Just gonna snip out the highlighted text to respond to. If you want to read the full context, follow the link to the actual post.
↑ itlepip wrote:Guess what, just because someone doesn't provide reasoning doesn't automatically make something NAI. Looking at what the read is and the timing of it can also give you a read. I understand if you can't read it, but
when someone comes along in a generally townread slot and says, yo, this easily could be town, I'm not sure why town would doubtcast that.
I can't tell what the highlighted text is talking about. I assume you're talking about how you, a generally townread slot, are saying "dram could easily be town." I'm doubtcasting that because you haven't provided any good logic as to
why
you're reading that slot as town, and I read it as scum.
As for dramonic's lack of reasoning, yes, it's alignment indicative, because he claims utter confidence in his read, and refuses to make a case for it. That could easily be, and I'm assuming it is, because he doesn't have a reason to actually think Axel is scum, and only has a reason to
claim
that Axel is scum.
↑ itlepip wrote:Same thing but worse because its you.
It's still bad play to call a player scum and provide absolutely no reason for your logic. People jumped down Cakez's throat earlier today because he didn't push tictac, a supposed scumread, hard enough at the end of day one. Dramonic hasn't pushed any of his three scum reads at all, despite considering them "obvious." If they're so obvious, he should be able to communicate why.
I happen to be more turned off by his scumread on me because while he could be correct about Axel, I know he's wrong about me. If he's town, I hope my flip will convince him to reevaluate how terrible his reads are.
↑ itlepip wrote:And it lets me get an inkling of a read on him.
Except what I'm claiming is that his post doesn't give you valid cause to townread him. Saying "I townread him because his posts are useful, and they're useful because they give me a chance to townread him" is circular logic.
↑ itlepip wrote:Okay, that's just not how the game works. Depending on the size of the game, scum need to achieve a certain amount of mislynches to win, with certain roles such as vig and medic affecting that number. What needs to happen for town is to get a few extra scum flips early so that if we do end up in lylo its at worst a 5p and not the awful 7p which 999/1000 times scum just win. Even if you think Dram is 100% unreadable here, unless you have nobody in the game who you think has greater than a rounabouts 4/20 something chance of being scum Dram shouldn't be killed right now. All you are doing right now is again 16/20 times just lowering the necessary mislynch counter by 1 while providing town with nothing to go off of. You are either super lazy town that doesn't want to try to solve the game or just scum.
Scum needs to achieve a certain number of mislynches to win. If you and Cakez are easy mislynches, he can save you for when scum is getting wagoned, and then counterwagon with you. Town got lynched yesterday, and scum!dram hasn't needed to cash in on what you're considering an easy mislynch, when other mislynches happened without his contribution. If a mislynch is happening anyway, dram has no reason to push you. Also, at this point, I'd consider his three highest scumreads easy mislynches.
I think multiple people in this game have a greater than 20% chance of scum. I think dramonic's the highest chance, and even if he's not, he's close to the top. We should lynch scum here to win, and dramonic gives us a great chance of flipping scum, but on the low odds that he isn't, we can at least take solace in the fact that we removed an easy mislynch early. If dramonic has a 90% chance to flip scum, and Cakez (for example) has a 95% chance to flip scum, I lynch dramonic because his mislynch isn't as catastrophic. Note, those are made up numbers. I'm just trying to make a point.
↑ itlepip wrote:His reads are solid in that I can verify that they are coming from a town standpoint and this feels like townplay to me. I think that you are fairly likely to be scum here, but even if you are town here the thought process from Dram is still towny. Town never have 100% reads, you can't try to read people based on the accuracy of their reads, but in whether or not the reads came from town or scum.
You can't verify that his reads are coming from a town standpoint because he OUTRIGHT REFUSES to explain how he came to his conclusions. That's so scummy, and the fact that you don't see it, or are ignoring it, is boggling my mind. You say that you can't judge people based on their reads, but the ONLY thing dram is contributing to the game is three, unwavering, 100% confidence reads. I have to read what I can, and that's all he's giving me.