Mafiascum.net

In post 3345, Andresvmb wrote:

In post 3339, InsidiousLemons wrote:i'm willing to call this a scumslip. in trying to curry favour by defending players she knows to be town, scum!asteria has revealed that she is mentally counting herself as armed mafioso rather than as her real claim. town!asteria does not believe that koba and i are both telling the truth, because to believe so necessitates the belief that none of the mafia are armed. and we know she didn't just miss the andante flip because she directly quotes anya's "rip andante" message earlier in the same post.

I’m not following this logic at all. Walk me through it like I was a child.

we have 4 gunned PR claims:
- Andante as gunsmith (confirmed)
- Asteria as neapolitan (unconfirmed)
- DK as weak vig (unconfirmed)
- me as role cop (unconfirmed)

knowing that we have 4 guns in play, the possibilities are:

- Andante + 2 gunned mafia + {Asteria, Dk, or me}
- Andante + 1 gunned mafioso + {Asteria and Dk, Asteria and me, or Dk and me)

Asteria is approaching this from the perspective that 2 people are telling the truth, which puts us in the second scenario. she asserts that these 2 people are myself and Dk, which would make what sense does it make for a real Neapolitan to make this mistake? did she forget what was in her role PM? did she forget that andante died? not likely. what's more plausible to me is that, because she is already accounted for as the gunned mafioso, she forgot to account for herself again in the PR pool. the only way for this to have happened is by a massive blunder of logic, and the explanation for that blunfer that makes the most sense to me is that asteria forgot to account for herself in the PR claims.

Or there’s an embedded assumption that this game actually has a traitor. No?

Or is that your second situation?

No you’re right it is the second situation.

In post 3347, VFP wrote:Anya is going to be the best lim here as scum Lemon's makes a claim like that to ensure Anya is safe. Meaning Anya is something important to scum.
I'm thinking Lemons is actually the traitor here.

if i'm the traitor then how do i know who is and isn't important to scum? sure, maybe i'm just a goon, but the fact that you didn't think of this demonstrates that you didn't consider this theory very thoroughly

Scum would have {Mafia Doctor, Traitor, [Blank] But Gunned}, leaving room for a total of 3 Town PR Claims, 1 of which is Andante who is now flipped.

So if Asteria is telling the truth, given your Role Cop Claim, DkKoba has to be lying. But that’s it no? Who else has claimed anything?

Or conversely if DkKoba is telling the truth, Asteria is Scum. Now, the odds that Insidious’ claim here is real the Gunsmith has been executed are probably high, since well why willingly put yourself in this position? Unless you think you can’t stop the Neapolitan from dying and targeting you which feels fanciful.

But I don’t see how Asteria is implying that they’re Scum with the assumption that DkKoba and you Insidious aren’t both lying. If only one of them is lying, doesn’t scenario 2 still allow for Asteria to be Town? That’s what I’m not getting.

Like Asteria didn’t assert Insidious and Koba are both telling the truth, but I think Asteria was saying that they think only one of them is not. That’s different than what your interpretation is.

I’m trying to be careful with this because Scum slips are rare, and this one doesn’t feel like one at all to me.

In post 3350, InsidiousLemons wrote:she asserts that these 2 people are myself and Dk, which would make asteria herself the liar.

Like yeah I think this assumption is incorrect. You should have asked to clarify before I think. I don’t take Asteria’s statement to mean that she thinks you and Koba are both telling the truth. The statement absolutely leaves the option open that 1 of you is lying, just not the both of you.

Koba not announcing who they supposedly targeted N2 is also highly suspicious.

Frankly we need to sort out between {Asteria, Koba}. No other execution makes any sense, and VFP pushing Anya is absurd. If we get it right, we mostly likely clear 3 other players and put the Scum on the ropes. Take it that Insidious is telling the truth. I already had Pooky as very likely Town so I’ll buy the clear, which now 2 different players have confirmed in different ways (remember, Andante also cleared them of a gun and now we know they’re not a Doctor. They would have to be strictly Traitor and I’m not seeing that). So, Pooky would be cleared, and the two other gun claims would be cleared. That leaves a really narrow pathway to victory for Scum.

And like, Vanilla Traitor? What kind of underpowered Scum has a Vanilla Traitor? Seems kind of silly.

The most logical execution even just from a mechanical perspective is always Koba. And that’s outside of the fact I SR them for other reasons that I’ve alluded to already.

In post 3338, InsidiousLemons wrote:VFP's simultaneous persistence in the notion that the claims will self resolve AND that even town!asteria wouldn't die tonight is pretty fuckin fishy to me.

This, however, is absolutely correct.

You want to know my theory? Either Koba is Traitor, or VFP is, and one has figured out the other is a Traitor. That’s what I actually think. It’s a bit crazy, and honestly quite unlucky that VFP was checked by Asteria and VFP has that to fall back on, but I do believe this to be correct.

But anyway I am not great at Mafia hahaha that’s just a thought I had.

The way to balance out this setup is for the Town to get bad information at some stages from the cops. Otherwise, it would just be too Town sided. That’s my thinking. So, there’s a Traitor that can’t be spotted by the Cops, and we’re quite likely at some stage to get a false clear. I TR Pooky so I don’t think they’re that but if you disagree I’m all ears.

In post 3360, Andresvmb wrote:

In post 3350, InsidiousLemons wrote:she asserts that these 2 people are myself and Dk, which would make asteria herself the liar.

Like yeah I think this assumption is incorrect. You should have asked to clarify before I think. I don’t take Asteria’s statement to mean that she thinks you and Koba are both telling the truth. The statement absolutely leaves the option open that 1 of you is lying, just not the both of you.

you're totally right. disregard everything I've said about this being a scumslip, i simply misread "i don't think both koba and lemons are lying" as "i don't think koba and lemons are lying"

I think VFP is acting boldly and assertively because they have this to fall back on. But c’mon, Anya? No. That’s absurd. Trying to push it away from Asteria and Koba is blatantly Scummy.

Oh wait wait. No. The Neapolitan gets a Vanilla Townie result right?

Oy.

In post 3354, InsidiousLemons wrote:

In post 3347, VFP wrote:Anya is going to be the best lim here as scum Lemon's makes a claim like that to ensure Anya is safe. Meaning Anya is something important to scum.
I'm thinking Lemons is actually the traitor here.

if i'm the traitor then how do i know who is and isn't important to scum? sure, maybe i'm just a goon, but the fact that you didn't think of this demonstrates that you didn't consider this theory very thoroughly

Can you word this differently I don't understand it?
I read it as how would you know who scum is?
Which doesn't seem like something that you would be asking.

Wait so how do we ever not execute between Asteria and Koba here? What other execution even remotely makes sense? If Koba flips Scum, that’s good, we have a circle of trust of sorts and the Scum is outside. Unless there’s no Traitor and one of the PRs is Scum.

In post 3368, Andresvmb wrote:I think VFP is acting boldly and assertively because they have this to fall back on. But c’mon, Anya? No. That’s absurd. Trying to push it away from Asteria and Koba is blatantly Scummy.

Why wouldn't I push it away if I believe they are town.
Setup wise you're the one lying here for me.

In post 3373, VFP wrote:

In post 3368, Andresvmb wrote:I think VFP is acting boldly and assertively because they have this to fall back on. But c’mon, Anya? No. That’s absurd. Trying to push it away from Asteria and Koba is blatantly Scummy.

Why wouldn't I push it away if I believe they are town.
Setup wise you're the one lying here for me.

No I was wrong you’re right. You supposedly came back “Vanilla Town”. Which you’ve hard claimed. So no ignore that.