Micro 900: Autumnal Mafia (Game Complete)

[Datisi]

Ok then massclaim time

Wicked - emps - Icon - Luca - Datisi

[Datisi]

Pagetop.

Also yes.

[Datisi]

Wicked you're a FN?

[Datisi]

How is that a crumb?

[Datisi]

Confirmed for you.

[Datisi]

Oh I think I get it. I'll check Icon's D2 reads later.

[Datisi]

Who did you protect?

[Datisi]

Okay, so Wicked is conf!Town, nice

[Datisi]

I'm VT
A bit busy atm but will be back in an hour or so

How does that mean that exactly Luca?

[Datisi]

I haven't read everything yet but I wanted to go last since 1) scum has to gamble if the most TR player is about to slap the Tracker claim down 2) fmpov it secures the last claimer is town

Obv these aren't a given from yall povs but nobody complained about me going last so

I'll go through the rest of the thread when I'm at the pc in a bit

[Datisi]

it's literally Datisi/emps

don't ask me how

it's exactly PoE

unless Luca is faking his claim

but that claim makes zero sense coming from scum so

okay i'm rereading now
Icon why does that claim make zero sense coming from scum from your pov?

[Datisi]

I'm sorry I don't see it, what post covered that?

And scum!me, going last in massclaim, claims Tracker here. Plain and fucking simple.

[Datisi]

Oh yeah, Icon, why did you keep bringing up daytalk throughout the game?

[Datisi]

yeah okay fair, but from an outsider POV, Luca's claim is relatively simple to make up

why is your first reaction there "that claim makes zero sense from scum"?

[Datisi]

I'm trying to think if it would make any sense for both scum!Luca and scum!emps to fakeclaim here and for the setup to be "FN + BU Tracker vs 2 Goons"

but what the fuck is that Doc claim. And that crumb bothers me for a v specific reason

[Datisi]

well if it isn't dats/luca then from town!icon pov he should be fine voting emps
but for the rest of us it's not that easy

[Datisi]

we're not voting yet

i want to actually play this day out

[Datisi]

I'm so fucking confused

last night I was thinking about the posibility of there existing a Mafia Tracker but 1) that seems like a shitton of swing 2) scum would then definitely fakeclaim Tracker here since they'd know there isn't a Town one

like I was fully expecting to have 2 Tracker 1v1 this LyLo

[Datisi]

Datisi's reads are definitely good for us, but I agree with your assessment that she's likely a PR. I'm not convinced emps isn't a PR still though, he's been on and off L-1 and he's not exactly volunteered a claim. He's hesitating to claim unless he has too. Also, check out my tinfoil theory. emps' very first post:

ima do

a

c

atchup

t

hingy

or

whatever

He loves memeing, apparently fakehammering, and lolhammering given how much he talked about it. Wouldn't be surprised if he's the kind of person who thinks it's a great idea to hide a PR breadcrumb in their first post because it's "proof" for later on of it's veracity. And if he's a doc then we have a tracker/doc setup.

While I was waiting for Icon to come online to claim, I remembered where I'd seen emps's crumb before.

In Newbie 1944, emps was VT. Scum however thought that this post of his could've been a Doc crumb. Post game, emps said that he wasn't planning on crumbing Doc, it was a coincidence.

So doc!emps uses the exact same crumb here?

[Datisi]

Yeah that's my issue, it could've easily been found later on and used as a crumb

if scum!emps thought he was going down anyway (especially after a lolhammer like that claiming he didn't see it was L-1, which also happened in 1944 btw, and exactly after I said i wanted more time to think about the lynch), he has literally nothing to lose by lolclaiming doc like this

[Datisi]

ah yes the grans mystery of this game

why the fuck did nobody claim tracker

[Datisi]

that sorta makes me think Icon/emps

because if scum was truly going first then they probably would've been more afraid to lolclaim tracker since they're like getting CCed 100% of the time

but does that make sense because scum!ico knew there was a FN in wicked and left him alive
and then tried to kill the tracker
and after the kill flipped VT he passed up on the 1v1?
and had scum!emps claim doc?

why does nothing make any sense this game

[Datisi]

Maybe the real Tracker was the friends we made along the way.

[Datisi]

backup tracker

informed

FN

cop

doc

someone in here is lying

because i don't believe there's gonna be 4 town PR in a 9 p gam

e

what's up with this post?
why do you write the "4 town PR in 9p" part? Since, from town!Icon pov, simply due to PoE he knows that at least one of luca/emps are lying?

