Titus v. Alisae (endgame)

[Flavor Leaf]

That’ll be a hell yeah they are

[Flavor Leaf]

Hokey pokey, that’s what it’s all about, right? Not right. Not right. I’ve been thinking about that for a while now, why would the Hokey Pokey be what it’s all about? Then I really started looking into the words. You do the Hokey Pokey and you turn yourself around. Sometimes life’s a bitch, and then you die. Well, sometimes. Sometimes life’s a bitch, and you keep on living. Past mistakes are what they are, they’re in the past. The only thing you can do is you turn yourself around.

That’s what it’s all about.

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

[Flavor Leaf]

Nah, i chang3d my mind on you before you were ever interactin with me, don’t misrep.

[Flavor Leaf]

First

[Flavor Leaf]

Thus far OkaPoka/Sherlock through their comments towards me are town indicative.

Nope, but i found this post.

I also went on to call Sherlock scum right after too.

[Flavor Leaf]

Because this is I think the second time you've accused me of misrepping you and whenever I point out that post you just don't ever respond

Misrep

[Flavor Leaf]

Eh, it’s in my ISO explaining my flip on you.

It had nothing really to do with your posting moreso than Krazy’s.

Along with me going over my drafting spec

[Flavor Leaf]

And you’re bleeding scum read as scum for wrong reasons

[Flavor Leaf]

And you think ScumFL, year of 2019 alone won 10 scum games, would be that obvious about flip flopping?

[Flavor Leaf]

If i were scum, scum would have won by now

[Flavor Leaf]

If i were scum, scum would have won by now

[Flavor Leaf]

Maybe you’re just town with Flavor Fever

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m a little flavor, cute and loud

Here is my handle, here is my clout

[Flavor Leaf]

Shibooya shu shu shibooya role call

My name is Flavor

Yes, that’s my name

They call me Flavor

Cuz that’s my name!

[Flavor Leaf]

This HokeyPokey deadass just sheeped Sherlock and Myself before going to Sherlock wtf

VOTE: OkaPoka

[Flavor Leaf]

We’re actually only 1 vote away from becoming a major wagon tbh

My boy AaronFrost, aka the Hollowest of Knights, aka the Zotiest of Mights, is also voting HokeyPokey

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

[Flavor Leaf]

Oka and kerlock arent S/S

[Flavor Leaf]

Cuz he scum scummy pokimane

[Flavor Leaf]

You see scumMe would have read all those posts

[Flavor Leaf]

Hectic played against Scum Rick Fucking Dalton, who’s 3-0 in win/record btw, as is Pretentious.

ScumMe don’t gotta leave out anything and will still get you lynched.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't understand why you feel the need to make posts that are absolutely meaningless to everybody

You're really not helping the game be any more readable

Oh, it will...it will, shark bait hoo ha haw.

[Flavor Leaf]

And we should have had a lynch 70 pages ago, we should be in day 3 by now

[Flavor Leaf]

3 years ago was my FL year, and I was rock in’ games at that time.

Maybe like 5 years ago.

I also NEVER got mislynched 3 years ago, I went 2+ years not, and I also had a 2+year scum undefeated streak, lost Magical Stories team mafia because fuck Dreaming God, and then went on another year and a half without losing.

So :shrug:

[Flavor Leaf]

And because I’M the one making this game unreadable :hardyharharhar: :LOLOLOLOLOL:

[Flavor Leaf]

And you know what else was evident around that time?

I got obvtown read almost every single town read game of mine because people didn’t realize my scum game was so prolific, even though I’ve had a strong scum game since my first scum game on site in 2014.

:shrug:

Gotta get rid of the BoP somehow

[Flavor Leaf]

Frankly, we’re still on Day 1, and my issue lately has been me actually trying to play the game Pre Day 3, which a lot of times I just didn’t care to. I used to have an even more presence of hammer out of nowhere even if it was my strongest town read, and the game was better off for it.

[Flavor Leaf]

It feels so right to be wrong, baby

[Flavor Leaf]

But I’m the one making this 100 page game unreadable even though this day phase should have ended prior to me even starting to play this game

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Maki

[Flavor Leaf]

Alt slip, my bad

[Flavor Leaf]

Imma start faking claiming as town again. Caught my scum with flies than honey

[Flavor Leaf]

I already have fine early game reads. And i have super fine late game reads.

It’s the early mid game, and that’s only because people won’t end days and go 100 pages

[Flavor Leaf]

Penguin should town read me too. I’m one of y’alls last chances at surviving this day phase

[Flavor Leaf]

Y’all seen the office? Consider me that Christmas episode where Michael just dgaf anymore

[Flavor Leaf]

Ankamius is avoiding the main wagons, just saying

[Flavor Leaf]

Aaron and I are masons so it’s okay

[Flavor Leaf]

I actually don’t feel that it’s bad to full claim masons as masons, and we’ve been talking about it for a while.

Hectic, AF, Myself are masons.

I feel that should have been obvious by now. Oka’s like near lock scum in that

[Flavor Leaf]

Aaron and I are masons so it’s okay

Smh why

I technically claimed it a long time ago, but people seemed to want to push us again.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like I said, I’m of the philosophy that getting the confirmed town late into a day phase allows you to read gamestate way better.

Lynch in the people who were coming at us. Okapoka

[Flavor Leaf]

nice meme why would titus pick that

She probably picked more names.

Having me as a mason means you don’t have to read me.

Also, AaronFrost, Titus, and I recently won a scum game together.

[Flavor Leaf]

you three are 100% not mason

You’re right, we’re not. Let’s move on from this conversation on that note.

