Tales of You (Endgame)

[MastinSSK]

And no, don't you dare give a fucking vague answer. I realize it's a Mastin thing to do, to be vague and not go into any specifics. But you two aren't me, and bluntly, that is a flaw in my play anyway, one that I've been trying to manage and maybe get rid of. I'm talking specifics. It should be pathetically easy to do. PATHETICALLY. Because a scum me has done so easily before. A scum me has masterfully fooled town players. A scum me has a whole repertoire of tactics to get townread.

So I'm not asking you to show me "scum-faking-town", either. That might be part of it. But even as scum, you know I post town things specifically because I know them to be town things, so there should be things that are legitimately town, too, even if you don't think they mean I'm town. (Umm. That made more sense in my head?) Heck, you don't even need to take time building it. It's not something you even remotely believe, so I don't expect you to do a whole iso and compile a full list of quotes showing the town side of me that a scum me would want to have maximized.

I'll sum it up. Know what I'm asking you to do?
"I realize you think Mastin is town, because of *reasons for townread*. But I disagree, for *reasons for scumread*."
You know.

THE.
Lesson I taught both of you. Basic fucking fundamental of the game. You can do it.

[MastinSSK]

And you know it's not a damn unreasonable request, either. It's something that you should be wanting to do anyway. Because if you actually did it well, you'd potentially get more support for lynching me, by shutting down the reasons for players to townread me and maximizing the reasons for me being scumread.

[AngryPidgeon]

I uh. Are you trying to argue you are town because you haven't done town things?

Like ffs. It's like this game is just spinning endlessly while mastin is still in it.

[Yggdra Union]

and if you're scum I don't wanna give you easy material to keep BS'ing about (bc it's obviously what your strategy has been so far)

...

-Y

[MastinSSK]

I uh. Are you trying to argue you are town because you haven't done town things?

No. I'm not arguing anything with them. (In general? I am done arguing. No more of that this game. We've had too fucking much arguing already. I have. Rancid did. Everyone has. Everywhere. Heated debates on all sides. And I'm going to shut those down. Discussion will continue, yes. But I refuse to let arguing break out. Not in MY town.)

Those posts are meant to illustrate a point. It does speak to them as a player, but it is ALSO speaking to them as a teacher. There is a lesson to be had. It's not "I'm town because I haven't done town things". That kinda sorta vaguely comes close to hitting on the lessons (actually now that I think about it, it's plural not singular), but is not an accurate description at all. I'll of course elaborate if pie/F-16 take me up on the challenge. (Which they really should be. Literally no downside other than that their scumread is the one requesting it, and a ton of potential upside for them.)

It's like this game is just spinning endlessly while mastin is still in it.

Has been spinning, yes. But that's part of what sparked my sudden decision. I haven't said it in games.
Literally, it's been GAMES UPON GAMES. Since I last said it.
But I am flipping the fucking switch into scumhunting godmode now. Because I'm sick of this.

And I'm not letting myself get lynched. Not on scumreads, and certainly not off of fucking policy. No. I'm going to do what we all should have been doing since the beginning and going about this reasonably and without emotions invested into it.

[MastinSSK]

(Btw, I saw a totally badass version of this shirt which basically sums up my feelings of how I am as scum. I'm kinda sad I can't find the version that I saw; it really helped sell the look, with the bunny and the black background and the stuff on the shirt other than the pink text.)

[MastinSSK]

and if you're scum I don't wanna give you easy material to keep BS'ing about (bc it's obviously what your strategy has been so far)

And I already explained why it's within your best interest to do so.

But let's say you had townread ask you to do exactly what I just asked you to do. Would you reject it, then?

[Yggdra Union]

yes I am ignoring your reachout. I have literally no interest in interacting with you any longer and giving you more shit to spew BS about. seriously, you managed to make 4 posts and not actually counter my real point.

this is an ultimatum. there is literally no town motivation in arguing with me any longer bc all it does is create even more noise. quit responding to my posts, or I am forced to assume you are scum who's just trying to spew as much BS as they possibly can.