[Datisi]

yeah okay fair, but from an outsider POV, Luca's claim is relatively simple to make up

why is your first reaction there "that claim makes zero sense from scum"?

can i just counter that with a question:

what use does scum have from that claim?

i don't see it

I mean
if you literally start Townreading him for it then it has a very good use no?

and tbh in a vacuum it seems like a relatively *safe* claim since even if i claimed Tracker as last it wouldn't be a hard counter

but if scum!Luca thought Icon was 2nd most likely Tracker (after alimdia) and Icon claimed VT does Luca really get cold feet there?

[Datisi]

like
i want to believe that luca's claim is Town

but that leaves emps/Icon with neither of them even attempting at claiming Tracker
and emps knew he was the most liekly lynch
why in the ever loving fuck would scum!emps claim doc here other than wifom reasons

why does nothing make sense this game

[Datisi]

Okay. Yeah. That bit by itself makes sense.
But then the setup is FN + BU Tracker + Informed of BU Tracker vs RB or *something*?

What was your role Luca? What was said in your role PM? (paraphrased of course)

[Datisi]

I'm slowly getting to the point where i wanna say "guys you wanna try to lynch the mod" because

[Datisi]

That was in your Role PM?

[Datisi]

Okay, for a second I thought you fucked up your fakeclaim lul

I mean it ~makes sense~
As much as everything else ~makes sense~

[Datisi]

well, not necessarily, nothing there proving Luca's Town.

pedit: there's at least one liar there fypov lmao

[Datisi]

Icon, fypov, do you think there's a chance here that both scum!Luca and scum!emps fakeclaimed here?

[Datisi]

If we can collectively agree that one scum claims PR and one claims VT, then this game becomes much easier. But I'm not willing to bet the game on that.

[Datisi]

Luca/emps. They're undecided between Icon and alimdia being the Tracker. They bet on alimdia, they miss.

Luca's ready to cc Icon's Tracker claim. Icon claims VT. ohshit.jpg Dat's the Tracker plan B claim some informed shit.

Dats claims VT.

Pedit: i mean from both our povs scum don't both claim VT

[Datisi]

Because scum!Luca was planning on ccing town!Icon.

Only after Icon claimed VT he switched to plan B.

I really want us to be T/T ico

[Datisi]

It's tinfoily but at this stage i think that's all we have left unfortunately

I'll go over all the pairings once I actually sleep for a bit for now I'm only throwing out ideas

[Datisi]

Ok, we're def not lynching anyone before the weekend's over

[Datisi]

I claimed one minute after Icon did - do you really think I’d have done that if I were weighing up two different fake claims?

I mean.

"If Icon = Tracker then CC, else claim Informed"

does not take up that much time.

But my claim didn’t fit until AFTER we discovered there as no Tracker.

If I had claimed Tracker, would your claim not fit then?

Because once you saw Icon claim VT, you were pretty certain that the scumteam was Icon/emps, meaning you (1) believed I was Tracker and (2) believed the setup of BU Tracker + Tracker + Informed + FN fits.

As I said earlier, potentially stronger than masons.

Masons also give 2 conftowns Day 2. They can also communicate.

[Datisi]

Wait, so no-one is claiming Tracker?

that makes sense if you are Informed town

Actually yeah, Icon said it here
It makes sense if Luca is Informed that I'm VT
since BUTrack + Track + Informed + FN is wtf

Hmmm.

pedit: luca i just don't wanna lynch the dragon boi okay
lemme work this out

[Datisi]

Yeah, had I claimed Tracker there still would've been too many PR's. Okay back to square one I guess.
pedit: yes I get that, hold on

[Datisi]

Why were you expecting me to claim Tracker then? If you were Informed, didn't you think that that would've been too many PR's?

[Datisi]

Luca don't do this to me

[Datisi]

2. Icon is the one who thought Alim was a PR, not me.

and you're 100% right with this I was mixing up posts

[Datisi]

Why did that post make Icon think you're the Tracker again?

[Datisi]

Yeah yeah I know. Sorry i literally haven't slept for 30 hours at this point I'll probably pass out within the next 2-3h then revisit all of this

I'm even more confused now than at he start of Day somehow

[Datisi]

If you're asking me to town!lock you or scum!lock you here, I cannot do that.

However, pops and Wicked go before you I think, barring shenanigans.

Also I picked up on ~something~.

And I'm willing to trust my gut /again/ for now. So I'm gonna say you're Town.

And sure. Could've said that right away to save me the quoting troubles.

Datisi, what was this all about?

I kept noticing that Icon was bringing up daytalk a lot, which I thought was odd. ("why can nobody read between the lines?")

I had a tinfoil theory that he was some kinda Town Encryptor enabling Mafia chat. And the last few times I played with him and thought he was crumbing PR I was right, so I thought maybe.

He's now said that it was just because the wording of the rules was weird, which i don't necessarily think so, but dunno if it's really AI.