VOTE: Okapoka

[Flavor Leaf]

Aaron and I are masons so it’s okay

gonna have to stop you there Oka
2 of those are masons

yeah Sherlock
and idk
Aaron's pocketing argument
your interactions with Ank
the dismissal of the Aaron case when i see nothing to warrant that from my ISO
and your overall tone/playstyle has just felt... off
compared to you on your alts

This is actually pretty hilarious, and I probably can’t fake joke real claim masons anymore. We’re just outed on this

[Flavor Leaf]

titus claimed 1-shot investigative

Right. That’s good. Believe that.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, AaronFrost, Titus, and I recently won a scum game together.

can you link that game?

-S

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=80850

[Flavor Leaf]

its not like ill actually ever believe that claim and its also not like flavor will ever stop pushing me

Shows how much you know!

[Flavor Leaf]

Omgus is still stupid even from a mason.

You’re an OMGUS!

VOTE: Maki

[Flavor Leaf]

lul see what Titus is saying Leafy

Yeah, yeah

[Flavor Leaf]

give Bitmap a few days.

You don’t have to catch him Day 1 if he’s scum. Sometimes it’s just not possible to catch people day 1, especially in a game that likely has team cohesion.

[Flavor Leaf]

Cuz he’s silly town

[Flavor Leaf]

Let’s lynch Maki and end the day phase

[Flavor Leaf]

Nah Maki

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m not moving off of Maki/Espeonage/Okapoka

[Flavor Leaf]

i said Krazy doesn’t get ran up in a game that forces team cohesion based on the leaders to L-2

[Flavor Leaf]

Fire is NAI. He’d have had the fire if i pushed him in that game

[Flavor Leaf]

What’s the 3rd wagon

[Flavor Leaf]

And just like that, i am 100% against an Amrun lynch

[Flavor Leaf]

Subject: Large Normal 223 | New Beginnings | GAME OVER

As much as I'd love for this to be true, I think this is town!Garmr. From what I can gather looking at his meta, town!Garmr does stupid shit like this all the time.

Fuck Aaron would metatowncase someone as scum

still his argument here was at least a bit better? Like that's vague, here he linked a specific game and stuck to the argument.

I guess I'm actually overvaluing his defense of Dunn a little though.

I still like him as town, I was not expecting to find a post like this in his scum play tho tbh. Still town tho. His scumrange is just wider than I realized

-S

He’s a mason.

Keep in mind, I was his scum partner and that was his first scum victory

He did really well, though, so yeah, bigger scum range

[Flavor Leaf]

If i lynched you and you flipped town, i doubt I’d get lynched tomorrow

[Flavor Leaf]

Amrun’s town, Sherlock town

[Flavor Leaf]

Don’t vote TSE, they’re obv town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Alisae been trying to get TSE slot to seem like they’re scum bussing TSE for lulls, but it TSE isn’t scum here

[Flavor Leaf]

TSE is literally like the most mislynchable person ever stop and think before a day 1 lynch on someone like that.

[Flavor Leaf]

oh no
I'm actually trying to townspew TSE

Which scum spews TSE, which townspews TSE.

[Flavor Leaf]

Which scum spews them which town spews them, yes. I see what you’re doing, TSE’s town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Subject: Large Normal 223 | New Beginnings | GAME OVER

As much as I'd love for this to be true, I think this is town!Garmr. From what I can gather looking at his meta, town!Garmr does stupid shit like this all the time.

Fuck Aaron would metatowncase someone as scum

still his argument here was at least a bit better? Like that's vague, here he linked a specific game and stuck to the argument.

I guess I'm actually overvaluing his defense of Dunn a little though.

I still like him as town, I was not expecting to find a post like this in his scum play tho tbh. Still town tho. His scumrange is just wider than I realized

-S

Context if relevant, Aaron thought Garmr was our traitor. We all did. So he wasn't really towncasing town fhpov.

Oh yeah, Gobbledygook was scum with us here, but I forget about that because he was our actual traitor, and we killed him real early on.

[Flavor Leaf]

Amrun/Sherlock counter wagons imply they’re town.

I recently was able to correctly indenting a town Maria game and wagon, and tried stopping her wagon, but couldn’t. This is not that

[Flavor Leaf]

Please lynch Maki

[Flavor Leaf]

What kinda mod puts 4 modifiers on one role

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m happy with this wagon, let’s end this day phase.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hi back I’m dad I’m dad i back

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, Sherlock, you pushing the wagon probably makes it less likely to happen.

I got this.

Vote Maki everyone

[Flavor Leaf]

I declare that the next vote on Maki is L-1

[Flavor Leaf]

Now hammmmmmmeerrrrr!!!!!!!!!!! I’m getting excited

[Flavor Leaf]

Man, does this mean I gotta stop lurking? Why the fuck are we even at L-2?

Sherlock decided to hard push you, no one else was. No one else supported. Ignore the rest of the wagon.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m actually solid with the entirety of the wagon tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

Alisae, tell your goons to vote and end the day

[Flavor Leaf]

Hectic/Oka, interesting.

Hectic is town, Oka is a Maki partner.

[Flavor Leaf]

There’s actually been a hard mason claim

[Flavor Leaf]

The only Leaf that brings the Beef

[Flavor Leaf]

Even more reason to use it

[Flavor Leaf]

Hammer

[Flavor Leaf]

I like to think of this game as either Titus wins or Alisae wins.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hammer

-S

[Flavor Leaf]

The general would like to mourn the death of Maki & Kaito
they were valiant soldier who didn't really get the chance to fight back
their sacrafice won't be in vain

So what I’m hearing, is I hyper analyze sociopathically draft pick specc’d you.

[Flavor Leaf]

Guys, I caught Maki hard.