BTW

So if you have so much as an iota of respect for my talent as town. Then now's the time to show it.

sorry but I have literally no respect for someone who pisses off other ppl and is arrogant enough to not even give two fucking shits about it, while at the same time being hypocritical enough to call other ppl arrogant and emotionally manipulate others. btw, if I really am your "student" as you so claim, the one thing I'd have "learned" from you is how important it is to interact and work together with town. which is the exact opposite of what you did re: BRO by handwaving his entire meltdown.
#rekt

-Y

[MastinSSK]

Oh. Just realized one thing that'd make them hesitate.
Promise.
Absolutely, 100%.
Will not use anything you use in saying why I'm town as a reason I'm town. (Unless it's a reason I already have said. Then I said it first, so I can still say it again in spite of you having said it, too. ) So say you make a damn-good 'case' showing the town aspects of my iso. I will quote none of it. It's not ammo to be used to avert my mislynch. Nor will I let others quote it as evidence against either of you being inconsistent, since it was me, specifically, who made the request of you, not something you did on your own.

I'm not going to say it's a good case. I'm not going to use anything in there. I'm not going to use it against you. I won't distract the thread further with points from it. I won't point out things in there that are right or wrong. I will do absolutely nothing to twist it to my advantage against you. Guarantee you. 100%. My word. Furthermore, I would be inclined to heavily scumread anyone who tried to twist your words against you, too, meaning that if you grant my request, you've basically earned yourself a free defender of yourself.

That's a damn-good deal. And you know I am honorable. You know I mean every word of what I'm offering, here. So you really have no reason not to take the deal. You can even spoiler it if you're afraid it'll be distracting noise.

[AngryPidgeon]

Mastin you are self destructing and in denial about it. If I had to sum up this game Day.

I'd have more sympathy if you weren't misreading me aggressively

[MastinSSK]

seriously, you managed to make 4 posts and not actually counter my real point.

Because you specifically asked me not to, and I honored that request. (If you want me to, I can, even though the answer's right there in my own iso, but you specifically asked me not to.)

sorry but I have literally no respect for someone who pisses off other ppl and is arrogant enough to not even give two fucking shits about it, while at the same time being hypocritical enough to call other ppl arrogant and emotionally manipulate others.

I'd take a look at Rancid's reactions to you and F-16 when making statements like this, pie.

the one thing I'd have "learned" from you is how important it is to interact and work together with town. which is the exact opposite of what you did re: BRO by handwaving his entire meltdown.

I didn't handwave his meltdown, pie. Read my response to it again. I specifically say that when I read it, it read to me as essentially having two core aspects:
*BROseidon scumreading Rancid and myself,
*And BROseidon melting down about suddenly being scumread.

You're saying "it wasn't like that!". I asked, "Okay, how wasn't it like that?" You never responded. That is how I read it. Simplified. Boiled down. Those were the two core, fundamental aspects of the post where BROseidon melted down. I specifically asked that if there was anything in there that I missed. If my description was inaccurate. For people to describe how, to show me what I missed. I got nothing other than essentially "you heartless bitch" as a response.

You're correct. I didn't pay much attention to it. But that's because the only thing it changed was my read on BROseidon, moving him to town. But the other aspect of the post I simply can't identify with, because I know it to be wrong. And said it to be wrong. This is all right there, in my iso. I boiled down what I saw, and explained why I didn't feel anything about it. But one key factor you're ignoring is that I did make small reach-outs to BROseidon after that. I'm too lazy to iso myself and track them down at the moment, but the effort is there. The townread on him immensely helped. But when he is stubbornly insisting I am scum and even had a meltdown about it, there's literally not a fucking thing I can do to help because he's doing the game equivalent of biting the hand feeding him.

That's one reason why I've mostly given up on reaching out to the Terrible Trio. I'm more than willing to work with you. But the feeling must. MUST. Be mutual, and it's not. F-16 has rejected that. (Admittedly, the earlier times he was justified in having rejected it. Not the later times, though.) You have rejected it since the moment you've been in the game. And DesBRO has rejected it.

When I was hypocritical, I admitted it. When I made mistakes, I owned up to it. Key aspects of offering reach-outs. I owned up to having had been emotional. I owned up to having been arrogant. I owned up on having been wrong. I owned up at having been bossy. I owned up on all that and more, in that effort to bridge the gap and cease hostilities. You're the one who burned the bridge down, though, because you twisted all of that against me.

If I was scum, then continued spamming would be anti-town. And quite bluntly, continued reaching out on deaf ears is slightly anti-town even with both parties being town. But I don't give a damn if it's potentially anti-town, because that rift existing for long-term is so much fucking worse that I'm willing to be a little anti-town short-term in order to stop being anti-town long-term.

