i wonder if he originally wanted to be the one not in before he realized his partner wasn't gonna make it
i think if anything that would fit with mala
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:20 pm
by fireisredsir
except for the bit where he criticized my mala townread ig
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:25 pm
by Roden
VOTE: NK15
Gonna just mentally check out of this game since I'm getting tilted and we've already won anyway. NK15/Fire is GG.
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:25 pm
by Aristeia
roden does feel tonally p townie
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:31 pm
by fireisredsir
kinda but idk what he can really do here if he's like always in the poe and it isn't likely anything he says can have much effect on that
i think that would be somewhat annoying as scum
that said i still think nk is most likely just cause he is playing the same way he does as scum and i think there is an element of his towngame that is very clearly missing
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:32 pm
by Aristeia
I've seen Scum!Roden just give up and stop posting before
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:32 pm
by Aristeia
the annoyance with being even in the POE rings kind of townie to me
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:33 pm
by fireisredsir
as a town in the poe im not annoyed by it but maybe thats just a personal difference
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:34 pm
by fireisredsir
i think I'd be much more annoyed by the gamestate if i were scum
im reasonably confident its in nk/roden, and so that's a win even if people think it might be me too
After reading Mena's ISO and getting a feeling for the game state, I don't think Mena vs Elephant is SvS. Mena switching from "kill STD" to "kill Rella -> Ari" after acknowledging he's the most likely elim today feels like a spew that would be harmful to his scum partner since I don't think it would be either of them in that scenario, which makes me think it's a genuine final reads list from a dying townie. I think their frustration with this Day phase is also genuine. Going back further, though I don't think STD is scum, I do think Mena's case on him came from a solvey mindset.
Where's your head at? VCs aren't telling me anything about what you're thinking, you stuck to one coalition choice Day 1 and currently aren't voting anyone.
i have an iso >.> but basically, thinking mena is town for [meta reasons that seem to not vibe with anyone other than skitter], ari is town for the way she played d1. have been thinking skitter is most likely scum in the coalition for a while (but i've kinda liked her more recent posting i guess??? jury's still out), and getting increasingly nervous about irrel
outside the coalition, thinking fire is town but fuck if i know about the other three -- std is more likely to be town than the other two i guess but i am v low confidence on all of those
I actually did read your ISO, I just wanted an updated take since EoD is approaching and you've been fence sitting.
NK15 feels obvtown to me, he's too confident and tunneled to be scum, and everyone here is competent enough to coach him to not flail with his reads/solves going into Day 2. Fire is null to me only because they didn't seem to have the spotlight at all so far. I agree with STD likely being town, but disagree with your Skitter scum read, consensus nominations tend to be town and nothing in her ISO sticks out as scummy to me.
I've noticed while skimming that a lot of people think there's at least one scum between you and Ari, and while I agree, I think it's odd that no one really seemed to push you two. It's too late in the day to do it now, but you two should've been leading wagons imo, that would've given everyone plenty of info seeing who would push who and if your wagons would naturally dissipate. If you were both town, I believe scum would see you two as the optimal push on Day 2, and if I'm right on NK15 being town then scum likely would've backed him when he scum cased the two of you. I just don't see how there could be zero momentum towards wagoning either of you if you're both town and part of the coalition.
I think I'm going to end up voting Elephant today, I just want to finish going through his ISO first. If I end up town reading him though then idk.
In post 2077, Roden wrote:Oof, I finished going through Elephant's ISO then saw ten more pages crop up and that he replaced out. I came away with a town lean, and after catching up I think his replacement is town. Idk who Bloodhail is an alt of but I like their entrance, and us having similar reads after replacing in feels like a good sign that I'm on the right track.
VOTE: Datisi
Gonna go back and reply to some stuff.
this kind of feels like town thought process. [tho he did forget his nk15 townread but I guess it feels like he forgot cuz he's town rather than he forgot cuz he's scum because I make excuses for people I townread for bad reasons]
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 4:42 pm
by fireisredsir
tbh at the time i thought his nk read was so unbelievable that it must be tmi
ig it could have been he just realized the reasoning was bad but he didn't seem to when I asked about it
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 8:55 pm
by Not Known 15
I have something to say later. Please don't rush any lim. We have enough time to discuss. Remember that scum was only caught very late into day 1.
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 9:13 pm
by Aristeia
NK15 why didn't you vote for Datisi at all yesterday if you were convinced he/me were scum together?
