no deadlines mafia [game over]

[Nancy Drew 39]

I don't know how your read of a slot influences Ausuka's survivalism tells.

Eh. I agree that she's a big pile of NAI. I just don't care about lynching her for it on D2. I'd rather lynch someone actively scummy.

Okay, liking this post. Mindmelding on the Ausuka push being really bad.

[Jingle]

Yeah, not what I was saying.

First part was about Ausuka, second was about mastina.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Which is actually a great way to play this game considering the playerlist. I feel that’s likely a play towards more mechanical or logic based players, or players who can be warlocked.

Gamma, Nancy, jingle to an extent. It’s most of the site.

Which category do Gamma, I, Jingle fit into?

I’m nullreading Mastina atm.

[Jingle]

Middle part of mastina's list supports FL's theory, still don't wanna lynch there today.

I kinda hope I'm the secret scumread.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy is the only one who would be worth the potential warlock in that scenario, however

.

It also fares well to go against xtoxm/myself in a way.

I’ve actually felt like Mastina is hoping I kind of just trail off onto someone else.

Mastina brought up that on her reads list Party Boat to Light Gandhi is pretty flexible. I’m on the townie side in between that spectrum which gives her an out to change reads at will on me, at the same time allows my other scum read of Light Ganski to be closer to my side, which gives Mastina an out if I were to push Light more, at the same time keeps a protective side over Light.

Masti

Wrt the bolded. Why?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Agree with the bolded. I really don’t understand the Ausuka push at all.

Beetlejuicing-ish, LHF, inconsistently treating different players attributing the same behaviors, and easily fakeable posts. TBF, no one has actually explained their SR there until now though.

I should probably ISO her but Wisdom pushing her lynch and not giving reasons, is really not helpful.

[Jingle]

That's Wisdom.

And I just gave four reasons. No one pushing the wagon cares enough to make a case. Also, probably an all town wagon.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Eh. mastina will shoot me before endgame if she's scum, so playing to confuse me isn't really a good assumption on her. Also, saying Nancy or Gamma is mechanically minded is pretty

I worked it poorly. Gamma is mechanical based. Very heavily, actually. But TownGamma gets emotional outbreaks sometimes.

Nancy I was skirting around saying she tunnels onto people which is what I meant by the warlock comment. Glad you brought that up because I knew I worded it poorly

Disagree. Scum!Gamma got pretty damn emotional in OK 2. I don’t understand how you saying I cantunnel=warlock thing. I don’t see the connection?

Also, I switched my read on Dann slot, because he actually gave me a VALID reason to do so. Both Jaylow and Saudade, were acting superscumy.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Agree with the bolded. I really don’t understand the Ausuka push at all.

Beetlejuicing-ish, LHF, inconsistently treating different players attributing the same behaviors, and easily fakeable posts. TBF, no one has actually explained their SR there until now though.

What is beetlejucing and what is LHF?

Beetlejuicing=only posting when they get mentioned/voted.

Lhf=low hanging fruit

[Nancy Drew 39]

To be clear, I'm laughing at basically every individual part of that post. They're all gold.

I’m happy to “amuse” you. I guess?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Surface reads from Nancy is pretty :/

Interesting theory. I'll look at her reads list and see where it matches to what I'd make up to be townread here.

???

FL was referring to Mastina, not me.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Honestly though Xtoxm is triggering me a lot as well so idk

And Jingle. Wisdom is probably just bad town here but eh.

Jingle's triggering you? Why?

He seemed very upset about the Dann wagon collasping and I still think he seems different here than in OK 1.

People unvoted Dann for good reason, so why is Jingle so bummed about that?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Yeah, not what I was saying.

First part was about Ausuka, second was about mastina.

Well, I’m mindmelding on both, in that case.

[mastina]

Like having stances on things just for the sake of having stances

No fucking shit?
I'm a replacement who has read the first five pages, the mod's iso, and the content since I replaced in--with most of the immediate content since I replaced in not having been useful to me as it made use of content prior to my replace-in that I have no context for.

When have I implied my stances are anything other than having stances for the sake of stances?
Because that's precisely what they are, and you shouldn't expect anything else.

(Also. There's two VERY specific things I am waiting for--two entirely different, entirely unrelated things, with no relationship to one another but both contribute to what I'm doing now. When one thing I'm waiting for happens, you'll see an IMMEDIATE jump in my content and push; when the other thing happens, similarly so. And with both, I'll be at full capacity but with neither yet having happened, this is like half capacity.)

