Mafiascum.net

In post 257, Korina wrote:
Also, if Dojaj isn't scum, and we put him at L-1, scum will want to hammer that as soon as they feasibly can.
Why? Because that cuts daylight short.

Going back to my point of "Scum don't want town to maximize discussion time", it follows the same point.
If you hammer someone early, that means Town doesn't have that time in the first place.

I agree, which is why I town read F.L

To be fair, I am the IC, so explaining the intent to hammer method there is pretty standard, I feel.

But nonetheless, I wasn’t ready to end the day.

I’m not sure how that makes me feel about Lames, though. That might be a weird thought process coming from scum, haha

Why don’t you think I could possibly be scum with doj?

@Fishy - you say this is not a town game for me? I’m not lurky like this as scum, either, though.

This is really just accidentally got busy me. But I like the fire that you’re giving people for this reason. I don’t know if I town read it, but I like it.

I am not talking about the intent to hammer part. That I get is covering the rules. But as a player you delayed the hammer, you literally said you think dojaj is not the day 1 lynch.

If you are scum with doj, who is most likely going to get the hammer, and dojaj flips scum, that would make you next in line, for you to defend an almost un preventable hammer, is way too risky, a bus would be more advantageous as scum there.

VOTE: Unvote

I think Fish’s irritance towards Lames comes from a townLames. I don’t feel like the attitude towards Fish comes from scum, nor the town read on me.

In post 279, Lamees wrote:I am not talking about the intent to hammer part. That I get is covering the rules. But as a player you delayed the hammer, you literally said you think dojaj is not the day 1 lynch.

If you are scum with doj, who is most likely going to get the hammer, and dojaj flips scum, that would make you next in line, for you to defend an almost un preventable hammer, is way too risky, a bus would be more advantageous as scum there.

Fair. I did get enough from this to change my read on you, though.

Fish did bring up a decent amount of reasons why, as scum, I could do that.

If Doj flips green, then we’re likely looking at scum on the wagon already.

In post 278, Flavor Leaf wrote:@Fishy - you say this is not a town game for me? I’m not lurky like this as scum, either, though.

This is really just accidentally got busy me. But I like the fire that you’re giving people for this reason. I don’t know if I town read it, but I like it.

Listen, I get being busy. I get busy and it doesnt mean I am scum. Doesnt mean you are scum here either. When you admit to lurking and only talking about semantics its add up to more though. And then when you do post its not what im expecting from you as you. Again not saying that these reasons make you scum, but it does make me want to see more out of you here.

In post 282, Formerfish wrote:

In post 278, Flavor Leaf wrote:@Fishy - you say this is not a town game for me? I’m not lurky like this as scum, either, though.

This is really just accidentally got busy me. But I like the fire that you’re giving people for this reason. I don’t know if I town read it, but I like it.

Listen, I get being busy. I get busy and it doesnt mean I am scum. Doesnt mean you are scum here either. When you admit to lurking and only talking about semantics its add up to more though. And then when you do post its not what im expecting from you as you. Again not saying that these reasons make you scum, but it does make me want to see more out of you here.

Fair. Most of my style comes from direct communication. I’m still figuring out who I think is scum. Do you ever have those times when you just don’t have really any scum leaning reads?

In post 283, Flavor Leaf wrote:Do you ever have those times when you just don’t have really any scum leaning reads?

Yeah, that was my issue before my hiatus. Also a main reason why I started playing in newbie games, so I could figure out how not to get in that situation much. It has seemed to have done some good for me though. I have better control over my reads and can articulate why I feel the way I do better.

You could always see what your town reads are up to and who they are looking at. They might have seen something youve missed. Or you could go into more detail about why you dont think dojaj is the lynch today.

To be fair, i am town reading all 4 on the doj wagon.

However, I’m only not town reading brae and acni

We are all confused and it’s because of ina tube players so honestly I’m gonna go ahead and just VOTE: braekss960
I do find formerfish scummy (not out fo spite I’m not that immature)but it’s impossible to get everyone on that wagon since it’s unclear. And I think if we will lynch someone on the mysterious day 1 might as well the inactive player if they’re scum then good but otherwise they’re just being a bad inactive towni to the rest of us who townies who are trying.

if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.

Who do you think that could be and why would you think a scum wouldn't bus him (if I understood you right) particularly if they were more experienced and saw him as a liability?