Follow my draft picks.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m also VLA until Monday

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

TrueSoulEnergy
Pine
Flavor Leaf
Hectic
OkaPoka
Espeonage
Bitmap
Maki and Kaito (hydra of Maki Harukawa & Kaito Momota)
Sherlock and Watson (hydra of PenguinPower & Krazy)
Frozen Angel
Chemist1422
AaronFrost
Spiffeh
gobbledygook
Ankamius
Reasonably Rational (hydra of Cerberus v666 and Drixx)
Amrun

Let’s look at this list? Who would you state are the scum heavies, picks by Alisae? By heavy, I mean the slot to be able to captain a scum team and maneuver their way around the majority of players, which is why I won’t have Bitmap or the RR hydra, even though I think they’re likely strong or capable scum players.

I would say:
Pine
FL
Maria/Dunn hydra (keep in mind, Alisae nomm’d Dunn for Rising Star)
Sherlock and Watson
Ankamius

There is absolutely zero chance that there isn’t scum within this list. I know I’m town, and you can deduct Alisae wouldn’t ever pick me here (you don’t have to believe it, but e knows it’s true)

So that leaves

Pine
Maria/Dunn hydra
Krazy/PP hydra
Ankamius.

Obviously you can’t just pick all heavies, that’s too many cooks in the kitchen, so it would be balanced out between strong supporting scum players, and a likely “no one would ever expect this!!!”

Does anybody disagree with this heavy list?

Secondary Scum List second in commands

Espeonage
Bitmap
Gobbledygook
Reasonably Rational

Under the radar coast be there scum picks
Hectic
Okapoka
AaronFrost
Frozen Angel
Spiffeh


Don’t really see Alisae picking unless having to choose between two of em specifically
TrueSoulEnergy
Chemist
Amrun

If this is the topic of conversation for the evening I'm tagging in Kaito and going to bed.

yeah the way he's doing it seems kinda passive-aggressive and uncool

I didn't realize boon was gonna neg half the player list when I poked the boon fire

-S

Combine that with the fact if I have to deal with people calling X town and Y scum for 'what ali would do' I'm going to actively ignore it because it's just stupid. Set up spec is stupid pick drafting is stupid. Let's just play mafia. Ugh.

I actually highly disagree with the drafting being bad, because Alisae gets to post in this game, and thus is readable.

This is my starting ground, building my base for me to eventually solve, and I’m showing my work.

Atm, I don’t think Ankamius is the 1 to have been drafted out of the 4.

One of Krazy hydra/Ankamius, but exactly one of them.

You're kinda looking at this the wrong way though

Duck and SS get to pick

If Ali goes first and does a top priority heavy that isn't Ank, then Duck could very easily double on us for town

Which is precisely why you're basically just looking at the pick logic totally wrong, you're over-prioritizing what is actually an incredibly difficult puzzle to analyze. Focus on play, Boon, before you actually make me want to policy lynch you for real Like half of what you've said since you stopped actually solving is like pure cancer

-S

So? I post a lot. It’s not like I don’t analyze play whilst all this.

I also think my posting is fantastic for reactions.

We’ll see.

If I’m right, like I usually am when people push at me, at least 2/3 partially, you can ask PenguinPower on my solve capabilities at the expense of some minor casualties.

And this is a solid base of the puzzle. I found a good amount of puzzle pieces, and looking at em all before I start trying to piece it together.

I think one of the people who have posted against me tonight is scum, and almost exactly one of them.

I no longer town read OkaPoka either. Maki/Oka/Krazy slot have probably 1 maybe 2 scum within them, but more likely 1.

So far so good.

Maki was even calling my draft spec bad, so that gives it more credibility now.

[Flavor Leaf]

Chemist/Amrun/TSE - are lean towns based on what I said earlier. TSE even moreso.

Gobbledygook/Bitmap are town reads of mine based on their play and posts, and position in the gamestate.

Spiffeh/Espeonage/Frozen Angel I think probably have scum in them based on their place in this game mixed with the drafting process and my other reads.

Okapoka’s probably just scum, especially if Krazy is town.

RR, idk, null.

OkaPoka/Maki/Espeonage is my way too early scum team, with probably like Spiffeh/FA.

[Flavor Leaf]

OkaPoka/Espeonage/Frozen Angel

[Flavor Leaf]

Okapoka
Espeonage
Maki
Ankamius

Then Spiffeh/RR/FA at a lower level is who keeps jumping out at me for the area to contain all the scum. Hmm...

[Flavor Leaf]

you're either 0/3 or 1/3

not very good options FL

People were saying this to me yesterday, and guess what?

We hit my first scum read

[Flavor Leaf]

And I’m really starting to think OkaPoka is scum, which would make me think Krazy is town, and possibly Ank and Maria/Dunn scum?

Interesting discredit Ank.

[Flavor Leaf]

imagine referencing posts from like 80 pages ago

Best way to catch scum tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

FL, have you read my most recent posts?

-Cerb

Yeah. I didn’t have a comment about it, but I took it in.

Not sure exactly what I think of it as a whole, but seems like solid analysis.

[Flavor Leaf]

lolllll

good luck ever catching scum!me then FL

If I just push you every game, I feel like I’d catch scum you then, what is this post?

[Flavor Leaf]

He's 1/3 cause somni is scum-somni

Boon would you like be the conductor and lead the party train on somni/fa-slot today so I don't have to type so much

-S

Who’s Somni?

I need some time to analyze gamestate, but just keep slingshotting me. I used your momentum to swing Maki through to lynch yesterday, couldn’t have done it without you.

[Flavor Leaf]

You can even have 60% of the cred, I’ll take 35

[Flavor Leaf]

He's 1/3 cause somni is scum-somni

Boon would you like be the conductor and lead the party train on somni/fa-slot today so I don't have to type so much

-S

I forgot you’re in this game.

