Mafiascum.net

EBWOP: counterwagon to Klingon.

Other fun from the EE slot: moans that I'm not telling him what my reads are in my scumgames, and moans that I'm not actually re-analysing my reads. I don't think I could be more blatant about re-analysing my reads, honestly. The former isn't my problem either - I have no desire to help you fuel your idiotic push on me, and even if I did, I would tell you to take some fucking initiative and look them up yourself.

I mean, you have been completely wrong about almost everything bar one read. I have had 2-3 scumreads wrong. If anything, you're the one who should be re-analysing your reads, instead of mindlessly ploughing on with the shit reads that appear to have been wrong all game.

Because this is a question that multiple people have asked you, and it still remains unanswered. Your reads are ridiculously fluid - they twist and bend themselves according to whatever suits you. Your read on me is strong evidence of this, your reversal of your read on Elyse is evidence of this.

So if you could answer that question, and then stop shitting up the thread for a few days, maybe I'll get a chance to solve this game.

TWIE, would you go back and reread errant? He kind of picks up on an Elyse push after little or no interest and then drops it again later. Yes also buddied pretty blatantly about the game.

You know, Errant, for someone who's townreading you, I would like to know why your activity is so good elsewhere, yet so mediocre here.

↑ Errantparabola wrote:Nothing in 142 actually matters that much... Eagle is probably town. I see where you got the whole non-voting shit from now.

↑ Errantparabola wrote:I take that back. I don't think Eagle is town. More like null. UNVOTE:
Give me some time to think

↑ Errantparabola wrote:Spifflop, you're my top townread. Just wanted to let you know.
Elyse is a ways behind you but still towny.

↑ Errantparabola wrote:Page 22-24

↑ grapes wrote:eagle, your townread on me is out of place, considering ive done next to nothing

This is the stuff that I hate right here.

↑ grapes wrote:

↑ Errantparabola wrote:I asked grapes why they neglected to provide a firm stance on what happened with kling and chose to ask an open ended question. They did not respond. I think that they are trying to avoid sticking their neck out, if anything.

I can join the fruit train, itlepip is going nowhere.
VOTE: grapes

kinda hard to respond when i haven't been here

and when you put your question in a spoiler lols

Just for you, I'm putting my catchup in multiple posts.

↑ Spifflop wrote:anyone voting spider gwen: wtf are you doing??????

It's not like anyone on that wagon is particularly towny

spifflop, thoughts on the fruit train now that grapes is responding to some things?

Going back to the big list that EE gave earlier (the one with the image that I couldn't see) I absolutely HATE how Eagle says that "Elyse is confident enough so that getting into the middle of things doesn't bother them" SCREAMS conf bias to me

↑ T S O wrote:...where does this jump come from? I'd really love to see your thought process here.

Basically the main reason I was scumreading him was because I found it hard to believe that Eagle would go through with the non-voting gambit, but he provided evidence as to why that was true so I decided that point was a wash

VOTE: eagle

I'm going back to this, mainly because IDK about the grapes wagon anymore (I want spiff's input), and I honestly am not so sure about spifflop-town anymore. Also very hesitant to join Kling wagon
Elyse why Kling > Eagle?

↑ Errantparabola wrote:Looking over 708 right now.
Took me three tries to realize that the spoiler on Elyse's reads list was purposely empty, holy shit I'm dumb
I was initially skeptical of Eagle's read on Elyse because of one early thing I remember being "scum usually doesn't want to get in the middle of things, but Elyse is scum because of getting in the middle of things because Elyse is confident scum" which was very sketchy to me (correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Eagle, because my memory is quite hazy)
But other than that, the case is well constructed. Eagle I've had several encounters with you where I've called your logic bad but I don't really have much to say on this one.
The one thing i'm unsure of is your whole idea of Elyse being opportunistic scum by switiching reads around. I really don't see how switching votes often leads to scummy behavior. I agree with what Titus said about optimal scum play being to push one person strongly to get a mislynch.
I don't really know how what Elyse is doing would lead to a scum victory, could you go in depth on that (or if you already have, please point me to it)

I'm also slightly concerned how you openly state you refuse to interact with your scumreads. Just because you're confident that someeone is scum doesn't mean the rest of us are. So interacting would be a help.

p-edit looked quickly at your recent post and it looks like some of my questions might be answered there. Will respond to that, but for now Eagle, you ain't lookin' too bad. I think I might want to try and reevaluate you because I see you coming up with some decent content.
I see me in the future being less confident with any possible scummy thing you might do actually coming from a scum slot because I've convinced myself otherwise twice now, and I'm getting closer to thinking it might be something akin to playstyle

UNVOTE:

@Varsoon and @ZZZX

Lets talk about errant and rm. Both have been relatively scummy recently. One has at least one person defending him, the other seems to have no one. One has been part of multiple lynches: avoided jumping on scum d1 until the last moment and then participated in town lynches. The other has avoided being part of most lunches and has generally been an all around da.