I've always had trouble controlling my emotions as town. I've always flaired up. It was one of the reasons I was a VI. It has dragged me down throughout the years. But I'm sick of it. That hostility it has created. And I'm going to put in the effort to handle things like an adult. Civilly. (Well, as civilly as I can while cursing like a sailor. ) Maturely. With no ill will. Because doing otherwise would sabotage the game for the town. And make a game which should be a fucking landslide town victory into an utter trainwreck that scum eat up.

I'm changing the tune of the game. I can't guarantee success. This is a bit of a new thing for me. But I refuse to let this blood feud continue.

[MastinSSK]

Mastin you are self destructing and in denial about it.

I was. I fully admit it. I had been self-destructing.

Now I'm not.

This will take me some time to figure out.

This will take time for me to refine.

But I'm.
Well.

I'm actually feeling like that the me I'm meant to be is coming out.

I can't say how fully I will succeed. Especially since this is so new to me, this rejuvenated life in me. But I will figure it out. No more shouting. No more snarking. Perhaps a little spamming, walling, and aggressiveness. But never in overwhelming amounts. I'm not letting that happen. I realize the words "I'm not letting that happen" often come from someone in denial. But I know my strengths. I know my weaknesses. I know myself. And I feel obligated to make this game not have that hostility. For it to simply have productivity.

Again, these by themselves are just words. I know that. It's one thing to say you mean something and another to actually do it. Which is why I'm still figuring things out. I'm trying to figure out a reach-out to DesBRO. (Coming up empty, though. The only time I did a successful reach-out to BRO was when I had a mason role and 'crumbed it as said reach-out.) I already reached out to Stalin. I reached out to pie and F-16.

I guess I could reach out to you, on the hypothetical scenario where you're town, but again, I'm coming up on empty. (Mainly, admittedly, because I'm coming up on empty on how you could be town. Generally a town-AP is instinctively inclined to be in-tune with me, making reach-outs unnecessary. And even when not, just as I respect a town-AP, a town-AP holds respect for me. Meaning that, well. I don't really have experience reaching out to you getting on my side, since you've done so automatically in the past.)

I have a strong suspicion I won't need to reach out to Kagura, either half. I will likely need a reach-out to Clyton, but my wavering (and, ultimately, waning) scumread there is at least a start, since I think we might be coming to a bit of an understanding of each other, and that said understanding (if legitimate) means he can be town and can be worked with.

I guess I could also reach out to orcinus and PV, in spite of my scumreads on them, but aside from, "Hi, I think you're both scum", I can't really think of anything to discuss (not argue) with them other than that, because while I'm open to being wrong about my read, I don't see how I would be. Oh, I guess I also need to reach out to Red Gyarados, since I'm not sure they're town.

When it comes to Fox/Hound, they're not someone who I so much need to reach out on, so much as they are someone I need to analyze. They're already kinda sorta with me already, and my read on them is continuously changing, but I don't think that interacting with them more directly will help, and that the only way I can get a read on them that sticks is by getting bearings on them via other factors.

And then there's Titan. I suppose I should reach out to Tammy, but basically...I don't think I can do any reach-out to Tammy that Rancid didn't do first.

So my words aren't just words. They have backing. Some already in place. Still figuring out the specifics, though.

[Yggdra Union]

ITT mastin tries to look oh so town by acting like he doesn't care that I'm taking it as a scumclaim if he responds to my posts

Because you specifically asked me not to, and I honored that request. (If you want me to, I can, even though the answer's right there in my own iso, but you specifically asked me not to.)

this is mastin being obtuse on purpose. it's p fucking obvious I don't want him to respond to any of my posts AT ALL and he does anyway while claiming he's "honoring my request". fail

can we just lynch this already? he fking claimed scum

-Y

[Yggdra Union]

about the NKs: there is literally no reason for scum to kill RBD. all the noise RBD was generating was nothing but beneficial to scum. Mac was townread by almost everyone and on top of that he might have died trying to protect someone. meanwhile RBD outright said they didn't wanna play anymore which makes them a v solid vig candidate

2 obvious possibilities are a janitor vig or RBD had a scum role that self janitors its flip, but I'm not going to speculate on the janitor'd flip bc this is a cabd game and there's all sorts of weird fuckery that might have happened

-Y

[MastinSSK]

about the NKs: there is literally no reason for scum to kill RBD.

If the scumteam included myself, yes. No reason to kill Rancid.

Assume me being town. Also assume Rancid being competent in scumhunting. Let's say he had one or two scum in his sights. He's also known for being charismatic. There's suspicion on him, too, so he's unlikely to be protected by a town PR. Additionally, he is defending against a mislynch.