[Flavor Leaf]

we could flashlynch FL for lulz

I’d be okay with that.

Scum are likely going to want to push me today even though they know they’ll have a hard time getting that through because of my presence getting the Maki lynch.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh damn, that’s a play.

[Flavor Leaf]

FL, have you read my most recent posts?

-Cerb

Yeah. I didn’t have a comment about it, but I took it in.

Not sure exactly what I think of it as a whole, but seems like solid analysis.

K, noted, so this is FL deciding that he doesn't care about the fact that by bringing up his draft analysis again he's doing the thing that I expected scum!him to do.

Got it.

Not sure what this means, but got it.

-Cerb

You say I don’t care about it? Where is that? Show the facts. I said I didn’t have a comment on it. There’s a difference.

And I’m bringing up more of my draft analysis.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Krazy - these people trying to act like I’d ever let scumMaria partner go down on Day 1 like that...

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m not scum, though, so that just kinda contradicts your analysis, at least post game.

I feel like there are many reasons that I am town here and that scum would want to push me.

You scum, RR? Whore you protecting?

[Flavor Leaf]

You weren’t talking to me about it. If you want me to comment and self meta more, i can.

[Flavor Leaf]

For me to be scum here, you’d have to accept I hard bussed ScumJOAT Maki (i feel this is extremely hilarious for reasons I’ll have to wait to bring up).

[Flavor Leaf]

An Interview with RadiantCowbells:

Q: So who do you think is scum?

RadiantCowbells

Alright guys I've been reading this game a lot and I really think flavor leaf is scum and I think that a vote on AaronFrost is really good for reasons. If you are a good player of ms.net you would sheep me Bitmap come vote AaronFrost

Confirms I’m town.

RC’s one of the people who scum reads me every single time I’m town. Thanks for confirming it Oka.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like yes, I know he COULD do it, because he's a cocky ass who is quite sure he could win the game by himself after sacrificing his entire team,

People like to always say this, but the fact of the matter is I had a no bus meta for like 2 years, backed up, and even when I did bus last year, it was only when I essentially had to.

I’m very anti bus, and believe team cohesion to be much better than not. I go for perfect scum wins, because the longer games go on, the scummier I come off.

Town me solves games late game.
Scum me ends them.

[Flavor Leaf]

FL, can you glance over my Aaron case? Spotted something juicy.

He’s my mason

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like Hectic’s rolecop thing is townie.

RR could be scum pushing a neat narrative, but he hasn’t made any mistakes thus far. I could see the slot as scum. It fits with draft spec.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m martyr scum if anything.

AaronFrost/Titus have seen me stick my neck out to protect them from going down.

In a game Krazy modded last year, both of my scum partners got guiltied the same night, and I hard defended them to protect them.

I was scum with Insomnia, and I out of nowhere put him to L-1 so people would get sketched out and would unvote.

I claimed Masons with CheekyTeeky to try and save a scum partner Day 1.

[Flavor Leaf]

so if aaron flips red you're next yeah?

Nah that just makes me wrong town.

I don’t bus MakiJoat ever here.

[Flavor Leaf]

Krazy started the Maki wagon, I finished it.

[Flavor Leaf]

tempted to sheep FL

If you’re scum, you’ve done a good job keeping me laying in that pocket.

[Flavor Leaf]

Ank, when do you rise to the level of good scum hunter that I’ve heard so much about but have not witnessed with my own two eyes

I feel like there’s a big possibility of AnkScum here. Not giant, but big.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t think Insomnia’s scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

I just don’t think it makes sense for him to come in the way that he did, and then have so much swing behind his wagon thereafter.

Plus, I don’t see anything that is necessarily AI of him, and later, I believe some of the NAI stuff could even be Town Indicative.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like Espeonage is clearly scum. He’s even trying to discredit me more because I’m on a roll this game.

Like if Maki/Okapoka/Espeonage is the scum team, this is the exact way they act, just saying.

I have been lessening on Okapoka, but nonetheless, I’m 1 for 1 so far

[Flavor Leaf]

I also actively didn’t vote Spiffeh when someone asked me to yesterday, just saying.

There’s a lot of clearly town objectives I’ve been pushing, and the scum flip shows it.

[Flavor Leaf]

And even when I’m bad, I’m lookin’ good

[Flavor Leaf]

@FL of 131 - RR is definitely a heavy but can flex to second in command.

I don’t think they have the mass player knowledge to be a heavy in this game, if that makes sense.

Usually I’d agree

[Flavor Leaf]

Say it again for the people

[Flavor Leaf]

Can’t hear you! Louder!

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like Espeonage is the most likely to flip scum out of the current people posting

[Flavor Leaf]

Ank, when do you rise to the level of good scum hunter that I’ve heard so much about but have not witnessed with my own two eyes

because catching scum isn't my strongest point

it's catching town

ftr I think insomnia is town

[Flavor Leaf]

Sleeping doesn’t even help me anymore
Its the only thing i want to do because its the only way to make these feelings go away but everytime I wake up they just come back

Sleeping doesn’t help, that’s what I’m tryin to say people.

That’s why i dont

[Flavor Leaf]

*also hug*

[Flavor Leaf]

I know, you and Boon both

You two are gonna make me work for it

I wish I could say I'm looking forward to it but I'm trying to decide if I'll be able to be assed to push it through before marathon weekend is over so I guess you have a few days to fish for the other two scum

-S

I actually won’t fight you about it, i can possibly even be convinced.