I'm really not seeing any other scumreads just at the moment tbh, either they are acting well or they are one of the lurkers. I'd suspect therefore that one of the less active players may well be mafia - specifically, brae and acri.


@acri, brae, have you anything to add? May I suggest skimming the game thread and seeing what you can pick up off the surface and posting your thoughts? that's a good place to start.

If I recall correctly the only person who is in any way defending dojaj is Flavor Leaf.

Three scenarios:
A) Flavor is going for towncred by not lynching which has the added benefit of keeping his partner alive longer
B) Flavor is keeping his partner alive
C) Flavor is town

I would put C and A roughly equal... I think he'd be experienced enough not to go down B when dojaj to be quite honest is almost certainly a lost cause if he is indeed scum? So lets say he is the least towny of my townreads, also because of slight lack of activity and thus lack of information to go on...

@formerfish, you've played a lot with him before apparently, have you any thoughts on this?

In post 291, LCpl Jones wrote:@formerfish, you've played a lot with him before apparently, have you any thoughts on this?

Like other than what I have already posted about Leaf/Boon? My memory of his play is a lot more erratic as town. Like I would expect to have him move his vote around a lot and make posts that lack any context and really are just hard to figure out where he is coming from. This feels a lot more metered and stilted. Also the fact that he knows me the best out of anyone here and isnt really making an effort to work with me here is troubling. I dunno if its scum level yet, but why wouldnt you reach out to someone youve worked well with before to figure the game out?

In post 292, Formerfish wrote:

In post 291, LCpl Jones wrote:@formerfish, you've played a lot with him before apparently, have you any thoughts on this?

Like other than what I have already posted about Leaf/Boon? My memory of his play is a lot more erratic as town. Like I would expect to have him move his vote around a lot and make posts that lack any context and really are just hard to figure out where he is coming from. This feels a lot more metered and stilted. Also the fact that he knows me the best out of anyone here and isnt really making an effort to work with me here is troubling. I dunno if its scum level yet, but why wouldnt you reach out to someone youve worked well with before to figure the game out?

Do you think I’d be that erratic in a newbie game?

You’ve out most of your thought s already into this game. I’m analyzing you every post as well, but I’m not quite sure what to make of you past you’re seemingly town minded, however I know you can project this.

Me as your target is quite interesting to me.

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

Lol :’) literally everyone is scum reading me tho.?like I said lunching the inactive player is the smarter move for all of us

In post 294, dojaj wrote:

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

Lol :’) literally everyone is scum reading me tho.?like I said lunching the inactive player is the smarter move for all of us

Which one though? It's starting to look more and more like acri to me (has been online since the questions from ff and myself, and even been online since his prod)

In post 259, Formerfish wrote:Kor, what is your read on Lam so far? I keep going back and forth on her.

On one hand I can see where she is coming from, because Ive made those bad pushes as new town and I get it. On the other hand I feel like she is being intentionally abrasive to try and get a rise out of me (this happens in a lot of my games for some reason...). Like I just feel as if there is a lot of shade being thrown in her posts without a lot of substance to back and of it up.

Sorry for late reply, was out at a local fur-meet all of yesterday.

Looking back through Lam's ISO, I don't really like the back-and-forth voting on Kald/Brae slot in #90, #108, and #118.
It just feels weird to me to have someone be like "Ok, this person isn't talking, let me vote them" to go to "ok they talked, let me unvote" to finally "they're the only lurker, let me vote them".

I liked #137, (the "what if kald is actively lurking" part), mainly because that's a good thought-process. I also understand that scum could fake that thought-process, however, that doesn't stop me from liking it.

#166 also feels weird to me with the "Oh this could be LAMIST". I don't really see that as LAMIST, (which means Look At Me, I'm So Town). I can kinda see where the LAMIST angle could come from, but, that's not what I originally got.
I saw it as "I'm TRing Kor because his playstyle is similar to my town playstyle".

The very bottom part of #170 also feels weird to me. "If we have kald late-game, that only helps scum. Scum would defend kald, and if kald's town, you waste a lynch when it matters".

We wouldn't have Kald late-game is the problem. Kald would get hanged before that point of the game simply as policy. In this case as well, FF even said that he'd bus Kald, and play as SK instead. Hell, I'd do the same exact thing too.

#211 also feels wrong to me. The whole "we have a subbed player, but I'm gonna keep my vote on them to see if they do anything" doesn't really sit right with me. I'm personally not a fan of voting players who just subbed in, unless they are confirmed to be scum in the first place.
If it's getting close to EOD, and we don't have a better lynch, sure, I'd be fine with lynching the subbed player, however, this isn't the case.

