Mini 1353 - Dr. Who Mafia - The End of Time (Game Over)

[Tierce]

I will. But not today, Grey. Not D1. I have a weak townread on him I want to explore a bit further.

[GreyICE]

I will. But not today, Grey. Not D1. I have a weak townread on him I want to explore a bit further.

HHHHEEEEEEEEE'SSSS SCUUUUMMMMMMM

[T-Bone]

@Kortul, if you like my post, what do you think of Acomist? I didn't see you say much about him.

@Zang. Acomist isn't the only one not giving content. Who else gets that free pass to catch up? Besides, Acomist looks pretty caught up to me, it's just all scummy. I think Korlash is likely to be scum too. However, I think I'm more likely to get the Acomist lynch at this point, as no one else seems interested in pursuing Korlash today.

Acomist...acomist...acomist....that post...scummy as fuck. Breaking up my post in a huge wall to deter people from reading it. Frankly I don't want to but just getting to the top of your post I already see errors.

First quote set - This is true. I was talking about Triangle's vote at the time. Your vote at the time was placed during RVS, a vote which you've NEVER actually backed up. Meanwhile I singled out Triangle because he voted after Greenknight explained himself and I felt greenknight's explanation was obviously townie.

Acomist WHY ARE YOU VOTING Greenknight? You've NOT answered this at all. Why is Jason scummy? Why is Starbuck scummy? Because you have mentioned next to nothing about any players. You're avoiding committing to them.

Second, third, fourth, fifth quote set. None of your responses defend your actions they just are insults thrown at me.

Yes Post 141 because you said right in the post "MY POINT STANDS". What point did you make at all during the game?

I'm interested in what Korlash thinks about you because I think he's also scum and if you're scum together he's gotta make something up. You may be content with lynching anyone and not having reads but I'm not. I want to lynch scum and find his teammates, and have my reads well documented in case I get lynched or killed.

More insults...

More insults and sarcasm.

I guess the point is that Acomist is scum and he needs rope. Insulting me documenting my thoughts as I read your ISO is not a defense. I read from left to right, top to bottom. How do you read? Because a lot of your 'defense' makes some sort of insinuation that I read by jumping up and down between words.

Your next post #285 AtE. How does you not having a working computer preclude you from being called on your scummy shit? Boo hoo. I view the thread from my phone for most of the day so reading walls is difficult. Guess no one can call me scum either.

It's real nice that in #286 you FINALLY document some thoughts about your scumreads. Oh by the way, I was reading from top to bottom in case you're confused as to why I asked this question earlier in my post, it's because you hadn't answered it up to that point, until I read down further.

But either way you mean to tell me after all this time that your reads are the top two wagons? How about some other reads?

Onto other developments. Greenknight. I still think Greenknight is an opportunistic lynch.

Starbuck I was paraphrasing when I said "yea maybe alright". So, what about his backing down from Zang don't you like? He could have easily continued to pushed with his flawed reasoning too, but he didn't. To be fair, GreyIce didn't say why he found GK scummy. It's just a lot easier to focus on the people calling you scum then the people not.

I think he took a clear stance. He said "Gray is probably faking, but Zang is taking the fact that people are voting him based on an "obvious lie" from a player he has history with too calmly imo." I interpret that as 'he's not reacting in a town way'. GK documented that he believed the townie reaction was to freak out when someone fakes a guilty on you, so I think that's not fencesitting. Gosh again with the fencesitting. Is that like the go to thing this game? There are some valid points against Jason, and then fencesitting is brought into the picture. These is a case on GK, and now you want to bring fencesitting into the case Starbuck. To me that reads like you just want to add another buzzword to your 'case' against him, whether it's true or not. (It's not)

I don't like this quote at all from Starbuck, "If you are town, maybe you'll work harder next time at not appearing so scummy. If you are scum, maybe you'll work harder next time at not appearing so scummy."

So you're content with lynching GK even if he's town?

[Tierce]

I will. But not today, Grey. Not D1. I have a weak townread on him I want to explore a bit further.

HHHHEEEEEEEEE'SSSS SCUUUUMMMMMMM

Doubt it. Cooperate with me and we'll put kortul back on the table tomorrow.

[Starbuck]

I don't like this quote at all from Starbuck, "If you are town, maybe you'll work harder next time at not appearing so scummy. If you are scum, maybe you'll work harder next time at not appearing so scummy."

So you're content with lynching GK even if he's town?

I was trying to offer him some advice on the chance that I am right or wrong.

