Mafiascum.net

Yeah, I know. Some players just ruin shit. But seriously though, I was looking for you two D6. "You" being the remaining townies. I was hoping that you'd get active, so I could push my lynch on #1 suspect. But that didn't happen and I got frustrated. Ugh.
Glad to know that I was right though. He's lucky I wasn't a cannon; I saw Ani buddy me from D1 and I knew if he was the recruiter he would have attempted to get me early.
*sigh*
My play suffered most D2-D4; focused too hard on Quag D4 and didn't get my wagon until D5.
Should have let Quag live, and let all you Oranges eat shit.
Oh well.

BTW, the reason for the no result on ooba is that all Loose Cannons gave no results. They weren't told that though.

Yosarian2 wrote:Also, Xvart, I don't know if anyone noticed this or not, but I made a point of REALLY trying to push for your lynch every time someone suggested lynching Robo. My goal was to manipulate the town yesterday into thinking Robo was my recruiter and to make them think I was trying to lynch you to protect him. I didn't really expect town to lynch you, although it would have been nice of course.

I was really pushing Robo, though it may not have seemed like it.

Early Day, I put up the idea that his PR was unproven, and included him on the list of potential Recruiters.

Then, I make a complete 180, insisting blindly to leave the Cult-Doc alive, and push Gurgi well past the point of believability, into the realm of obvcultist defending CR: Result: Robo Lynch.

And I seriously thought that Andy was the sole Townie. lol.

--

Were I the CR, I would have chosen to Shoot all four, no point recruiting the useless weight.

Chronopie wrote:And I seriously thought that Andy was the sole Townie. lol.

I , though. I was the only townie left at endgame, really.

@ gandalf: I thought of that. I figured they were "no result" when they shot.

Considering the difference between a win and a loss is an essentially meaningless number which only gets recorded if you choose to record it, and the way you played throughout the game is more important, I say Gurgi should have the win.

Porochaz wrote:I dont think I played particularly well, but I dont think I did shit. I think we had different views which may not have been communicated the best with each other. After all I did call out that yos was speaking bs. etc. I think your sucking sour grapes a bit. Yes, both me and gurgi were a pain in the ass, but when we enter a game under Flay, we want to play the setup to its full potential. With some players that wasn't possible.

Honestly, though, prozac, if you had quoted vezoks PR claim earlier I wouldn't have gone through with the robo lynch (and I realize I am to blame for that as well since I never went back and read vezok/robo) but my reaction was completely honest.

Andrius wrote:@ gandalf: I thought of that. I figured they were "no result" when they shot.

And however mentioned this in game made a shockwave roll down my spine "like no duh how stupid am I for not thinking that."

Yeah, reading your guys QT was good. It was nice to see the synergy and the working together behind the scenes.

Absolute shame that I did not get an opportunity to play. If I had the time and if I wasn't so knee-deep in school, I would have surely stayed in this game.

That being said, this game was great and when I get time on Mafiascum again, I hope I'll be able to join a Flay's game.

I don't see how it doesn't make sense. When we can't beat the sons any more we're certainly not going to keep fighting. We were each given the option to side with them or go down fighting. So sue me if I don't want to die. I'd wanted to be recruited for some time.

I don't see any problem with the lynches of Gandalf, Furc, Friend, or Robocopter. Faraday was a legitimate mistake.

Similarly, trying to break the setup with powerroles in a cult setup is something I will never trust. Why didn't the cult recruit the power roles?

Lord Gurgi wrote:I don't see how it doesn't make sense. When we can't beat the sons any more we're certainly not going to keep fighting. We were each given the option to side with them or go down fighting. So sue me if I don't want to die. I'd wanted to be recruited for some time.

I don't see any problem with the lynches of Gandalf, Furc, Friend, or Robocopter. Faraday was a legitimate mistake.

Similarly, trying to break the setup with powerroles in a cult setup is something I will never trust. Why didn't the cult recruit the power roles?

Elaborating: Quagcult.

Also BBM: No love for me brudda? What happen to da love and ting?

To be honest, you we're on our shortlist both N2 and N3. I don't remember our exact reason for going with who we did over you. Like I said earlier, after that point, we basically just sheeped the innocents from RC. I recruited you in the end though.

I was an innocent, bastardbay.

Lord Gurgi wrote:I was an innocent, bastardbay.

Astardbay. Like I said, "after that point". The first sheep was Chrono, the RB. If the LCs didn't use up actions as quick as they did, we probably would have gone for them at some point. I didn't go after singer because I thought she had been culted at that point. Again, too much overthinking.

Still interested if my crazy theory of Robo being recruit immune was right, or if "unrecruited" was just missing from the first post...

Lord Gurgi, 3408 wrote:Why didn't the cult recruit the power roles?

We didn't because two of our recruit attempts failed (neither were on PRs) and we spent two nights killing people we thought were the recruiter. Once we were down two recruits I suggested just going for shooting the recruits/recruiter because we didn't have our shit together to get an instant recruit once the night started so any chance we had at getting a PR was too risky because the other Cult was probably recruiting immediately. It was my opinion with how not with it we were that failing to recruit more was worse than killing recruits/recruiter.

And so we ended up with most of the persistent PRs :/

Lord Gurgi wrote: I don't see any problem with the lynches of Gandalf, Furc, Friend, or Robocopter. Faraday was a legitimate mistake.

Whoa Whoa Whoa,

Let me point out that lynching me was the stupidest idea ever. I was clearly who i said I was. And if I wasn't I would be a recruit. Me being a recruiter was just the stupidest idea.