Not a strong read by any means, especially because FA was on my list

[Flavor Leaf]

players also need to stop doing draft analysis and just hunt

Do both like me

[Flavor Leaf]

Oka is mech confirmed town

Gobble is just really townie for me, I can probably do a case but I don't really think it's worth of an elaboration? Especially his latest theory about bitmap pocketing ank.

titus, i still think RR is scum and my thoughts are that Pine is probably thread spewed which just annoys me but it could be a reality.

False

[Flavor Leaf]

Ooooo, Chemist has some big scum equity.

Sherlock’s town, like come on. He started that Maki wagon, and absolutely was not going to be able to have it go through without me slingshotting him.

[Flavor Leaf]

This my last night on set this week, I’ll start playing more soon

[Flavor Leaf]

@TOTUS - Titus of the US, does Chemist sound like a decent lynch today? It would be another check off my checklist as well.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah I like it just wish I saw it more tbh

<3 u rock

I'm not really caught up btw, I'm still more preoccupied with marathon weekend. Insomnia still best chance for scum (I say that not having carefully analyzed all of his posts as of right now but going off what I saw on his entrance), Bitmap and Pine are both fine compromises.

-S

I like it too.

I think he’s scum still.

[Flavor Leaf]

He also had impeccable timing responding after I typed my last posts.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Chemist

[Flavor Leaf]

But whatever you lynched Maki so you must be town now ay?

If you’re town here you’re doing nothing but flipping a coin right now

Peace out, probably not gonna invest more time casing people

PoE Chemist / Aaron / Pine

If it’s not in there

PoE S&W / Amrun / FL / RR

Like it’s actually pretty straight up bad to have Sherlock and I in there.

The sooner people realize that I’m straight up not losing a scum partner Day 1 in a game of this size where I am an active voice, the better.

These types of post just throw shade on a slot, and is just weak BoPing.

If you’re town, this is why you have stuff on you that scum is taking advantage of.

[Flavor Leaf]

SW went from commuter -> ascetic -> commuter -> vanilla.

I don’t understand the motivation to claim commuter when they did if they were really vanilla the whole time.

However, I began to doubt my scumread on day 1 for tonal reasons and their push on MK seems genuine to me.

Exactly, this is a townie trajectory not a scum one in conjunction with their push on Maki, Kaito

[Flavor Leaf]

Chemist is objectively scummy, I agree with TSE.

[Flavor Leaf]

Correction at the lynch deciding comment:

This day phase starts to wrap down when I get back into this game, bet.

[Flavor Leaf]

Apparently they’re calling me a clairvoyant prodigy now, so I now have a duty once I make my return

[Flavor Leaf]

TSE why exactly do you think that the whole scum team is JOATs all with neighborizers?

Like all JOATs I could see, but each of them having a neighborizer seems unlikely to me.

If you've already explained this then quote it for me.

Alisae response to Neighborizors was BAD for a Treestump.
Also their so and so “Slip” is also telling.

I think the 'slip' was done to cause pandemonium, which it's apparently doing a good job of.

Like I agree that scum most likely has another neighborizer of some kind, but to say the entire scum team is neighborizing JOATs is a reach for how much info we have right now.

Maybe but think of it.
Don’t you think it’s very possible for Alisae to pick a setup like that.
Look at Alisae
Then look at all the Normal Roles.
Which ones you think Alisae is going to pick?
Which would cause the most chaos and make Titus lose?
That’s right! Neighborizing JOAT’s.

Chemist is a good choice for a scum mate for a few reasons.
1) He’s not a scummy player.
So he can’t really be PL’ed and you doesn’t really ever fool around to the point of being bad.
He’s a very relaxed and “chemist” Playstyle.
I don’t like it TBF but it has its pluses.
2) He’s good at Neighborizing.
In a game I played on Mafia 451 he Neighborized the Cop.
Told his mafia to frame the Cops target.
Got the target lynched who from reactions to the cop guilty alone spewed town.
But no one was willing to lynch Chemist for it.
3) Leverage
Chemist as the capability to get out of situations the “Chemist” Way.
Like to the point that no one feels directly comfortable on lynching chemist.
So Chemist can sound so genuine and make people uneasy on voting him.

And with all this I don’t know what else I have to do to explain to people that Chemist is Scum here.

Like thinking that SW or the great one can be scum is just laughable right now, tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

That quote wasn’t supposed to be there.

Also, disliking does not equal scum

[Flavor Leaf]

What would I have needed to do better yesterday then?

Not catch scum?

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

TrueSoulEnergy
Pine
Flavor Leaf
Hectic
OkaPoka
Espeonage
Bitmap
Maki and Kaito (hydra of Maki Harukawa & Kaito Momota)
Sherlock and Watson (hydra of PenguinPower & Krazy)
Frozen Angel
Chemist1422
AaronFrost
Spiffeh
gobbledygook
Ankamius
Reasonably Rational (hydra of Cerberus v666 and Drixx)
Amrun

Let’s look at this list? Who would you state are the scum heavies, picks by Alisae? By heavy, I mean the slot to be able to captain a scum team and maneuver their way around the majority of players, which is why I won’t have Bitmap or the RR hydra, even though I think they’re likely strong or capable scum players.

I would say:
Pine
FL
Maria/Dunn hydra (keep in mind, Alisae nomm’d Dunn for Rising Star)
Sherlock and Watson
Ankamius

There is absolutely zero chance that there isn’t scum within this list. I know I’m town, and you can deduct Alisae wouldn’t ever pick me here (you don’t have to believe it, but e knows it’s true)

So that leaves

Pine
Maria/Dunn hydra
Krazy/PP hydra
Ankamius.

Obviously you can’t just pick all heavies, that’s too many cooks in the kitchen, so it would be balanced out between strong supporting scum players, and a likely “no one would ever expect this!!!”

Does anybody disagree with this heavy list?

