Warehouse 13: The Mafia Game (Game Over)

[Prism]

re: Dunn some scum moments early like w/ me/sangres, only town thing I remember in your ISO is risking LLD fury early Day 2, liked Spiffeh's posting that I saw last night. You are the next revisit after I finish Spiffeh/bork, mainly because I'd like to spend time reading people I actually think might be scum

re: Cakez

(Grey goes down because Titus is probably just scum over him)

My intuition is not solid and there's a reason I wanted mechanical focus on GreyICE over more votes.

[Prism]

While I will be around later tonight and am more than happy to serve as a sounding board, I really do not want to take the position of town leader-Pooky can attest to how much I hate it-and forcing my own vote through in light of how yesterday and the fact I'm likely wrong in multiple places seems ill advised. There's a reason I'm starting with reading two townreads.

I don't think there needs to be a town leader, just people working back over the game themselves without waiting on other people to actively challenge them or otherwise say something interesting. If the game is waiting for me to do that, then OK, but there's nothing special about me that means I'm the only person capable of rereading of their own initiative.

[Prism]

Does any1 have any good reasons for why Cake has to be town here?

"Good" is the tough qualifier here. I liked the way he voted mastina, the way he talked about his claim Day 1, and for questionable meta. This is very weak.

Right now I'm pretty frustrated that everyone seems to be going "Well it's my reads that are right", cross their arms waiting for something to happen, rather than actually being proactive and trying to prove themselves wrong. At least you're asking but the entire town has done literally nothing for the entire day outside of 1/2 isolated sequences. The only reason I'm not naming names and getting specific is that people will just get defensive about how they

totally have

done more than everybody else which is equally useless.

Anyway I'll finish up the Spiffeh/bork ISOs, try to read Dunnstral, and after that I guess read Cakez. Tammy is worth a read but being real there's 0 chance she gets voted today so w/e

[Prism]

Like, here's a fun exercise for the table. Answering publicly is absolutely encouraged.

Who is a player you have changed your mind on, or at least had your view of challenged in a way that made you

actually doubt the read

\, in the last calendar week, and why?

[Prism]

"Good" is the tough qualifier here. I liked the way he voted mastina, the way he talked about his claim Day 1, and for questionable meta. This is very weak.

I guess we just disagree about whether the way he voted mastina was good.

like I just don't see that as the vote of a TPR hanging on the edge of death who is vote-pushing the only viable wagon other than him

on a player that he believes flips scum.

I believe his vote is the vote of a scum reluctantly voting his scum buddy because there's nothing else for him to do.

Is this referring to mastina? I don't think Cakez was scumreading her too heavily at the time of the vote. He does start off suggesting she's scum but this weakens over time into just "would vote" territory whcih is questionable!

I think the reluctant vote after Titus/Dunn both fail is pretty in line with this.

Also, there's plenty to do. Voting her is an opportunity to salvage something via distancing. The verbal reluctance is somewhat advanced, and given Cakez has played for a few years

god I hope he knows to do things like that sometimes

, but I lean town for it.

[Prism]

^ I've changed my mind on Pooky a few times. I'm thinking Pooky-town here, based on meta. And also Mathblade - I've gone from a hard scumread to probably fairly neutral in the context of a large number of scummy players. Meta-wise, it feels more like scum mathblade, but I dunno. feels like he's been the voice of reason more often lately.

also while I'm here, I am quite surprised at how activity has really fallen away. makes me think either we have the scumteam pretty nailed in the consensus pool, or we are way off the mark. A mis-elim today and probably worth revisiting everything tomorrow. it is weird to think that Cakez' hypothetical partners wouldn't be doing SOMETHING to help here...

I think I've set the bar a bit low for Pooky scum, but I definitely liked his posts analyzing Cakez progression/calling out that Cakez blatantly doesn't have shit on him other than that Pooky was aggressive towards him (which is very Pooky NAI)

MathBlade I continue to go back and forth on, no fucking clue lmao. Posting is often absolutely fucking insane, which is a valid strategy as scum but their qualitative evaluations of players is very hit/miss and the insistence on wagonomics null.

I was really surprised and glad to see you being the first one to answer; the game could use more of your posts. You mentioned considering bork, what makes you willing to go there/what do you think about Spiffeh?

