Team Mafia 2020: Open Setup - Game Over

[bob3141]

Votecount 1.02

Elsa Jay (3) -

NaCl, popsofctown, DrDoolittle

Titus (1) -

Elsa Jay

Nancy Drew 30 (1) -

OkaPoka

Hectic (1) -

Krazy

DrDolittle (1) -

Nancy Drew 39

Not Voting (8) -

Eddie Cane, Titus, Something_Smart, Pine, Hectic, pisskop, Amrun, bob3141

With 15 players alive it takes 8 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2020-01-16 22:00:00).

Votecount 1.15

Pine (3) -

Hectic, Amrun, Krazy

NaCl (3) -

Pine, pisskop, Titus

Hectic (2) -

Elsa Jay, Nancy Drew 39

OkaPoka (1) -

NaCl

Titus (1) -

bob3141

Amrun (1) -

popsofctown

Something_Smart (1) -

DrDolittle

Krazy (1) -

Eddie Cane

DrDolittle (1) -

OkaPoka

Not Voting (1) -

Something_Smart

With 15 players alive it takes 8 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2020-01-16 22:00:00).

Here's two reasons why I disagree.

Scum are unlikely to bus early in RVS, as the attention to the slot is bad in a game like this. Second, most everyone was against outing the hoods. Putting pressure on Elsa indirectly supports my idea.

Second is Nancy's movement. Nancy hard townreads Elsa. So her vote makes sense in thread context. Yet the NaCl wagon is a thing. Nancy sheeps a lot if wagons on the back end but avoids the NaCl one.

You think scum are unlikely to bus early. But why do you think that also. And how do you think it effects your read on your two players your pushing in this post. elsa and nancy. Also are you dismissing any pairings because they voted for each otehr early?

so what about nancy vote movements makes you think she is scum and why only come out with it now?

Why do you think a player hard town reading another means they must be scum. As cant a player see something that changes there mind as the game goes on. And what leaves you to teh conclusion that nancy read switch must mean she is scum rather than town changing her mind?


But what do you think of the nacl wagon? Tell us what you think of very player that voted for nacl and what you think of their reads?

I am NOT pushing Elsa, I am suggesting elsa is town.

As for why Nancy, I can't do any VCA without a flip. It feels like you're suggesting my push is somehow disingenuous because of that.

I don't think a player hard townreading another player has to be scum. I don't know where you got that.

It's the players who Nancy didn't vote that give rise to my suspicion, not who she did.

So which wagons did as you nancy not got for and why do you find that suspicous.

Nancy, I can't factor in OOG influences. That'll get you banned.

Nancy got on Hectic, Pine, and almost every other wagon but NaCl that went to 3+.

But what leads you to the conclusion based of that nancy is scum. Are you saying nacl is scum as your saying the fact nancy didnt vote for him marks her for scum. So is that the reason you think nancy is scum.

What do you think of her votes on hetic, pine and the oterhs as you put it.

thats the nacl wagon. I see your on it but why do you think now nacl is scum and how has that progressed through out teh game.

[Eddie Cane]

Firstly:
I do not think Titus should ever be lynched this game. I will not be alive in a hypothetical lategame if it gets to that point, so it won't be my decision, but I firmly believe she is town. Lots of the votes on Pops could be bussing, but I really do not think Titus' is.

Titus: I also very much do not think Nancy is scum. She has done some scummy things, but I believe the townie things far outweigh that, and I believe she's out of her scum range as well. This read is backed strongly by Dann. Again, it is not going to be my decision if this game reaches f7 or f5 or f3, but I will say I hard veto her lynch today. Can you please try and evaluate worlds as if she is town? I think it would be far more productive for you two to work together


Secondly:

Not much of it.

And I am more interested in proving my town game. I just forget I'm shit at opens where setup and mechanical spec is the most useful instead of true hard reads.

This game lost interest to me the second we actually lynched scum day 1 and you guys can do the solve strategy. I was hoping Pops was town and I hammered so I could get scumread and give myself motivation to try-hard and save myself, and find scum in the process.

Instead I guess I'll just see what happens and just gently tell Oka to get ready and search your other scum reads as hard as you did me.

Look at it this way. There is no real consensus scum right now. Prove your town game by finding the partner to Pops, or just finding scum independently. You want to talk from a TM perspective? In postgame, we are all going to be rating each other's usefulness or skill or whatever it was. If you are mafia or if you are town, it does not benefit you to get lynched having done very little. You owe it to your team mafia team and your in game team to put in more effort, regardless of your alignment. Get help from FF or Dave or Gamma? This is probably the highest or second highest quality TM game, I'm sure they wouldn't hate skimming it. I know Dave and Gamma are busy but I believe FF has time dedicate. This is a team game.