Votes are an easy way for town to quickly see who is scum-reading who. Keeping a vote on a player who just subbed in doesn't really tell us a whole lot. You would re-vote them once they did something suspicious, not once they subbed in.

I also don't really like #260, the "Well if you're scum-reading me, I don't really care" part in particular.
I don't think town, especially newb!town would follow that sort of playstyle. I know when I first started out, if someone scum-read me, I was instantly trying to figure out why, and what I could do to change that. I never had a "well i don't care if I'm being scumread" attitude when I originally started.

I also don't really like the "oh well flavor delayed the hammer" posts. Flavor saying that he doesn't think Dojaj isn't the D1 lynch means very little. I could say the same thing and it'd carry the same weight. He's the IC, he's here to help instruct you guys on how to play, but that doesn't mean he's any more likely to be town or scum.

To answer your questions on if Lam is being abrasive or just newb!town, I feel like it could be a bit of both. Some of the things, I could see newb!town doing, however, some of the others I don't really see newb!town doing, (the "I don't care you're SRing me", mainly). I'm also currently scum-leaning Lam. There's a few points that I brought up that I'd be fine with dismissing as newb!town, however, there are others I can't really say the same for.

I'll post the rest of my catch-up in a bit.

In post 266, dojaj wrote:

In post 262, Formerfish wrote:

In post 260, Lamees wrote:Look, I don't mean to offend. But "is that all" type of responses dont mean anything or do anything.

I disagree, I think it depends on the context but there is a difference between dojaj saying "hmmm..." and me expressing disappointment in a specific persons engagement and contribution to the game so far. Which is what I was doing with Leaf. In fact

@Leaf step it up man or you'll leave me no choice but to eventually lynch you.

I never expected you to be the one complaining about shade throwing since you outright called me out saying I am bad. Then when I show where you are bad, you get all emotional and start going to korina for backup, you're prone to omgus, call outplayers, [...]

Shade is very different from calling someone straight out, you know that right? And where did you show me I was bad and I "got emotional?" I would love to see the posts you are making this basis from. "Prone to omgus"- I know my alignment. If someone is trying to push me as scum I have to figure out if they are misguided town, or if they are scum pushing me for a mislynch to try and out a strong player. I got into it with Kor and have him down as town. I have gotten into it with you and have you as a town lean with a reservation for the fact that you cant let me go and worry about anyone else it seems. Tunneled much?

players

respond in a way you dont like, try to get everyone to scum read the player

. Whatevs.

Yeah, welcome to the game. You know that is exactly what we are doing here, trying to lynch scum based off feelings and interactions. I am not going to apologize for pushing a scum read. Why do you have an issue with that?

If you were to read me as scum, I really dont care. Flavor did it. I didnt throw shade? You didnt call me scum though, you tried to one up me or something.

Tried to one up you? What are you seriously even talking about right now?

Yeah shade is very different yet you shaded me before. Tsk tsk disappointing
Hhmmmmm

I don't like this post. I really don't. This just feels hollow once again.
This doesn't feel like it has any real substance to it. It just feels like a "well you did it with me, shame on you" type post.

In post 288, dojaj wrote:We are all confused and it’s because of ina tube players so honestly I’m gonna go ahead and just VOTE: braekss960
I do find formerfish scummy (not out fo spite I’m not that immature)but it’s impossible to get everyone on that wagon since it’s unclear. And I think if we will lynch someone on the mysterious day 1 might as well the inactive player if they’re scum then good but otherwise they’re just being a bad inactive towni to the rest of us who townies who are trying.

If you find FF scummy, then why wouldn't you vote him? Why would you vote the lurker instead?
Lynching the lurker on D1, (unless that's their meta), never gives us information. Lynching active scum however, gives us information. That gives us an idea of who their partner is.

Your vote is bad in this post, and tbqh, it kinda feels like you're trying to direct attention away from yourself onto the lurking slot.

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

The first part of that logic works for anyone but me, FF or Flavor, IMO.
Like me and FF have said before, we'd just bus our team-mate and play as SK if they were a liability.

The second part I wanna address is the hammering vote stuff. Whoever hammers, certainly could be scum. However, they could also be town thinking they were scum. My point I wanna say is that if it is a quick-hammer, I'd certainly treat the hammerer as scum, however, if it's not a quick-hammer, I'd still like to take a look at the hammerer, however, I wouldn't see them as scum to the same degree as if they had quick-hammered.