TheBrie is town

About that.

TheBrie is a player whose stances largely overlap with mine, calling many of the same people town/scum that I do.
So by that metric I should be agreeing.
Except.

Literally everything she posts other than the people she's pushing just looks scummy as fuck.
It's like the people she's pushing comes from a town mindset but everything she does is coming from a scum mindset.

Isn't it kinda suboptimal to lynch a claimed PR when players like Sheep and Vax exist?

Since it's publicly known I'm a jailkeeper, can I just chime in with my expectation that almost every player in the game is going to be a PR?

Like, we're not talking by-the-book, literal, role madness where there is no VT--but where the VTs in the game are token additions, paltry padding in an otherwise PR-centric game?

As in.

This game had 24 players; I'd expect about 4 total VTs, PR heavy?

Yeah, I’m basing my Sheep stuff off of other people right now.

If people give me shit for my third axis stuff, they better also be looking squarely at content like this.

ScumXtoxm has zero reason to give up the sheep push like that to push for a Mastina lynch here as scum. That’s just incredibly inefficient and not worth the mislynch objective, tbh.

Why?

What's the loss in switching from one mislynch to a different mislynch? It's still a mislynch, just a different one. He switched from one wagon that definitely wasn't going through to a different wagon that's probably not going through. There's nothing town about that.

mastina's read of xtoxm is..........................unnatural to say the least

Nope! I have DAMN fucking good reason for this Xtoxm read and if you have some fucking patience I can fucking prove it.

[mastina]

No offense but your posts are far from the clearest, most easy to understand

Except yes they are.
I am verbose SPECIFICALLY SO THAT I COMMUNICATE

MY

EXACT

MEANING.
There are NEVER two ways to interpret statements of mine. (Well, except for when I'm being a cheeky scumfuck. Or I guess when I'm town fakeclaiming/half-claiming which is the same cheekiness applied to the opposite alignment. BUT I DIGRESS.)

There is only the one.

Because there's only one interpretation of what my words mean.
Now, what that interpretation is, you can subdivide to mean a town thing or mean a scum thing, but you can never interpret it to mean one thing when it means something else.

Admittedly, I CAN misspeak.

But.
YOU.

Are literally.

YOU, not others.

YOU.

Are literally.

The ONLY player.

I have EVER encountered.

In the LAST YEAR.

Who hasn't.
Understood.

What I am saying.

So I feel damn fucking in my right to say that the problem's not on my end.

Literally every other fucking person understands; literally every other fucking person doesn't ask the questions you do, because they got it the first time.

So why don't you?

I could argue that really smart scum only sr the more mislynchable players and pocket obvtown.

What do you suppose Purrcocet's locktownread of you would be then?

She obviously does or else she wouldn’t have given me fruit N1.

The problem with Purrcocet is the following.
Follow along with this.
Okay.
So do you agree:
A town player with a fruit vendor role wants to not fruit vend to the nightkill.
You agree with that, right?

Okay, so a town player wants to not fruit vend to the nightkill.

Purrcocet sent fruit to you.
You obviously know that, right?

Okay, so Purrcocet sent fruit to you.

Purrcocet was townreading you as obvtown, right?
Okay, so Purrcocet sent fruit to you, when you were obvtown.

...Why weren't you a nightkill possibility to Purrcocet?

That

is the point I am raising. If Purrcocet thought you were obvtown, then Purrcocet as town would want to avoid fruit vending to you for fear of you eating the nightkill.

In contrast, if Purrcocet is scum who sent fruit to you, knowing who the scum are nightkilling, Purrcocet would know you weren't the one who would die, thus, Purrcocet would know you'd be alive to receive the fruit.

Sheep was your partner in that game and you voice no opinion on his play here wrt to that game.

How could I?

I.
Am.
A.
Fucking.
Replacement.

Who.
Hasn't.
Read.
The.
Game.

Is that not clear enough?

How can I voice my opinion on someone I haven't even really fucking gotten the chance to read the content on?

So of course my answer is to sheep someone who

has

--and who I trust to be

just as recently informed

. It's not like sheep and I talked at all in the scum PT, it's not like we had some sort of scum strategy we discussed; we submitted actions in there, and that was it. The only thing I have from that game is the same thing you do; his posts in the game thread itself.

Except now,

you have

more

than I do

, because you have the WHOLE of this game; I only have a PART of this game.

