Mini Normal 2125: Chiptune Mafia [The End]

[Aloratom]

Okay, I've got to go to bed for real. It's only 10:30 PM, but it's been an exhausting week. I'll be on tomorrow.

[eyestott]

Spoiler: Every time Taly or myself have talked about my decision to target Paragon in chronological order. Strikethroughs for the parts of posts that arent related to this. Taly has four sets of posting, each separated by me clarifying why targeting Churros would've been a bad idea.

Eye

, why didn't you try to confirm

Churros'

claim was correct?

It would've been very easy for

Churros

-scum to fake a claim altogether and then NK

S_S

So why was

Para

the best target here? He already claimed VT.

But Churros, eyestott checks for vanilla townies. He'd get a negative on you regardless of your alignment.

Exactly.

Eye

could've cleared

Churros'

claim on

S_S

being correct, and thus found a reliable - potentially town - PR.

If anything,

Eye

could've checked if

Churros

fakeclaimed, and if he did, that would've invalidated the

S_S

clear.

But that information doesn't benefit

Eye

-scum, who has more motivation to kill

S_S

over statements like:

I mean, of course I'm not going to die unless eyestott is scum.

Unless you had solid reasoning to believe

S_S

was the kill before EoD3, the fact that

Eye

had the ability to absolve one of the PRs N3 but didn't, is likelier because it wouldn't have served him.

Late-game, scum have to preserve themselves as much as possible by trying to find a reason to doubt EVERYBODY still alive.

Eye's

play executes this perfectly on

Churros

.

Think about why he checked you,

Paragon

:
Even in the world that you are town, he gets someone who he could pocket by having a soft

"clear"

on them, and an additional townie to push a lynch for.

Eye's

play - despite how you slice it - is suboptimal at best, and scum at worst. Makes perfect sense why

Scum Neapolitan

is a valued scum investigative:

It will out the Gun-Smith, 2shot-BP, and 1shot-Vig.

Paragon, what will it take for you to trust that I'm town?
I'm pretty sure at this point that the scumteam is Taly/Churros, mainly from a setup point of view. They also don't seem to understand how the neapolitan actually works.

Something_Smart was the most likely person to be nightkilled other than myself (Though scum leaving me alive to mislynch me now is a good play on their end) because a lynch on him was unlikely for today given the alleged clear from Churros. His death proves that it was the correct decision for me to NOT target him. Taly's question of "why didn't you target the person who ended up dead" answers itself.
Paragon, you asking me to investigate you IS in fact a reason why I investigated you. You taking the initiative to try to extend that leaf to me seemed towny in my eyes, and you're much more active right now than Alo, so It'd be much easier to work together with you than Alo.

Something_Smart was the most likely person to be nightkilled other than myself (Though scum leaving me alive to mislynch me now is a good play on their end) because a lynch on him was unlikely for today given the alleged clear from Churros.

His death proves that it was the correct decision for me to NOT target him.

OK, full-stop.

You thought

S_S'

was always dying N3... and that's the reason you didn't check

Churros

N3 to verify his claim?

What?

The point still stands, you could've greatly helped clear a scumread.

That's a disingenuous move and mode of thinking.

Maybe question PR claims after we lynch someone 4+ people agree is probable scum?

I'm not questioning them, I'm saying this lynch is fine because there's no way all 3 PR claims are fake given everyone else has claimed VT.

Something_Smart, do you believe this setup is balanced?

• 1 mafia rolecop
  
• 1 mafia goon
  
• 1 town 1-shot vig
  
• 1 town 2-shot BP
  
• 1 town novice 1-shot gunsmith
  
• 7 VT

Plus 1 town neapolitan. I'm not sure how he left that out. I'm also not sure how he assumes a mafia rolecop.

Anyway, one of these PRs has to be fake. That's just too much power for Town.

excuse you, do you think

eye

used his check N3 effectively?

instead of saying

"these PRs all are town but that's too much power"

then make a declarative statement or assessment that provides insight about the claims.

Alora, Neapolitan doesn’t work how you think it works


Scum Churros will return a result of not a vannjjla townie
PR Churros will return a result of not a vanilla townie
Why would I target him?

The only correct choices to target would’ve been either paragon or yourself.
Do you think I should’ve targeted you?
If so, why not ask me to target you during D3?

The only correct choices to target would’ve been either paragon or yourself.
Do you think I should’ve targeted you?
If so, why not ask me to target you during D3?

You could have picked Something_Smart also, right?

I could’ve, but with him being the NK, that would’ve been the incorrect decision

It's kind of weird, if you've always suspected I fakeclaimed, why were you content with me jumping into your pocket?

Need me to send you the posts as a reminder?

