's pretty funny (town, not a threat, scum - expected to be there because as town not at threat)...

I have to give me 150% now as town in LYLO because of my scumgames.

[Bert]

I get paranoid about people who are universal town in LYLO, but then I remember games like Tammy in Hard Boiled which balance out gmes like 501 Stacking the Deck where Tammy and Tierce were in LYLO and I was spectating

and I also remember a few of my own games where people gave me free passes

that's why there's a tinge of paranoia about you, but I don't see myself voting for you at all

notscience doesn't appear to be stepping it up, I've pulled the demotivational card in my scumgames (1418 newbie, 1482 castle, 1462 serra's game especially) it's crazy how much I have done it so yeah it doesn't influence me at all what ns's doing it just makes me more concerned

[Bert]

Ffery and sakura I guess since there's paranoia about me

try to get me to type things that are harder to talk about, harder to emulate

harder for me to just type up if I'm scum

if that helps any

And Wisdom as town is probably no better than Cabd at reading me (heck Cabd keeps a notebook), so Wisdom being so sure about me in LYLO was a huge red flag - it was like a barrage of attacks and so I get so sure about him being scum and then I vote him, that's what happened

Even Nacho has trouble reading me, so Wisdom with that conviction when I have been quite transparent (including freakouts that heck brought IRL in which never happens)

that boggles me, I expect some paranoia, not just going from Bert's likely scum to BERT'S SCUM!

[Bert]

you keep evading my reads request. I'm sad and it just increases my suspicion of you...

Do you think Wisdom's scum, then?

Where is your friends list?? I still like Mara btw, she rocks, it's just in scum QT it's competitive, people give honest evaluations and that's what mine is

What do you mean you changed your playstyle after 527? You mean after the D1 speedlynch? Scum was part of your wagon btw, iirc

[Bert]

I don't see a friends list of yours, this is not Facebook....

I have a friends list but I don't think it's public...

just because someone's a jerk doesn't mean you don't keep going, sorry I don't want to sound condescending but

you're in this game, just play it anyway? we're in lylo for real

[Bert]

If I count the number of times I have been called retarded/stupid through the heat of the game (many, many times) and gave myself a nickel for each time that happened, I'd have like 10 dollars now seriously

[Bert]

tbh I'm worried I underestimate you.

People have underestimated me a lot. And I'm worried I underestimate your scumgame and how you adapt.

There are some things I can't emulate. Some of this stuff I'm typing, these barrages of half-emotion/half-logic stuff, a lot of that I can't bring on in spurts like this

and give so much of this

and that kind of fencesitting I did on D1 + D2, I would psyche myself out as scum if I kept doing that, it would make me so paranoid about being caught

I'm sorry for self-metaing but what I'm trying to say is

there are things I Can't emulate

just like Tammy's game, her scumgame is darn good I can't tell a thing, but she says there are things she can't emulate, and Nacho agrees

there's a reason for that

you gotta keep prodding me if you're town and see what you get and if it feels genuine, same case as 1415

[Bert]

But yeah it's funny we're both worried about each other like this. But you were paranoid in 1415 that my paranoia about you was fake. Or half-convinced, that's the word you used.

So that's why there's still a little bit remaining, although I understand that N2 kill HAD to be a PR, so that's why obvtown you still is here. That's what I tell myself when Tammy's in the game on D3 in Syry's game. That N2 and N1 were due to PR kills, and that didn't mean strong players were playing well as scum and making it far.