is a BP, and it is possible that he was shot by Mafia last night.
Inferno
is a Visitor.
Andrius
has claimed an investigative role too, I think.
Dram
being a Mafia RB, alongside the reality of an SK, WITH a Vengeful in this game, means that both Town and Scum have some next-level PRs. So this game is as entertaining and as fucked up as most Normals are allowed.
We are not setup specc'ing anymore right now. I, and others believe that our lynchpool/scumpool is too fragile and large to lynch
Chickadee
, some say is potential scum, a shot on another scum.
TW
, whether he's Vig or SK, is not a lynch priority right now, and there are both arguments to say he's 3p or Town, but it's mechanically impossible he's groupscum.
Quoted for everyone.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:40 am
by Almost50
In post 2221, Inferno390 wrote:@A50
First off, tell me more about sheeping N_M.
Second, please elaborate on your reads on Brass and TW.
Third, who out of Ausuka, MoI, and I do you think is going to flip red and why?
1- N_M notoriously has better than average reads as town, and when he tunnels someone the target is more likely to flip scum than not.
2- What's there to elaborate. I have some chemistry with these two, having played lots with them of late. I think I can gut/soul read their play with high precision.
3- I have no idea. It's just the concept of having 3 similar roles that is bothersome to me. And two
loyal
FVs? And they're both alive to confirm having visited someone each?
Btw, who
did
receive fruit last night? (Thanks for helping me get into the game, Profii). I hope Ausuka/MoI didn't claim their targets already though.
is a BP, and it is possible that he was shot by Mafia last night.
Inferno
is a Visitor.
Andrius
has claimed an investigative role too, I think.
Dram
being a Mafia RB, alongside the reality of an SK, WITH a Vengeful in this game, means that both Town and Scum have some next-level PRs. So this game is as entertaining and as fucked up as most Normals are allowed.
OK.. cool. Let's be specific.. did MoI and/or Ausuka claim their targets first or did the targets claim they received fruit. Again, I want this bit to be specific.. like -say- X claimed having received fruit, and Y acknowledged visiting them, then A said they also received fruit and B confirmed.. y'know?
We are not setup specc'ing anymore right now. I, and others believe that our lynchpool/scumpool is too fragile and large to lynch
Chickadee
, some say is potential scum, a shot on another scum.
TW
, whether he's Vig or SK, is not a lynch priority right now, and there are both arguments to say he's 3p or Town, but it's mechanically impossible he's groupscum.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:48 am
by brassherald
Andrius ans Rask each claimed their fruit before the vendors claimed who they targeted
@Taly: Do note that I also targeted dram last night.
@A50: Cool on N_M. I’ve never played town against him before, so I was wondering where that came from.
On Brass and TW, I really just want to hear your voice and how your reading at this point. Even if it’s pretty basic stuff, I just want more from you, because that generates discussion and reads for everyone else.
On the Visitor roles, MoI has confirmed giving fruit to Andrius, and Ausuka to Rask.
Gonna guess we have some sort of tracking investigative role. Tracker or Watcher or something. No one confirm this tho.
P-edit: This is true Brass, and might be key to cracking this game wide open. Thoughts?
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:56 am
by Almost50
In post 2229, brassherald wrote:Andrius ans Rask each claimed their fruit before the vendors claimed who they targeted
OK.. that's a bit less sus than the other way around, but still there's a slight chance (like really really small but existing chance) one pair is scum gambitting (y'know .. like the scum claiming masons kinda gamble). But I'm willing to look elsewhere for now.
So, BOTH VENDORS targetting me tonight is ideal. Scum will have to choose between shooting me or one of the claimed investigatives or the Vig, let alone the FVs themselves (whom are acting as investigatives as well). Now can you see why I'm still sus of all the claims being true?
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:59 am
by brassherald
I believe one claimed odd-night loyal fruit vendor, the other claimed just loyal fruit vendor or something like that. I don't know what it means.
Of the group, I think the ones who received the fruits are better today than the vendors and vending is not a clear IMO.