101 i dislike because it's a v easy way to get onto what's popular at the time. also the explanations for the votes are kinda lackluster because the description of my 37 is very uncharitable and "skitter seems to be solving" is like, such a low bar to place for someone like skitter
then, his vote of mena for 145/146. maybe it's me who's used to mena's sense of humour and writing style and those posts seemed very normal to me. (in fact they were a bit of a positive sign after the first few posts which felt way too boring but anyway.) std immediately jumping onto that feels like scum who saw a townie acting wacky and decided to try to spin them into looking bad, i.e. performative, because the words that they wrote were level-zero-thinking bad. like, i usually find that town is more likely to critically think about *why* mena would write something that maybe looks weird while scum is more likely to try to make it seem bad because that is their job description. yes i'm aware std later said he misunderstood or changed his mind or whatever no i still don't like it.
the rest of his iso is also... kinda boring. like, a bunch of it is joking around or arguing theory with mena. like, afair i don't think std usually puts out a lot of content as town or rather not a lot of "serious, well structured content", but there's usually some sorta thought process i can follow and here i don't think i can follow a lot of it. not sure if i could explain the reason of one read he had.
like, again, page 15 48 hours but it's not a Great look.
i feel that both irrel and std are some sorta vibe townreads for the majority of the game, and either my vibe radar is broken or they're getting read for nonsense reasons and idk which and mafia is a fuck
so i didn't go into this fully yesterday but one of the things that tipped me off on datisi was this about how he played the coalition stage:
it looked like he was systematically trying to weaken townreads on players like relly and std - as compared to everyone else who was trying to assemble a towncore, he loooked to be putting doubt on players as a means of making himself more likely to be included in the coalition
i don't think he pre-emptively tries to keep his partner out of the coalition if they're getting townread and i want to say this makes STD town (i think in general STD is, like, way way outside his scumrange this game but additional evidence helps)
looking back on this post - I think it's in response to STD's coalition at 306 which relly sheeped at 326
it's also what skitter wanted at EOD1
so uh go me for drowning out people with better reads than me ooops i sux :/
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 11:26 pm
by skitter30
Can u walk me thru ur logic for why you sheeped dats again?
Iirc i wanted me/mena/irrel/std
And dats wanted me/mena/irrel/you/him
And you had offered to sheep me but decided to sheep dats' version
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 11:34 pm
by Aristeia
it wasn't very clear to me who you wanted for your fifth player.
I had offered to be your fifth but I didn't think you actually wanted me to be your fifth.
in the case where your fifth is datisi - I'd rather take STD's spot and sheep Datisi's coalition because then he would be responsible for coalition failure and it would be easier for me to vote for him.
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 11:39 pm
by Aristeia
for example:
In post 1027, Aristeia wrote:well you were the most healed person the first time I did a VC so I guess you're kind of stuck being the leader unless someone else wants it.
I can be your fifth if you want me to be your fifth because I know I'm town but if you don't know it I suggest you find someone you can trust.
I was offering you your core 4 + me in this post but I never got the idea from you that you were ok with that.
I am sheeping Dats because in the world where we have to kill him I wanted him to have a chance to win for us
Yeah i dont think i could have confidentally said a fifth jist then
But what did you mean by this?
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 11:43 pm
by Aristeia
I meant that I wanted Datisi to have a chance of winning the game for us[by picking a correct coalition] in case the coalition fails and you want to kill him.
Posted: Sun May 22, 2022 11:45 pm
by Aristeia
In post 1038, skitter30 wrote:Ok if std being in it isnt viable i can probably compromise on that but that is not my ideal, i really would like std in it
And honestly to be perfectly frank if it failed i would probably flip you first
Probablh something like dats -> mena -> ari -> irrel
Maybe swap mena/ari idk
you said here you wanted to kill him if the coalition failed
so I'd rather let him take a shot with his coalition - then if you want to kill him still, it'd be like his fault for the coalition failing so he'd have some agency in it.
if you had pushed skitter/irrel/mena/std/datisi thru, and then coalition failed, i would not have been happy with you killing datisi cuz it wouldn't have been his coalition that failed.
Gonna just mentally check out of this game since I'm getting tilted and we've already won anyway. NK15/Fire is GG.
don't take it personally. if you're town, i get it, you're getting suspected for having a correct read and that really sucks. you didn't really get a chance to establish yourself in the game and you have to deal with the baggage from the player who was in the game before you. that's kind of out of your control, unfortunately, and i know how it goes speaking as someone who replaces into games a lot. just do the best you can from spot you're in. it's possible i'm
way
overthinking this because i'm mentally projecting an idea of how scum would play this setup that may not be accurate. i trust that if you're town we can work things out here.
In post 311, Datisi wrote:In post 178, Malakittens wrote:
datis is prob town
ari feels town as well.
HEAL: datis
HEAL: ari
idk about skitter,
i'm very bad about reading std
i dont have much exp with fire
mmm
this reminds me of like, lazy scum-mala i guess
the first thing that jumps out at me is the "i don't have much exp with fire" because i know mala's exp with me is one (1) game where we were both scum and i don't think the discussion about fire was so much about past experiences compared to discussion about other people that it warranted to mention specifically for him that she doesn't have experience
that sentence is a mess but it boils down to "explain pls"
I mean tbh other than Skitter & STD I haven't really played a game with either of the following players or played more than 1 with them. So technically I'm going to suck at reading you all.
I just know i REAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLY suck at reading STD, mainly becuase i ahven't seen scum-std.
In post 805, Malakittens wrote:TBH
NGL
I don't want the following players in a coalition {STD, Nk15, Ari & dat}
I'm VERY much down to have skitter & irrel in it. Fire is a gut-yes
at this point I want to place myself it in bc i'm town.
