Mini 1246 - Bizarro Mafia: ...Mate! Who won?


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Post Post #350 (ISO) » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:06 pm

Post by Junpei »

First point (other than "ok") which you bring up is a horrid skew of the facts. Defending someone is the act of protecting them from harm with the intent to do simply that, protect them. What I was doing was not in that intent, rather to point out a bad post someone else made with the intent of finding scum. You interpreted my post the way you wanted to to paint me as scum, but what I did is far from defending Darox.

Second point is the same thing. You took the two instances of me scumhunting in regards to something that was posted that implicated Darox and are bloating it to try to push a lynch on me. Unfortunately for you, I won't sit down and get mislynched, and you won't win this game. As this conversation goes on, I get more and more sure that you are scum, as you are pushing such distorted ideas onto the gamestate, abusing your previous action of lead to do so.

Third point is that I was preaching an argument that I discredited earlier which is completely untrue. The only thing in 171 pertaining to Darox is a sentence about how you misrepped his statement on how we should claim votes or not.

Fourth point is highly erroneous as well. I thought that player X was scum, and given their actions, by relation tells, I could not possibly see Darox as scum. This is very different than what I am now saying. Now I am saying that, given that players Y and Z are scum, by relational tells, I see you as scum along with your current actions.

You may call it fear-mongering, but what it really is is me stating your real plan. Yes I am definitely the largest obstacle in your path and I have no problem saying it. I do believe that I have been the player most on your back Ace this game. Even suspecting a connection between you and Darox a while ago. But alas, Tracker must die, and you didn't view me as a Tracker-prospect so you couldn't kill me.

If you were scum, who is the biggest obstacle in the road for you?

The summation of my case on you is so awful that I hope that no one reads it, I'm not going to restate my position, read this post and others. My hiplop scumread was based off of his erratic play. To be honest, I haven't been too sure of myself ever since IS flipped scum. I couldn't understand it, and then Darox flipped scum, and I was confused once again why scum would act like that. But this... this fits the puzzle so well, I would be oh so surprised if there is a better fit than this.

pedit: My case revolves around the fact that you being scum fits perfectly. It solves the case. I do not have damning evidence, what I have is circumstantial, but luckily this is not the US courts, and we can convict on it. You have nothing better, actually what you have is arguably worse. I bet when hiplop called me scum your mouth watered. I'll ISO you later to see if I can find obvious bus hints, but given day talk, I don't know what I could find.
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Post Post #351 (ISO) » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:12 pm

Post by hiplop »

my play isnt erratic :(
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Post Post #352 (ISO) » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:25 pm

Post by ace5993 »

Junpei wrote:First point (other than "ok") which you bring up is a horrid skew of the facts. Defending someone is the act of protecting them from harm with the intent to do simply that, protect them. What I was doing was not in that intent, rather to point out a bad post someone else made with the intent of finding scum. You interpreted my post the way you wanted to to paint me as scum, but what I did is far from defending Darox.

Second point is the same thing. You took the two instances of me scumhunting in regards to something that was posted that implicated Darox and are bloating it to try to push a lynch on me. Unfortunately for you, I won't sit down and get mislynched, and you won't win this game. As this conversation goes on, I get more and more sure that you are scum, as you are pushing such distorted ideas onto the gamestate, abusing your previous action of lead to do so.


If you really consider either of your defenses of Darox to constitute scumhunting I am worried about what statements of yours wouldn't constitute scumhunting in your mind.

PlayerX: This is why Darox is scum
Junpei: Oh no that's not valid

That's scumhunting, but not defending? Yeah, OK.

Junpei wrote:Third point is that I was preaching an argument that I discredited earlier which is completely untrue. The only thing in 171 pertaining to Darox is a sentence about how you misrepped his statement on how we should claim votes or not.


Explain what "Darox was just being foolish" meant? You went from "Darox is just being foolish", to "Darox is pretending to be a VI". I see this as a contradiction.

Junpei wrote:Fourth point is highly erroneous as well. I thought that player X was scum, and given their actions, by relation tells, I could not possibly see Darox as scum. This is very different than what I am now saying. Now I am saying that, given that players Y and Z are scum, by relational tells, I see you as scum along with your current actions.


Uh-huh.

Junpei wrote:You may call it fear-mongering, but what it really is is me stating your real plan. Yes I am definitely the largest obstacle in your path and I have no problem saying it. I do believe that I have been the player most on your back Ace this game. Even suspecting a connection between you and Darox a while ago. But alas, Tracker must die, and you didn't view me as a Tracker-prospect so you couldn't kill me.

