UberNinja wrote:I am very serious about lynching shos. I won't lie, I have pulled the white-knighting thing as scum before (the game was deleted), but I am really genuine in my reasons for not wanting to lynch shos (yet). Namely, because I just won a game as scum where we lynched town Day 1 in 3 pages and town never recovered from the suspicion and infighting brought about as to whose fault that was. If I was scum, I kid you not, I would have ridden his wagon until death did us part.
What, exactly, is the argument against shos? The only point brought up against him seems to be OMGUSing his voters during what he (and I) thought was RVS and “flailing” when he expressed bemusement over being voted. The way he reacted to his wagon doesn’t seem scummy to me.
UberNinja wrote:Why vote me without reasoning, and then say someone else is going to give you headaches?
I voted you because I thought you were scummy. I said that Parama would give me headaches because I find players with his playstyle hard to read. I’m not sure why this distinction is lost on you.
As for why I didn’t state my reasons for voting you, I wanted to see who was thinking along the same lines as me so that I could identify them as more likely town, which I now see shos as.
Quilford wrote:a) Just because their reasoning for Parama being scum is valid doesn't mean he is scum. That's what mislynches are.
b) Getting shitty gut reactions does not equal thinking someone is scum. This is the same mistake that Nuwen made and the resulting argument which it spawned has completely consumed my recent posts. I'm at a loss as to how you've missed them.
While I now understand your argument, it wasn't clear to me from your original post and I don't think it was obvious either. But okay.
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:51 pm
by Furcolow
Zar you disappoint me
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:58 pm
by Chiarosicada
Zar wrote:
Ew. This has to be one of the worst posts (if not, the worst) in this thread so far. First of all its so wishy washy it hurts. It also takes the opportunity to tag along with another's opinion. (Which is what, the second time Chiaro parrots another players thoughts?). It also looks like something a buddy would use as an excuse to vote for a partner.
I'm just being honest. I was scared to call Parama scummy for something I wouldn't hesitate to vote most other players for, a scum claim, because I know his meta. When an older player called him scummy anyway, I felt encouraged to do so.
As for being wishy-washy, I've gotten that both as town and as scum but I don't agree with the accusation. Mafia's a nuanced game and town lacks information. I think it's worse to have certainty of players' alignments on page 3, which some people in this game have claimed to have.
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:00 pm
by Chiarosicada
I don't see uberninja as scummy as parama anymore.
UNVOTE: uberninja VOTE: parama
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:12 pm
by Parama
unvote, vote: Chiar
bussin' time
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:18 pm
by shos
Furcolow wrote:shos's interaction to his wagon is scummy
why wouldn't he have addressed this in #224, nothing has changed since then
he's scum skimming, and milking the votecount
What was scummy there? Iirc I just asked wtf.
Uber and parama have already supplied their reasons for votirng me-parama thinks the whole saga was already out of RVS and uber either misread or misrepped me. But you and diddin im still waiting to hear from. Diddin just seems to be lurking behind his rvs vote and you-well answer the question above
Furcolow wrote:shos's interaction to his wagon is scummy
why wouldn't he have addressed this in #224, nothing has changed since then
he's scum skimming, and milking the votecount
What was scummy there? Iirc I just asked wtf.
Uber and parama have already supplied their reasons for votirng me-parama thinks the whole saga was already out of RVS and uber either misread or misrepped me. But you and diddin im still waiting to hear from. Diddin just seems to be lurking behind his rvs vote and you-well answer the question above
Shitty Iphone posticng
the scumminess lies in the lack of you posting your wagon whining in 224
why did you wait to make this post:
You are clearly not following the game, and reading at a skim. You didn't even realize you had 4 votes until the mod edited it! This is the 2nd time you've been woe is me, and you've already flailed at me once.
00berninja reads as noobtown trying too hard, not particularly scummy
. shos, on the other hand, is flailing scum.
Care to ellaborate on the reasons for both opinions?
diddin: You've already covered your thoughts on shos.
What about UberNinja's posts makes you feel this way?? (underlined for clarity)
His posts feel like he's genuinely trying to help out and are giving me some town vibes.
Why are people voting chiaro again?
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:08 pm
by shos
I'm not sure what your point is. firstly, in post 224 I had only three votes; I did not *wait* to write that post, I just saw the votecount and didn't bother to go back and search for your reasons to vote me. hence the word 'remind'. Diddin never supplied a reason - I asked him more than once, he just seems to ignore it(btw, if you think that I'm skimming the game and therefore scum, why are you not calling diddin for his lack of EVERYTHING in this game?); Uberninja gave a bad reason which I posted about already, still waiting for his answer; Parama said his reasons and I responded, it's a dead end discussion so there's nothing much to do about it.
in your only 3 posts with content you managed to bandwagon me with no reason; then tried to invent reasons to that vote; then refused to be active; and then called me opportunistic? did you see WHEN I cast my vote?
this post is terrible
unvote;
vote: shos
soo...what is so terrible in that post?
Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:37 pm
by Vi
This post is me checking in to tell people to vote Parama; everything else since my previous post has been entirely superfluous.
I mean really, no one is saying that a Parama vote is a bad thing even as they pursue their worse votes.
Furcolow wrote:shos's interaction to his wagon is scummy
why wouldn't he have addressed this in #224, nothing has changed since then
he's scum skimming, and milking the votecount
What was scummy there? Iirc I just asked wtf.
Uber and parama have already supplied their reasons for votirng me-parama thinks the whole saga was already out of RVS and uber either misread or misrepped me. But you and diddin im still waiting to hear from. Diddin just seems to be lurking behind his rvs vote and you-well answer the question above
Shitty Iphone posticng
Anybody else think he was [trying to garner sympathy, making excuses, etc] by insinuating he's on a mobile phone?
Anybody else think the "posticng" at the end seems just a little ... oh... FAKE? This is why I'm voting shos. This right here.
Furcolow wrote:shos's interaction to his wagon is scummy
why wouldn't he have addressed this in #224, nothing has changed since then
he's scum skimming, and milking the votecount
What was scummy there? Iirc I just asked wtf.
Uber and parama have already supplied their reasons for votirng me-parama thinks the whole saga was already out of RVS and uber either misread or misrepped me. But you and diddin im still waiting to hear from. Diddin just seems to be lurking behind his rvs vote and you-well answer the question above
Shitty Iphone posticng
the scumminess lies in the lack of you posting your wagon whining in 224
why did you wait to make this post:
You are clearly not following the game, and reading at a skim. You didn't even realize you had 4 votes until the mod edited it! This is the 2nd time you've been woe is me, and you've already flailed at me once.
what is your opinion on yosarian? you've tunneled a lot on shos, but I don't see much productivity otherwise from your slot
UberNinja wrote:Why vote me without reasoning, and then say someone else is going to give you headaches?
I voted you because I thought you were scummy. I said that Parama would give me headaches because I find players with his playstyle hard to read. I’m not sure why this distinction is lost on you.
As for why I didn’t state my reasons for voting you, I wanted to see who was thinking along the same lines as me so that I could identify them as more likely town, which I now see shos as.
or maaaaaaybe it's because you wanted to say "yeah me too" to something instead of striking out on your own and saying why you thought I was scummy, for fear of being shot down on your bullshit reasons, which are clearly bullshit
so please, tell us why you think I was scummy, in your own words.
you have mentioned him a grand total of zero times so far in this game.
care to say anything about chiaro besides opening up a can of WIFOM?
Question: What has chiaro said about me?
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:01 am
by UberNinja
Are you seriously implying your vote is nothing but OMGUS?
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:10 am
by Parama
Question: What has chiaro said about me?
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:02 am
by UberNinja
A lot. Anything in particular you want to point me to?
Or are you just trying to be cute by ignoring my question and asking your own again?
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:12 am
by Parama
Yes
No
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:15 am
by UberNinja
Then do it.
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:54 am
by Parama
Let me paraphrase Chiaro for a second.
"I think Parama's scum claim is scummy. I didn't want to push it though because I have no real case... but since Vi is pushing it, it's okay to push now. This one thing makes Parama scummier than Uber, who I didn't have any reasoning on in the first place. In fact, I have yet to do any scumhunting. But Parama is scum."
I mean... the entirety of his play is based on sheeping others, and acting like he had actual reasoning to back it up. He's sitting around waiting for others to post cases on other players.
Le quotes of relevance:
↑Chiarosicada wrote:However, you were also the first to draw attention to Parama, who I'm also finding scummy for claiming scum. Frankly, I wasn't comfortable calling him out on it due to knowledge of his meta but Vi's vote gives me more confidence.
UberNinja wrote:Why vote me without reasoning, and then say someone else is going to give you headaches?
I voted you because I thought you were scummy.
...
As for why I didn’t state my reasons for voting you, I wanted to see who was thinking along the same lines as me so that I could identify them as more likely town, which I now see shos as.
↑Chiarosicada wrote:I'm just being honest. I was scared to call Parama scummy for something I wouldn't hesitate to vote most other players for, a scum claim, because I know his meta. When an older player called him scummy anyway, I felt encouraged to do so.
I find the third one to be the most incriminating... "I was scared to call Parama scummy" even though it's town's job to scumhunt and call others scum. It also implies a fear of being lynched. Who else is afraid of being lynched? Hmm...
On a side note, Vi is 100% golden-plated confirmed town once Chiaro flips scum.
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:57 am
by UberNinja
I admit I almost voted for him last page based on most of that.