[Prism]

dude

imagine you are holding a town power role.

imagine you are 1 vote away from being elimmed

on

day

one.

Would you really be so weak and feeble?

Like cmon

I think this is a good point. Looking back at the vote on Page 83, it actually comes right after Bell swaps from mastina to Cakez. At this point it seems a Cakez flip is completely inevitable because Bell was one of the key people shoving it, and even I had basically no hope that Bell would actually swap back shortly thereafter.

I just finished reading Spiffeh so want to collate the posts/notes I took, but this is a really good point Pooky so thank you.

[Prism]

So first, I think Spiffeh's behavior around the mastina hammer is a lot better than people give it credit for.

Spoiler: Wall of quotes about mastina with commentary

I agree with a lot of what Prism said about Cakez' play style difference between this game and Xenoblade, and found his recent posts to be not awful so I'm sticking with my town lean on him.

When deciding between mastina and Titus, I can say that I have seen several glimmers of town!Titus whereas mastina has basically been a blank slate since the beginning of the game and has remained that way throughout.

I think mastina's Prism flavor case is trash but I don't think it is necessarily alignment indicative for her. I thought her avoidance of the thread early on could have been scum indicative as I have only seen inactive mastina be scum, but I thought her transition to a more consistent (albeit less than I would like) activity was encouraging. It scares me to say that it's a possibility that all three viable wagons could be Town here.

However, the fact that I can point to things I townread from Titus makes me want mastina limmed over her. I do understand why several players want Titus limmed because of her defeatist attitude, so all I can say is that if Titus lives today I hope she is able to reset and pick it up on Day 2.

I also like the wagon-comp of mastina better than the others? Three town reads in sangres, Bell, and Prism, and even Battle Mage's more recent posts make me feel better about him.

I really just want Nacho to swoop in and save the Day with a five star case on some obvscum that none of us are seeing but I shouldn't hold out hope for that.

VOTE: mastina

A+ posting choosing mastina over both Cakez and Titus.

but i'm more spooked by the last minute shift here than anything else because titus is just sitting there, mastina is MIA, and yet there's momentum

If you're talking about the recent votes on mastina, who specifically are you spooked by on that wagon?

Very good questioning of bork, getting in the way of counterpushes to mastina. There are multiple followsup to this but the most eloquent and brilliant is 2528 which zeroes in on why bork was more hostile with the listed voters. 3349.

VOTE: Dunnstral

I'll be around to condense elsewhere but can we do this?

Swaps to Dunnstral. This shouldn't be a red flag at all imo given Spiffeh's reads Day 1. This vote really only comes after Cakez/BM decide to wagon Dunn.

I am just at a loss at this point.

Even mastina's recent content looks Town to me.

I have no opinion about the claim and it does not affect my Cakez read, I am still town leaning him by play.

I might just throw away all my reads and start fresh tomorrow, I am so NOT on the same page as a lot of people that are probably Town and I am starting to think it's more of a me problem then a them problem.

Again, will be on for deadline to push a lim through.

I do think it's CONVENIENT of Pooky to actually start contributing now that we are close to our deadline/page count limit.

There are a few things to this. First is that he defends mastina's recent content but is very adamant about not going on Cakez ("adamant" comes more from the below quote a bit later). sangres similarly thought mastina's posting around that time was good even though I found it pretty trash, so pretty understandable imo. Who is he hoping for other than mastina/Dunnstral at this point? Pooky line is extremely in line with Spiffeh's Day 2 start.

Can you guys (sangres, Tammy) elaborate on what makes the claim suspect beyond flavor reasons? I thought Cakez's play around the claim was pretty Town and I felt his sass about potentially getting limmed for flavor reasons was really genuine.

I don't think the role clashes with Tammy's claimed role either. If Cakez is scum here he really snowed me and I don't think he's ever done that before.

Defending Cakez/forcing two people currently on mastina to justify potentially swapping off.

tl;dr: Dude completely shuts down the possibility of him voting the two counterwagons to mastina, swaps off temporarily when his top scumread gets voted. Shocking.

I really like his content around bork even though I have disagreed for the most part.