Shutting down a mislynch. On scum's asses. Charismatic enough to get scum lynched. Mostly townread...but having enough scumreads to make protection unlikely. You literally can't ask for a better combo of reasons to nightkill a player.

[MastinSSK]

Oh.

I forgot.

Has a role that is deeply, deeply threatening to them, actively claimed.
Not just the rolecop, but also gladiate aspect of it.

Seriously. All there.

Also, something worth considering--Mac easily coulda protected Rancid, yet because lolcabd, both died through some weird role shenanigans.

[MastinSSK]

ITT mastin tries to look oh so town by acting like she doesn't care that I'm taking it as a scumclaim if she responds to my posts

Figure I might as well address this.

It's as I said. The rift's there. You're hounding for my blood, and will either refuse to respond or scumread literally every point I make, so it's not like the void can get much worse by me posting responses to you. It can get better, though. Basically minimal risk, for high potential reward.

Like, I get your concern about noise noise noise, drowning the thread out. I also get your concern about your questions and points and whatnot getting lost. But while me not intervening would seem like wisdom, the warning in my heart is that not closing the rift as soon as possible will cause damage too deep to fix.

[Red Gyarados]

V/LA through Saturday.

Because fuck you guys and how many pages you can generate.

Also, Notty is alive and talking to me again and we have things to discuss.

[Red Gyarados]

Also, the other three posts weren't mine.

[The Fox and the Hound]

I'll be getting back up to speed tomorrow.

-DV

[MastinSSK]

Derp.

If Kagura wasn't conftown before, they are now.
Mac was a modified rolestopper.
Look up what rolestopping does.
AP claims to have had Kagura targeted, but having received no result--regardless of AP's alignment, I'm inclined to believe he's telling (most of) the truth in that.
Kagura was Mac's target last night.

[MastinSSK]

(By the way, for those curious overall to as what sparked the overall change in my approach this game. I'd like to say it was all me, but it was very largely GreyICE's feedback that I was thinking of at the time. I was in my car, about to get to driving, when his words entered my mind. And though I knew that I couldn't get nightkilled because I had claimed, I also knew that his advice was good advice to have regardless of that. And that was the thought triggering Xeno, with me essentially going as an instinctive response, "That advice has backfired on you before!" But as I was driving, I kept weighing things. And I thought of the things I talked about. How I've been in a rut for...quite a while. And not feeling like, well, me. I've noted this before, and tried fixing it. But I think I was focusing in the wrong areas before, because they didn't have a large impact on me. But this simple change...has.)

[MastinSSK]

Realized I could do a reach-out, here.

Vote: stalin

Also fine with PV

I'm wagoning PV. You still interested in joining?

Would you call me town as scum mastin I wonder...

Difficult to say (that'd require me actually being scum ), but...probably? I mean, probably the main difference is that a scum me likely would take a stance and only change it if it's convenient to do so, whereas a town me isn't sure and both takes time to develop the read and doesn't put a hard stock in it. I've seen you as scum multiple times with me as town (not that you'd know all of them were me), and suspected you correctly of being scum, but I never was absolutely sure about it.

[The Fox and the Hound]

Yggdra, I have difficulty rebutting your point about the reaction to the Bro meltdown, since you insist that one's next post address it. But I don't think it's going to be enough for me.

I would like to note that your insistence on Mastin not responding to you is frankly kind of silly and she would very obviously respond to you anyway regardless of what her alignment is. If anything it's odd that she is not just straight up attempting to rebut you, and I know /you/ are tunneling so hard you don't want to hear it but /I/ am interested so you really could stand to quit trying to shut down discussion.

That said, Yggdra is pretty fucking town.

[The Fox and the Hound]

(By the way, for those curious overall to as what sparked the overall change in my approach this game. I'd like to say it was all me, but it was very largely GreyICE's feedback that I was thinking of at the time. I was in my car, about to get to driving, when his words entered my mind. And though I knew that I couldn't get nightkilled because I had claimed, I also knew that his advice was good advice to have regardless of that. And that was the thought triggering Xeno, with me essentially going as an instinctive response, "That advice has backfired on you before!" But as I was driving, I kept weighing things. And I thought of the things I talked about. How I've been in a rut for...quite a while. And not feeling like, well, me. I've noted this before, and tried fixing it. But I think I was focusing in the wrong areas before, because they didn't have a large impact on me. But this simple change...has.)

You say your approach to the game has changed, but other than you suddenly asserting that you are a town leader and everyone should follow you, I don't really feel like anything actually different is happening?