[bob3141]

Titus whats your read on me?

[Eddie Cane]

And, specifically in this setup, mechanics don't even really matter anymore. There are two hoods in 6 that have 1 scum, and an IC somewhere. Other than that, its effectively an all VT game. You can read it like mountainous.

[Hectic]

Not much of it.

And I am more interested in proving my town game. I just forget I'm shit at opens where setup and mechanical spec is the most useful instead of true hard reads.

This game lost interest to me the second we actually lynched scum day 1 and you guys can do the solve strategy. I was hoping Pops was town and I hammered so I could get scumread and give myself motivation to try-hard and save myself, and find scum in the process.

Instead I guess I'll just see what happens and just gently tell Oka to get ready and search your other scum reads as hard as you did me.

You're getting scumread now so you're gonna have to try-hard to save yourself regardless.

This logic is so roundabout and anti-wincon though, that I'm not sure I buy it. Also, why are you ignoring my question? You know that just tells me you're ignoring it because you don't have a good answer for it?

[bob3141]

titus how did you pops read progress through out day one and what was your own reason you came to the conclusion she was scum. I onyl ever see you mnetion that you scum read her or possibile teams with her in. But never how you came to concusionn that she was in fact scum.

As we now know from day ones flip

[Eddie Cane]

Anyways,

UNVOTE:

I don't know exactly who I want to kill today yet. If DDL has a strong opinion I'll sheep him. Still mulling.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I also never voted scum!RC in Gameshow or scum!A50 or scum!Dunn in Surprise and that’s assuming you’re even right on NaCl and I honestly don’t think you are but you being suspicious of me for not doing that before she’s even flipped? Seriously?

Why would I vote players I’m tr @Titus?

[Eddie Cane]

I also never voted scum!RC in Gameshow

flashbacks D:


Nancy, can you talk through what happens if your Piss Unwnd solve is wrong? Those are like two of the independently scummy slots, sure, no argument, but all 3 scum piling on me like that in the way they did and just being this obviously aligned is... very rare. I do not think its actually the solve, even though its a prominent one. And, following that, one or two of them could be town. I don't think wasting time talking to Titus is going to be productive.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Not much of it.

And I am more interested in proving my town game. I just forget I'm shit at opens where setup and mechanical spec is the most useful instead of true hard reads.

This game lost interest to me the second we actually lynched scum day 1 and you guys can do the solve strategy. I was hoping Pops was town and I hammered so I could get scumread and give myself motivation to try-hard and save myself, and find scum in the process.

Instead I guess I'll just see what happens and just gently tell Oka to get ready and search your other scum reads as hard as you did me.

Didn’t you tell me post-flip, you felt he was scummy? *confused?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Not much of it.

And I am more interested in proving my town game. I just forget I'm shit at opens where setup and mechanical spec is the most useful instead of true hard reads.

This game lost interest to me the second we actually lynched scum day 1 and you guys can do the solve strategy. I was hoping Pops was town and I hammered so I could get scumread and give myself motivation to try-hard and save myself, and find scum in the process.

Instead I guess I'll just see what happens and just gently tell Oka to get ready and search your other scum reads as hard as you did me.

Didn’t you tell me post-flip, you felt he was scummy? *confused?

You never tr her, you said you were sr Pops since the beginning of the game. Explain this @Elsa.

[Titus]

titus how did you pops read progress through out day one and what was your own reason you came to the conclusion she was scum. I onyl ever see you mnetion that you scum read her or possibile teams with her in. But never how you came to concusionn that she was in fact scum.

As we now know from day ones flip

To be honest, it was a gut thing. I don't like gut things so I didn't push it. When I was away for awhile, Math wanted Eddie as scum so I voted. The wagons were evened up. I turned and voted pops in my next post because I just felt Eddie was town.

[Titus]

what is woat btw

worst of all time but I am legit pissed at Titus for completely ignoring D1. It’s so so fucking insulting.

<<--- I hate D1. You know this? Like I don't even read on subbing in.

Also, how am I ignoring D1 when it's the only thing I can base my VCA on?

[Eddie Cane]

@Piss and @ anybody else who has unwnd as townish

Can you please explain why?

[Eddie Cane]

what is woat btw

worst of all time but I am legit pissed at Titus for completely ignoring D1. It’s so so fucking insulting.

<<--- I hate D1. You know this? Like I don't even read on subbing in.

Also, how am I ignoring D1 when it's the only thing I can base my VCA on?

Girls... ladies... guys... all sound awkward help

Can

ya'll

please not? You are both just town. This is not helpful. Please focus elsewhere until I'm not in the game.

