Mafiascum.net

A Gaggle of Geese wrote:Can't say, etc. You apply the tell inconsistently though, that's for sure.

farside22 wrote:

far wrote:Let me ask you GG: How many baits were you willing to put out there? How many times are you going to bait a player before they are allowed to respond to false scum hunting?

From what we can interpret of this question, you want to know how often we were going to vote someone with no words to "bait" them into OMGUSing us? Is that the question?
If so, then the answer is just you for the moment. #242 was incredibly scummy, and given that our vote was in #243, how hard is it to figure out why we're voting you?

And What was suspicious about #243? Please share the same thing I pointed out the OGML case here except mine second post was a reminder why OGML case isn't about tunnel vision is about misinterpreting and making false statement.

OhGodMyLife wrote:

Unvote

farside, just because someone doesn't explicitly express suspicion of you doesn't mean they're not suspicious of you. Did you consider the possibility that I unelected you as I became suspicious of you?

GG is saying I'm calling you scum based on your unelect comment when in fact I had a case on you and voted you way before that. His point on me about calling everyone scum that finds me suspicious I suspect is invalid.

A Gaggle of Geese wrote: Also, you have to earn the right to call our logic bullshit. Show. Quote. Argue. Mafia is not a game of rhetoric-shouting.

Pot this is kettle SGR has the right to tell you to take a flying leap.

I noticed in looking at CK's meta a bit he's a troll that likes to spam alot and likes to argue. I'm still looking into more but the boy really spams hard in games.
@Chesskid (CK) Are you doing to tell me that in all the games you played here at MS no one ever called you out for not making a case before? I noticed in a couple of games you vote with a oneline reason but I didn't see anything were you voted based on a feeling. Do you have examples of you playing this way before.

farside22 wrote:
I noticed in looking at CK's meta a bit he's a troll that likes to spam alot and likes to argue. I'm still looking into more but the boy really spams hard in games.
@Chesskid (CK) Are you doing to tell me that in all the games you played here at MS no one ever called you out for not making a case before? I noticed in a couple of games you vote with a oneline reason but I didn't see anything were you voted based on a feeling. Do you have examples of you playing this way before.

Hey, luckily the massive trollololol decided to take this game seriously, isn't it? Guess I'm a calming influence.

Also, checking one half of a hydra's meta, when it was me who desired to vote you without any reason seems sub optimal play at best. I'm sure people have called me out, I'm sure people have called it scummy, I don't actually know, I don't however think find it scummy, which is the argument here, you've played enough games to see unexplained votes, farside.

farside22 wrote:GG is saying I'm calling you scum based on your unelect comment when in fact I had a case on you and voted you way before that. His point on me about calling everyone scum that finds me suspicious I suspect is invalid.

Again, you misrepresent us. Let's try this again:

You suspect OGML and us, both of whom have expressed suspicion of you. The timeline is irrelevant here.
The point we made at the end of #264 was that there is a contradiction in your play.

You have jumped all over OGML for his opinion that if SGR was scum, his most likely buddies were the ones defending him.
And yet, you seem to have no problem believing that OGML and us are scum together, cross-chainsawing and attacking you.
THE ERROR
DO YOU SEE IT
WE CERTAINLY DO.

I can't speak for my other head, since in the QT we both commented immediately after #242 something to the effect of "wow farside is scum". I found it very scummy because I read based on motivation, and there was no pro-town motivation in that post. All I see in that post is sarcasm and discretization.

PEDIT:
Oh hey look namecalling! What does farside have to gain from discrediting our reads by calling Chesskid a troll? Thoughts from the class?
Have you observed spamming in this game? Why are you bringing something clearly irrelevant up?
Both heads of this hydra have almost certainly been called out before for not making cases. Some people believe it to be a scumtell, others don't. We find it very scummy that you find not making cases to be scummy only some of the time. (Read: whenever it suits some underhand purpose)
And yes, I play based on gut/motivation/whatever you want to call it. It works. - Chesskid.

Actually, SGR has no right to tell us to take a flying leap. When we disagreed with those who said Ghostlin was scum, we posted why we believed that, and when we disagree with someone, we have and will continue to explain why, and we demand the favor be returned to us.

-Ninjaed by my other head, as well.

Seacore wrote:I'm assuming it's Chess making most of these gaggle posts, (except for the last one, that reads like Faraday) but it's been ages since I've actually played with Faraday, rather than just have him as my best mod buddy.
So I really want to vote Gaggle right now, but I think it's just that Chess looks scummy, which I saw in [Redacted]. Farside isn't coming off scummy to me at this point.