Pick the scummier thing out of the two in each sentence and let's talk.

Oops. :/ I didn't mean to add those quotes in there. I did want them elsewhere, though. I'll get to that later, I've gotta go to work.

I feel bad poking holes in your points constantly, but it has to be done. I'm going to encourage you to be specific in why you think your reasoning for random-scum doesn't also encompass {Peregrine, TWIE, IAI, MOHIS, inte}, because right now it does.

↑ Passionate Storm wrote:TSO town
Shiro town
Elyse probably town
Garmr town

EE will depend on who he pushes today

Random errant and inte are good votes same with PV

Why are you still alive.

I was told if you were got to later stages of game and still alive, that means scum.
So....yeah.

↑ T S O wrote:I mean, you have been completely wrong about almost everything bar one read. I have had 2-3 scumreads wrong. If anything, you're the one who should be re-analysing your reads, instead of mindlessly ploughing on with the shit reads that appear to have been wrong all game.

But your reads have been dead wrong too....
What?

↑ T S O wrote:I feel bad poking holes in your points constantly, but it has to be done. I'm going to encourage you to be specific in why you think your reasoning for random-scum doesn't also encompass {Peregrine, TWIE, IAI, MOHIS, inte}, because right now it does.

This is the laziest pool of players in existence.
Like saying throwing in all players who aren't at the top of posting or something.

↑ TheWayItEnds wrote:I have infiltrated the ranks of the lurkers in order to study them, how they think, how they act. I have gained deep knowledge of the truths the bind all mafia players together. I can see the lines that connect all things.

Also I read their posts and they are town.

This post made my day, 10/10.

↑ T S O wrote:TWIE, I'm still not townreading MOHIS. I feel like this is a read you feel you need to back for your honour or something, and that's fine, but I really can't afford to be wrong about him, so if you can't actually elucidate on why you think he's town, then just say so.

For your honor? LOL?
What? TSO, what the hell are you smoking?

↑ T S O wrote:I feel bad poking holes in your points constantly, but it has to be done. I'm going to encourage you to be specific in why you think your reasoning for random-scum doesn't also encompass {Peregrine, TWIE, IAI, MOHIS, inte}, because right now it does.

Holes can always be poked since the only solid evidence is the flip and how people react to such things is rarely factually scummy or factually towny. Far too much is subjective to have arguments that can't have holes poked into them.

I feel like random has done more than the lurkers you mentioned and is scummy for additional reasons, including wifoming seemingly endlessly. I'm not sure, though, and so that's why I presented it like that. I think the goal there was to see the thoughts put forth on what is scummier and then discuss the players in further detail. In addition to helping me read random and errant, I think this also helps me read Varsoon and ZZZX if who they say is scummy doesn't match what they say is scummy for some reason.

MOHIS!

Unfortunately I have to go to work in a minute, but if you'd like to talk to me about errant TSO and rm, that would be super cool and I'll defs get back to you first thing when I get off.

↑ T S O wrote:Passionate Storm, the Titus hydra, is conftown.

Where? When did this happen?

I do have to ask because I'm really bad at figuring this out myself when it concerns me: do you think tso misrepresenting me is honest mistake or intentional? And if latter do you think it's because of pride/dislike of me personally/something that makes him not scummy?

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:MOHIS!

Unfortunately I have to go to work in a minute, but if you'd like to talk to me about errant TSO and rm, that would be super cool and I'll defs get back to you first thing when I get off.

TSO is TSO, no read from him right now. He is sitting in my Null pile.
Errant is town, but everytime I have thought Errant was town was actually scum, so skeptical town there.
Randommidget I think is town though. Mostly meta reasons on that.

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:I do have to ask because I'm really bad at figuring this out myself when it concerns me: do you think tso misrepresenting me is honest mistake or intentional? And if latter do you think it's because of pride/dislike of me personally/something that makes him not scummy?

Probably honest mistake.
Miscommunication often happens in games at some point.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:MOHIS!

Unfortunately I have to go to work in a minute, but if you'd like to talk to me about errant TSO and rm, that would be super cool and I'll defs get back to you first thing when I get off.

TSO is TSO, no read from him right now. He is sitting in my Null pile.
Errant is town, but everytime I have thought Errant was town was actually scum, so skeptical town there.
Randommidget I think is town though. Mostly meta reasons on that.

Hmmm. Ok, more on this later.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:I do have to ask because I'm really bad at figuring this out myself when it concerns me: do you think tso misrepresenting me is honest mistake or intentional? And if latter do you think it's because of pride/dislike of me personally/something that makes him not scummy?

Probably honest mistake.
Miscommunication often happens in games at some point.

Alright. I'll get to his posts when I get back thet

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:MOHIS!