[Datisi]

I did not actually. I thought his TR of Wicked was completely out of the left field, but I didn't connect that to PR shenanigans.

[Datisi]

I'm not yet willing to outright bet the game on that.

Named Townie + FN vs Informed of the Townie... Seems too scumsided I think. I don't know. I've never dealt with Informed roles but I've seen them on both sides. I don't know what to think.

[Datisi]

Hmm. Going over the earlier points, it's not *just* Named. It opens the door to scum fakeclaiming, as we were all expecting a Tracker claim.

Though I'm still not willing to 100% agree that the informed part couldn't be made up. Aldu died N1.

That would however mean that both scum decided to fakeclaim in mass. With emps going first, and confirming Wicked, and then getting bussed by Luca who was taking a gamble on me being or not being Tracker I guess.

It doesn't make sense, but there isn't a team right now that outright makes sense.

[Datisi]

i just don't wanna lynch the dragon boi

[Datisi]

Yeah, I guess. Rather than "emps/Luca decided some ungodly both fakeclaiming strategy while leaving Icon (who they thoughts was the tracker) alive and shooting alim who Datisi was heavily suspecting" the simpler explanation is just scum!Icon.

[Datisi]

I actually have not*. We have 5 completed games together, and he was Town every time. I misread him 50% of the time though.

*he was Mafia against me once in Lynch Happy, which is a pretty weird and unbalanced setup, and which I had to replace out of almost immediately after it started due to being busy irl, and I really don't remeber that much from it.

[Datisi]

Wicked, do you think amildia kill makes any sense from Icon/Luca? Because looking at those two teams (Icon-emps and Icon-Luca), Icon/emps strike me as more likely for it.

[Datisi]

Then I would say that "A" sounds much more reasonable and balanced. If we go with "B", then that means there are three confirmable players in the setup and no other types of town power roles present.

If this is the setup, then there are 2 confirmable players. Luca isn't confirmable exactly, if he was we wouldn't be here.

[Datisi]

If we lynch emps today and there’s still no ‘conftown’ player among the three final players then it plays into scum’s hands.

Alternatively, we could lynch emps' hypothetical partner and have him 'protect' me tonight. Hypothetically, catching his partner today might reveal something more about the setup and help us sort the two of you.

This might be a good idea actually. If there's one scum in {Datisi, Icon} and one in {emps, Luca} then we need to sort both brackets anyway.

[Datisi]

Wicked, do you think amildia kill makes any sense from Icon/Luca? Because looking at those two teams (Icon-emps and Icon-Luca), Icon/emps strike me as more likely for it.

To expand on this.

In Icon/Luca world, I don't see why they wouldn't kill Wicked. If they had, they'd have LyLo where they were both generally Townread, alimdia would be going after emps, I would be going after alimdia, and the Wicked kill would implicate me, paired with general ~paranoia~. Plus they knew that Wicked would've most likely become unlynchable if he'd lived.

Icon/emps makes at least some sense in that regard, I think.

[Datisi]

emps, you gonna try to help us solve or keep fencesitting?

[Datisi]

I think it actually is optimal to sort me/Icon today. A possible scum PR flip would help us sort between Town PR claims, while it wouldn't do crap for sorting the VT claims.

[Datisi]

Also tbh it’s not even been that easy, it was a fucking horrible first 20-something pages that shouldn’t have happened and I accept being at fault for,

but which on the other hand gave me pretty solid reads I think on you [Datisi], Luca, emps, and icon

If those reads are right and wimpy!slot isn’t actually scum then the upside is I think the PoE coming out of that shitfest is quite good

okay I was going over some earlier posts and i found this

Mena actually predicted this LyLo
though probably not in the way he expected

[Datisi]

And with nobody even attempting to claim Tracker.

Wicked, where's your mind at? Which bracket should we be sorting today?

[Datisi]

Icon/emps. I was thinking of a scenario, but I don't think there's a way where both emps and Luca are scum and pulled off the fakeclaiming stunt.

Out of the two of them, emps comes out worse. He was TR'ed throughout the game based on ~tone~ and PoE, while Luca was producing good content.

That "accidental" hammer after I said I want more time to think is just horrible - especially with the fact that in the same goddamn game scum did an "accidental" hammer like that too.

And i still don't see Icon/Luca, but I've only skimmed your posts as I'm a bit busy atm. I can go into it more a bit later if you'd like

[Datisi]

Hm... Wicked, if you're sure emps/Luca aren't partners, is it okay if I place my vote on Icon?

It would give me a certiain peace of mind, and if they're scum together I think the game is lost anyway so might as well let them hammer.

[Datisi]

Here goes. VOTE: Iconeum

Both Luca/emps have to be posting at the relatively same time. No use just one posting lol

[Datisi]

Whew okay. I think I just refreshed my browser like 30 times in a minute with the unvote ready.