Spoiler: Two select quotes on bork+commentary

VOTE: borkjerfkin (willing to vote DGB too as that might be more attainable)

If I were to redo my reads list I would put borkjerfkin in null, I may have overcorrected a bit when he reacted well to my initial pressure on him. I'm sensing a lack of urgency from his recent posts? Like he doesn't really care? We're so close to deadline and I feel like as town he'd notice how divided the wagons are and be more active in gathering players like ffery and Tammy and trying to lockdown the best lim for today, but he's kinda just going with the flow.

Again, could just be me having unfair expectations, but I feel like there's something missing here that was present in Tenet and I can't put my finger on it.

This still applies. I still feel he phoned it in as the Day was wrapping up and feel he would try to work with town reads (especially ffery) to secure a good lim and he was kinda just around, halfheartedly pushing Titus until swapping his vote to mastina at the end of the Day.

Of the final lim wagon on mastina I think his vote is the most likely bus vote. He mentions being spooked by the sudden votes on mastina here and lists myself, Prism, and sangres as the votes that scared him here, which is almost unbelievable to me coming from town!bork. It would be a different story if bork had continued to vocalize his paranoia and persisted with this train of thought for the rest of the Day, or attempted to engage with myself, Prism, or sangres about our votes on mastina, but this is the last time he mentions mastina or the three of us until he naked votes mastina at the end of the Day.

I understand that we were condensing on viable wagons because the Day was over in a matter of hours, but the fact that he votes mastina without addressing his earlier paranoia reads to me like he recognized calling us out for the mastina votes was a mistake as her lim was becoming more likely and tried to brush it under the rug by being on the inevitable scum flip.

I completely agree with Tammy about his response to me here. As I've already said, it should be clear based on my stances at the end of the Day why I am singling him out over Tammy, but instead he tries to discredit my suspicion by deflecting onto Tammy.

@bork, who do you want limmed today and why? On top of everything I've stated above, I feel a lot of your posts today are surface level and I have no idea where your head is at.

This is very good posting. I liked bork's interrogation of me/sangres/Spiffeh itself, but the issue is that bork is fine harddefending partners Day 1, and Spiffeh is right that there's 0 attempts to actually engage with or work with us. bork just votes mastina over Cakez in 2061 and calls it a day. I've been way too laxy with just assuming he was busy. This post is entirely consistent with how Spiffeh's been treating bork all along. He's actively set up bork to succeed multiple times w/ the lim question and the reachouts.

Instead of grandstanding about it: what was bad about my posts in a way that you're applying scum motivation to?
and I dunno; you basically vote parked me all day yesterday, but you seem to feel that you have to qualify the fact that you want me gone now by virtue of my bad end of day posts and that makes me further question the earnestness of your vote being where it was in the first place yesterday.

I dunno. Fucking talk to me about it. I'm town, and I'm resetting today. I suggest you do the same.

The posts that bothered me are below (surprise, they're all about me!):

I feel like Spiffeh has been vocally talking about wanting to vote DGB today but has patently avoided doing it, even in the face of one of the hardest scumreads I've seen this game (and certainly harder than he should be ostensibly scumreading me at this particular juncture based on what he's posted)
Like in the same post of "Hey I think this is a scumclaim from DGB (which is not contrary to anything he's previously stated; doesn't vote there) but lemme tell you about bork here hint hint"

When I think the town thing to here is to leave me until tomorrow if he really thinks we're both scum

this heavily imples DGB scum

Pushing me today in general is whatever, but we're close to deadline and you're where you are and Spiffeh is where he is at

I realize spiffeh posted his "this is why I'm not on DGB" right now like right above me but that's still how I feel

I already addressed why your interpretation of it was wrong in 3153. To be honest I was like 100% sure you and DGB were scum buddies after 3141 and I was all set to call that out today had DGB flipped scum. Regardless, I think a quick read through my posts Day 2 would tell you that DGB was always my second choice and I had no problem with its lim. I wasn't around as the DGB wagon took off and by the time I returned it was at L-2 or L-1? and felt no need to add my vote in before I was done catching up. I was not avoiding it. You did a decent amount of talking about DGB but only voted it for like 25 minutes and never went back. What is the difference between my not being on her lim wagon and yours?