Secondary Scum List second in commands

Espeonage
Bitmap
Gobbledygook
Reasonably Rational

Under the radar coast be there scum picks
Hectic
Okapoka
AaronFrost
Frozen Angel
Spiffeh


Don’t really see Alisae picking unless having to choose between two of em specifically
TrueSoulEnergy
Chemist
Amrun

If this is the topic of conversation for the evening I'm tagging in Kaito and going to bed.

yeah the way he's doing it seems kinda passive-aggressive and uncool

I didn't realize boon was gonna neg half the player list when I poked the boon fire

-S

Combine that with the fact if I have to deal with people calling X town and Y scum for 'what ali would do' I'm going to actively ignore it because it's just stupid. Set up spec is stupid pick drafting is stupid. Let's just play mafia. Ugh.

I actually highly disagree with the drafting being bad, because Alisae gets to post in this game, and thus is readable.

This is my starting ground, building my base for me to eventually solve, and I’m showing my work.

Atm, I don’t think Ankamius is the 1 to have been drafted out of the 4.

Kinda like Maki's tone here but not sure enough to undo the damage Dunn did to my read there earlier

I absolutely do not like Maki’s tone here. Explain please.

I almost impulsively voted Maki a bit back.

One of Krazy hydra/Ankamius, but exactly one of them.

You're kinda looking at this the wrong way though

Duck and SS get to pick

If Ali goes first and does a top priority heavy that isn't Ank, then Duck could very easily double on us for town

Which is precisely why you're basically just looking at the pick logic totally wrong, you're over-prioritizing what is actually an incredibly difficult puzzle to analyze. Focus on play, Boon, before you actually make me want to policy lynch you for real Like half of what you've said since you stopped actually solving is like pure cancer

-S

So? I post a lot. It’s not like I don’t analyze play whilst all this.

I also think my posting is fantastic for reactions.

We’ll see.

If I’m right, like I usually am when people push at me, at least 2/3 partially, you can ask PenguinPower on my solve capabilities at the expense of some minor casualties.

And this is a solid base of the puzzle. I found a good amount of puzzle pieces, and looking at em all before I start trying to piece it together.

I think one of the people who have posted against me tonight is scum, and almost exactly one of them.

I no longer town read OkaPoka either. Maki/Oka/Krazy slot have probably 1 maybe 2 scum within them, but more likely 1.

I’m not comfortable throwing Ank off the table yet, but yeah.


Aaron and Hectic were lean towns for me from my read through, I commented on my AF read, so that’s good that my gut was right with them.

Pine being a mason actually helps a lot, and lowers a heavy pick.

Maki/Krazy-PP/Ank is a semi POE.

Chemist/Amrun/TSE - are lean towns based on what I said earlier. TSE even moreso.

Gobbledygook/Bitmap are town reads of mine based on their play and posts, and position in the gamestate.

Spiffeh/Espeonage/Frozen Angel I think probably have scum in them based on their place in this game mixed with the drafting process and my other reads.

Okapoka’s probably just scum, especially if Krazy is town.

RR, idk, null.

OkaPoka/Maki/Espeonage is my way too early scum team, with probably like Spiffeh/FA.

Oo, baby, I had a good day 1. I didn’t even requote my analysis and thought small posts.

I will if people argue me

[Flavor Leaf]

there are 4 im p sure

maki
bitmap
chemist
hectic

This follows my draft pick spec

[Flavor Leaf]

If all of

OkaPoka, S_W, TSE, Flavor Leaf, Ank, Espeonage can agree on everyone in this pool being townreads then we can Wisdom of the Towncore PoE the list

If you don't agree on townreads then we can start there !

whee

Hmm, i think I’m okay with this town core. I’m not 100% sure it’s all town, but i like it, and can see it being all town with higher chances that you’d probably think based on play and whatnot.

[Flavor Leaf]

Guys, I’m having a really good game. My draft spec has been hella accurate.

I even stated that if Bitmap was scum he’s going to actively pocket me and for you guys to take care of figuring out if he was scum or not, AND he fit the secondary scum slot I as talking about.

[Flavor Leaf]

Are we a town block, you 2?

[Flavor Leaf]

This entire page is probably town.

Gobbledygook could be a hidden scum, but I like him right now tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

Apparently they’re calling me a clairvoyant prodigy now, so I now have a duty once I make my return

I have returned.

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

TrueSoulEnergy
Pine
Flavor Leaf
Hectic
OkaPoka
Espeonage
Bitmap
Maki and Kaito (hydra of Maki Harukawa & Kaito Momota)
Sherlock and Watson (hydra of PenguinPower & Krazy)
Frozen Angel
Chemist1422
AaronFrost
Spiffeh
gobbledygook
Ankamius
Reasonably Rational (hydra of Cerberus v666 and Drixx)
Amrun

Let’s look at this list? Who would you state are the scum heavies, picks by Alisae? By heavy, I mean the slot to be able to captain a scum team and maneuver their way around the majority of players, which is why I won’t have Bitmap or the RR hydra, even though I think they’re likely strong or capable scum players.

I would say:
Pine
FL
Maria/Dunn hydra (keep in mind, Alisae nomm’d Dunn for Rising Star)
Sherlock and Watson
Ankamius

There is absolutely zero chance that there isn’t scum within this list. I know I’m town, and you can deduct Alisae wouldn’t ever pick me here (you don’t have to believe it, but e knows it’s true)

So that leaves

Pine
Maria/Dunn hydra
Krazy/PP hydra
Ankamius.

Obviously you can’t just pick all heavies, that’s too many cooks in the kitchen, so it would be balanced out between strong supporting scum players, and a likely “no one would ever expect this!!!”

Does anybody disagree with this heavy list?