Can you explain what “me jumping into your pocket” means?

I townread you thinking you had no reason to want a claim as scum.

But you didn't argue this, yet you seem to believe that my PR claim is false from the beginning, or at least potentially.

If you believed my claim was false, why didn't you try to clear

Churros'

again? You still avoid this question.

It's kind of weird, if you've always suspected I fakeclaimed, why were you content with me jumping into your pocket?

Need me to send you the posts as a reminder?

Can you explain what “me jumping into your pocket” means?

I townread you thinking you had no reason to want a claim as scum.

But you didn't argue this, yet you seem to believe that my PR claim is false from the beginning, or at least potentially.

If you believed my claim was false, why didn't you try to clear

Churros'

again? You still avoid this question.

Clear churros by targeting him with my investigation?

Alora, Neapolitan doesn’t work how you think it works


Scum Churros will return a result of not a vannjjla townie
PR Churros will return a result of not a vanilla townie
Why would I target him?

I'm saying it's mostly in Paragon hands because without him, the tie that the game is currently in can't be solved, but a lot of agency on how this plays out as well? You've a vote, don't be pessimistic like that?

Even if things go wrong as well, I thought about it and want the message of this game to be "it's OK to be wrong". In fact I don't think we taking away the victory from eyesott right now is glorious at all because he put a pretty good perfomance until now and the only reason we're here might be the stacked setup. I would be ok with eyesott winning here by this point.

Then yeah, to both you/Paragon supposing you're town Taly,

it's OK to be wrong.

That's all.

V/LA until Tuesday's morning.

p-edit: I can see what you're talking about but I would rather focus on today. Thinking too much ahead is a moot point. Yesterday you thought I would turn into you but the game went in unexpected ways. The same can happen tomorrow. Live in the moment.

oh,

eye

AND

alo

have played a wonderful game, im actually really surprised with their ability, especially in a playerlist with multiple seasoned players. theyve also been the LAST people in the playerlist to actually garner concrete suspicion, which is a feat in any plist that is larger than a Micro.

and yeah, i have gotten invested in this game to being overly competitive and lashing out at others... which isnt like me, and i dont want this behavior to reflect me in future games.

i have no problem with anyone in this game, and actually, i like playing with all 4 of you

para/churros/eye/alo

. dont know if you feel the same way but i wouldnt be sensitive if you felt differently, haha.

but yeah, i do see a solve right now, im going to heed your advice, and we'll see.

p-edit

To be completely frank I'm not 100% on town!you as much as I think that eyesott/Alo with those interactions make more sense as well considering how you vs Alo acted around him today. Your claim makes plenty of sense to me as well considering we may have a scum!neapolitan. I'm not hedging in scum!you this dayphase because I'm doing that, I'm living in the moment.

If we get eye lynched today I'm surely getting NK tonight, and I think you're townier than Alo rn, therefore I'm taking things simple. Even if I wouldn't be NK'ed, I would still do this teamwork with you and take things simple until tomorrow. This is coming from someone that worried a lot about later days as town instead of focusing in the current thing. It never helped me.

In fact, you constantly hedging on scum!Eyesott and defending me, but in the end not voting eyesott, makes me slightly more paranoid of you but I'm gonna chalk it up for now as you being super cautious.

oh no, ive been scumreading

eye

pretty hard since his claim of checking

Paragon

last night.

im just not officially voting yet until i give a nuanced assessment, it feels the most fair.

oh no, ive been scumreading eye pretty hard since his claim of checking Paragon last night.

Paragon, what do you think of Taly’s insistence that I should’ve tried to “clear” Churros last night
Even after I explained multiple times that that’s not how Neapolitan works
It just seems like a weird play, regardless of alignment

Taly
The only way scenario I could’ve gotten a positive result from Churros is if he is a VT fakeclaiming an investigative

I would’ve gotten a negative result if he was scum fakeclaiming, or Town PR telling the truth.
Therefore, THERE IS NO REASON FOR ME TO HAVE INVESTIGATED HIM.

[Taly]

VLA until Thursday, I will have both ISOs done by that time, though, so expect 2+ walls.

[eyestott]

Paragon, Alora! Nows our chance! Both the scum are V/LA, so now the town comes out to play!

[Paragon]

Good point. How are you still confused about how Neapolitan works, Taly? eyestott and I have clarified this several times now. Neapolitan.

Something_Smart would like to hear the reasoning for your misinterpretation, and consequent misunderstanding after eyestott/I clarified it. He believes you to be more mechanically sound than this.

[eyestott]

Taly even QUOTES THE ROLE FROM THE WIKI, yet is feigning ignorance.
What would you like to talk about, Para?