More importantly, my interpretation of your read on me Day 2 was that you didn't like my push on you but you were still torn. I don't think I was even in the bottom row or players in your reads list. However, in 3141 you seem to be scum reading me to the point that MY actions there "heavily implied DGB scum", which is not only bad because preflip associatives are bad, but is a disconnect from how you were struggling to read me prior. And I understand you were supposedly scum reading DGB but I feel it was a pretty garbage reason to give your blessing for the DGB wagon.

I feel I have engaged you a fair amount this game so I don't really buy the whole "talk to me about it" shtick. I have talked significantly about my issues with you and not much you have provided has changed my mind. I am looking forward to your reset as I desperately want to identify you as Town if you are Town. To start, who are your top three scum reads?

So first this account of his vote is very consistent with his entire Day 2, but the bolded is ridiculously, ridiculously sharp, and Spiffeh is right that bork really just...is dropping the ball in reading Spiffeh other than to complain about Spiffeh tunneling him.

tl;dr: Consistent attitude+approach towards bork all game, multiple genuine reachouts/setting up bork to succeed, incredibly sharp observations and posting that are seriously worth reading.

I spoilered this but 100% these two quotes in the spoiler are worth picking through.

I'm not putting an emphasis on tracing through all of these but I've seen no red flags with Spiffeh's treatment of anyone, really, beyond being understandably conflicted about mastina and mastina. Consistent push/followups on bork. Natural progressions on Cakez/Pooky. Literally scum-Spiffeh has been begging all game to trade 1 for 1 in a way that really makes no sense given how relentlessly clean his play has been.

The only redflag to me is that he's less emphatic in pushing Dunn today than he should be. That's literally it.

This is the last time I am revisiting this slot without someone actively making a scumcase on Spiffeh. This was a good use of my time but until someone really digs into this slot and gives something more substantial than "but they're pushing me T_T" and being willfully blind to every explanation Spiffeh gives I will not be revisiting this slot until elo.

[Prism]

ie. If Spiffeh is scum, I fucking tried. Anyone who disagrees with me, your turn to work through his ISO and wall it out.

[Prism]

My reads probably would sort into:

{LLD, Bell, Prism, Pooky, Math}
{GreyICE, Cakez}
{Spiffeh, Tammy, BM}
{Dunn, Titus, DGB}

Ctrl+F searching Cakez in your ISO doesn't give a lot of direct thoughts on him, just a bit of team speculation with Titus and you agreeing that it's worth seeing whether Cakez was a town counterwagon. You also didn't like people thinking your "fuck off" was out of scumrange.

What's been the evolution of your thinking on Cakez to the point he's now a higher tier vote choice?

[Prism]

I'm going to take a bit of a break, hopefully let bork answer that+give feedback on Spiffeh ~if he wants~ but I know he was trying to get away from that topic, and then hopefully work through his ISO with that response in mind.

[Prism]

also paging one (1) tammatha

help

[Prism]

I find it surprising that you're buying into the info argument to the extent that your vote is there without any sort of review of his qualitative play. Your answer here explains why you've reconsidered a few others but says nothing about Cakez at all.

[Prism]

BM I've had a couple of recent posts on that i think felt town, and I think 3657 was a really good post.

Can you elaborate on this?

BM has been tonally on point all game, and this one is no exception, but substantively I want to know what screams town to you in this post. Responding to my post was greatly appreciated but it's very, very free as scum, and leaving incentives for both alignments was intentional on my end.

[Prism]

But otherwise I'm not really sure what else to do other than flashwagon Dunn

I know that you may not have

time

to do other things but acting like there's no option but to just go "eh wagon somebody" over challenging yourself to dig deeper and find what you're missing is really uninspired.

If you don't have time to reread, it's okay, just say so, but right now it looks like you just have 0 drive to win or actively solve regardless of what you are atm.

[Prism]

notscience replaces GreyICE. Vote count shortly.

might be joining greyice soon tbh

[Prism]

Part of me now legitimately wants to policy the GreyICE slot but the rational side of me says hopefully one to three of bork/Bell/Pooky get something from that fresh replacement.

[Prism]

The claim stuff is all null. He could have that role reasonably as either alignment.
posts like 3543 are asking questions but they don't seem terribly useful or relevant and they're not set up to go anywhere.
I did like the tone in 3581 and i think he probably realizes he's on the short list of people that would be the target of said wagon.
The posts reading Bell & me seem pretty shallow.
I liked the justification he gave in 3404

Thanks!