Secondary Scum List second in commands

Espeonage
Bitmap
Gobbledygook
Reasonably Rational

Under the radar coast be there scum picks
Hectic
Okapoka
AaronFrost
Frozen Angel
Spiffeh


Don’t really see Alisae picking unless having to choose between two of em specifically
TrueSoulEnergy
Chemist
Amrun

If this is the topic of conversation for the evening I'm tagging in Kaito and going to bed.

yeah the way he's doing it seems kinda passive-aggressive and uncool

I didn't realize boon was gonna neg half the player list when I poked the boon fire

-S

Combine that with the fact if I have to deal with people calling X town and Y scum for 'what ali would do' I'm going to actively ignore it because it's just stupid. Set up spec is stupid pick drafting is stupid. Let's just play mafia. Ugh.

I actually highly disagree with the drafting being bad, because Alisae gets to post in this game, and thus is readable.

This is my starting ground, building my base for me to eventually solve, and I’m showing my work.

Atm, I don’t think Ankamius is the 1 to have been drafted out of the 4.

Kinda like Maki's tone here but not sure enough to undo the damage Dunn did to my read there earlier

I absolutely do not like Maki’s tone here. Explain please.

I almost impulsively voted Maki a bit back.

One of Krazy hydra/Ankamius, but exactly one of them.

You're kinda looking at this the wrong way though

Duck and SS get to pick

If Ali goes first and does a top priority heavy that isn't Ank, then Duck could very easily double on us for town

Which is precisely why you're basically just looking at the pick logic totally wrong, you're over-prioritizing what is actually an incredibly difficult puzzle to analyze. Focus on play, Boon, before you actually make me want to policy lynch you for real Like half of what you've said since you stopped actually solving is like pure cancer

-S

So? I post a lot. It’s not like I don’t analyze play whilst all this.

I also think my posting is fantastic for reactions.

We’ll see.

If I’m right, like I usually am when people push at me, at least 2/3 partially, you can ask PenguinPower on my solve capabilities at the expense of some minor casualties.

And this is a solid base of the puzzle. I found a good amount of puzzle pieces, and looking at em all before I start trying to piece it together.

I think one of the people who have posted against me tonight is scum, and almost exactly one of them.

I no longer town read OkaPoka either. Maki/Oka/Krazy slot have probably 1 maybe 2 scum within them, but more likely 1.

I’m not comfortable throwing Ank off the table yet, but yeah.


Aaron and Hectic were lean towns for me from my read through, I commented on my AF read, so that’s good that my gut was right with them.

Pine being a mason actually helps a lot, and lowers a heavy pick.

Maki/Krazy-PP/Ank is a semi POE.

Chemist/Amrun/TSE - are lean towns based on what I said earlier. TSE even moreso.

Gobbledygook/Bitmap are town reads of mine based on their play and posts, and position in the gamestate.

Spiffeh/Espeonage/Frozen Angel I think probably have scum in them based on their place in this game mixed with the drafting process and my other reads.

Okapoka’s probably just scum, especially if Krazy is town.

RR, idk, null.

OkaPoka/Maki/Espeonage is my way too early scum team, with probably like Spiffeh/FA.

Oo, baby, I had a good day 1. I didn’t even requote my analysis and thought small posts.

I will if people argue me

[Flavor Leaf]

Secondary Scum List second in commands

Espeonage
Bitmap
Gobbledygook
Reasonably Rational

Under the radar coast be there scum picks
Hectic
Okapoka
AaronFrost
Frozen Angel/Insomnia
Spiffeh


Don’t really see Alisae picking unless having to choose between two of em specifically
TrueSoulEnergy
Chemist
Amrun

I wanna update this a little bit, play around, this was just the base. Alisae probably messed with it a bit.

Espeonage I think is town.

Gobbledygook/RR probably have scum in them.

I think it’s probably RR. Insomnia brought up the idea of them being scum along with Oka and Gobbledygook town.

Spiffed is dead, right?

This brings back to Hectic/AF, my mason buddies from day 1. I half think “of course I mason claimed with a scum”, so that’s possible.

But I think one of TSE/Chemist/Amrun have a chance.

So RR scum, with one of Hectic/AF/TSE/Chemist/Amrun.

I can probably thin that out a bit more later, but i just wanna sit on it for a second.

[Flavor Leaf]

This entire page is probably town.

Gobbledygook could be a hidden scum, but I like him right now tbh

Absolutely not. He had a bitmap boner.

So? I was town reading Bitmap early too.

But like, you can see in Bitmap’s play that he was obviously going for that play.

It’s more of a why does Insomnia die if Gobbledygook is being strongly town read by him.

[Flavor Leaf]

FL, I’m not scum. Like, mechanically.

Awesome. I wasn’t thinking you were scum either.

Honestly, I don’t think it’s TSE, i was just doing it for clarity’s.

Can you give me a rundown, Jim, on the mechanical stuff this game?

I really think it’s just RR and one of Hectic/AF/Chemist.

Have masons been outed yet?

VOTE: RR

Espeonage and I are masons essentially now

[Flavor Leaf]

FL, I’m not scum. Like, mechanically.

Awesome. I wasn’t thinking you were scum either.

Honestly, I don’t think it’s TSE, i was just doing it for clarity’s.

Can you give me a rundown, Jim, on the mechanical stuff this game?

I really think it’s just RR and one of Hectic/AF/Chemist.

Have masons been outed yet?

VOTE: RR

Espeonage and I are masons essentially now

I’m sorry but after I did the gamesolve I don’t know how anyone could think it’s me.
Do you honestly believe me to be a mafia Neighbourizing JOAT?

Read on, i clearly stated my thoughts afterwards.

[Flavor Leaf]

I could see Pine still. I’ve been thinking about that, but yeah.