[Paragon]

Regarding 2691:

The second setup you've proposed still seems townsided to me, and Something_Smart would agree, even if we upgraded the mafia neapolitan to a rolecop:

Maybe question PR claims after we lynch someone 4+ people agree is probable scum?

I'm not questioning them, I'm saying this lynch is fine because there's no way all 3 PR claims are fake given everyone else has claimed VT.

Something_Smart, do you believe this setup is balanced?

• 1 mafia rolecop
  
• 1 mafia goon
  
• 1 town 1-shot vig
  
• 1 town 2-shot BP
  
• 1 town novice 1-shot gunsmith
  
• 7 VT

That seems pretty townsided to me.

But I do agree with your assessment of the first, all in all. I'm still struggling to imagine that world.

[Paragon]

Taly even QUOTES THE ROLE FROM THE WIKI, yet is feigning ignorance.
What would you like to talk about, Para?

I suppose I could ask you why you aren't trying to case Churros as scum more, given the fact you know he's scum from your perspective. What's your opinion of the Churros-Taly interactions from Day 1? The whole way Churros came in declaring Taly as his no.1 scumread, and then refusing to talk about it with him. And then the dejected way Taly reacted to it.

Why is that SvS?

[eyestott]

Taly even QUOTES THE ROLE FROM THE WIKI, yet is feigning ignorance.
What would you like to talk about, Para?

I suppose I could ask you why you aren't trying to case Churros as scum more, given the fact you know he's scum from your perspective. What's your opinion of the Churros-Taly interactions from Day 1? The whole way Churros came in declaring Taly as his no.1 scumread, and then refusing to talk about it with him. And then the dejected way Taly reacted to it.

Why is that SvS?

Churros and I DO have a truce against casing eachother...... but this is important!

I haven’t actually looked back at D1 yet, but I’ll get around to that tomorrow morning (as in, in 8-12 hours)
I don’t know who is behind Churros as a player, but he seems like the kind of person to take charge and could easily make a ballsy play like that. Taly was never in any real threat of being lynched, and was townread by pretty much everyone at that point, as far as I can remember. So a new player comes in and shows a completely different perspective to everyone else? It’s definitely plausible. And then scum!Taly could easily feel blindsided by this, and channel that negative emotion to feign outrage.

But I’ll actually look at it tomorrow.

[Paragon]

Looking forward to the analysis tomorrow!

I don't get the truce btw; I'd still read through any cases you two made on each other, and it'd only help me discern your alignments.

[eyestott]

The thing is, if our positions and roles were switched, I’d probably think you were scum purely because of setup imbalance

And so I have no idea how to combat setup-spec related arguments against me
Even though ultimately they’ll prove to be incorrect

[Aloratom]

Regarding 2691:

The second setup you've proposed still seems townsided to me, and Something_Smart would agree, even if we upgraded the mafia neapolitan to a rolecop:

Maybe question PR claims after we lynch someone 4+ people agree is probable scum?

I'm not questioning them, I'm saying this lynch is fine because there's no way all 3 PR claims are fake given everyone else has claimed VT.

Something_Smart, do you believe this setup is balanced?

• 1 mafia rolecop
  
• 1 mafia goon
  
• 1 town 1-shot vig
  
• 1 town 2-shot BP
  
• 1 town novice 1-shot gunsmith
  
• 7 VT

That seems pretty townsided to me.

But I do agree with your assessment of the first, all in all. I'm still struggling to imagine that world.

That setup in 2432. Is that if eyestott is scum, you're assuming he's a rolecop?

[eyestott]

Alora, what can we talk about?

[Aloratom]

As near as I can tell you're pretty sure it's Taly/Churros, right?

[Aloratom]

And good morning btw. From here anyway. I guess there it's good evening.

[eyestott]

It’s 1am! I’m committed to speaking with you!
And yeah, I’m about 70% sure you’re town now
But my read on you is irrelevant because if we lynch correctly today I can just investigate you tonight.

[Aloratom]

That's true. I would be the logical choice. The only choice, really.

[Aloratom]

That's true. I would be the logical choice. The only choice, really.

[Aloratom]

I wish we hadn't missed Paragon.

[eyestott]

Same.

Who are you thinking are the scum out of myself, Taly and Churros now?

[Aloratom]

I'd really like to get his thoughts on the setup he proposed in 2432.

[Aloratom]

That's one of the reasons I need Paragon.

[eyestott]

More importantly, are you willing to lynch either of Taly and Choo Choo Chooo Rose today?

[Aloratom]

One the one hand, I wonder "why is eyestott still alive?" but on the other it looks more and more like Taly and Churros.

[eyestott]

I’m still alive because I’m mislynch bait who messed up his first two actions