Having seen 2181, I obviously disagreed that you're incapable of being very abrasive as scum, and reacting with a bit of with a bit of hurt/offense was definitely something that came out that game. The very harsh attitude towards Cabd on his unwnd push comes to mind. One post that a really stuck with me was a post to ffery about "I feel like with one breath you're telling me to work with you more, but with the other you're pushing me away"

But Cakez/Dunn aren't me. I thought Cakez pulling off of you for that was a bit +town, since he's been more than happy to push you to now.

[Prism]

I also liked 3404 looking at it btw

And really wish Cakez would have better followup; asking questions is inherently scattershot but the depth in his reads is often very lacking.

[Prism]

That's fine, I really appreciate you trying and of course have a life outside: I just really hate the attitude of most of the game which has been "Well it's that time of the week where I post the same thing again". Challenge yourself and dive deeper when you can and hopefully it helps clear up the vote situation, helps resolve you/Spiffeh automatically, and lets me ride the coattails in the event you find something great

[Prism]

notscience replaces GreyICE. Vote count shortly.

might be joining greyice soon tbh

Please, Assume I’ve learned from my mistakes. I’m not going to go into this further, but I understand why you feel this way and would like the opportunity to redeem myself.

You’re probably town and gut pinging bell town too.

It's fine I can suck it up you didn't hit my cat or anything but for the most part you're their job, do your best and wish you well.

[Prism]

I think the last 2 sentences, "But Cakez/Dunn aren't me. I thought Cakez pulling off of you for that was a bit +town, since he's been more than happy to push you to now." was the more important part of that post.

[Prism]

I am town

but I think you might be scum

FWIW I'm giving him time but I almost instavoted in reaction to 3723

[Prism]

I'm gonna say take advantage of the fresh air and step back a bit for now, may or may not actually get around to bork but his recent posting was very mixed.

I also just bought Assasssin's Creed Origins, which will be the first video game I've played made after the year 2011, and I kind of want to play that instead so as long as someone else is spurring activity I'll take it.

P-Edit: oh holy mother of god tammy became the printer ok i might read that instead

[Prism]

The only thing that really bothers me about pooky was his mastina protocol thing making him town and his push on cakez that felt off from both of them. However, if cakez is scum then pooky is probably just town unless he decided this was the game to burn the way he interacts with his partners to the ground. AND he pushed the hell out of cakez over mastina day one, and if cakez is rolled then this points a bit stronger to pooky town maybe? The only reason I have a maybe here is because of the leashing to LLD thing day one, and I can't shake how theater-y the Cakez/pooky interaction felt day one. Other than that I've liked his posts, again like his thread health posts, liked the mason issue post and liked his actual case posts on cakez. I'm leaning a lot of prism for this read though. I know that prism has seen pooky town a couple times at least whereas I've only seen him as scum, so it's entirely possible the things that concern me are just things that are part of pooky's playstyle and the similarities I see to scum play area just coincidental.

I was really impressed by his interactions with me/MathBlade, his willingness to take a step back, and the Cakez wall. I totally got why he thinks Cakez is scum. Pooky's over the top bravado may have been null but the slapfest that ensued was pretty trash and Cakez's wall trying to back it up really showed there was little teeth to it beyond "he called me scum for no reason". That said, I actually haven't seen Pooky scum other than some games I skimmed months ago, so I'm concerned I set a low bar. I liked that he wasn't trying to hide behind me/ffery, but arguably clinging to LLD isn't much better.

Still think mathblade is most likely to be town, but I'll admit to not reading the majority of his posts. I got a read early, read some here and there and he still seems quite town. I think the bit about near claiming to be confirmed town due to not killing the masons and various things here and there that feel like he's just probably town really. I also don't really read most of bell's posts about mathblade because I just do not care.