[Datisi]

Fucking hell Dragon boi rolled scum

pedit: shut up emps it was nerve racking ok

[Datisi]

I have a new scum team theory that I'm actually feeling pretty good about.

Did you ever share this theory?

[Datisi]

Hah, I'm still pretty sure that objectively speaking, me/Icon team makes zero sense since then all 4 PR's would be Town.

Also Dragon boi's on his VLA, he'll be back in some 18-19 hours.

[Datisi]

Reduced 6 possible teams down to 5.

I know, I was replying to this.

[Datisi]

Alright, I'll go into it after I reread a bit later, I've just woken up. Off the top of my head the answer is PoE/a bunch of others looked scummier/my top TR was scum and I was half-sheeping them in that regard.

[Datisi]

Eh, I'm feeling "relaxed" because I don't really want to tear into Icon and attack him while he's VLA, and I know he'll be back tomorrow. I'm still here to answer any questions ofc, I was just going to get into it.

It wasn't exactly a "strong" TR. My strong TR's this game have been Mena, Luca and Icon. (s i g h) My SR's were
pops - Wimpy slot, and the one who qh Mena,
alimdia - who I thought was having a couple of very bad takes and was getting passes where they shouldn't have,
Wicked - that I still think the Mena case was bad, and
Aldu - whose readslist was very odd (tho I'll admit the whole refusal to claim did get him Townpoints in my eyes.)

With those 4 that I had a level of certainty on, and with both Mena and Icon calling emps Town, I wrote it off as PoE Town/half-sheeping read.

[Datisi]

to explain the crumb

ive literally never ever crumbed my role before

mostly because im lazy but shhhhh

and uh that was like the only doc crumb that came to mind after thinking for like a good 30 mins lol

emps, how serious here you here when you say that you were thinking of a crumb for "30 minutes"?

[Datisi]

Eh, i'm asking because if you started thinking of it at the begining of the game, thought for 30 or so minutes, decided to go with that crumb - why did you do the crumb in the middle of Day 1?

[Datisi]

And re:Luca, I think I've been pretty relaxed around you too, even though I knew there is at least one scum in Icon/Luca, since you two were my TR's. Also, at first I hadn't exactly worked out the implications of the claims, plus I still thought there was a ~chance~ that both you and emps could be fakeclaiming.

[Datisi]

Hmmmm

okay
what are your thoughts on me v Icon? The only thing you've said so far is "lul i TR'ed them both"

[Datisi]

...that's it?

That part is genuinely one of the easiest things to fake. Anything about either of our's progressions in this game? You've played with both scum! and town!Icon too, right? How does this game compare?

[Datisi]

I was SRing him that game (well, until the massclaim at least), of course I was acting more paranoid of him. My acts around other players depend hugely on my read of them.

And i think we've had quite a bit arguments this game too. Obviously they've been a little different, since I thought he was Town.

And what sense do FN + Named + Informed + Doc in a 9p make?

[Datisi]

Also, pretty sure if I was scum with anyone here I'd just claim Tracker in mass since I was going last, but ya know.

[Datisi]

Alright, knock yourself out.

Though if we're sorting me/Icon today and we come to the conclusion we're probably not both scum, I think it's fair to ask to eventually let us confirm we're not a team, as we did with you/emps.

[Datisi]

Just woke up, quick points I wanna put down:

1) the reason why I want to confirm that me/Icon aren't a team is because I just know I'm going to be kept alive as paranoia fuel for tomorrow even if we do lynch Icon today - especially since Wicked won't get killed due to "doc" being on him

2) i don't think it's luca/icon (though at this point I'm not even sure) since they were 2/3 of my strongest TRs this game plus i really think the alimdia kill makes not much sense then since alimdia was likely to gun after emps, i was likely to gun after alimdia, and wicked dying would take away a conftown.

3) i thought about it but i don't think there's a scum tracker since Tracker as a role becomes much stronger once only one scum is left - and it seems very swingy and unbalanced for town to GAIN a strong PR once they lynch correctly - plus in this scenario scum would've fakeclaimed tracker

4) i was protecting emps since i genuinely thought that my actual SR'S, those more involved with the Mena lynch had a higher chance of flipping scum, especially with alimdia constantly going after emps which was pinging me like all hell

[Datisi]

Morning love =)

[Datisi]

Here goes. VOTE: Iconeum

Both Luca/emps have to be posting at the relatively same time. No use just one posting lol

icon stop wasting your time on Luca/emps case and vote me already

[Datisi]

Though the fact you were calling out and shading Luca, and suggesting Luca/emps while it was still very much likely I'm scum fypov makes me think emps is the partner...

