Open 587 - Nightless Vengeful Mayhem [Game Over]

[Teapot]

Unvote, vote Teapot

Unvote, vote vettrock

Unvote, vote Astinus

Let's shake things up.

All ABR naked wagon hops, why are people saying my votes are bad when this guy is doing it 10x worse. If Vettrock isn't scum he is the next lynch.

[Teapot]

VOTE: Vettrock
Morgan is town, unless he's scum with ABR and is panicking after a bus. I won't consider that right now though.
The ABR wagon went way too fast.

(I'm going away for a few days.)

I would normally be against a lurker wagon, but he is not just lurking, he is jumping on my wagon with basically naked votes. Am I sure he is scum? No, but of those on my wagon I consider him the most likely. As I said with 3 scum, it is likely that one of the three on my wagon is scum. I'm just not sure who it is yet.

I find it somewhat interesting that you are complaining about the speed of the ABR wagon, but have no problem jumping on my wagon that shot up nearly as fast in response to a test vote/push for Morgan (who had no votes), and my susequent move of my vote back to ABR. That and the fact that I was actually active and posting. Archbobs case on me is basically, I have been actively posting, and have not "done much". Which is basically because until recently, there wasn't much to go off of other than fluff.

and ABR's reponse to all of this is a three word post:

VOTE: Vettrock
Morgan is town, unless he's scum with ABR and is panicking after a bus. I won't consider that right now though.
The ABR wagon went way too fast.

(I'm going away for a few days.)

You wanted to pressure!wagon ABR, and now suddenly the wagon is "too fast"? Your wagon hopping is what's too fast.

Someone remind me why we're not lynching this.

We still can.

I guess that can be inturpreted to mean ABR thinks Teapot could be the lynch instead of me? A little more explanation would be helpful.

This is actually a good post, he's thinking similar to me. I'm starting to doubt my read on him.

[Teapot]

So uh, vettrocks not scum. I'm not allowed to say why due to site rules, I'll say no more.
VOTE: ABR
If it isn't clear yet; Votes all main wagons, not usual play, similar to other scum games and intentional no content.

[Teapot]

I don't mind being lynched, I like to vig kill.

That's L1, I don't believe we have any PR's this setup.

[Teapot]

ABR if you are lynched, who will you shoot if I'm wrong?
Nobody hammer until we have discussed this.

[Teapot]

I don't mind being lynched, I like to vig kill.

We'll see about that.
Texcat, do you see any similarities to his scum game with you?

[Teapot]

If ABR flips scum Vettrocks town. I'd suggest him shooting Astinus, I'm however unsure.

[Wisdom]

Zymf has not posted despite receiving a prod, so I'll look for a replacement for him as well. He may stay if he posts before I find one.

[Wisdom]

Also, Astinus has been prodded.

come on guys, less prodding, more activity.

[texcat]

I don't mind being lynched, I like to vig kill.

We'll see about that.
Texcat, do you see any similarities to his scum game with you?

I'm way too lazy to read old games. My gut read from my memory is still town rather than scum. But I've said that I find him difficult to read; I didn't see that much difference in his scum game to his town game or to this game. They are are similar. You were the one who said you could sort him.

So people stop voting ABR and start voting Astinus, I'll sort ABR's play later. I'm familiar with it.

This is scary in any number of ways. First that you think you can sort ABR's play. I can't imagine being able to do that. Second, that you think we should trust you enough to do it. But I'm looking forward to your ABR reads anyway.

For someone who seems so certain about things, you've done quite a bit of flip-flopping recently.

[archaebob]

unvote

@ Teapot -

Despite my earlier comment I see in the vote count that my vote is on Morgan rather than ABR.

VOTE: ABR

This is L-2. Given that he hasn't produced much, I do think we need to wait for a response before going any further.

Morgan is probably town. If ABR is scum, archaebob and Sup-Zero are probably town, as I don't think all of the scum would jump on the same wagon that quickly. If ABR is town, I wouldn't say they are scum, but they shift more towards null.

This is a horrible vote and is why I unvoted, he's supporting a quick lynch and is even showing he isn't certain he's scum. Of cause scum wouldn't care who's lynched, hence he's fine with a quicklynch.
Town wouldn't support a quicklynch with a week left and so little content in the game, unless someones got town meta of vett supporting QL's as town this is really bad.

Help me understand where vettrock was calling for a quicklynch here.

VOTE: Vettrock
Morgan is town, unless he's scum with ABR and is panicking after a bus. I won't consider that right now though.
The ABR wagon went way too fast.

(I'm going away for a few days.)

I would normally be against a lurker wagon, but he is not just lurking, he is jumping on my wagon with basically naked votes. Am I sure he is scum? No, but of those on my wagon I consider him the most likely. As I said with 3 scum, it is likely that one of the three on my wagon is scum. I'm just not sure who it is yet.

I find it somewhat interesting that you are complaining about the speed of the ABR wagon, but have no problem jumping on my wagon that shot up nearly as fast in response to a test vote/push for Morgan (who had no votes), and my susequent move of my vote back to ABR. That and the fact that I was actually active and posting. Archbobs case on me is basically, I have been actively posting, and have not "done much". Which is basically because until recently, there wasn't much to go off of other than fluff.

and ABR's reponse to all of this is a three word post:

VOTE: Vettrock
Morgan is town, unless he's scum with ABR and is panicking after a bus. I won't consider that right now though.
The ABR wagon went way too fast.

(I'm going away for a few days.)

You wanted to pressure!wagon ABR, and now suddenly the wagon is "too fast"? Your wagon hopping is what's too fast.

Someone remind me why we're not lynching this.

We still can.

I guess that can be inturpreted to mean ABR thinks Teapot could be the lynch instead of me? A little more explanation would be helpful.