the realest thing I have read in this entire thread

I've had a lot of troubles with my battle mage read. I thought he might be a mason day one due to the way he interacted with and around people when LLD claimed day one. But I started doubting that day one when I reread it and figured I misread. I also thought some of his interaction with cakez early on felt odd like when he offered to give cakez advice on how to wolf properly after the game (I think it was cakez and I think it was day one). But I really liked the post where he said that he was on a six game winning streak and not to screw it up town. And I actually liked his miller claim. I should hate it; I really should and while I don't really believe in twtbaw reads, that kind of day three oh y'all I'm a miller just in case feels like something that i want to scum read so much but really does scum, who made the I'll give you advice for how to scum day one, come in day three and go oh hey guys I'm a miller? This does mean he's not a mason like i thought he was day one, but I already got over that and said so. Can someone check me on this? I should think he's scum for claiming miller randomly on day three when someone may have gotten an investigative shot from an artifact as Prism had kind of alluded to, so why do I think he's town for it? I feel like this is one of my patent reasons for thinking someone might be town that sets me down in flames so please help.

I had similar thoughts wondering if BM was the mason before deciding that wasn't the case after the artifact votes. I think BM is just playing insanely well tonally if he's scum, and I really have no issues with what BM

has done

, only what he hasn't, which is post enough and doesn't really bring his force to bear anywhere. I have no clue what to think about the miller claim, standard is to claim it Day 1 and it's unclear why he didn't.

I just do not know about Cakez. i hated his interaction with pooky day one, mostly his "I WILL END YOU" which felt so freaking posturey. I do not really like his roll usage (thought quite frankly mine might not be much better), because the way he acted around pooky it felt like that should have been the clear winner for who he would use his role on day one. Yes, I know some theories regarding role usage as a cop is to go for the null, but I don't know if you feel so completely strongly about it, why aren't you checking the person you're hoping to bury? I did like some of his pooky case but some of it felt not really alignment indicative really. The problem i have with cakez is that I'm not really sure I'm expecting that much more depth from him and he's felt pretty natural in many parts that aren't pooky related, and the unnaturalness was the only little part that I picked up on for scum him in xenoblade, and GreyICE is right in that he's been miselimed a lot, and if I call him scum it's on the basis of not really understanding why he checked quiet or spiffeh BUT I really liked his reaction to thinking that spiffeh had an artifact to use before he realized it was something sent to him after day start.

I really don't know how to read into his yelling slapfight of certainty on Pooky given that it just...wasn't a good read, but also I kind of buy it? Shit's hard. Backing off of bork recently was good, still a townlean, Pooky made a good point about the EoD vote on mastina that told me that wasn't as good as I thought. Despite what people say though he's doing a great job of seeming natural this game if he's scum, I agree with you there. There were several posts in Xenoblade that made me tell peta we should autovote him and I've seen none here.

Titus is difficult because she really is not playing what I'm used to as town or scum. I'm used to more aggression and fight as scum for sure and usually as town but she is a bit more subdued lately than she used to be. My big holdover concern with Titus is the fact that she agreed with mastina that her flavor case on prism was good. (and I just finished season two of warehouse two and while superficially she can be a bad guy, she's a super grey character with reasons she totally believes are for the best for the entire earth and is conflicted about that so yeah). Some of the logical blips are that just logical blips. I didn't like her day one play around mathblade, but quite frankly as the days have progressed I do not have a problem with that at all. This read is harder for me to nail down in a way I feel comfortable about because she's not hitting some of the markers that I have come to look for with her as either alignment. However, she did start isolating things regarding vca early day one. There was a point where she defended me day one as someone who does get behind sometimes and it's not alignment indicative (<3) and then later when she saw a vote count had me in a possible scum pool. Now most people that have as much experience with me as Titus does ignore the fact that I don't vote until end of day, but I could see that coming from Titus as town or scum really because regardless of alignment she'll often start off with me as a town read that she then things might be scum except for when she thinks I'm scum from the start lol. (Part of me wants to say that if titus is scum then bork is not, but after hearing that in 2181 the majority of his play was trying to ensure he looked unpaired to his partner I want to caveat this even though I do feel this due to the way that Bork focused on Titus day one.)

I think the way she progressed on me is +scum. It's really, really strange to choose to sheep mastina w/ the flavor case before even asking Math about it, and even stranger to just drop the read entirely because it's not me/Cakez. Cakez may have seemed worse to her, and both of us is unlikely, but dropping me and flavor entirely was just bizarre.

I do not know on dunnstral at all. He could literally be whatever. The biggest scum ping I've had on him is the way that he told LLD day one that he would have voted for her for the artifact before she claimed mason. There was just something so damn skeevy about that post. I don't remember anything else he's done this game.