[Datisi]

Icon, my vote's been sitting on you for longer than 24 hours. But you know what, sure, go ahead. Just what we need. More page inflation.

[Datisi]

I have voted you 30 goddamn hours ago. I have not been online constantly refreshing for those entire 30 hours. They haven't even attempted to try to organize a quickhammer.

Like... I'm genuinely unsure of what to say here. I was getting ready for a bloody 1v1. What is this?

[Datisi]

Because you're kinda confirmed scum fmpov? As I am from yours? You said yourself at the beginning of Friday. Like...?

Plus you're not even worried, you didn't even try to get me to unvote?

[Datisi]

Eh, for posterity's sake, you ever explained why that one post made you think Luca was the Tracker?

pedit: what wrong assumptions? That scum will try to at least organize a qh when they have the chance?

[Datisi]

what fucking towncore, we're the most likely team to the conftown?

actually does make a lot of sense, since you thought alimdia was a PR and you knew Wicked would 1) most likely be conftown this round 2) he's almost the only person to doubt me at all this game 3) it gives you that sweet sweet towncred to keep him alive

how sure are you at your Luca/emps case?

pedit: uh huh.

[Datisi]

ok
who's the partner?

[Datisi]

sir are you aware that night kills aren't compulsory

like if we lynch Luca today and he flips scum (and that's a big fkin IF)

scum can and most likely will no-kill?

like even if scum!me was dumb enough to kill doc!emps in this case, why in the ever loving hell would you lay out this strategy for me?

doc!emps is gonna protect wicked and die, giving town the winning lynch in you tomorrow

[Datisi]

like even if scum!me was dumb enough to kill doc!emps in this case, why in the ever loving hell would you lay out this strategy for me?

doc!emps is gonna protect wicked and die, giving town the winning lynch in you tomorrow

actually this isn't even true since you could still objectively be scum here

[Datisi]

@dats

all covered that

read first

then you can explain to me how you aren't scum this game

jezus christ there's literally only 2 options here

emps/datisi
luca/datisi

icon these were your thoughts straight out of the massclaim

what makes you think now that I'm /not/ scum?

pedit: nvm i guess

[Datisi]

exactly 0% my dude

but what use is saying that to you?

[Datisi]

you still haven't answered, what was the point of laying ot the strategies for scum in 2451?

[Datisi]

like

why am i alive for starters

is this wrt a specific team or just in general

pedit: i mean the part where you say how you'd catch scum!me and basically lay out the strategy what to do but you know
also do you even still think it's Luca?

[Datisi]

but it isn't, even if we assume kills are compulsory and emps dies, Icon/Dats is still not solved

pedit: i want someone neutral to tell me if i'm insane for thinking luca/emps cannot be partners here but I know Luca technically is biased there and I'm feeling so lost

what the fuck is happening

[Datisi]

wdym if you're wrong on Luca? Isn't Luca/Dats technically possible for you?

pedit: lmao the worst of all i know town!icon is bad with mechanics so this is legit NAI from you

[Datisi]

wait are you giving up on Luca/emps?

pedit: what about it
like
you've seen scum claim bullshit at bad times and win because "lol wtf was that claim"
like you literally just lost a game because of that

[Datisi]

Please do so. I really don't wanna get pushed tomorrow because of paranoia.

[Datisi]

2484 kinda made me think you're torn between luca/datisi and emps/datisi so that's why i asked

[Datisi]

Well okay then. Guess not.

[Datisi]

Calculated risk vs reward imo, but this is a post game discussion I feel.

[Datisi]

So, are you still feeling that Luca/emps case, still convinced they wouldn't have quickhammered, or anything?

[Datisi]

Yeah, I guess. Rather than "emps/Luca decided some ungodly both fakeclaiming strategy while leaving Icon (who they thoughts was the tracker) alive and shooting alim who Datisi was heavily suspecting" the simpler explanation is just scum!Icon.

Because Luca/emps doesn't make too much sense after thinking about it. And if it's about ruling out unlikely scenarios first, then that was an unlikely scenario I was willing to try to rule out. "Game losing bet" is a bit strong, because even IF i'm online when they decide to go for it, I still have to actually get my unvote in in time.

Why does Icon feel comfortable sitting on 1 vote for this long in LyLo?

[Datisi]

Couldn't they be waiting for me to go offline? :)

[Datisi]

Well, Wicked wants to lynch in {Icon, Datisi} today, so... You're not gonna vote yourself right?

