Mafiascum.net

Just a note, here's a site: http://www.probuilds.net/champions/Veigar

If someone here says "it's a noobtrap" and you see the item on multiple players who have played that champion, disregard everything they posted.

This has been your PSA of the day.

On cdr veigar vs full dmgs veigar:

Similar to cdr lb vs full dmgs lb, it's a difference in thought process. With the athene's build, you're putting yourself solidly in the cdr range of someone that can get off your spell rotations frequently to abuse good base damage (or in veigar's case infinite free ap), giving yourself survivability, and getting solid mana sustain (anyone that assumes you'll always have a blue buff active on you / veigar passive is enough is silly). This also gives you more pushing and farm potential (farming veigar q is huge).

On the other hand, the damage build asserts as much presence as possible on one, maybe two, targets with the thought process of "burst one thing down before it can do anything, win game" which works when done right but has more risk involved in the sense that if you blow your rotation and they live... you're fucked. The cdr build is less likely to insta-burst people but provides more up-time on your burst casts.

It's a matter of playstyle, though I'm in the "build athene's on every ap champion that uses mana" camp. Not literally all of them, but close enough.

I'd probably do DFG first if the MR from Athene's was immaterial in lane.

In post 31322, FakeGod wrote:So.

Getting DFG first means that I can 100 to 0 whoever I'm laning against when I come back to lane.

Whereas, any other item as the first item doesn't allow me to do this.

Farming Q bit faster is nice, but it's not as necessary for Veigar to farm Q as much as it is for Nasus.

I feel that early Chalice isn't important for the mana anyway, since as the mid laner I should be getting a blue.

I mostly build it when I'm up against a champion who can reliably deal magic damage to me, similarly to when I build Armguard versus Yasuo/Zed, etc.

Personal experience, Veigar's passive isn't enough to sustain constant Q/W farming in lane.
Wheras Chalice added on top of Veigar's passive synergizes to give a fairly large mana pool and barely enough to do the Q/W farming mentioned above.

In normals or in solo queue you cannot reliably get blue.
*ahem* I mean, some junglers don't give you blue.
Also, you can die quite often. You might not get to keep blue.

Getting blue in no way justifies not getting a chalice.

Chalice is a necessity. Athene's is a necessity. Whether or not Athene's is to be bought earlier than damage or later than damage at what point is up for debate but the fact you must get a chalice on your first or second back does not change. Even against AD champions.

I've seen (and lost because of) players who play Udyr and build like this: Boots-Wriggles/Flare-Elder Lizard-Zephyr saying that this is the way trick2g builds and therefore the way all Udyrs must build.

As if playing Udyr isn't bad enough, you go ahead and do this shit.
-____-

madstone is a great build though. I love Trick's videos but they're not like...instructional.

In post 31321, Saki wrote:The enemy walks into a bush you warded. Not really a mistake but you can capitalize upon it in the form of gtfo if it's their jungler or harassing for enemy laners.]

*Jungler sits in my warded bush for 10 seconds, stays there and gets a ability hocked at them from afar*

And if you see them, try to make it look like your gonna push, make them think they are gonna be useful cause it keeps them there longer.

As for Veigar, personally i feel the ability to blow 3/4 people up late game is better then the ability to blow 1 person up early, especially since your veigar and more of a farm champ then a snowball champ.

If your going for more of the one target early damage i feel like picking veigar isn't necessarily best, but hey whatever floats your boat.

In post 31330, Oman wrote:madstone is a great build though. I love Trick's videos but they're not like...instructional.

Madstone works, for those who actually know how to use it, the problem being, he doesn't actually explain when to build it and when to not build it.

Hint: Never go for a fucking FF if your lanes are losing, if your on an FF champ that doesn't mean you have to go FF, that just means you can if lanes are ahead.

In post 31328, Saki wrote: Personal experience

Um, I thought you said you don't play Veigar.

Cause you have to have played a champ to have had experience with them.

In post 31334, JasonWazza wrote:Cause you have to have played a champ to have had experience with them.

Uhhh, isn't that the definition of "I had experience with [champion]"?

What do you define as "experience"?

Playing with/against said champions.

Watching people play said champions (though i don't count that as much.)

You can pick up the patterns without actually playing them, i've played him a decent amount of times and had mana problems with him even while i have blue, chalice and his passive (this may or may not have been before i learned about mana conservation relatively well)

Mmmmk.

Like for example, I've seen players who play Sion.

I've played against him and had him on my team numerous times over the years, but I've never played as Sion.

I doubt I could give any sort of advice on how to play Sion, other than really basic ones.

Maybe that's just me being pedantic about knowing a champ inside and out if they are on my or the enemy's team....

If i encounter a champ that's rarely played (or that i see rarely played) i quickly do a good look over the Wiki about the champion.

I mean sure, I know from the Wiki that Sion can cast a stun and its dmg scales with AP, he can shield himself that explodes after a bit which also scales with AP, the thing that raises his max hp, and he has massive lifesteal ult.

I still doubt I could give any sort of advice on how to play Sion, other than really basic ones.

Stack AP and hope the enemy team doesn't know to break the shield, I think is what it amounts to.

Which AP items and in what order?

Also, is going AP the correct choice? Why not tanky AD or some other shit?

I wouldn't be able to answer any of these questions.

This PBE update is HUGE! Let's list:



... holy crap.

Riot made a thread about his rework here. Probably relevant to some of that.

I understand that you meant it rhetorically, but.

I have honestly not seen Sion in months.

Possibly years.

I saw him one time when I was playing with AP a week or so ago. He shielded my Ace in the Hole. :[

that's unfortunate

did he do well?

[quote="In post 31342, FakeGod"][/quote]


AP Sion can play pretty well with standard APC items, from what I've seen - and he can go AD as well, but the AP kit largely outclasses the AD kit (despite the AP kit only really focusing on two abilities).

Sion is scary, that's all