I don't know how you actually believed for one second that I was a recruiter.

Robocopter87 wrote: Whoa Whoa Whoa,

Let me point out that lynching me was the stupidest idea ever. I was clearly who i said I was. And if I wasn't I would be a recruit. Me being a recruiter was just the stupidest idea.

I don't know how you actually believed for one second that I was a recruiter.

Because your ability was completely unconfirmed.

Now, Andy should have known you were town, since you being town was the only reason he was still town. Everyone else, though, had no way of knowing.

Yes, and with all the other roles that interferred with recruiting it was hard for me to swallow. I guess Flay will tell us if RBing stopped recruitment or not. However, like I said, I never would have pursued your lynch if either someone had pointed out or I had found/remembered vezok saying Andy didn't change alignment. I guess also that with so many conspiracy theories it would have been nice if just one of them had been true.

yea, my ability was unconfirmed. But it was obvious i wasnt recruiter. Thats what Im getting at. I wasnt Recruiter.

Robocopter87 wrote:

Lord Gurgi wrote: I don't see any problem with the lynches of Gandalf, Furc, Friend, or Robocopter. Faraday was a legitimate mistake.

Whoa Whoa Whoa,

Let me point out that lynching me was the stupidest idea ever. I was clearly who i said I was. And if I wasn't I would be a recruit. Me being a recruiter was just the stupidest idea.

I don't know how you actually believed for one second that I was a recruiter.

Because of the way you were acting so damn pissy, I actually assumed you were a recruit playing jester. Until M=W told me that you were town.

Robocopter87 wrote:yea, my ability was unconfirmed. But it was obvious i wasnt recruiter.Thats what Im getting at. I wasnt Recruiter.

Hmm? If you were lying about your ability, you were almost guaranteed to be a recruiter; no recruit would have any real reason to lie about their role.

But the way Vezo acted it just made it so obvious he wasn't lying.

But whatever, its over now so it doesnt matter anymore.

I dont think Flay would ever stick a jester in a setup, particularly one years in the making.

Robocopter87 wrote:yea, my ability was unconfirmed. But

it was obvious i wasnt recruiter

. Thats what Im getting at. I wasnt Recruiter.

Of course it's obvious to ; you have the role PM. Try to think of it from other people's point of view, though. It becomes much more muddled, especially since nobody could confirm your claim, only Andrius was affected by your actions, and even he had no confirmation, etc. Also, you had the misfortune of replacing in for vezokpiraka, which throws a wrench in everything too.

Don't feel bad. Your wagon was scum-driven. It's not like you got lynched by townies.

ReaperCharlie wrote:Don't feel bad. Your wagon was scum-driven. It's not like you got lynched by townies.

QFT.

Okay, so I think I can do a sum-up post for this game when I say: This fucking game.

Something went wrong here. I'm not certain the setup was all that flawed, though I'm thankful for the changes my reviewers (mykonian and Max) encouraged me to do, they helped immensely.

I underestimated the change to site meta, for one. I was worried about flakers (and I had to find replacements, tyvm) and should have been more concerned about problematic personalities. To his credit, I think Furc did a pretty good job, and I mention him specifically because I saw some prior game problems and asked him to 'rein it in a bit'. He said he would, and I feel he acquitted himself fairly well.

Vengeance lynches and personality clashes, though... what a mess that threw into Day One. People, you have GOT to leave out-of-this-game stuff out of games! It's distracting to the town, it multiplies the opportunities scum have to divide you, and creates noise instead of signal. That plus some serious spamming made Day One very hard on Town, despite the fact that you were 17/20 players (both Sons started Night Zero without allies and got the chance to recruit, as someone who was still town guessed), but they both tried to recruit Seraphim, so you started Day One 17:2:1. I'll make a separate post with (I think) all of the Night Actions and how they resolved, but this post is mostly analysis.

After that, you (town) ran into some bad, bad luck/choices on Night One. One Loose Cannon shot another, a second Loose Cannon shot a Bodyguard (again due to personality conflicts, as far as I could tell), and both Enforcers investigated a Loose Cannon, who functioned like Millers for the purposes of determining allegiance. The schtick of their role is that they'd come up unreadable to Enforcers, but were unrecruitable by Sons. They were to be the fallback for town getting behind the recruitment curve, but instead by N2 they were all used up!

Still, all was not lost. Robo did the right thing in maintaining protection on the same person all game; I kept waiting for scum to try to kill Robo, but they never did! Don't remember if it was a Townie or Recruit who said Day Six that there was no "flavor reason for a Cult Doc", but I wanted to smack them. If anything, there should have been two roles that could stop recruitment. After Quagmire died, the dead QT lit up, and there was a fairly good chance that town could have nailed Flameaxe as well if they'd not played into RecruitedCharlie's hands. They'd still have been up against a large scumteam, but Yos2 was already revealed, RC probably would have gone down, and Andrius was still fairly safe, depending on if xvart wanted to score town points by protecting him once. For some reason though, they totally ignored both Robo AND Andrius...

Molls/roleblockers couldn't stop recruitments, by the way, only kills and other role actions. They DID stop Sons from talking in their QT though if they blocked them, which eventually became an unexpected strength of their role. I had a ridiculous amount of fun coming up with 'flavor' for their night action confirmation PMs, and then of course there's the night they confirmed each other...

I'm sure there are other questions, but let me get a post together with all Night Actions and then I'll answer more directed inquiries. Also, here's the Green Room: http://www.quicktopic.com/45/H/iGBYtbLMY9K