Hectic/AF/RR/Chemist/Pine probably contains the rest of the scum

[Flavor Leaf]

TSE Alisae isn't a complete idiot to make all of the scum have the same role. They would make it so that multiple people have very similar roles tho.

Oh trust me on this.
Alisae

WOULD

do that.

Wait, you have experience with Alisae then?

Interesting. This changes stuff.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think it’s fair to think you could still be in the POE.

I’m not giving a damn about setup in this game tbh

[Flavor Leaf]

Boon did you get fruit?

-S

Nope. Should I have?

[Flavor Leaf]

Lynch Chemist first then?

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Hectic is townie actually too.

[Flavor Leaf]

The thing for Ank with me is I feel she’s had much more stage presence, and enough where if she were scum, they wouldn’t have lost 2 scum already

[Flavor Leaf]

I could be wrong, I’m not confident with that at all, but that’s my 2 cents

[Flavor Leaf]

He pocketed me, bitmap, as well

[Flavor Leaf]

I think that Ank wagon has too many outliers in it to think bitmap was bussing there right now

[Flavor Leaf]

I legit pushed through the Maki wagon, and I actively said I got pocketed by Bitmap.



Just pushes to shove I’m of the type that no matter what I do, people just hate whoever’s at the top.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh no, I'm expecting that

The problem is he's saying he got pocketed, which implies he isn't carrying, which I think is out of character for him

I'm half joking

How is it implying I’m not carrying. My draft spec has been unfaultered, even if I didn’t think Bitmap was scum, I saw I could be getting pocketed, which was the entire play Bitmap was making. He played it well. Scum NEED to make plays, but people like to coast.

[Flavor Leaf]

I have a new gimmick with my heel ness. Been the good guy too long.

[Flavor Leaf]

Chemist is great. He’s scum, but he’s great

[Flavor Leaf]

Why are AF/Hectic green for you?

[Flavor Leaf]

If Pine/Espeonage is higher due to pairing wise, i feel like RR is just more likely to be scum then.

I don’t feel Espeonage is scum here

[Flavor Leaf]

Alright, let’s go RR then. He’s on your shortlist, fits my draft spec, and I think has natural scum equity based on game state and POE

[Flavor Leaf]

And by you saying that, his plan of getting town read is already working

[Flavor Leaf]

Congratulations on proving that nothing is concrete, Flavor Leaf.

Do you have anything else to say about my reasoning?

Nah, but I’m probably going to try pretty hard to make sure that today’s is RR, so be prepared.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh, are we repeating day one?

That would be a good thing if we did. I hit scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

Let me know how brute forcing a lynch works out for you!

Usually pretty good

[Flavor Leaf]

Worked Day 1.

[Flavor Leaf]

Worked when I mislynched Penguin, but the rest of my POE pool has scum in it including Okapoka

[Flavor Leaf]

Not this game

[Flavor Leaf]

I could still go Chemist, to be fair

[Flavor Leaf]

Hmm...am I pocketed by Espeonage...?

[Flavor Leaf]

if we dont lynch chemmy my #2 might be boon lolololololololololololololololololol

-S

I feel like i should be conf town in your eyes

[Flavor Leaf]

I just want you to take a sit, think about how when you said you liked Maki’s tone, i said I didn’t, then when you couldn’t get Maki lynched, I stepped in and said I’d get her lynched for you, AND THEN, I gave you 60-30 the credit on it even.

And then Bitmap scum goes down, and as sit here barely playing the game after that...?

Explain that thought process please

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like i should be conf town in your eyes

i agree yet ur so scummy lately lolololololol

-s

Oh, fair.

I’m coasting because I feel I can, so haven’t really been paying attention and I’m just spouting one liners.

I’m mentally out of this game rn, but trying to stay, if thta makes sense.

[Flavor Leaf]

i kno

so much town

but then u ask if esp pocket u

scummy lolololol

stop being scummy n lynch chemmy

-S

Why? I got pocketed by Bitmap. Obviously, too, and I knew I was, but still was clueless.

Now I’m like lock town if Espeonage, and people are saying he could be scum, so I think it’s to have the self awareness as could be getting pocketed again. I don’t think I am, but i think it’s fair, and townie even

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like I had heard the Ank vigging Insomnia thing somewhere before too

[Flavor Leaf]

Maybe it was in the scum pt

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Flavor

@Alisae - I’m obv town and I’m gonna get lynched. Beat that.

[Flavor Leaf]

boon did u read alis thoughts in pt then copy them to thread to bus maria?

-S

Yeah, I’m a giant follower scum type.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m scum, lynch me

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m no longer playing this game, if you couldn’t tell. I’ll make one liner quips and brag post game about my reads being correct no matter what, though

[Flavor Leaf]

If y’all need my flip to see I’m correct, just flip me.


I will be taking credit of being a sacrificial martyr to help town win

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m reaction testing them for you, Titus, but I’m not gonna stop my lynch

[Flavor Leaf]

I wish I could have been a fly on the wall in Ali's draft.

I left detailed, but imperfect notes, on my mason selection(s) in my PT.

Wanna know how it went...? I have a few posts that can show you

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Chemist

Did somebody say L-1?

[Flavor Leaf]

Y’all are easy. All I had to do was move away from the wagon I initially wanted, and y’all treat it like honey on the wall for a fly

[Flavor Leaf]

Ankamius, Hectic, Espeonage, Pine, RR have scum in them.

They’re the off wagon, and I feel there’s at least 1 scum off that wagon.

VOTE: RE

[Flavor Leaf]

Ankamius, Hectic, Espeonage, Pine, RR have scum in them.

They’re the off wagon, and I feel there’s at least 1 scum off that wagon.

VOTE: RR