I just think a profii lynch is best here, he's being evasive.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:05 am
by Inferno390
@A50, that’s a great idea...
Unless you’re scum with one of the FV.
Then your partner shoots the other FV and you now have an excuse for only getting one banana.
Not to mention it doesn’t even matter because one of the claimed FVs is odd night
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:08 am
by Ausuka
Also announcing targets doesn't work because the traget can claim two fruit regardess of what actually happened.
after that light and dark mafia I can confirm what Ausuka is saying makes sense. also still feeling the informed scum fruit vendor idea even if it's loopy as hell.
we should lynch profii I think
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:22 am
by Inferno390
TW, don’t jump to any lynches yet. You haven’t heard about the other half of my scumteam yet.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:27 am
by Almost50
In post 2235, Ausuka wrote:Also announcing targets doesn't work because the traget can claim two fruit regardess of what actually happened.
I resent the implication that I might be scum, but then it's Ausuka and she probably will never learn how to read me..
Probably! Life is not worth a damn w.o. a Duck a l'Orange dinner.
P.S. Just so I won't be outright lying or misleading, I personally do not eat duck IRL. Just saying.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 12:10 pm
by the worst
phew that was a close one. I'm actually a vegetarian for reals, offences against ducks are punishable by deattthhhh
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:24 pm
by MagnaofIllusion
So first having a go at Taly’s Elbirn case -
Taly
I spent about half an hour going over your case on Elbirn and decided I wasn’t going to spend 2 hours putting together a wall to argue with you. So I’ll summarize my thoughts and why I’m not really swayed at all on Elbirn. I think your case can be summed up as follows.
1. Elbirn doesn’t play like you think Town should.
2. Elbirn chose to challenge those who scum-read or questioned him (Inferno, Flubber being prime examples).
3. Elbirn chose to push his own angles (xyzzy) while ignoring Dram.
That I think is your distilled case. And while I appreciate the effort I don’t see it. Frankly I think you went in with a pre-conceived notion and fit the posts to your case as opposed to the other way around. I get the feeling his push on you upon replacing in gave you a sour taste and you let that taint how you approached him. And frankly I don’t think his stance was unreasonable. I was not a fan of your early posting either.
I see Elbirn as having Town posts and being frustrated with the spammy nature of this game.
I don’t see his turn around in Inferno in 232 and HitAlt in 794 as scum motivated. Frankly I think scum have every reason to keep static reads on players who make themselves lynchable. And while you’ve called his slot scummy for ignoring the wagons on HitAlt and Flubber (one of which I have as a solid Town read and the other flipped Town) I’m not seeing only scum motivation in his reasons for doing so. Frankly if Xyzzy is Town there are tons of players who look very bad for jumping there (some of which are in your Townblock). So holding Elbirn to a higher standard than others isn’t solid play.
I mean if you want to push on that slot 507 where he downplays Dram’s playstyle perhaps to prevent pressure from forming there I could possibly see . Meanwhile his challenge to Inferno in that same post feels very Town to my eyes. But in your write-up the part that is most damning is almost an afterthought to you.
Taly
– I want you to re-read your own case from those posts on Sky. Because that on the other hand I think makes a solid bit of reasoning why Sky is scum.
--
@Andy
– Do me a favor and just don’t bother jousting with Inferno. He’s probably Town who just doesn’t understand that people not agreeing with him is not a scum-tell. I mean you probably saw all you needed to see when he thought his claimed Visitor role was somehow a counter-claim to Ducking’s “Vig” claim. We aren’t talking Spyrex here … we are talking Furculow or Chesskid.
Duckling if you aren’t a SK after posting this I don’t think we can be friends. This is just so bad.
In post 2212, Almost50 wrote:Not convinced Pine would include 3 similar roles in this setup, but I'm not exactly an expert in his modding meta either, so I'll just say I'm skeptical.
Maybe they should (or at least the two FVs of them) target me tonight? That sure makes me a prime NK target as well, but I think that would relief many of you (those who were willing to lynch my predecessor)
You do know I’m Odd Night and Inferno’s role is effectively a VT except it can be proven by Track / Watch type roles, right Almost?