[Datisi]

this is genuinely stupid but ok

[Datisi]

I think we both know at this point one of us is eating rope today

And you're trying to use the 1) some are concerned this could be bussing and if you do get lynched I'm not getting NKed 2) you're half pushing Luca while commenting whatever on emps in order to leave crap assocites for tomorrow even if you do end up hanging today

Which we both very well know isn't a given at the moment because the person who's been suspecting me the most this game is left alive for some reason

[Datisi]

A potential scum PR flip could help clear out the Town PR claims so

Technically fmpov it'd be correct lynching in emps/Luca since I know for a fact there is at least one scum there but if we're talking objectively plus that they're basically confirmed not partners

Then yeah I think so.

[Datisi]

Holy fuckign shit

You're trying real hard to make this look like an awful bus aren't you

[Datisi]

[Datisi]

/fmpov/ it's optimal
Objectively it's not

And where tf is your case where is anything you talked about Luca/Datisi a second ago all while saying you don't know who it is

Just
Aaaaaaaaaa
I can't take this shit seriously anymore

[Datisi]

Emps or Luca, my guess is on emps but fuck if I know

[Datisi]

ok just reread the last few pages and i don't see an emps/Luca case

[Datisi]

Ok if I had actually missed it you would've linked it by now good to know I'm not insane

[Datisi]

Holy shit this game is a shitshow

[Datisi]

If you're genuinely trying to sell that you forgot whether you were casing emps/Luca as a team or as impossible to be the team

Then I'm just done

[Datisi]

Okay so. Going just by Icon's progression today - basically elaborating on my post 2513.

Icon's catchup post is 2427, in it he has this as a reply to Luca's 2379:

I wasn’t expecting you to attack Icon during his V/LA, it was more the interaction before his V/la where you both seemed unusually relaxed despite knowing the other was very likely to be scum. I’m about to sleep so will elaborate on this tomorrow.

Oh I wasn't relaxed one bit by the thought of potential Scum!Datisi in this game

In 2379 Luca talks about how he's not expecting me to attack Icon during his VLA - in response to us talking about

my vote on Icon

.

In Icon's next post (2428) -

he talks about how it's most likely Luca/emps.

Gets ready to "case" them.

He acts surprised about my vote in 2432

-

and he keeps denying that Luca/emps team is cleared in 2433, 2436, 2443, 2445, 2446

.

In 2449 he expresses certainty how Luca must be scum. After short "cases" of 2452 and 2456 he very soon drops the idea of scum!Luca in 2465/2466, and affirming in 2487.

Then in posts 2508/2509/2510 says that Wicked doesn't really wanna vote in Icon/Dats today (???) and that he [he as in Icon] thinks Luca fits the most plausible teams. Then tries to argue about lynching in emps/Luca.

Then says he's "sad" that I don't see Luca/emps like he does in 2521.

When asked to present a case he said he's already cased it. (2523) I reread, said I don't see it in 2528 - no response for a couple of hours.

After I call him out on it,

he says he cased specifically why the two of them cannot be the team -

literally claiming he forgot what stance he was taking on the matter.

(2530) Three times he expressed at least some certainty in that team then to say he forgot that he was casing AGAINST the team, and not IN FAVOR of that team.

(Also ignore the fact that

he's literally not cased them either way.

) Then he STILL doesn't vote me.

He's done absolutely nothing but spew WIFOM all over to muddy the associates and make this appear like a shitty bus - his statements are contradictory, he's forgetting his own viewpoints, his progressions don't make any sense.

[Datisi]

Oh no, he wasn't seriously suspecting Luca/emps, in fact he made a whole case why they cannot be partners. Then forgot about that and thought he cased why they must be the partners. Because that happens.

[Datisi]

You literally forgot what case you were supposed to be making, that's not a read change.

[Datisi]

- Has confirmed scum from his POV
- "i feel most comfortable lyching Luca" (oh look we're at scum!Luca again?)

[Datisi]

Stop playing stupid holy shit
You said you made a case why luca/emps cannot be partners (you didn't but ok)

That literally makes me confscum from your pov

[Datisi]

Why is he so reluctant to accept this fact?

He's trying to make it look like a bus

[Datisi]

if you really wanna push me being scummy for being fucking UNSURE about any of this, go for it I don't even care anymore

I'm not pushing you for being unsure
I'm pushing you because the mindset of literally forgetting what your own case is supposed to say is not a towny one

And because there's uhhhh confirmed scum between the two of us

[Datisi]

Me too
Can you please fuxking vote me
Luca or emps ain't happening

[Datisi]

There is no sign of a genuine progression of reads, he's just scattergunning.

Thank you
Fuxjing
THABK YOU

[Datisi]

You won't be around when the deadline strikes?

[Datisi]

As soon as I saw Aldu had been killed N1 I knew my role held no water whatsoever, and would only look bad on me due to the 'convenience' of it. I was gutted tbh as I didn't see the Aldu kill coming at all.