I dunno about you but if I replaced into a game with my former scumbuddy, the very first thing I’d do would be to ISO them, since based on that, they’d be a relatively easy sort.

Newsflash: I'm NOT you.

I

did

do something similar, but using a vastly different method.
No isos involved.
But reading your posts past my point of replacing in.
I went through a process.
"Town player I just played with--are their posts here almost identical to that towngame we just played?"
The answer was yes.
Given that, "Do I trust this player to be knowledgeable about who they are talking about?" Not for most players, but for your sheepsaysmeep read? Absolutely, yes.

I don’t understand. How are Purr and Dann remotely linked?

I have strong reasons to scumread Purrcocet; I have strong reasons to scumread Dann. However, the scumreads are mutually exclusive, because they simply don't work as scumbuddies given the myriad of interactions I've picked up across the game.

Obviously they could both be town, but that'd mean my scumread on both is wrong and I don't think it is. Well, I think one scumread is and the other isn't. The reasons they don't work as scumbuddies is basically all the stuff I've been talking about. The way votes have unfolded, the general aura of the game, they just don't work as partners but they both, separately, individually, work as scum in spite of me knowing only one of them can be.

I'm pretty clearly outside of my scum range though.

This must've happened before I replaced in because it sure as fuck isn't after I did.

[TheBrie]

Honestly though Xtoxm is triggering me a lot as well so idk

And Jingle. Wisdom is probably just bad town here but eh.

Jingle's triggering you? Why?

He seemed very upset about the Dann wagon collasping and I still think he seems different here than in OK 1.

People unvoted Dann for good reason, so why is Jingle so bummed about that?

Point. I think it was just being fed up with the day going so long. Sounded kind of joking to me. Like he id want a lynch, and that was a lynch that we was happy with, and if we're not going to do that one, we better get another quickly. Kinda blatantly lynch happy in a way that i don't think scum would do. Apart from that I've been getting a town feel from his recently posts. But I'm drawing from no meta. I've played with him, but I think it was all mishmash, and don't remember it that well.


(Wrote this before/during Mastina's last two posts, and got tripped up on the post review. Again. But here it is now.)

[mastina]

I’ve actually felt like Mastina is hoping I kind of just trail off onto someone else.

Frankly I don't give a shit about you and I don't see why I should.

Mastina brought up that on her reads list Party Boat to Light Gandhi is pretty flexible.

A stance which has since changed and is now far more grounded and with only a small pool of four players whose positions are flexible. (Well, approximately four players, anyway.)

For instance you are a hard townread and have been since the get-go.

she’s actively choosing where she wants every player on her reads list.

No shit sherlock. That's literally the fucking point of making a readslist in the first place? It's to visualize where players stand in relationship to one another, and making active deliberate choices on where people are gives active, deliberate thoughts.

I promise (as if people believe promises) I didn't jump here just because Purr says I'm town.

But can you promise that literally any of your read changes aren't because general thread consensus was moving that way?

Purrcocet to town, Flavor Leaf to town, Xtoxm out of scum, Dannflor to town-enough, me from town to mixed, literally every single one of those changed reads is a read that is a thread consensus read.

Kinda feel like i was getting pocketed here

Pot.
Kettle.
Black.

Remind me what your first post about me was?

I'm pretty sure she's ignoring my presence in the game, because I'm ignoring hers. Mastina is easiest to sort when I ignore her.

Oh I am absolutely NOT ignoring you. The polar opposite of it, in fact. Just because I'm not quoting your posts (because there's nothing in them for me to quote) doesn't mean I'm not paying attention to you.

[mastina]

Also, as promised:

I do think there's a chance Xtoxm is wrong about you because I feel like you were not very much into lulzy shitposting as scum before.

Used to not be, but then I got so sick of scum roles I threw up my hands in a "I no longer give a fuck" way, so alas, the towntell no longer holds.

Nothing I've done this game, I haven't done in a recent scumgame, so really, the closest to a towntell for me this game is that this game's a conglomeration of prior scumgames in style.
(Since I only use the same trick once, using the past tricks of all recent prior scumgames would be violating my standards.)


Plus:
Wisdom
Nancy Drew 39
vonflare
Party Boat
Flavor Leaf

Kokichi Oma
Enter
sheepsaysmeep
Wagonomics

Purrcocet/Dannflor

Ausuka
Vaxkiller
light_ganski
Jingle

Trekkie99
Gamma Emerald
TheBrie

singletonking
Dannflor/Purrcocet
Xtoxm

This is pretty much where I'm at. The Ausuka-Jingle pile is the null-pile. Below is scum, above is town.