In post 2214, Almost50 wrote:I could switch my vote to Andrius if you say the case on him is good enough.
So Andy’s confirmed Town. Was I wrong on Elbirn and Taly has it right Almost?
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:33 pm
by Inferno390
This is a BAD post that I’m going parse when I open up on MoI tonight.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:52 pm
by MagnaofIllusion
In post 2243, Inferno390 wrote:This is a BAD post that I’m going parse when I open up on MoI tonight.
No a bad post would be, for example, thinking a Visitor role counter-claimed a Vig claim in a Normal (which is be definition not Bastard) or calling for the Loud role to be outed when HitAlt clearing indicated he thought they were a protective.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:57 pm
by Taly
MOI
is one of, maybe 3 people right now, that is actually leveling with me,
Inferno
So no, I don't see your point there.
I will respond to you in depth
MOI
, and revise my thoughts on
Sky
and impression of
Almost
so far, very likely tomorrow because I've been busy on/off the past 2-3 days.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:23 pm
by Almost50
In post 2242, MagnaofIllusion wrote:You do know I’m Odd Night and Inferno’s role is effectively a VT except it can be proven by Track / Watch type roles, right Almost?
Except for he odd night part I'm not sure what your point is. Any/all of you could be tracked, and if all were to target the same person a watcher can confirm all 3 at once. I do now realize this can't be done on N2 though.
In post 2242, MagnaofIllusion wrote:So Andy’s confirmed Town. Was I wrong on Elbirn and Taly has it right Almost?
Why is Andy conf!Town?? And .. that's the spirit. I was gazing with surprise you TR'd the slot I replaced into..
I'm Town, mate.. but I don't expect you -in particular- to just take my word for it, and I very much understand.
Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:27 pm
by Almost50
In post 2243, Inferno390 wrote:This is a BAD post that I’m going parse when I open up on MoI tonight.
To the contrary, I feel good about MoI after that post in particular, but maybe it's more personal than public knowledge. MoI almost never trusts me regardless of my alignment, and he almost always pushes me. The thing is I used that fact in particular against him in our last game together (a Red Flag setup where I was scum myself).. but that's kinda irrelevant. The thing is I totally understand MoI would be skeptical about me even if he TR'd my predecessor, and the post looks very much natural from Town!MoI's PoV.
is one of, maybe 3 people right now, that is actually leveling with me,
Inferno
So no, I don't see your point there.
I will respond to you in depth
MOI
, and revise my thoughts on
Sky
and impression of
Almost
so far, very likely tomorrow because I've been busy on/off the past 2-3 days.
As for you, Taly.. the main problem for me is I don't want to consume/invest too much effort in this game. I came in with a more "let me just chill and have some fun" mentality. I want to work with you (and everyone else who cares to) but I won't be doing my hyper excavation of details and setup speccing (at least not today), and it's hard to convince you of my alignment here if you compare that to most of our previous games (in fact I'd expect you to SR me some based on that abandoned Varsoon game if you're using past personal experiences to read me).
The good news though is there's not a player in this game who hasn't played with me before. The bad news is not all are experienced enough with me. You just need to get your own read and compare it with those who are more likely to peg me right and see if you agree, and if not then why.
But I'll make it even more simple for you.. the reason I'm trying to bait the NK is I am a VT.
In my response to rw (someone who does know how to read me better than the average guy) I said:
Absolutely not. In fact, I'm being very transparent with you when I say: I am very town here.
This was a basic coded message to him and I fully expected him to get it.
V
ery
T
ransparent. and
V
ery
T
own. These are my trade marks for crumbing VT to someone as familiar with me as tw is.
So, people targeting me = getting myself shot = no biggie (and saves you the effort of sorting my slot and -even better- a mislynch, since I knew Elbrin was @L-1 at some point before he replaced out.
.. that's the spirit. I was gazing with surprise you TR'd the slot I replaced into..