My claim only made sense after it was established that there was no Tracker

, which I had no way of knowing at the time of claiming.

This part kinda confuses me. Were you expecting for there to be no Tracker?

[Datisi]

what
the shit

what has changed from here:

i had to go back and read, turns out i cased specifically why i think they [emps/Luca] can't be a team lol

ur actually scum this game aren't you?

to here:

I'm not gonna try and sell you a scum!datisi read. I don't have one. If there's a single townread left standing this game for me, it's datisi.

???

why does nothing make sense this game
why

[Datisi]

this game legit gives me anxiety lmao

Luca how come you're not crossvoting him?

[Datisi]

Hmmmmmmm
It's not but thank you

also i realized that i was a bit stupid here with calling the non-cross-vote out but it's okay we lose from Luca/emps anyway

[Datisi]

get out of my head

[Datisi]

Yeah, me too.

[Datisi]

Ok
How about you do what is actually asked of you
And make a bloody Luca/emps case?

[Datisi]

Yeah, this makes no sense, town!Icon isn't this flaccid in LyLo, especially not in qh range with what he presumes to be a Townie voting him.

[Datisi]

My gut feeling is saying emps/Icon, but I admit I have become less sure of Datisi today.

Luca, what raised your suspicion about me here? And what made you walk back from it?

[Datisi]

Ah, it was today as in D3, not as in "the last 24h"?

I don't know. I feel like there is an answer sitting right in front of me and I can't see it.

[Datisi]

Ok I just had a crybaby vent post about this LyLo typed up but I deleted it.

[Datisi]

I've said before I'm not ready to lockscum emps. What's with the condescending attitude?

[Datisi]

Right. Mate, I've had my reads flip the opposite of what I was expecting time and time again this game. Fuck, I came into the night calling an alimdia/Wicked team. I can't yet feel confident about this solve.

[Datisi]

I'm not "sure". I believe based on what we've seen that he's the correct lynch for today and my vote is staying there. But until emps gets his ass in here and writes "no hammer" or until the mod flips him I'm not gonna be "sure".

[Datisi]

Don't get me wrong - if you were to put a gun to my head, I'd blurt out emps/Icon.

[Datisi]

I didn't know I could at the same time feel both "oh thank fuck Icon is scum" and "oh god no Icon is scum" so strongly

But I do

[Datisi]

Oh yeah friendly reminder whatever that emps """protects""" Wicked tyty

[Datisi]

Btw, I'm around for a while if you need anything from me.

[Datisi]

Icon won't be back for a minimum of 5 hours.

[Datisi]

Here.

[Datisi]

I'll tell you the same thing that I told Mena around mid D1: It can't be that easy. You/pops looked scummy to me - maybe even the most out of those on-wagon (I still believe your case on Mena was Bad, but not much point arguing now). But I've been in enough games to know that just because someone *looks scummy* to me doesn't mean they will *flip scum*. While it was my gun-to-head choice, I wouldn't have actually bet the game on pops/Wicked.

Another thing I felt was that the gamestate was horrendously damaged - my Town play consists of finding allies and working with them. I believed I had found a strong ally in Mena. For the Town to then turn on him and lynch him was a bit of a kick to my ~general game read~. And I thought it left a lot of people looking bad (while they obviously can't all be scum) that it would've been very easy for actual scum to push whatever they want based on that.

And keep in mind, a lot of my posts in early Day 2 were much more emotion-driven than they should've been. "Wasn't a fan of the bandwagon" is an understatement - between Icon not listening to me and not unvoting when I was asking him to (who I was strongly TRing at the time), you making a case that I felt was bad but couldn't explain it (and a lot agreeing with it even though you were a popular SR day 1), alimdia calling his ISO damning and declaring him scum based on a misrep/misremembering, and that pops quickhammer - and with the feeling that nobody was even trying to hear what I was trying to say even though I was the UTR - it left me angry and frustrated.

And I can't tell you an exact number or anything. I've TR'ed Luca based on content (though I haven't had much chance to reread everything based on having more pressing issues at hand) while emps was a tonal/PoE TR. That quickhammer is simply bad, the Doc claim doesn't make sense, and the crumb is so odd. Plus I know he often loses motivation as scum late-game, and here he's barely existant.

I don't know about the nightkills. I feel like Aldu was a "safe" kill for any team since he (1) was off wagon (2) gave PR vibes. I still think alimdia as a kill makes more sense for Icon/emps, because Icon/Luca simply kill you - town!alimdia goes after town!emps, town!me goes after town!alimdia, general chaos in LyLo. Obviously this might not be the case if scum!Icon and scum!Luca thought alimdia was the Tracker and decided that to be the priority. I'd agree that the alimdia kill doesn't make perfect sense for Icon/emps unless they genuinely believed he was the Tracker and were willing to try to wifom something out.

