In post 3970, Nimueh wrote:
That would be an awesome mechanic. Yeah, let’s swap horrible NMSA and Elbirn and bring back Brigitte and Xtoxm. I’m all for it.
I still think Elbirn is scum and NMSA is only town due to clear anti-partner associatives. Elbirn lied. He claimed to townlocked me, when the closest he ever got to that, is you can be town for now but if I sr you, we be cool crap.
But here we are.
We must look forward. I don't fault your scumread on Elbirn, I myself was suspicious on him on my first readthrough, but he seems genuine. Which is why I really want to get your attention to Succinct, who is a lot more deserving of your scrutiny, but instead he is just riding on Enter's coattails.
In post 3965, Tohru wrote:He magically arrived at this readslist on his 3rd post.
Magically arriving with a readslist is my specialty, so dunno what to make here.
There's nothing wrong with magically arriving at readslists. But there is something rather dishonest if five posts later he claims that "I've explained all my reads".
Do you do dishonest things when you're town, Creature?
In post 3965, Tohru wrote:He magically arrived at this readslist on his 3rd post.
Magically arriving with a readslist is my specialty, so dunno what to make here.
There's nothing wrong with magically arriving at readslists. But there is something rather dishonest if five posts later he claims that "I've explained all my reads".
Do you do dishonest things when you're town, Creature?
I confess I sometimes end up lying simply because I didn't remember and didn't bother to check, but not intentionally (unless I had some kind of play to make).
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:25 am
by Creature
I want to see how will Succinct answer to that though.
In post 3965, Tohru wrote:He magically arrived at this readslist on his 3rd post.
Magically arriving with a readslist is my specialty, so dunno what to make here.
There's nothing wrong with magically arriving at readslists. But there is something rather dishonest if five posts later he claims that "I've explained all my reads".
Do you do dishonest things when you're town, Creature?
I confess I sometimes end up lying simply because I didn't remember and didn't bother to check, but not intentionally (unless I had some kind of play to make).
What would you say about someone who lied about explaining the reasoning behind his strongest scumread? Do you think he genuinely forgot?
What's your level of interest in a Succinct lynch?
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:28 am
by Tohru
In post 3978, Creature wrote:I want to see how will Succinct answer to that though.
I think from all the evidence I've seen (160 pages of game) it proves unequivocally and definitively to me that Succinct is guilty. Sure, we could cross examine the defendant, but I'm not sure what more we can learn that we couldn't from 160 pages.
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:29 am
by Tohru
I'll be back tonight. Hope to get more interaction and engagement from members of the town regarding my push. Hoping for favorable responses.
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:30 am
by Creature
In post 3979, Tohru wrote:What would you say about someone who lied about explaining the reasoning behind his strongest scumread?
usually would first re-ask their explanation and expect them to quote or repeat it
Do you think he genuinely forgot?
would say he believed he did explain somewhere
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:31 am
by Creature
In post 3979, Tohru wrote:What's your level of interest in a Succinct lynch?
dunno
Not feeling like wagoning Succinct rn considering he's likely eating a prod first before returning
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:31 am
by Creature
though, dunno, many players are like 1 day without posting
I take offense to that.
I do question the point in playing on an alt if you're playing identically to your main. (My gimmick's in my name. Speaking of...)
In post 3884, Tohru wrote:Sure. Apart from his abysmally low postcount, post quality, and thereby remarkably poor contribution to the game, I also have not been able to find a single reason to townread him in a 150-pager. Looking at his ISO, it's scummily-barren, he isn't trying to gamesolve or have the conviction that town would.
You're scumreading playstyle. Look at my name. It's my approach; deliberately minimalistic. I'm also a late-D1 replacement. I average 1 post/day. My game solving's in all my posts; I mostly only quote pertinent content. (Almost)
Everything
holds relevance.
In post 3886, Tohru wrote:But, I observed his lack of emotion and/or conviction in those posts [compare to NMSA], hinting that it may be indicative of a distancing attempt on a scumpartner who was already under fire (and therefore also the prime candidate to escape the game).