This is actually a good post, he's thinking similar to me. I'm starting to doubt my read on him.

Help me understand what makes this post good.

[Teapot]

Actually thank you Bob, I misread that. I thought it was "I don't think we need...".
Also, it may have sounded like me saying I'm good at sorting ABR, I wasn't saying that. I was at first intending to ignore him and get a read on him later game, however things changed.

[Teapot]

He's actually looking at the game and trying to think it through in that post, I've got other reasons which I can't (yet) mention.

[Albert B. Rampage]

All I know is that Teapot is awfully scummy.

[TheCow]

I am back from the dead. Does anyone have any specific questioning they would like to do about me?

[Wisdom]

pisskop

replaces droog, effective immediately.

[pisskop]

Hi

Ive been following loosely. SupZero, why u so scuzzy?

Anywho, Ill reread w/interest when Im not on a phone.

[archaebob]

@ Teapot -

No more shenanigans please. Your credibility is waning fast.

If you're a hyper-verbal smart person like me, who maybe, you know, started playing this game to test out his logical prowress and mind reading capabilities, then this will be a bitter pill to swallow - the reality that you can't catch scum with meta research, that playstyle gambits don't work, and that nobody is enough of a mafia god to leave things "until later" without explaining themselves and still maintain their clout in the town. If you've gotten away with this stuff in other towns, I congratulate you, but if you won those games it was despite these tactics, not because of them. They don't actually work. They brew darkness and distrust. They make it difficult for town to recognize one another. And I promise you, they don't work. There's too many variables. Always. You'll never imbibe fully the context of the games you are studying, because you weren't there. You won't feel the weight of time, of uncertainty, of your own ass on the line. And even if you could, it wouldn't help you. Meta is too malleable. Your eyes will cherry pick the narratives they want. Always. No matter how enthusiastic, hyper-obsessive, and method actor-esque your process becomes, you will find yourself back at square one, in conflict with other players for untestable, personality driven reasons. Which is fine, because that's what happens anyways. But what you

can

do is comport yourself with a humble, productive demeanor, intelligible to other players, and immersed fully in the tug and pull of the town's multitudinal pressures. To withdraw from that matrix of constant, incessant, infuriating feedback because you fancy yourself an ivory tower guru, capable of piecing together the full puzzle from a bird's eye view while the masses thrash about, only to descend later with the scum's name etched out in tablets, is a very serious, hubris-laden mistake. It has the added flaw of preventing me from trusting you, which is an even graver error.

I think it has become convenient again for you to be on ABR's wagon, possibly because y'all have daytalk and Albert-scum loves to be bussed. I think you're good at planning your posts to simulate a gradual change of perspective over time.

vote Teapot

[Wisdom]

BBMolla

replaces Zymf, effective immediately.

[Wisdom]

Vote Count 1.8

Albert B. Rampage (5)

-

pisskop, BBMolla, Astinus, vettrock, Teapot

Teapot (3)

-

texcat, Albert B. Rampage, archaebob

Not Voting:

theslimer3, TheCow, Morgan, Sup-Zero

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2015-02-14 21:36:32).

[Sup-Zero]

Hi

Ive been following loosely. SupZero, why u so scuzzy?

Anywho, Ill reread w/interest when Im not on a phone.

Scuzzy?

@Arch: That is a giant wall.

[Sup-Zero]

Arch if you think that Teapot is bussing ABR then why bother switching at all?

Your point on daytalk seems like a bit of a stretch.

[Albert B. Rampage]

@ Teapot -

No more shenanigans please. Your credibility is waning fast.

If you're a hyper-verbal smart person like me, who maybe, you know, started playing this game to test out his logical prowress and mind reading capabilities, then this will be a bitter pill to swallow - the reality that you can't catch scum with meta research, that playstyle gambits don't work, and that nobody is enough of a mafia god to leave things "until later" without explaining themselves and still maintain their clout in the town. If you've gotten away with this stuff in other towns, I congratulate you, but if you won those games it was despite these tactics, not because of them. They don't actually work. They brew darkness and distrust. They make it difficult for town to recognize one another. And I promise you, they don't work. There's too many variables. Always. You'll never imbibe fully the context of the games you are studying, because you weren't there. You won't feel the weight of time, of uncertainty, of your own ass on the line. And even if you could, it wouldn't help you. Meta is too malleable. Your eyes will cherry pick the narratives they want. Always. No matter how enthusiastic, hyper-obsessive, and method actor-esque your process becomes, you will find yourself back at square one, in conflict with other players for untestable, personality driven reasons. Which is fine, because that's what happens anyways. But what you

can

do is comport yourself with a humble, productive demeanor, intelligible to other players, and immersed fully in the tug and pull of the town's multitudinal pressures. To withdraw from that matrix of constant, incessant, infuriating feedback because you fancy yourself an ivory tower guru, capable of piecing together the full puzzle from a bird's eye view while the masses thrash about, only to descend later with the scum's name etched out in tablets, is a very serious, hubris-laden mistake. It has the added flaw of preventing me from trusting you, which is an even graver error.

I think it has become convenient again for you to be on ABR's wagon, possibly because y'all have daytalk and Albert-scum loves to be bussed. I think you're good at planning your posts to simulate a gradual change of perspective over time.

vote Teapot

OUTSTANDING

[theslimer3]

From "hmm maybe scum" on vett to a post later saying that he's not scum at all. Not only this, but L1ing (or at least he thinks he did)

And then that fearsome "who will you shoot if you're wrong" settled me bad. It seemed like scum trying not to get shot, so cautiously seeing what will happen in this scenario. I think I'm leaning more towards you than ABR right now

[texcat]

I am back from the dead. Does anyone have any specific questioning they would like to do about me?