4 TPRs in each Setup
No Backups Ever
Convoluted TPRs.
Now if we actually have EN Gunsmith and Gunsmith backup and One Shot Role Cop as three of our TPRs our town is like kind of fucked on a PR level if we're dealing with the standard datisi 4 TPR setup because lol wut.
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 8:31 am
by Stephen A Smith
like town having a full gunsmith and a backup gunsmith imo is just way too much power esp if town has an ungated protective who can play wifom games with the mafia nightkill. that combined with a follower/rolecop is just absolutely busted in terms of town power
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 8:35 am
by Dwlee99
Eh jailkeeper (which is sort of effectively what your role is?) breaks follow the cop
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 8:37 am
by Dwlee99
Like scum have a roleblock + your protect roleblocks. Gunsmith + backup gunsmith probably get off on average two checks which isn't that strong when two town roles (role cop + backup vigilante) are gunsmith millers. Role cop can get one inno - me, and otherwise just gives setup info.
In post 2780, Andante wrote:Can you tell me how that makes sense though? "Not getting much sus, so I figured he might be maf" like... do you just believe no one else can make reads or what?
Ok i'll rephrase, Stephen was in the middle of the POE(for most ppl anyways), so as an Investigative, i wanted to check someone whos in the middle of the POE
In post 2781, Andante wrote:If hockey is real, I'm not sold that Stephen isn't mafia doctor.. just sayin
yea, there is a possibillity hes mafia doctor, but meh
I think the last scum is between Dwlee/Hockey because I don't think Datisi puts 5 TPRs in this game
we have 3 lims so we can just elim me/dwlee/hockey and auto win
I want to start with Hockey first because scum leaving the gunsmith alive makes very little sense to me and I don't think we're dealing with a Mafia Doctor.
VOTE: HockeyFan
Does Hockey make sense as scum? scum backup gs to a town gs is really swingy, and I'm not sure this setup is approved with that level of scum power + that level of scum-sided swing.
Otherwise if hes not backup gs, does his role make sense with the Nero fuckery on d1?
we may be better forcing Hockey into d6 and having him 1v1 someone lol I think wave was still a fine kill for scum to make
Arguably there's more town power in that game than in this one. And here we have a scum roleblocking role (jailkeeper) + an enabler on a strong town role (alien).
Arguably there's more town power in that game than in this one. And here we have a scum roleblocking role (jailkeeper) + an enabler on a strong town role (alien).
I'd just yeet both eyes and umlaut then pick up the pieces later if needed
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:05 am
by the worst
I didn't tpr read dwlee but that kinda +1s my tpr on them i think. Needing to survive that hard does kinda cause that instinct to be less quick to evalulate your reads ?
I think I tr andante more after yesterday, i think i could hear her mind expanding during our back & forth yesterday
VOTE: eyes my heart keeps resting here.
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:11 am
by the worst
I'm not even sure if eyes is my top scumread?? I think he is but I also really value knowing if his voting was pure or not
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:22 am
by HockeyFan
lol of course more mechinal bullshit So The claimed/dead PRs are
town gunsmith,
town jack-of-all-trades,
backup gunsmith,
Stephens claim alien voyeur whatever,
and Dwlee's claim?
Fwiw, I'm inclined to believe Dwlees claim alot since they had no real to reason to claim there lol(as scum anyways), so can all of these 5 exist in this setup, someone help. @TW, is it plausible for these 5 PRS to exist?
If yes, POE is Umulat/eyes?(leaning towards umulat)
if no, well POE is pretty much me/stephen/dwlee
I think we win either way lol
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:26 am
by the worst
sure. these are all like, moderate strength tprs with groovy role interactions. scum have a fair bit of power/control with their roles. I don't think 5 tprs is outlandish. I think a scum backup gs is slightly more outlandish fwiw.
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:27 am
by the worst
I'm not like...... renown for my setup review talents btw..... my brain is about the size of an apricot...
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:33 am
by the worst
here's the thing I guess. I wouldn't gamble the game on either interpretation being correct; I don't share stephen's confidence in datisi being incapable of shaking up his mod meta. I don't assume for a moment that datisi is so strongly in favour of 4 tprs per setup that he's going to fight the normal review group on their notion of balance. I think this setup is designed so that increasing one faction's ev deliberately nerfs their sheer power (as scum die, town power roles get weaker). I think that design ethos shines brighter than some bizarre notion that 10:3 games MUST;!!! have 4 TPRs. I think that notion is kind of silly.
I also dont think its entirely impossible.
But I think it's a goofy excuse to chainsaw though claimed roles at the expense of just chainsawing scumbags.
I'd rather just eliminate potential scumbags until I'm confident I can solve via day stuff.
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:35 am
by Stephen A Smith
datisi is an artist, he likes 4 tprs because it is pretty
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:36 am
by Stephen A Smith
hockeyfan is the most susp by dayplay too
and him not dying last night is a massive red flag imo
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:38 am
by Stephen A Smith
gunsmith + backup gunsmith is a shitload of power
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:39 am
by the worst
for Stephen to be scum, we would need
- a scum doctor in a gunsmith heavy setup (extremely powerful scum role + 1 reasonably strong scum role + 1 scum anti swing role vs. a gunsmith, backup gunsmith and a couple of millers. which would be insane.)
- Stephen bussing his own enabler, and then correctly guessing that his correct play was to claim literally the most perfect fakeclaim possible
- just to reiterate: half the TPRs being miller variants, one of whom was also a jack-of-a-couple of trades
I'm pretty comfortable just declaring Stephen absolutely town; I think andante is fairly likely town by play (a lot of past criticism about her is kinda the same reason ive just scumread her like two games in a row; she just changes her mind a lot and doesn't slow down to talk thru it much); I think Hockey's role fits the design ethos better as town but I wouldn't bet the game on it; I think Dwlee's play is very consistent and makes a lot of sense but I'm not sure I'd bet the game on that either.
absolutely think that the last scum is in eyes/umlaut.
in a game with 2 gs millers and the inexplicable notion that gs innos are ~~~never quite innos~~~?
sorry, I am just not picking up what youre putting down.
sell me on 2 of [town!eyes, town!umlaut, scum!hockey] by dayplay and you have my sword.
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:41 am
by Stephen A Smith
i pretty much never fakeclaim alien after i get investigated as an inno lol
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:42 am
by the worst
I'd put a scum backup gunsmith in this setup at like, nearly as strong as a doctor. nrg hate scum roles which look town via setup.
again I keep reminding myself that I'm not going to correctly solve this game mechanically so this isn't a wager on the game, I just don't think its a remotely compelling argument to saw through tprs
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:42 am
by the worst
In post 2822, Stephen A Smith wrote:i pretty much never fakeclaim alien after i get investigated as an inno lol
yeah fr
I have trust issues dont mind me qualifying my townread on someone inno'd