[TheBrie]

Like having stances on things just for the sake of having stances

No fucking shit?
I'm a replacement who has read the first five pages, the mod's iso, and the content since I replaced in--with most of the immediate content since I replaced in not having been useful to me as it made use of content prior to my replace-in that I have no context for.

When have I implied my stances are anything other than having stances for the sake of stances?
Because that's precisely what they are, and you shouldn't expect anything else.

That does explain some things. Didn't realize how little you had read.

Isn't it kinda suboptimal to lynch a claimed PR when players like Sheep and Vax exist?

Since it's publicly known I'm a jailkeeper, can I just chime in with my expectation that almost every player in the game is going to be a PR?

Like, we're not talking by-the-book, literal, role madness where there is no VT--but where the VTs in the game are token additions, paltry padding in an otherwise PR-centric game?

As in.

This game had 24 players; I'd expect about 4 total VTs, PR heavy?

I think this is quite likely, and also a completely NAI thing to say.

I could argue that really smart scum only sr the more mislynchable players and pocket obvtown.

What do you suppose Purrcocet's locktownread of you would be then?

She obviously does or else she wouldn’t have given me fruit N1.

The problem with Purrcocet is the following.
Follow along with this.
Okay.
So do you agree:
A town player with a fruit vendor role wants to not fruit vend to the nightkill.
You agree with that, right?

Okay, so a town player wants to not fruit vend to the nightkill.

Purrcocet sent fruit to you.
You obviously know that, right?

Okay, so Purrcocet sent fruit to you.

Purrcocet was townreading you as obvtown, right?
Okay, so Purrcocet sent fruit to you, when you were obvtown.

...Why weren't you a nightkill possibility to Purrcocet?

That

is the point I am raising. If Purrcocet thought you were obvtown, then Purrcocet as town would want to avoid fruit vending to you for fear of you eating the nightkill.

In contrast, if Purrcocet is scum who sent fruit to you, knowing who the scum are nightkilling, Purrcocet would know you weren't the one who would die, thus, Purrcocet would know you'd be alive to receive the fruit.

That makes a lot of sense. There was risk there. I think Cheeky was more Obv town, and i don't think it was publically said Nancy was Obv town, but certainly a risk. You're assuming though that Purr would have thought it through to the same conclusion.
And did Nancy say Purr was reading her as obv town to everyone? Just that Purr was TRing from the start.

I don’t understand. How are Purr and Dann remotely linked?

I have strong reasons to scumread Purrcocet; I have strong reasons to scumread Dann. However, the scumreads are mutually exclusive, because they simply don't work as scumbuddies given the myriad of interactions I've picked up across the game.

Obviously they could both be town, but that'd mean my scumread on both is wrong and I don't think it is. Well, I think one scumread is and the other isn't. The reasons they don't work as scumbuddies is basically all the stuff I've been talking about. The way votes have unfolded, the general aura of the game, they just don't work as partners but they both, separately, individually, work as scum in spite of me knowing only one of them can be.

What are you reason for SRing Dan now? I understand before the replacement, but now?

If i was trying to pocket you Mastina, it failed immediately.

Where's you Vonflare Town read come from?

[Wagonomics]

Does mastina want people to invest in her coin?

[Wagonomics]

Purrcocet/Dannflor

Ausuka
Vaxkiller
light_ganski
Jingle

Trekkie99
Gamma Emerald
TheBrie

singletonking
Dannflor/Purrcocet
Xtoxm

Why is there Purr/Dann in the middle and then Dann/Purr at the bottom?

also why is vonflare town?

[mastina]

Does mastina want people to invest in her coin?

To near a lynch, but not reaching a lynch, yes, actually.

Players near a lynch, being in the spotlight, have a chance to show their reads off--people actually listen, even if they normally wouldn't.
The minute the lynch goes through, that same player's posts are never once again read by any other player in the game, beit replacement or original, and thus even if they nailed the scumteam because they got lynched nobody pays them so much as a second thought.

I'd be the first to admit my reads aren't as good as I want them to be--but in spite of them being based on what amounts to hot air risen from the steam from a pile of garbage, I'd like to think that despite where they started out and their self-evident flaws, they are

not

worthless to the point of justifying discarding them and have merit to them.