In post 294, dojaj wrote:

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

Lol :’) literally everyone is scum reading me tho.?like I said lunching the inactive player is the smarter move for all of us

No it actually isn't. Once again, I feel like this is actually an attempt at trying to shift attention from you to the inactive slot.
However, please, explain how lynching the inactive slot is better than lynching someone like you, for example.

In post 298, Korina wrote:

In post 266, dojaj wrote:

In post 262, Formerfish wrote:

In post 260, Lamees wrote:Look, I don't mean to offend. But "is that all" type of responses dont mean anything or do anything.

I disagree, I think it depends on the context but there is a difference between dojaj saying "hmmm..." and me expressing disappointment in a specific persons engagement and contribution to the game so far. Which is what I was doing with Leaf. In fact

@Leaf step it up man or you'll leave me no choice but to eventually lynch you.

I never expected you to be the one complaining about shade throwing since you outright called me out saying I am bad. Then when I show where you are bad, you get all emotional and start going to korina for backup, you're prone to omgus, call outplayers, [...]

Shade is very different from calling someone straight out, you know that right? And where did you show me I was bad and I "got emotional?" I would love to see the posts you are making this basis from. "Prone to omgus"- I know my alignment. If someone is trying to push me as scum I have to figure out if they are misguided town, or if they are scum pushing me for a mislynch to try and out a strong player. I got into it with Kor and have him down as town. I have gotten into it with you and have you as a town lean with a reservation for the fact that you cant let me go and worry about anyone else it seems. Tunneled much?

players

respond in a way you dont like, try to get everyone to scum read the player

. Whatevs.

Yeah, welcome to the game. You know that is exactly what we are doing here, trying to lynch scum based off feelings and interactions. I am not going to apologize for pushing a scum read. Why do you have an issue with that?

If you were to read me as scum, I really dont care. Flavor did it. I didnt throw shade? You didnt call me scum though, you tried to one up me or something.

Tried to one up you? What are you seriously even talking about right now?

Yeah shade is very different yet you shaded me before. Tsk tsk disappointing
Hhmmmmm

I don't like this post. I really don't. This just feels hollow once again.
This doesn't feel like it has any real substance to it. It just feels like a "well you did it with me, shame on you" type post.

In post 288, dojaj wrote:We are all confused and it’s because of ina tube players so honestly I’m gonna go ahead and just VOTE: braekss960
I do find formerfish scummy (not out fo spite I’m not that immature)but it’s impossible to get everyone on that wagon since it’s unclear. And I think if we will lynch someone on the mysterious day 1 might as well the inactive player if they’re scum then good but otherwise they’re just being a bad inactive towni to the rest of us who townies who are trying.

If you find FF scummy, then why wouldn't you vote him? Why would you vote the lurker instead?
Lynching the lurker on D1, (unless that's their meta), never gives us information. Lynching active scum however, gives us information. That gives us an idea of who their partner is.

Your vote is bad in this post, and tbqh, it kinda feels like you're trying to direct attention away from yourself onto the lurking slot.

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

The first part of that logic works for anyone but me, FF or Flavor, IMO.
Like me and FF have said before, we'd just bus our team-mate and play as SK if they were a liability.

The second part I wanna address is the hammering vote stuff. Whoever hammers, certainly could be scum. However, they could also be town thinking they were scum. My point I wanna say is that if it is a quick-hammer, I'd certainly treat the hammerer as scum, however, if it's not a quick-hammer, I'd still like to take a look at the hammerer, however, I wouldn't see them as scum to the same degree as if they had quick-hammered.

In post 294, dojaj wrote:

In post 289, xx2008 wrote:if dojaj is scum, whoever is defending him the most is his scummate.
If he is town, I agree that scum would want to hammer quickly. Whoever casts the hammering vote may be scum. Or, both scum would have already voted against him.

Lol :’) literally everyone is scum reading me tho.?like I said lunching the inactive player is the smarter move for all of us

No it actually isn't. Once again, I feel like this is actually an attempt at trying to shift attention from you to the inactive slot.
However, please, explain how lynching the inactive slot is better than lynching someone like you, for example.

Because if they’re town they’re being bad town by not even contributing. I know I’m nt the best town cuz I freaked all of you out with my messy behavior making you think I’m mafia but at least I’m active and a pet of the community and I try to help push the game forward.