If you were scum, who is the biggest obstacle in the road for you?

The summation of my case on you is so awful that I hope that no one reads it, I'm not going to restate my position, read this post and others. My hiplop scumread was based off of his erratic play. To be honest, I haven't been too sure of myself ever since IS flipped scum. I couldn't understand it, and then Darox flipped scum, and I was confused once again why scum would act like that. But this... this fits the puzzle so well, I would be oh so surprised if there is a better fit than this.


Absolute bullshit. You are first making the assumption that I'm scum and then seeing if it's possible. That's not how it works. There's an outside chance of anyone being scum. TehBrawlGuy I would consider a stronger player than you in this game so far.

Junpei wrote:pedit: My case revolves around the fact that you being scum fits perfectly. It solves the case. I do not have damning evidence, what I have is circumstantial, but luckily this is not the US courts, and we can convict on it. You have nothing better, actually what you have is arguably worse. I bet when hiplop called me scum your mouth watered. I'll ISO you later to see if I can find obvious bus hints, but given day talk, I don't know what I could find.


It's not even circumstantial evidence Junpei, it's bullshit. What you're doing IS LITERALLY FEAR-MONGERING. "It would be bad if ace is scum". That's the extent of your argument. THAT IS WHAT YOU ARE ARGUING. Hell, having Wasabi as scum fits the fucking puzzle perfectly and solves the case. You are spouting nonsense.

As I've said, this screams of panicked scum about to lose.
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Post Post #353 (ISO) » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:33 pm

Post by Junpei »

"Outside chance of anyone being scum" is a logical paradox Ace. By the logic you are imposing to make my argument invalid, no one is scum, but that is certainly not the case. Someone is scum, and sometimes you have to pick up a piece and see if it fits, which is what I did. The only scum whom is panicked here Ace, is you. Also, it most certainly is circumstantial, and I do not see how you are denying it, or why you would deny it. It is not fear-mongering... there is a difference between inciting fear for malicious purpose, and explaining a likely scenario and why it is likely even though it is a bad scenario.

Ace, reads and interpretations change over the course of the day, I believe somewhere in this game you said the same thing. It isn't a contradiction because they weren't of the same instance. I was not practicing supposed doublethink, rather I was practicing a development of opinion over the course of time. You are doing what we call, STRETCHING.

Your entire case is bad, and you fit the profile of scum.
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Post Post #354 (ISO) » Mon Oct 10, 2011 1:57 am

Post by Jedo the Jedi »

2 days, 0 hours, 29 minutes
until end of day.
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Post Post #355 (ISO) » Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:21 am

Post by Junpei »

Town, wake up, it has been nearly 24 hours, this is an important cross road, and you need to understand the poor arguments Ace is presenting.
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Post Post #356 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 2:54 am

Post by Jedo the Jedi »

23 hours, 35 minutes
until end of day.
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Post Post #357 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:13 am

Post by Junpei »

Town...

...

... It has been 48 hours and I have been the only one to post. Literally everyone in this game but me is about to get prodded. This is ridiculous, scum are riding the wave.
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Post Post #358 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:38 am

Post by ace5993 »

I've said all I have to say. Your argument is crap, hopefully most people see it that way as well, but if not and if I get lynched today you'll just get lynched tomorrow. We win either way :roll:
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Post Post #359 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 12:30 pm

Post by hiplop »

...
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Post Post #360 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 1:15 pm

Post by VisceraEyes »

I voted for Junpei. He says Ace's reasoning is bad, but doesn't say why. He's attempting to appeal to fear without looking like he's appealing to fear. He's flopping around. Ace is not.
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Post Post #361 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 1:33 pm

Post by Wasabi »

I suppose we'll see shortly.
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Post Post #362 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 1:54 pm

Post by Junpei »

Viscera, I clearly explained in detail why it was wrong -.-
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Post Post #363 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 4:24 pm

Post by ace5993 »

Junpei I'd also like to note that you had no problem with my case on you until I started pushing for your lynch. The case didn't change and you gave a bad defense in #298. I stated that your response was bad, still had no problem with me at #314. In #315 I restate the same case in more depth and
announce that you're my lynch target
and BAM, ace has to die. You never had a problem with the case, only that you're going to be lynched.
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Post Post #364 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 4:32 pm

Post by Junpei »

Uh, in 298 you said that you wanted me to justify a vote on Darox.. that wasn't a big deal, and I just viewed it as a common neutral question.

314 was a post that had to do with hiplop calling me scum for meta reasons, but I said that I had issues being as active as normal. It wasn't until 315 you restated the case so there was nothing to refer to as far as your case.