I also never said that. I see him as scum and scum must be lynched. If I am wrong about him, then I am wrong, but I won't know that until he flips.

[T-Bone]

That's just how it came across to me.

[GreyICE]

I will. But not today, Grey. Not D1. I have a weak townread on him I want to explore a bit further.

HHHHEEEEEEEEE'SSSS SCUUUUMMMMMMM

Doubt it. Cooperate with me and we'll put kortul back on the table tomorrow.

Vote: JasonT1981

You need to stop believing people are town
Because they play like you would if you were scum pretending to be town

[jasonT1981]

So many things to do, so little time. Knowing how to fly a TARDIS is a bit irrelevant when you don't have one accessible at the moment.

TL;DR: Post tomorrow, must review T-Bone, and was that a kortul vote I saw somewhere? Grey, you should know better.

HE'S SCUM

DAMMIT

LOOK AT HIM

SCUM

No, why don't you fucking do something and explain to us why you have these fucking scum reads on people FFS

[CryMeARiver]

Hey guys.

Jason is scum.

Unvote: Whoever Vote: Jason

That's all.




Nahhh, I won't pull a GreyICE before my longish V/LA

But all he's done:

RVS Zang (which anyone who questions that was RVS is being stupid)
Fencesits (Jason, come on bud, you were doing it)
Defends himself profusely
Attacks Grey for calling out scum without reasoning and votes
Says his views on Grey are shortsighted and unvotes
Keeps attacking Grey
Makes cases on no one else
Defends himself with meta saying that by his attacking Grey that makes him town

Nah bro, you're scum.

Wish me a happy V/LA!

[jasonT1981]

OH FUCK OFF

How many times has it been proven I was not fence sitting and took a fucking stance.

[jasonT1981]

RVS Zang (which anyone who questions that was RVS is being stupid)

So, a vote on Page 1, saying it sounds like a dr who villian is a stupid vote?

Fencesits (Jason, come on bud, you were doing it)

proven I have not been

Defends himself profusely

Kinda had to, haven't I?

Attacks Grey for calling out scum without reasoning and votes

Yes, this is very frustrating, all shouting, no reasoning... tell me thats not annoying?

Says his views on Grey are shortsighted and unvotes

Yes, he does it most games I have seen him do it. Already said vote was out of frustration

Keeps attacking Grey

Gray still giving no reasoning, so attack is valid

Makes cases on no one else

Kinda hard to make cases when I am having to defend myself all the time on the fence sittng that keeps being brought up despite being proven wrong

Defends himself with meta saying that by his attacking Grey that makes him town

No, simply making a point about how I reacted to Gray as scum in another game

Nah bro, you're scum.

Wish me a happy V/LA!

[jasonT1981]

Scum lies in

Tierce
kortul
triangle123
Acosmist

middle of the road

GrayICE
Cryme a river


Town

Starbuck
GreenKnight
Ice
T-Bone
Korlash

[kortul]

It's impossible to be in town in such a hot summer, so for now on weekends i will be mostly V/LA without internet access. On a bright side, it allows watching Dr. Who from a flashdrive, saw the first 7 episodes of Ninth doctor so far. I forgot when last time i were watching funny science fiction, so i am glad i tried it

Back to the game. Answering or asking as i am going through the posts. Hmm, after all those concise to extreme posts Acosmist managed to make a post i was unable to read through after two tries. Will try again when i'll be ISOing him.

With nothing else going on in the game and nothing else to incriminate Zang, how can you say that you were adding a vote that wasn't based on Grey's claim being true?

Starbuck

, so you think that greenknight believed the Grey claim and voted based on it?

I don't think green would have focused on Zang if not for Grey's gambit. Also, green never said that he didn't believe it.

Hmm, of course he focused on Zang because of Grey's gambit, since he didn't like Zang reaction to the gambit. As for green believing it, you do realise that he could believe it in 2 cases - if he is town, or if he is scum together with Zang?

@T-Bone, i am in process of reassessing my reads and doing ISO's, so my will tell my opinion then.

No, why don't you fucking do something and explain to us why you have these fucking scum reads on people FFS

And three posts later you do the same thing?

[MagnaofIllusion]

Vote Count 1.8 - As of post 313

Greenknight (3) - Acosmist, triangle123, Starbuck
jasont1981 (4) - Tierce, Iecerint, GreyICE, CryMeARiver
Acosmist (1) - T-Bone
Starbuck (1) - Greenknight
T-Bone (1) - Korlash

Not Voting (3) - kortul, jasonT1981, Zang

The Current deadline is July 17, 2012 at 10:00 am EDT. Countdown is (expired on 2012-07-17 10:00:00).

