Datisi's Café [game over!]

[Andresvmb]

And if I’m Scum, why am I even bothering to read through slots that are more peripheral to what’s actually occurring today? It’s like surely I’m looking to clear slots as Scum upon my flip that would make it what, harder for my supposed Partner to win? I just don’t get it.

[Ydrasse]

nd i dont put that much stock in like meta play either tbf
some vibes yes but generally i just kinda go Watever at meta because things can always change

[Ydrasse]

Dann said it smarter than me

[Andresvmb]

Andres I need to get a better sense of who you think is scum

I feel like you’re afraid to push anywhere

It’s all defense no trying to solve the game which you really should be as town if you are this uncertain about who scum could be

I literally gave you a ranking of all of the slots in the game. And I think I’ve commented on basically everybody. My next ISO was going to be Mala who I read through some of their posts and I didn’t think there was much solving there. But they defended me so consistently I can’t bring myself to attack the slot. And I had some homework in that I needed to justify the summary I provided for Klick but I didn’t get around to it just yet.

[Andresvmb]

And yeah I am tentative. I don’t feel confident enough right now to lead.

[Dannflor]

Okay but your ranking has no outright scum reads, me at neutral, and jjh at uncertain

Like, there’s no urgency behind fixing that

I feel like as town your top priority would be sorting me and jjh but I don’t really see that?

Like mechanically you are doing the work of ISOing and sorting but I feel like your heart isn’t in it exactly? Like you are sorting but not reaching any solid conclusions. Which is fine… I’m often uncertain too, but I don’t really get the sense you feel like you need or even particularly want to fix that

[Andresvmb]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=88600

this game, for instance

which malakittens was not in

What is your point about my play that game btw? I’m not sure I follow what it is you’re trying to say.

[Andresvmb]

Okay but your ranking has no outright scum reads, me at neutral, and jjh at uncertain

Like, there’s no urgency behind fixing that

I feel like as town your top priority would be sorting me and jjh but I don’t really see that?

Like mechanically you are doing the work of ISOing and sorting but I feel like your heart isn’t in it exactly? Like you are sorting but not reaching any solid conclusions. Which is fine… I’m often uncertain too, but I don’t really get the sense you feel like you need or even particularly want to fix that

I have a Lean Scum in Uncrowned that basically no one agrees with, and I am somewhat skeptical of PenguinPower for various reasons I have already explained. I’m actually beginning to feel okay about your slot funny enough (if you just wanted to get rid of me as the easiest execution, you wouldn’t be asking me questions as openly as you seem to be, but rather condemning me in a way similar to how fire say is arguing against my slot), which makes me doubt fire’s alignment a bit more.

[Dannflor]

my point was malakittens was using a point of reference that was you low posting and basically flaking out as scum

I just linked that game to show that you can obviously do a lot more as scum. That doesn't mean you *are* scum I just don't think malakittens' read is good

[Dannflor]

btw was there a reason we aren't killing fire today i forgot

[Andresvmb]

I don’t agree that my heart isn’t in it btw. Me expressing uncertainty does not speak to motivation. I may be busy sometimes during the week and my job is just heavy at the moment (which is why I haven’t signed up to any games in months). But when I’m here, it’s not like I’m not here trying to solve. If I was just hanging out or just defending myself that would be one thing. But I’ve tried looking through votes, reading through Titus’ comments, read through the beginning multiple times, ISO’ed multiple players. Like I don’t get how you come to the conclusion that I’m not at least trying.

[Dannflor]

Can you talk to me a little bit about jjh? I realize you said you hadn't iso'd them yet but even just vague uncertain feelings would be nice to hear

that slot just kinda makes my eyes go fuzzy when I try to read it

[Dannflor]

I don’t agree that my heart isn’t in it btw. Me expressing uncertainty does not speak to motivation. I may be busy sometimes during the week and my job is just heavy at the moment (which is why I haven’t signed up to any games in months). But when I’m here, it’s not like I’m not here trying to solve. If I was just hanging out or just defending myself that would be one thing. But I’ve tried looking through votes, reading through Titus’ comments, read through the beginning multiple times, ISO’ed multiple players. Like I don’t get how you come to the conclusion that I’m not at least trying.

I think a lot of the time the line between "scum trying to look like they are trying but not actually do anything" and "townie trying to do stuff but struggling" is a thin one

and I'm not entirely certain where you are

I'm sorry if you are town I know it sucks to be told you aren't trying when you really are, I'm just trying to gauge how performative it is and I find not having really any major scum reads to speak of suspect after doing so much sorting. Like it reads maybe like you don't want to get your hands dirty on like a furtive wagon or anything like that. I guess you have been pushing Uncrowned though so maybe that isn't entirely fair

[Dannflor]

not having any major scum reads to speak of is suspect*

[Andresvmb]

my point was malakittens was using a point of reference that was you low posting and basically flaking out as scum

I just linked that game to show that you can obviously do a lot more as scum. That doesn't mean you *are* scum I just don't think malakittens' read is good

Yeah I mean I don’t roll over as Scum all the time obviously. I don’t like to lose so if I have the time I’ll put effort in as either alignment. But I think I’ve been much more transparent here with my thoughts. I just don’t understand how you can see a Scum agenda behind what I’m pushing. So I tried to condemn Titus after trying to make sure the focus stayed on them (and I was criticized for it) in a game where their execution makes me look a bit foolish… instead of defending them all the way? Like why? You can’t play as Scum to defend all of your blind spots but surely you must think I had some motivation to try and protect Titus not to be linked with them and I don’t do that after Roden flips Town.

[Andresvmb]

But I have expressed Scum Reads. It’s just that some of it has been short circuited because mechanically the game has shaken out in weird ways. Titus was caught lying and I didn’t for a second doubt myself there. And that stopped me from immersing myself in the play and analyzing the slot, which I clearly was in the middle of doing. mastina also hijacked a lot of the conversation yesterday with their mechanical push on fire. And I pushed against Vivax D1 quite strongly (particularly for their read on Lukewarm) and I was right on the read, wrong on the player. And I have been questioning Uncrowned sharply. If I didn’t want to get my hands dirty, shit I would be proclaiming some players are Town from the sidelines, saying whoever has the least amount of posts that they’re Scum, and avoiding the thread.

[Andresvmb]

To tell you the truth, I am uncertain on jjh because they feel like they’re almost deliberately avoiding posting a whole lot.

[Andresvmb]

Like what am I supposed to feel strongly about exactly? And there’s a lot of slots like that. But I’m getting blamed for having a lot of uncertain feelings on players, at a time when a lot of players are actively refusing to put votes down or play this game a whole lot.

[Andresvmb]

Frankly sometimes I feel like just sheeping mastina and calling it a day. And I mean I defended furtive quite loudly. Do you think I was wrong? Are they Scum to you? Because if they’re Town to you, do you think I have any motivation ever to try and break up a mis-execution today?

[Andresvmb]

VOTE: andres

Like this slot hasn’t read my posts but comes out of VLA to vote me when a wagon builds?

[Dannflor]

I think you would have motivation to not be on a wagon that'll flip town and make it look convincing, but I don't necessarily think you were wrong no

[Dannflor]

eurgh am i being pocketed by PP

[fireisredsir]

hm

VOTE: klick

[Andresvmb]

I think you would have motivation to not be on a wagon that'll flip town and make it look convincing, but I don't necessarily think you were wrong no

Not after losing two of my Partners. In a vacuum, yes. Today? Absolutely not. Never. I’m not suicidal as Scum.

[Dannflor]

I think people are generally overestimating the value of "scum would never bus with 2 scum left"

scum bus for no rhyme or reason