YouapparentlymissedafewpostspushingFlubbersignificantly.
Of 29 posts, I pushed him in 9+ of them.
The ones not pushing him, most're establishing/defending/explaining townreads, or pushing NMSA, or pushing Elbirn.
I never let up on Flubber; my push on NMSA's been the same since D2.
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:22 am
by Succinct
In post 3888, Tohru wrote:1. Flying under the radar, and 2. Lack of gamesolving.
You'll never find me active, least of all not now. (Knowing my main'd help know why I'm particularly inactive now.) My gamesolving's in establishing townreads more than establishing scumreads, but I've done both.
I'm aided by people engaging me, but them not doing so's out of my control. If people don't interact with what I post, then I don't have anything to follow through on.
You're making me miss Ank, because she's one of the few who
would
engage me.
Question my reasons for NMSA, question my reasons for Elbirn, question my townreads.
What about it's wrong?
The only possible scum mastermind's me, and I
know
that's not right.
Knowing this, scum didn't have one.
Knowing they didn't have one, scum're going to play more as individuals.
The average individual scum player shows high levels of self-preservation, more interested in personal survival than survival of scumteam.
I think given this setup, that trait's amplified.
Voting Flubber risked five players becoming conftown. Flubber had ~7 different voters at different time. They aren't all town. As a result, scum at some point did cast a bus vote, and I think they did it for precisely the reason I outlined above: an increased sense of self-preservation, leading to a decreased interest of survival of the scumteam.
In post 3899, Chara wrote:NMSA also has good reasons to be town (that i've actually looked at)
Remind me why.
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:36 am
by Succinct
In post 3903, Chara wrote:considering this is Succinct's only scumread, i wonder why they didn't go harder on it,
I can't go harder than I do.
You expect me to bs reasons?
I made my points.
They held.
Nobody engaged those points.
No new points were raised; nothing changed existing points.
What more
could
I have done?
Honest question, because I genuinely could use the feedback from the answer.
What you saw
was
me trying.
If my trying wasn't good enough, tell me what needed to be better.
scum Flubber decides to try and live another day for seemingly no reason.
I was tired, I was exhausted, I was dejected. It wasn't worth the effort. I knew he wasn't getting lynched. I wasn't happy he wasn't getting lynched, but nothing I said or did would change it. I couldn't argue we should lynch him in spite of the claim, because from a theory standpoint we
should've
let him live, and I
knew
that theory.
How would you feel knowing the correct theoretical play's to let your scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?
In post 3919, Tohru wrote:Enter has only been in the game for a fraction of its duration
Actually, this time you're mistaken.
Enter was in the game for 75 pages.
I've been in the game for 78 pages.
Page-wise, we've been around an equal amount.
In post 3919, Tohru wrote:Succinct is extraordinarily scummy and therefore we can infer that he is arguably a lot worse at hiding his alignment than Enter.
For those who know my identity:
In post 3918, Tohru wrote:I would really appreciate it if you helped me with the Succinct push.
I would really appreciate it if you dropped your one incorrect read to push the correct NMSA/Elbirn combo.
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:41 am
by Succinct
In post 3929, Tohru wrote:in a replacement situation you should always aim to read the easier and more transparent slot, not the one which is better at scum.
By that metric, you'd be reading Enter, because
I
am the slot that's better at scum.
In post 3931, Tohru wrote:As for Elbirn I acknowledged that I am biased against his way of playing.
And yet the thought didn't occur to you you're biased against mine?
In post 3931, Tohru wrote:NMSA has demonstrated strong town flashes during the course of the game.
In post 3941, Tohru wrote:How is it townie? Enter is shadethrowing and discrediting Reck who is one of my top townreads currently.
can you convince me on Reck being town?
I can.
Read 2551. The analysis there was solid.
