Mini 1567 - Such Unusual Pretermen... ...Evil Too!

[Kagami]

Well, you're kind of right on point one. Both 214 and 204 imply that you two hadn't read the game much at all at that point, at least.

I don't see the motivation behind the sass there, given that I don't claim that a josh iso led to said vote. To my mind, the Josh's posts probably clear NS and juls (who was already town enough).

The beli vote is in part because of his non-acknowledgement of 28 and also for the defense in 124/180, though I am concerned that josh answered attacks on him so readily, but ignored 33, not to mention the flimsy vote on me after voting geists.

p-edit: why would the vig claim? That was a vig shot and obviously a vig shot.

[geists]

Yes, why wouldn't the vig claim, Kagami? Afraid of having another confirmed town?

[geists]

I don't see the motivation behind the sass there, given that I don't claim that a josh iso led to said vote. To my mind, the Josh's posts probably clear NS and juls (who was already town enough).

Defend this statement. In what way does Josh clear NS?

[Kagami]

or the kill-preventer?

Why do you want conf-innos before they are wagoned?

This is not role madness, mass-claim has significant negative utility.

[Kagami]

Stop trying to townslip.

WTF is that?

Seriously though, Bel was the first mod to accept my off site experience and allow me to sub in on JesusChristMafia. I wasn't going to play this game because I don't know what a peterman is, and I don't watch GoT or read Jane Austin novels. But, I saw that the game had been open for signups for a while, and Belisarius was in it, so I added my name to the list.
Except for JCM, I don't have any completed games on MS, so most mods have been rejecting me because of experience. So, that's the other part of why I'm playing. Empking accepted me, and I love to play the game.

I'll be at a disadvantage because I don't know much about the theme, but scum tells are scum tells, whether I know the theme or not.

[geists]

Alright if ffery is St Traft, I'm the 4/4 angel token!

Is this something game-related that I need to understand, or irrelevant fluff that I can safely ignore?

Or to use a different metaphor, if ffery is the stand user, I'm the Stand.

[Kagami]

You believe that incredible flail was caused by pressure from his buddy?

[Zephyrus]

Leaning Scum

Nobody Special - Absolutely nothing out of him day 1. Lots of conversation but he just voted more-or-less for Josh. Felt like scum resigned to partner getting lynched.
Zephyrus - Didn't like his RVS. Has stuck in my head ever since. Didn't contribute much to day 1 and the hammer felt off. Plus playing the confusion-card so far today.

Vote: Zephyrus

So you believe I hammer my scum buddy? Ok...

[geists]

or the kill-preventer?

Why do you want conf-innos before they are wagoned?

This is not role madness, mass-claim has significant negative utility.

Because we have the advantage--scum are down a member and missed a kill. We have two confirmed towns right now in us and Who, and a strong townblock.

This game might not be role madness, but Empking's games always have something that makes them tick. Massclaim, I defend, does not have negative utility when the tempo advantage gained by confirmed innocents outweighs the scum benefit of picking their nightkills ESPECIALLY in an Empking game.

Also 273 is scumtell in my eyes.

[geists]

So you believe I hammer my scum buddy? Ok...

Zeph, look, I know you're both new and lynchbait but you really gotta try harder to make me think you're not a traitor.

You believe that incredible flail was caused by pressure from his buddy?

I find it MORE likely, to be correct.

[geists]

Like I think your premise for clearing ns is built off an incredibly shaky interaction and is, at it's least menacing, hopelessly misguided.

[Juls]

I do. Who wasn't voting and I had just pointed that out. What better way to earn town points?

I am usually not a fan of mass-claiming and I really think a setup is weak if you can "break" it on Day 2. @geists - convince me why this is a good idea?

[Kagami]

I don't see how tempo matters at all; if anything, it devalues the mass-claim.

If there are 3 living scum, they might be willing to fake-counterclaim to get a lynch in if a PR is wagoned. When there are fewer, any counterclaim is almost certainly going to come from town. Why draw out the conf-innos before we get votes on them worth analyzing, especially when we know the prior setup had both NKs and vanilla-ization?

[geists]

I do. Who wasn't voting and I had just pointed that out. What better way to earn town points?

I am usually not a fan of mass-claiming and I really think a setup is weak if you can "break" it on Day 2. @geists - convince me why this is a good idea?

1. Site meta overall has dissuaded early massclaims for so long now that people don't actually account for it.
2. Read my last post. We have the advantage. Use it.
3. People are not cavalier enough with their power roles. The scum's best advantage is their superior setup knowledge, even the odds. Our primary investigative role is outed, as it stands.
4. When I say massclaim,

I know

I'm right.
5. Go look at the SUPREME. I know what I'm talking about. This setup is likely to have some interesting parallels(see: gunsmith not being negative utility, likely vanillaizer on Who).

[geists]

If there are 3 living scum, they might be willing to fake-counterclaim to get a lynch in if a PR is wagoned. When there are fewer, any counterclaim is almost certainly going to come from town. Why draw out the conf-innos before we get votes on them worth analyzing, especially when we know the prior setup had both NKs and vanilla-ization?

What kind of bizarro logic is this, Kagami? Massclaim gets better the less scum there are simply due to the opportunity cost on something going wrong.

Why do we care about power roles, if last game proves anything they are unreliable!

[Juls]

What is "the SUPREME". Sorry, I have been retired for awhile, I don't get or have forgotten some references.

[Kagami]

If you believe I'm scum and that scum vanilla-ized who, then don't you think I would have carefully checked the playerlist and zapped you instead?

Last game doesn't prove they're unreliable... it's true that roles changed, but inte and espeon both were vanilla'd because their roles were outed, and the town suffered for that, from a spectator's perspective.

What's the "opportunity cost of something going wrong?"

[geists]

We're not going to have any more scum get investigated most likely, so the tangible benefits from hiding information is to protect against addition nks or getting off additional vig shots. Why do we care who, if anyone, scum shoot? Losing vigshots kinda sucks but meh, whoever's in charge clearly isn't using them well.

[Kagami]

I guess it's true that you guys probably wouldn't have doubted kaze if you weren't in probably lylo.

[Kagami]

I would have strongly considered shooting vezok.

[geists]

I guess it's true that you guys probably wouldn't have doubted kaze if you weren't in probably lylo.

what?

[Kagami]

You guys didn't believe kaze-slot about the artefact, and even vigged him.

[Kagami]

I guess that was pre-lylo.

[geists]

What is "the SUPREME". Sorry, I have been retired for awhile, I don't get or have forgotten some references.

Such Unusual Pretermen Rarely Exist Maybe Evil (Too)

If you believe I'm scum and that scum vanilla-ized who, then don't you think I would have carefully checked the playerlist and zapped you instead?

Last game doesn't prove they're unreliable... it's true that roles changed, but inte and espeon both were vanilla'd because their roles were outed, and the town suffered for that, from a spectator's perspective.

What's the "opportunity cost of something going wrong?"

Last game was lost on me taking the advice to scan instead of bulletproofing. And Espeon's role was strictly negative utility. But, yes, the only roles that were reliable was the monkfather last game.

The opportunity cost for scum of fucking up a massclaim with less players is larger, so they're claims are going to be safer and we get a more accurate picture of the setup.

[geists]

You guys didn't believe kaze-slot about the artefact, and even vigged him.

I believed him to be scum outside of the artefact.