Particularly my top and bottom tiers.

I mean sure if people sheeped the top and bottom tiers of mine I'd eat the mislynch any ol' day but simply put the moment I die they never ever actually will, so. Near lynch, fine; actually lynched, a waste of your dime.

What are you reason for SRing Dan now? I understand before the replacement, but now?

This hasn't changed in spite of Dannflor's posts since:

The reason I am not unvoting Dannflor is because my read, disregarding my feelings of general game atmosphere, remains unchanged.

Dannflor's content is thoroughly "could be either alignment with a RIDICULOUS amount of ease", with

ever so slightest the scumlean to it

.

So while by feelings of general game atmosphere he should logically be town, when he posts I'm like, "yeah I'm okay lynching this".
It's not the

happiest

lynch (that'd probably be either Xtoxm or singletonking) I'd have, but it's one which I feel is

okay

.

Where's you Vonflare Town read come from?

A pocketing attempt.

[mastina]

Why is there Purr/Dann in the middle and then Dann/Purr at the bottom?

That represents this:

Purrcocet and Dannflor are an either/or now. I don't think that they're both scum, but I DO think one IS scum.

I don’t understand. How are Purr and Dann remotely linked?

I have strong reasons to scumread Purrcocet; I have strong reasons to scumread Dann. However, the scumreads are mutually exclusive, because they simply don't work as scumbuddies given the myriad of interactions I've picked up across the game.

Obviously they could both be town, but that'd mean my scumread on both is wrong and I don't think it is. Well, I think one scumread is and the other isn't. The reasons they don't work as scumbuddies is basically all the stuff I've been talking about. The way votes have unfolded, the general aura of the game, they just don't work as partners but they both, separately, individually, work as scum in spite of me knowing only one of them can be.

Name1/Name2
Name2/Name1 is literally the best way in a readslist to present an either/or dilemma. It represents "one of these is scum and the other is probably town", but makes it clear that I'm not sure which. (Sometimes the orders of the name give a lean, other times, they don't; in this case it goes back and forth enough to not.)

[Dannflor]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... B%5D=30560

Scum!sheep in Box of Silver

This looks exactly like the sheep I know. Granted, I don't have a town frame of reference for Sheep, but nothing in this game really changes my read on him. What do you think is so different about his behavior here?

-reads list wall-

These are the exact kinds of posts that make me feel uneasy about Brie. Surface level they look fine, but every single read and reasoning for that read is ripped directly from elsewhere in the thread.

The "nullish to scummy" pile here is particularly suspect because it's all just "eh not particularly scummy," "maybe scummy," and "hasn't been around much so probably scummy." It looks like someone really struggling to fine "the correct" reasons for scum reading people, and waiting for others to give her the go ahead. Like, she literally asks where she should vote at the end of this post. The rest of her posting is just kinda... luke-warm, lots of empty questions.

Before I forget I wanted to elaborate on my Gamma town read a bit. Gut read is that the emotion and righteous anger possessed by her comes from a town place. Yes, scum can get emotional too, but Gamma reads more frustrated from not getting their point across and the game going in a bad direction for town. It's a similar sort of read that I have on the whole Varsoon and later Nancy/Flavor situation. Gamma is genuine this game, genuinely towny.

For example:

ok can someone case Leo cos I dont see it

I can get that tbh
VOTE: Leodanny

I do not see scum

ever

making this progression. At least not Gamma as scum the way she plays this game. In almost every instance I'd expect the progression to be a lot closer to Sheep's or Brie's waffling.

I have no idea how many vote are on me so I’ll just claim.
I’m a roleblocker. THAT is why I’d been pushing Theta: I GREATLY doubt there’s 2 Jailkeepers and a roleblocker all town in this game.
So now could we wagon actual fucking scum?

Additionally, I don't think a scum Gamma claims unless she has to. The motivation here is to catch scum, not save herself since she knows she'll likely be on the chopping block next if this is wrong. Especially if she's a mafia roleblocker, I just don't see scum giving away that information unless they absolutely have to to avoid being lynched. THEN, they would probably try to use their claim to go after the JK. Pre-empting that is town, IMO.

Jaylol, null
Saudade null

Danifloor: Ugh, hes like taking everyone popular opinions, and playing off past emotions. this looks bad.

I just wanted to say congratulations because I have never seen a worse misspelling of my name before

do you have like, reads? looking through your ISO is like wading through sludge

[Flavor Leaf]

Rawr.