[Datisi]

I was not going to speedlynch pops and then Wicked without considerarion - as much as I wanted to do that atbthe start od D2. EoD D2 I asked for more time about pops.

I didn't notice it until he revealed, I completely had forgotten. And I'm kinda eh on it? I feel like he would've said it sooner as Town / still would've been more involved with the game. The NK is an interesting point, but depending is the scum thought alim was Tracker or not, I can't say how true it is right now.

[Datisi]

I'm still Town.

[Datisi]

Don't worry, it's one hell of a game.

[Datisi]

More memes! More memes!

[Datisi]

How to find scum in a Datisi game:

lynch her townreads

Townread

- {

Icon

}

Townlean

- {

emps

, Mena}

Null-Townlean

- {Luca}
Null - {Aldu}

Null-Scumlean

- {Wicked, alimdia}

Scumlean

- {Wimpy!slot}

Scumread

- {}

i might actually have to try this method sometime

[Datisi]

Also thank you for modding Plum

[Datisi]

Oh, I love reading mod's comments on the game.

Also I recognized emps's hammer as extremely scummy and then immediately called Wicked/alimdia nice

[Datisi]

Yeah, it started from "I wanna try and Solve the game" and slowly degenerated into hysteria.

pedit: day 1 it was used for actually solving, the hysterics only came in lylo

[Datisi]

I mean I didn't solve MUCH (other than some funky business about daytalk), but you know.

[Datisi]

Uhh, reading Datisi private topic is actually really weird because I feel like I'm witnessing a doppelganger of mine

I've had two people in a span that's less than a week tell me my posting style reminds them of you and I was honestly Spooked

[Datisi]

So I guess indirectly I was one of the town's most powerful roles but at the time I died I was like "yes I drew the NK away from Datisi and won't get mislynched."

Datisi: hard TRing one scum while hard protecting the other
Aldu: yessss i died so Datisi can live

[Datisi]

Tbh I can relate to "Luca's playstyle seeming scummy", I was hard SRing him for that in our last game where we were T/T as well

And I was getting the same pings throughout the whole game here but I kept reminding myself to look at the content not the tone and whatnot
turned out ok
saved 5p lylo

yeah when I saw 2387 i honestly thought it was All Over
boi the two days straight of lylo were a clutch

[Datisi]

I am finally at the point of feeling paranoid about dats even if she’s still town

Also I’m now getting paranoid that RC wasn’t trolling because I really feel like this good be scum drawing in the final vote

Ugh maybe RC wasn’t trolling I’m not convinced town!dats would be monitoring the thread this hard

AHEM

i fucking stay up all night to convince wicked to hammer icon
i write posts in my sleep
and what do i get in return

"OoOoOOo i'M nOt CoNvInCeD"

[Datisi]

Yeah
My track record with being Town in LyLo is
Ummm
Not Great
I did not want to be there exactly

[Datisi]

Hmmmm
Also emps
If you actually rolled scum third time in a row

I feel bad for you man

[Datisi]

Thank you Luca, and likewise! I can't say that during Night 4 I wasn't starting to feel paranoia, but if I'd survived I most likely was never voting you.

[Datisi]

Also, dang I didn't realize you were setting alarms to respond to me.

I am

dedicated

[Datisi]

I still think one of the Mafia's bigger mistakes was shutting down the IconvDats 1v1. I thought Icon had a decent chance of coming out on top there, especially with Wicked suspecting a Luca/Datisi team. (also i was genuinely looking forward to it rip)

Also can't wait to read the PT

[Datisi]

Wicked: "why are Luca and Datisi pushing an Icon/emps team? That team makes no sense to me. I think this is a Luca/Datisi team."
scum!Icon: "...yeah i basically had nowhere to go in lylo"

Also am not a fan of being called a ~distraction~, though it very much would be accurate. I was also semi-surprised by being the NK.

[Datisi]

"scum!Datisi and scum!Luca attempt to kill Wicked, scum!emps no-kills" was my ~mechanical solve~

[Datisi]

Can you scumfucks say "no redactions" so i can read the scumchat pls

[Datisi]

IcOn Is a ToWn MaFiA dAytAlK eNabLeR

[Datisi]

*Datisi, having voted Iconeum in LyLo three days ago and there still being no quickhammer*: he can still be town tho right????

[Datisi]

oh my god
are you kidding me
emps used the exact same crumbing method I did when I was scum in Micro 892
and I completely missed it

[Datisi]

I have a ~hunch~ emps might be the tracker and that he dies tonight.

I am afraid to think what would've happened if emps claimed Tracker with a guilty on Luca...

Fwiw, this is why I asked that Wicked claims before emps does.