With 13 active votes - 7 are required to lynch.

Activity Check - All currently good.

Mod Notes - I will be LA as usual Saturday and Sunday for family weekend duties. Vote Counts will still appear

Korlash will be V/LA from July 7 to July 15.
CryMeARiver will be V/LA from July 8 to July 14.

[jasonT1981]

No, why don't you fucking do something and explain to us why you have these fucking scum reads on people FFS

And three posts later you do the same thing?

Sucks balls, don't it. Was done on purpose to make a point

[kortul]

I went through two ISO's so far, GreyICE and Zang.

GreyICE

. I read through his ISO several times, he is unique. Some of his posts (and general behavior) seem to be done by a spoiled 6-years old child, some posts (those in CAPS) look like roleplaying of DALEK, and some of his posts show good logic and analysis. Since i remember him making normal posts in discussion topics, i assume this is his playing style, and based on comments of other player this is his usual style. So i have to read him on a logical basis. So far he did no direct scum tells/actions. I wish he had more "normal" posts, but our conversations with him are one way so far, so i don't see a point in asking him. Maybe Tierce will introduce that idea to him, like a Rose to Dalek.

As for

Zang

, i've got a question reading the ISOs. After recent posts it seems that in all your games with Grey you were scumbuddies. Did you really were trying to lynch each other in those games? Can you tell the names or give the links to those games? Also, i would like to hear your answer to my question in 283. Will tell my opinion after those answers.

PEdit.

Jason

, ok you made it. Now, if those are your real reads, are you going to explain them? One child in a game is more than enough.

[jasonT1981]

Yes, I do intend to give my reasons later tonight or tomorrow, shattered from work and going to lie down for an hour. I believe I missed 2 people on that list, sorry. Will update with them included when I post next.

[GreyICE]

It's impossible to be in town in such a hot summer, so for now on weekends i will be mostly V/LA without internet access. On a bright side, it allows watching Dr. Who from a flashdrive, saw the first 7 episodes of Ninth doctor so far. I forgot when last time i were watching funny science fiction, so i am glad i tried it

Back to the game. Answering or asking as i am going through the posts. Hmm, after all those concise to extreme posts Acosmist managed to make a post i was unable to read through after two tries. Will try again when i'll be ISOing him.



It's impossible to be in town in such a hot summer, so for now on weekends i will be mostly V/LA without internet access. On a bright side, it allows watching Dr. Who from a flashdrive, saw the first 7 episodes of Ninth doctor so far. I forgot when last time i were watching funny science fiction, so i am glad i tried it Back to the game. Answering or asking as i am going through the posts. Hmm, after all those concise to extreme posts Acosmist managed to make a post i was unable to read through after two tries. Will try again when i'll be ISOing him.

SEE IT'S SHIT LIKE THIS TIERCE

READ IT

YOU SEE THE COMMENTARY ON JASON'S WAGON?

YEAH ME NEITHER.

IT'S PROBABLY THE BIGGEST EVENT IN THE TOWN AND KORTUL'S LIKE "DEE DEE I'M WASHING MY FUCKING HAIR."

Tierce can we fucking kill this scumbag? He blatantly doesn't want to take a stance on Jason's wagon, and there's no townie motive.

[Tierce]

Grey. Teamwork. Please.
You need to realize the fact that you're in a team and that the kortul wagon has no pull today, so move on to the next best case. Compromise.

I really don't like this blind tunneling and it makes me suspicious of you--yes, there is no commentary on jason's wagon on that post, but it's a weekend (when he said he would be V/LA) and kortul is ISOing people, as he said he would.

kortul will be back on the table tomorrow. Today, other fish are due on the frying pan.

[Zang]

Acosmist- Do you think that T-Bone is scum?

Jason- Is there a reason why you didn't list me in your reads?

Oh fuck this.

Vote: Kortul

Why?

That's why I'm not reading them.

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Yeah that shit is completely pointless. No one cares. No one reads it, no one wants to read it. I can read a well constructed paragraph. Or a dozen. But I'm not going to try and follow some thread of some dinky little conversation you're having that's veering off course. If you wanted me to read it, you'd make it readable.

This is horribly anti-town.

@Zang. Acomist isn't the only one not giving content. Who else gets that free pass to catch up? Besides, Acomist looks pretty caught up to me, it's just all scummy. I think Korlash is likely to be scum too. However, I think I'm more likely to get the Acomist lynch at this point, as no one else seems interested in pursuing Korlash today.