[Nancy Drew 39]

what is woat btw

worst of all time but I am legit pissed at Titus for completely ignoring D1. It’s so so fucking insulting.

<<--- I hate D1. You know this? Like I don't even read on subbing in.

Also, how am I ignoring D1 when it's the only thing I can base my VCA on?

I am a bit legit hurt that . . . never mind. You’re right, not worth risking an mk.

[Titus]

what is woat btw

worst of all time but I am legit pissed at Titus for completely ignoring D1. It’s so so fucking insulting.

<<--- I hate D1. You know this? Like I don't even read on subbing in.

Also, how am I ignoring D1 when it's the only thing I can base my VCA on?

Girls... ladies... guys... all sound awkward help

Can

ya'll

please not? You are both just town. This is not helpful. Please focus elsewhere until I'm not in the game.

That's not what the votes tell me. Instead of explaining, Nancy threatened our friendship. There may be an explanation but I need it.

[Hectic]

Nancy's essentially locktown for me now for

reasons

, but you should really stop talking about stuff that may have happened outside of this game. You're edging real close to modkill territory.

[Eddie Cane]

Maybe I'm wrong. I've been wrong before. I'm sure I'll be wrong again.

Now, ignoring that preface, few good reasons Nancy is town.
1) One of my teammates has a 100% scum tell on her. She has not done it in 3 ISO pages.
2) She was not on Pops for much of the day, true, and called us TvT. But she consistently had me as hard town, and specifically shouted at every single vote that happened on me. It wasn't just buddying, it was directly anti-wincon if she's partners with Pops, when she isn't even trying to get bus cred.
3) I have played with Nancy few times, but I don't think I've ever been wrong on her either and I think she's lock town. I have hard defended town!her before who was close to getting lynched, and called out town!her on having bad reads.
4) I... think this is just out of her scum range. Full stop. She showed good analysis several times yesterday, I think most of it is page 2 of her iso.

Please focus elsewhere.

[Nancy Drew 39]

what is woat btw

worst of all time but I am legit pissed at Titus for completely ignoring D1. It’s so so fucking insulting.

<<--- I hate D1. You know this? Like I don't even read on subbing in.

Also, how am I ignoring D1 when it's the only thing I can base my VCA on?

Girls... ladies... guys... all sound awkward help

Can

ya'll

please not? You are both just town. This is not helpful. Please focus elsewhere until I'm not in the game.

That's not what the votes tell me. Instead of explaining, Nancy threatened our friendship. There may be an explanation but I need it.

No, I’m not. Just because I’m legit hurt that you could think so little of me, I don’t unfriend anyone, unless they’ve actually crossed the line, which you haven’t. It still hurts though.

Just fyi, I would never do such a thing, just to avoid a possible mislynch and again, you’re misreading me. You actually have to attack me personally or actually cross the line. I am not even remotely that petty and anyone who would seriously do something like that to you over just playing a damn game, was never your friend anyway, which I obviously STILL am. That doesn’t mean I don’t have the right to be hurt though but the day I throw away an awesome friendship with someone I truly care about for anything not game-related, is the moment, I seriously need my freaking head examined. I don’t end friendships unless I legit feel INTENTIONALLY betrayed in some way.

[Titus]

VOTE: NaCl

I'll come back to the vote history on Nancy if I need to. I respect your opinions. Nancy could be a townbeard. I wanted to give her a chance to explain though. It's hard to change my read in such an emotional state though.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy's essentially locktown for me now for

reasons

, but you should really stop talking about stuff that may have happened outside of this game. You're edging real close to modkill territory.

She’s misreading me. I wasn’t threatening our friendship. If I was Titus, I would very clearly tell you that, I wouldn’t be hinting at it. I’m not but that doesn’t mean I can’t be hurt, does it?

[Nancy Drew 39]

VOTE: NaCl

I'll come back to the vote history on Nancy if I need to. I respect your opinions. Nancy could be a townbeard. I wanted to give her a chance to explain though. It's hard to change my read in such an emotional state though.

I would a 1000% choose to be mislynched over losing a valuable friendship. I would never ever put a game over a real friendship. I’m truly sorry if I gave you that impression. I will still be your friend even if you wind up mislynching me.

[pisskop]

@Piss and @ anybody else who has unwnd as townish

I felt krazy was townspewing. Once i decided he was a townlean it kind of snowballed. I think unwnd has a lot of that charisma

[pisskop]

unwnd is in any case a counter to a counter wagon at this point. I think Ive underestimated the methodology oka has employed here and he's gathering reads, but the wagon itself is a compromise.