I agree with everything chess has posted, and have posted some of the things in the farside back/forth.

I find it interesting that SGR went to great lengths to make farside look as town as possible, then just went meh yeah don't care about AGar.

OGML thoughts on farside?

Oh man I should have previewed before I posted that vote, this last bit with farside was juicy.

Pretty certain she's scum, but I'm more interested in seeing where an AGar wagon can go first.

I would certainly prefer she not be elected to go backstage

OhGodMyLife wrote:Pretty certain she's scum, but I'm more interested in seeing where an AGar wagon can go first.

Oh, I want to vote OGML just for this post.


Also, FaraGaggle, it's not the opinions that made me think it was Chessagaggle posting, it was just the style. It was very reminiscent of recent tunneling attacks I've seen him do. At the moment, Gaggle v Farside is null read v null read for me. I'm more interested in a Ghostlin lynch. And I'm going to do some rereading and see whether I'm interested in an OGML lynch.

Considering he was the only one vote voting for so long and decided to start a bandwagon rather than join one that he felt was "pretty certain"... feels like scum. Could even be scum with AGar, but thats with not having a read on AGar.

Weird = Weird I use the expression "Weird" because I am fairly positive farside22 is Towny, but, stand-alone, those posts are scummy.

OMGL, you asked me who I'd rather lynch between Agar and farside22. I ISO'd farside22 and told you why I trust him. I trust him more than I trust Agar. That's all there is to that post. Don't take any deeper meaning from me not writing a ISO EXO on Agar

We are uninterested in either a Ghostlin wagon or an OGML wagon.

These "tunnel attacks", how accurate were they? Recent memory puts past targets as rather darn likely to be scum, though YMMV. What game(s)?

PEDIT:
So weird = scummy. And you've found the majority of Farside's last 10 or so posts to be scummy.
And yet you have a solid townread? Wat?

6 out of 22. Plus, the fact that they are nearly not scummy enough to compare to the rest of the Towny posts.

Well, we had her at null until #242, at which point we both put her at scummy, and then recent developments have firmly cemented her at scum.
FOPOV, she has basically been nonstop discrediting since we encouraged people to vote for her, and has recently started mudslinging and flailing with this "Chesskid a troll" crap.
*shrug*

OhGodMyLife wrote:I find it interesting that SGR went to great lengths to make farside look as town as possible, then just went meh yeah don't care about AGar.

Vote: AGar

How does this line of reasoning lead you to an AGar vote?

AGar wrote:

Locke Lamora wrote:AGar: what exactly do you think was wrong with Ani's logic about WC? As far as I can see, that's a pretty accurate description of what he was doing.

My issue was with his "It's cool I'm not worried about the OMGUS vote on me," which has no purpose being said in the first place then his weak reasoning to re-inforce is random vote on the guy he said he isn't worried about the OMGUS vote coming from.

That totally makes sense in my head.

Your posts prior to this indicated that the vote was for the weak reasoning behind his vote, not the shrugging off of the OMGUS vote prior to that. I'll reiterate my first question, though; what's weak about Ani's reasons for voting WC? To reiterate:

animorpherv1 wrote:All Wraith has done so far is explain how many games he's been in, defend himself and give us a very tiny amount of meta.

SGR: do you rate scumminess on some kind of points-based system?

Huh? Not really, I like to look at everything overall. Which is why farside22 was kinda scummy with the overly defensive tone against Gaggle, but I still feel as if he's town for the rest of his posts.

Oh, you are saying this because i said 6 out of 22? That was in a answer to Gaggle saying I found half of the posts from farside22 scummy, yet I didn't think he was scummy.
Which isn't true, because there were only 6 out of 22 posts I found scummy, and even those were just a little weird due, and they still bought good points.

A Gaggle of Geese wrote:Well, we had her at null until #242, at which point we both put her at scummy, and then recent developments have firmly cemented her at scum.
FOPOV, she has basically been nonstop discrediting since we encouraged people to vote for her, and has recently started mudslinging and flailing with this "Chesskid a troll" crap.
*shrug*

And What was suspicious about #242? Please share. the same thing I pointed out the OGML case hereexcept my second post was a reminder why OGML case isn't about tunnel vision . It's about misinterpreting and making false statement.

*Note: I changed the link so it showed the correct place. I made a few grammar correction to be clear so my point is not ignored a second time.