I believe that everybody deserves the chance to post content. I try to lynch someone on day 1 for being scummy rather than just because they don't post much content.

I understand the case on Acosmist and I'm not against lynching him,

As for Zang, i've got a question reading the ISOs. After recent posts it seems that in all your games with Grey you were scumbuddies. Did you really were trying to lynch each other in those games? Can you tell the names or give the links to those games? Also, i would like to hear your answer to my question in 283. Will tell my opinion after those answers.

When I said that, I was basing it off of memory.

My games with GreyICE:

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=16125

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19225

My dislike towards him really has nothing to do with his alignment but with his playstyle.

[triangle123]

Acosmist's post 286, where he answered my question about his reads on Jason, Green, and Starbuck, has actually ameliorated my concerns about him. I don't think it's necessarily scummy that he supports both the leading wagons as long as he's able to back up his reasoning for doing so, and I think he's done that sufficiently in 286. At first his null read on Starbuck gave me pause, but the more I think about it, it actually seems a bit townier that he would be so honest about his indecision regarding a player.

I don't understand how asking for some reasoning for scum reads is a loaded question.

I believe Acosmist was referring to when you questioned Grey's scum read on you by adding:

Because I didn't get worked up over what I thought was a joke?

which is mildly misrep-y as there were other players who didn't get "worked up" over the daycop claim either but weren't listed as scummy by Grey. However, I don't really see this instance of misrepresentation as particularly scummy.

Green's case on Starbuck is contrived and rather unsubstantiated. It's another thing that solidifies my scum read on him.

[Iecerint]

Back a day early. Catching up tomorrow.

[kortul]

Grey, Jason wagon isn't the most important thing in the world after the Doctor and TARDIS, so i don't see why should i comment on Jason or his wagon every time i post. I already gave my position on him recently, and not much changed since that time. But i am reassesing my reads anyway, and the order of ISO isn't that important to me, so i will do his ISO next (most likely this evening).

My read on

Zang

, after the ISO and his answers, is slightly leaning scum. When Grey made his claim, Zang told that it is obvious lie. He also said that "We both hate the other's playstyle and usually want them lynched" was the reason for this. When i asked him about the details, his answer was "I haven't played with him in a while but from what I can remember, he is very overly aggressive". Recently GreyICE mentioned, that they played with Zang together two times, and both times they were scumbuddies.

I did a quick double ISOs (Grey/Zang) in both games, and came to conclusion that the part that they don't like each other playstyle is true, but "usually want them lynched" is exaggeration. Also, last game finished like 9 months ago, so their relations aren't exactly fresh. That's why using this playstyle dislike as a reason to show that GreyICE claim is a lie now sounds to me like defensive discrediting of the claim just in case Grey is serious, and that is possible only if Zang is scum (Zang-town would know that claim a lie and there is no need to come up with extra reasons to explain that). That would also explain two posts, that sounded wrong the first time i saw them:

I just know that it's a lie because I know the history that GreyICE has with me (aside from the fact that I know that I'm town).

How the knowledge that Zang has a history with Grey is more important to him then the knowledge that he is town? When i saw this first time, i assumed that their games with Grey were recent and the hatred still fresh, but apparently that's not the case.

I assume GreyICE is admitting that the whole cop thing wasn't real.

Just to remind you, the claim of "I'm a daycop, I can't read his useless ass, so guess what I did?" was followed by "Zang is actually town folks". With such a wording it sounded like a second claim, Korlash and me asked about it, and as we know now Iecrint actually believed this to be a second claim. So, if Zang is town, who thinks that Grey did a claim because of history between them and the desire to lynch Zang, why hearing these words along with unvote he assumed that the whole cop thing wasn't real, not that he is conf town now?

The rest of Zang posts are actually ok - he is asking relevant questions, isn't nitpicking, isn't afraid of discussions or of changing position, and without those posts i would be leaning town on Zang. Thing is, i am much much more experienced in RL games, where things happen fast and there are no flips, so i doubt my reasoning of preemptive discrediting - in RL game such defence would be actually useful, but what about forum games? Nobody else commented things that caught my attention, so i am interested in opinions.

[Acosmist]

Chrome seems to be working ok. I will read now and make a post before I go get a coffee. WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[Acosmist]

See posts like 284, 287, and 289?

I'm not reading those

Agreed. Walls are awful in mafia and awful in life. Especially MTG.