While he reversed his read on Flubber, the way he did so indicates they're not scumbuddies. 2552 wouldn't be town without 2551 prior, but with it, it shows a strong indication he's not scum. Why would scum start to set up for a distance with their scumbuddy, only to immediately hard-reverse it into defense?
Stances in 2560 were original, and not sheeping the thread consensus.
In post 3452, xRECKONERx wrote:i have been very clearly off the mark and got got by flubber's random play
i need to reevaluate this game. i still think tris is a good lynch but after the flub flip i dont feel so great about my ability to read anyone.
In post 3453, xRECKONERx wrote:like i can't even argue with people wanting to lynch me. my defense of flubber looks really really bad and i cannot defend it because it was shit based on gut. and couple that with me leading the brigitte charge d1 and yeah, i get the desire to lynch me. im not even sure i particularly have it in me to fight the lynch because it's deserved.
In post 2063, Ankamius wrote:Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore
Experience says odds're slot's scum.
Ank was talking about Flubber.
Someone who's in the scum pool yet you don't remember why is usually scum; doubly so when said someone's a player like Flubber.
If anyone had
asked
me about this at the time, I'd happily have said as much.
Nobody did, but I can't control that, can I?
In post 3966, Tohru wrote:No explanation was ever given for Flubbernugget and Brigitte scumread.
In post 2058, NotMySpamAccount wrote:Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.
Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.
Context: skitter made this post after I replaced in:
In post 2037, skitter30 wrote:the elbirn wagon was: brigitte, chara, xtoxm, nimueh
my gut says that there's prob scum in the elbirn voters, probably in this order of likeliness: nimueh >
brigitte
= chara > xtoxm
My post was saying, "I think Nimueh's town, and the scum on Elbirn was Brigitte".
Succinct explanations != no explanations.
Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 11:05 am
by Succinct
In post 3989, Succinct wrote:How would you feel knowing the correct theoretical play's to let your scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?
I should also emphasize: how would you feel, as a person who prides themselves on theory, that the correct theoretical play's to let your largest scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?
I knew the correct theoretical play was letting him live.
And I was feeling defeated because of it.
I do question the point in playing on an alt if you're playing identically to your main.
On this note, Tohru, I'm hoping you're not on the blacklist of any player in the game (as you might be if you're who you obviously are), because no offense, I'd rather any of them than you.
In post 3969, Nimueh wrote:
Can you please link/quote where this happens?
Enter did make pushes. He pushed me really hard for bad reasons but I tr his conviction in those pushes. However, it wouldn’t be the first time two players from the same slot had contrary reads on me. I was in a recent game where a scumslot put a really bad vote on me and then their replace in, put me as their #1 town.
Please pay very close attention to 3903. I think Chara might have explained it better than I can.
Alright, this is a damn good catch. He is far too certain of the claim being false and he should have tried to push for Flubber lynch, if he was that certain.
Okay, Chara probably town then. I still think Elbirn is scum though.
In post 3970, Nimueh wrote:
That would be an awesome mechanic. Yeah, let’s swap horrible NMSA and Elbirn and bring back Brigitte and Xtoxm. I’m all for it.
I still think Elbirn is scum and NMSA is only town due to clear anti-partner associatives. Elbirn lied. He claimed to townlocked me, when the closest he ever got to that, is you can be town for now but if I sr you, we be cool crap.
But here we are.
We must look forward. I don't fault your scumread on Elbirn, I myself was suspicious on him on my first readthrough, but he seems genuine. Which is why I really want to get your attention to Succinct, who is a lot more deserving of your scrutiny, but instead he is just riding on Enter's coattails.
I dunno, I think Chara’s AtE seems genuine, where as Elbirn’s is just posturing. The only thing that gives me possible pause about it, is would scum!Elbirn really be that nasty? Would he really employ character assassination as a method to mislynch me? I’ve witnessed scum do it, so meta reads would be most useful in that regard. Like I know for me, I wouldn’t do that as scum but I’ve seen it happen and been on the receiving end of it.