Unfortunately I have to go to work in a minute, but if you'd like to talk to me about errant TSO and rm, that would be super cool and I'll defs get back to you first thing when I get off.

TSO is TSO, no read from him right now. He is sitting in my Null pile.
Errant is town, but everytime I have thought Errant was town was actually scum, so skeptical town there.
Randommidget I think is town though. Mostly meta reasons on that.

Out of these three gun-to-your-head who would you lynch today?

I used to always wonder why Thor was such a bitter old curmudgeon. Now I understand how he felt.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ Passionate Storm wrote:TSO town
Shiro town
Elyse probably town
Garmr town

EE will depend on who he pushes today

Random errant and inte are good votes same with PV

Why are you still alive.

I was told if you were got to later stages of game and still alive, that means scum.
So....yeah.

Read the game. Try that. Try reading a single page of this game. This event not only happened ages ago, which I hoped you might have read, but was actually discussed very very recently, for a long period of time. Not only have you not read events in the past, you haven't even read events in the present. So, please. Read the game. Go do that.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ T S O wrote:I mean, you have been completely wrong about almost everything bar one read. I have had 2-3 scumreads wrong. If anything, you're the one who should be re-analysing your reads, instead of mindlessly ploughing on with the shit reads that appear to have been wrong all game.

But your reads have been dead wrong too....
What?

Right on Klingon, pip, Elyse, AJ, SG, PS, Spifflop. Wrong on DS/Alch/grapes. That's a 70% correct rate. That's poor for me. That's not globally poor. I am not sure you have ever had a 70% correct rate as town, for example. I don't really care enough to check.

I am trying to refrain from insulting you here, but it's oh-so-difficult to do when you test my patience with stupid posts like this.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ T S O wrote:I feel bad poking holes in your points constantly, but it has to be done. I'm going to encourage you to be specific in why you think your reasoning for random-scum doesn't also encompass {Peregrine, TWIE, IAI, MOHIS, inte}, because right now it does.

This is the laziest pool of players in existence.
Like saying throwing in all players who aren't at the top of posting or something.

You're fucking useless lurkers. Call yourself what you are. You've had zero useful imput the entire game. Your slot's sole action was to quickhammer town. You didn't help at all d1 when we were busy pushing Klingon, and since then I have forgotten on occasion that you were playing the game.

The only thing that disgusts me more than lurkers is lurkers who don't even fucking admit what they are.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ T S O wrote:TWIE, I'm still not townreading MOHIS. I feel like this is a read you feel you need to back for your honour or something, and that's fine, but I really can't afford to be wrong about him, so if you can't actually elucidate on why you think he's town, then just say so.

For your honor? LOL?
What? TSO, what the hell are you smoking?

I'd rather ask TWIE what the hell he's smoking by having a hard townread on you. Can you suggest why he has that read? I've read your ISO countless times, and I still can't. He has yet to explain it. So the most obvious explanation is the one above.

If you have a good reason for someone to townread you that's not complete and utter rubbish, go ahead and say it. Otherwise, go back to lurking.

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:

↑ T S O wrote:I feel bad poking holes in your points constantly, but it has to be done. I'm going to encourage you to be specific in why you think your reasoning for random-scum doesn't also encompass {Peregrine, TWIE, IAI, MOHIS, inte}, because right now it does.

Holes can always be poked since the only solid evidence is the flip and how people react to such things is rarely factually scummy or factually towny. Far too much is subjective to have arguments that can't have holes poked into them.

I feel like random has done more than the lurkers you mentioned and is scummy for additional reasons, including wifoming seemingly endlessly. I'm not sure, though, and so that's why I presented it like that. I think the goal there was to see the thoughts put forth on what is scummier and then discuss the players in further detail. In addition to helping me read random and errant, I think this also helps me read Varsoon and ZZZX if who they say is scummy doesn't match what they say is scummy for some reason.

Actually, most good cases are fairly watertight. There's a difference between that and a case like this (or your read on me, for example) which is leaking gallons of water. If you have reasons to feel random is scum other than the ones you've presented, I'm all ears. But WIFOM isn't going to be one of them. Random is the sort of player that performs WIFOM regardless of alignment. That's how it is.

↑ My Other Head Is Scum wrote:

↑ Extrapolated Eagle wrote:MOHIS!

Unfortunately I have to go to work in a minute, but if you'd like to talk to me about errant TSO and rm, that would be super cool and I'll defs get back to you first thing when I get off.

TSO is TSO, no read from him right now. He is sitting in my Null pile.
Errant is town, but everytime I have thought Errant was town was actually scum, so skeptical town there.
Randommidget I think is town though. Mostly meta reasons on that.

Given that I am likely the foremost player you should have a read on, a null read just further proves you aren't reading the game.
I worry that your random read is a waste of time, but I'm prepared to hear it out.