As far as your restatement in 315, the issue was the massive misrepping and the BW hopping as a result. That's what had me flabbergasted.

Once again, you are skewing the facts, this time in a desperate attempt to shroud the truth from towns' eyes as you coast the lynch.
TOWN PLEASE READ THESE TWO POSTS AT LEAST
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Post Post #365 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:23 pm

Post by VisceraEyes »

IMO, with two scum down, town is in a good position to just insta-lynch Ace if Junpei flips town...I don't think scumAce would risk that by engineering your mislynch. Town Ace, however, doesn't care...because he can still win EVEN IF idiot town lynches him for being wrong.

Junpei, YOU however are flipping out and OMGUSing Ace in response to his pressure. You're not actually scumhunting, you'd see that Ace's game has been pretty Townie from the beginning (barring an unbelievable double-bus scenario that we'll take once we HAVE to...in a LYLO situation). Hell, I'd think you're more town if you said
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Post Post #366 (ISO) » Tue Oct 11, 2011 8:10 pm

Post by TehBrawlGuy »

Basically what VE said. TownJunpei should just be quiet, tell us to lynch Ace, take the lynch, and that's that. Between the amount of struggle you're putting in, and the fact that you are really just tunneling Ace.......
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Post Post #367 (ISO) » Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:07 am

Post by Junpei »

No one considers the case where Ace and I are both town? I think Ace is scum, but I could be wrong.
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Post Post #368 (ISO) » Wed Oct 12, 2011 1:31 am

Post by Junpei »

Also for future reference in games for you all: Town flip out when scum are using inane logic to take them out when they are surrounded by sheep town. I know we have two MLs, but I think we can easily lose this game. I'm going crazy that no one is seeing what I'm seeing here, hiplop does, but Viscera chalks it up to "flailingscum", wasabi to "I guess we'll see", and TBG to "+1 Viscera flailscum". This is really frustrating, because I'm not flailing, I'm going step by step through everything Ace has said today and explaining how it is so very flawed and explained how him being scum makes so much sense.
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Post Post #369 (ISO) » Wed Oct 12, 2011 2:26 am

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As the day is ending, you all head to your voting booths to make your decision and catch a little rest. Shortly though, you hear a loud scream and silence accompanied with the smell of burning flesh. You each come back out to investigate. You discover Thirdkoopa's booth has been consumed by fire from the heavens, and there is now nothing left of him.


Thirdkoopa, town
, has been modkilled.

Day is now over. Please send your votes to me within the next
48 hours
. I will be prodding people who need it.
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Post Post #370 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:58 am

Post by Jedo the Jedi »

Official Vote Count:

Junpei (5) - ace5993, TehBrawlGuy, mozamis, Wasabi, hiplop, VisceraEyes

ace5993 (1) - Junpei

-----
"You guys, this is so ridiculous! I am not the last scum. ace is!" shouted Junpei.

"Why would he double bus? That doesn't make any sense," replied Wasabi.

"Plus, you weren't consistent in your reads," added mozamis.

"Those things don't matter! Why can't you see?" pleaded Junpei.

"Of course they matter. Besides, we already lost the tracker, so this is only based on posts. Yours are the most scummy," countered ace5993.

So the town led Junpei to the gallows. He writhed and squirmed and attempted to break free of the mob's grasp, but ultimately he was stood on the platform with a noose around his neck. "Just don't forg..." and he was dead. You check his pockets, but there is nothing in them.


Junpei, town
, has been lynched.
Day has begun and will end in
7 days
.
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Post Post #371 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:56 am

Post by mozamis »

Arse. Sorry Jun. Ok, time for me to stop mindlessly sheeping Ace and to start playing the game.
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Post Post #372 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:58 am

Post by mozamis »

@ Mod: can we have a guarantee that there will be no more modkills of town, even if it takes a long time to find a replacement? otherwise, the worry is that modkills might occur "to balance the game/to give scum a chance" and obviously that makes it pointless for town to scumhunt.


I have done what I felt was best for the game, and I will continue to do so. I will make no guarantees about my actions except for what the previous sentence says. We can discuss my decisions after the game. Also, I see nobody worrying about modkills except you.
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Post Post #373 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:23 am

Post by hiplop »

ok so its ace, SUP ACE
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Post Post #374 (ISO) » Fri Oct 14, 2011 6:54 am

Post by VisceraEyes »

I'm rereading. There's got to be something in the interactions between our caught scum that is telling enough to find a good lynch today.

Pre-Reread, I don't think it's Ace. I was never convinced it was EITHER Ace OR Junpei. But it's certainly not impossible, and I'm not ruling it out.
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