Also your stating another lie. Before post #242 you stated

We would also not like to see Farside elected, as he is null leaning scum,

This means there was something you supposedly saw before that had you leaning scum on me and now your using a post number saying it's scummy without a reason.

A Gaggle of Geese wrote:I can't speak for my other head, since in the QT we both commented immediately after #242 something to the effect of "wow farside is scum". I found it very scummy because I read based on motivation, and there was no pro-town motivation in that post. All I see in that post is sarcasm and discretization.

Answering it again so it can be ignored again.

As to your other point, about how we "lied", before #242 all we were going off of was vibes. Bad vibes. Hence null leaning scum.
#150 which you linked to may very well have been the source of some of those bad vibes, I honestly don't remember.

A Gaggle of Geese wrote:

A Gaggle of Geese wrote:I can't speak for my other head, since in the QT we both commented immediately after #242 something to the effect of "wow farside is scum". I found it very scummy because I read based on motivation, and there was no pro-town motivation in that post. All I see in that post is sarcasm and discretization.

Sorry I must of missed this.


The only sarcasm was my comment about his unelect. I found it childish behavior from OGML and based more on my case that he's ignoring and seems more pissy as he hasn't said anything so far on why he finds me suspicious. Really if you don't like sarcasm you and I will never get along.
As for the rest of what I said about OGML he stated the following:

OhGodMyLife wrote:Guys, first off, tunnel vision isn't even scummy because its never been a bad thing to try to get the person you're sure is scum lynched, and second I haven't been exhibiting tunnel vision simply because I haven't voted for anyone else. Third, again, its not setting up chain lynches when what I've said is conditional. If scum then scum is the only relation I've posited. Its not like if he flips town I'll go durrr ok well I thought AGar was his scumbuddy so he must still be scum

I can't dispute that comment? I can't put the fact that those reason's listed above didn't cover the case I had on him?

First up, direct responses...

GG wrote:

Ythill wrote:SGR v Ghost is boring me. I feel like the stances are clear on both sides.

We agree with this, in that it is town-on-town and only gets more apparent every time each of them posts.

You v far was fruitful at first, but has become boring as well. My notes have you at dynamic MotR and I'm starting to think that only the chess head is being scummy. That mean either alignment. However, I'm also noting as of this post the absence of a pretty solid Faraday meta scumtell. Hydras are weird (and by that I mean weird, Seacore).

If BS (BackStage) was a majority vote, far would already have been sent and GG'd be @ BS-2. Neither of you is going to be today's lynch. Anyone voting either of you should start paying attention and stop wasting their vote. This includes both of you.

vezo wrote:This isn't town agar I know.

Explain please. I have some experience with town AGar but no meta read at this point.

Hi. Do you like replacing in as scum?

Saint wrote:(1) Perhaps I am reading too much into this. (2) Do you share your scumreads? (3) Who else do you see as being a likely scumteam with OGML?

1. Not "too much," just reading it in the wrong direction. I'm more interested in vote changes than behavioral stuff.
   
2. Yes, and I have in this game. Please do not waste my time with the obvious.
   
3. I don't think OGML is scum per se. And I think associative tells are pointless speculation on D1. If you're asking who I find scummy, the current list is: ani, Ghost, Magna, Wrath, and Apok.

Ghost wrote:Regardless of how you feel about GG or farside, do we really want them to go backstage together, get into a possible argument that might derail and dominate the backstage talk considering how they're going at it RIGHT NOW?

Thought provoking... after consideration, this may actually be desirable for what I have in mind for Backstage. I need to get a solid read on the Geese.

Out of curiosity, if you this the chess head is the head being scummy, while the Faraday head is not, care to guess who made what post by ISO number?
We'd like a chuckle.

Since when was being childish a scumtell?

I just did an ISO of OGML and it's moderately scummy.
There's a lack of scum hunting, there's rhetoric without cases. There's a lot of fluff.

I think OGML is scum. I think OGML could very well be scum with AGar due to two points. 1) AGar is on his list of "if SGR flips scum, these people are scum" there's no info there, so it could just be some light distancing. 2) He votes to start a wagon on AGar, knowing AGar isn't going to be a lynch today, but this way he can say "hey, I try to START a wagon on AGar ages ago, he can't possibly be my buddy.

But that relationship isn't based on whether AGar is scummy, I'll look into that lately.

So at the moment, I'll vote for Ghostlin or OGML, whichever has a larger wagon.