So i'm looking for one more townread for my townblock
i'm down for a {Skitter, irrel, NK, fire & me} I'm also ok with mena being in ←
scum is prob within {STD, Ari, Dat}
In post 811, Malakittens wrote:Your interactions are weird. Your tone is weird. Maybe its the vibes between u/dati i don't like. there's just something there I dont like and if one of you is scum you're gonna pocket each other and i'm just not about that life rn
In post 821, Malakittens wrote:Right now I'm back to being paranoid of being pocketed again. Maybe because i was pocketed by Val in that newbie game or recently I let Math pocket the hell out of me, but it's whatever
i just cant in my right mind place the two of you in a coalition when i cant trust you arent pocketed
In post 837, Aristeia wrote:I guess I just find it weird you think my scum partner is Save the Dragons but you don't say it and instead have some round a bout way of saying one of me/dats is scum but you have a really bad feeling about me because I scumread you without having played a game with you and don't really mention anything I've done with SaveTD who is my partner?
well it's more i got a poe of you three. my less solid of a townread is NK & mena
In post 856, Malakittens wrote:which i said if i'm being left out i'm ok with mena
but again nk & mena are my weakest reads
so id at least want to place myself over one of them because I KNOW i'm town via my own role pm via mod (unless the mod is just a jester)
so why would i leave myself out to possibly risk interchanging a mafia in it
naaaaaaaaathanks
In post 867, Datisi wrote:like idk if i'm town in mala's position and i see a coalition forming that i think is capital b Bad i probably try to spend the little time we have until it convincing people why it's bad not doing *this*
Just because people don’t agree with my reads prior to an actual flip. I can’t help you
Again just because I’m low effort and then start to effort isn’t AI. You can see that in recent games where I’ll be a lurker fest until it’s needed at either alignment.
But whatever
If everyone wants to call it scum panicking then fine, but just note you are all fucking wrong
If you want to leave me out that’s fine: I’ll just treat this like a dance game & I’ll see myself out by myself and prove a point
In post 995, Malakittens wrote:no because obv you are set in your ways that i'm scum and i prob willneed some type of miracle for you to see how i'm town
i just have a hard time trying to explain my gut read in regards to ari/datisi
it might be the flirting thats pinging me, but who knows
just a bad vibe
but std potentially could be town which means i'm wrong somewhere
In post 996, skitter30 wrote:I mean i'm opening the door for said miracle if you'd like to explain ur pov some more
Werent u townreading them at the time of the initial flirting?
No, not because of the flirting.
IDK. I was liking ari's initial posts because she felt like she was trying to move the game along and as for Datisi. I may have just gotten the warm and fuzzy feeling in his inital i'm going to townping her and I like how he didn't care to give his POV.
In post 999, skitter30 wrote:Can u point to something specific ur paranoid over?
I believe I answered this already. I have a tendancy to get pocketed quite easily. once i get townread and i have known/comfortable with the player i kinda just place blinders on and don't think the slot can be scum. it just burned me in two games recently, one which i was able to get out of the pocket and the other which i didnt
i'm just scared if one of dat/ari is scum the other is pocketed and they are going to use each other to manipulate
In post 822, Malakittens wrote:Right now I'm back to being paranoid of being pocketed again. Maybe because i was pocketed by Val in that newbie game or recently I let Math pocket the hell out of me, but it's whatever
i just cant in my right mind place the two of you in a coalition when i cant trust you arent pocketed
Maybe I’m coming around to a ari and dat town again
okay so, i actually did do some rereading of malakittens last night
and i think, on her own, irrespective of anything datisi said, i kind of like mala's posts. (this does not necessarily come through in the stuff i quoted, i just pulled all the ones about datisi in some way so people can evaluate on their own if they want)
i read her play in spring fling and ktane to contrast and there's a distinct edge to her in this game that was not present in her scum games
she does repeatedly call out the datisi/ari dynamic - there's a paranoid part of my brain that says there's some low level WIFOM where she was generally not trusted by the thread and could have been reverse psychology distancing, but idk how
sound
a strategy that is when skitter was trying to shove ari/datisi out of the coalition and it was entirely possible mala and datisi could have both been pushed out in that scenario. it's a bit of playing with fire in that scenario. she also attempted similar distancing in spring fling only for it to blow up on her - i only have secondhand info to rely on for this though because her PT with lukewarm was never released
i kind of scratch my chin and raise my eyebrow at the insistence that "one of" ari/dats is mafia, because it makes my brain paranoid. but the way she interacted with datisi, if only in a very limited sample, feels decent. from her end it doesn't really look partnered to me. 888 in particular feels like it has a decent amount of bite to it and is not awkward like i'd expect from distancing. of course hard to say with limited volume from mala but what there is there seems...fine
idk, don't want to necessarily spend too much time staring into spew, like i said if i take mala in a vacuum and ignore the alignment of everyone else in the game her posting actually seems town for her
Posted: Mon May 23, 2022 2:37 am
by bloodhail
meh actually i checked bears with guns 2 and idk anymore lmao
Posted: Mon May 23, 2022 2:47 am
by bloodhail
nah ok i checked a towngame (mini normal 2271) and i think her play here is much closer to her towngame