Yeah, I got a bit annoyed when he asked why he was in the scumpile to me. It was a valid question but like ??? literally how am I supposed to sort someone that posts like 3 sentences a week. I am having to dart throw off the smallest shit (eg. Pushing me for the artifact and risking LLD wrath) over actual extended engagement/reads. I remember this post about bork scum and the vote on DGB and that is fucking it.

I don't know about Bork and I hate that I don't. I wish I felt better about him. I've felt that he seemed angrier than he should be this game and I feel skittish interacting with him at all because of how he feels. (Incidentally I wonder if this is how people felt interacting with me in the before time and I want to go apologize to anyone who felt they couldn't ask me a question because I'd bite their hand off for it.) I'm going to center some of this around me, because I didn't like that in his reads list he said that he couldn't empathize with anything I'd done this game, but when thinking about this earlier today his biggest scum read was of Titus day one, and I talked a bit about my issues with trying to figure out Titus. This I know because when bell accused me of basically copying him and mathblade I checked to see what I said about Titus day one and I talked a bit about Titus, so really was there nothing to empathize with? It feels like if he had actually had some issues with Titus and had actually been reading me to see what my alignment was, there would be some empathizing with how hard a time I was having with reading her. I didn't much like our interaction the day I got pissed off at Bork because it felt like he wasn't actually interacting with what I was saying and that felt weird.

I thought bork was natural and not really worried about positioning. I liked that he openly claimed to have targeted sangres. That said, he does hard defend partners, and while I know there are posts I feel are town that I'll remember when I reread, when it comes to the "Who is the most town?" game bork is behind the others because he's relying a lot on my extrapolating both his scum and towngames from a 1 scumgame sample size. I appreciate him diving deeper on Cakez but that response to Cakez's bork progression I highlighted was not good.

I'm not going to quote about GreyICE, I thought his interactions with LLD were just dumb and while I wanted to scumread him I just chose to discard them. I didn't like how he went from not understanding what I was saying at all and allcapsing about catching me, dumb motherfucker, etc. to changing tact to something more rational that understood exactly why I scumread him the next moment. Him begging me to respond to that Titus gotcha only to completely ignore it, despite posting shortly thereafter was ???? what the fuck dude. I dunno.

[Prism]

A person after my own heart. I'm playing the first kingdom hearts right now lol.

Thought if you played the old final fantasy 7, which is my favorite video game ever, the remake that came out last year is so worth it.

Haven't played FF7, the JRPG backlog is long.

Kingdom Hearts is one of those games that I never beat growing up, and a few years ago I finally sat down, revisited, and 100%ed it. I was surprised at how well it's held up imo, still a ton of fun. I listen to the Traverse Town and Twilight Town themes a lot for background noise, and the Tensions Rising/Dance to the Death battle themes actually been a constant while rereading this game or playing chess.

[Prism]

FWIW what I don't like about notscience is that he went "Oh I've learned my lesson!" and immediately went to touch tonal bases with the entire circles.

Granted, me saying it was the Cabd crew's job to sort him didn't help, but I have a hard time seeing why asking Bell who town is is a great starting point for notscience actually solving the game.

[Prism]

Like respectfully, if he has read enough of the game to have me as solidly town he should have a hell of a lot more than me/Bell to comment on.

[Prism]

I mean it's not about reining it in if you feel that it's useful for solving. The point was I thought the way you did it was scummy, which is just wrong if you're town, and you don't have to let that interrupt you.

[Prism]

My reasoning is that it's easier for me to go Origins into Odyssey than the reverse, though Odyssey might be more mindblowing. I'm excited to see how much gaming has progressed in a full decade.

The most recently released game I've played before today was Catherine other than some party games like Mario Kart/Smash Ultimate. I guess League also counts.

[Prism]

There are people here who have spent that past week saying they should read into me more and just haven't and continue to call me scum

Name names. Push these players. My being one of them after I got partway through Spiffeh is no surprise.

I am sick of you doing nothing the entire game then crying when you get scumread. If your entire ability to win games as scum requires you to 0 effort and give only the most baselevel reasoning as town, something is wrong with your playstyle.

VOTE: Dunnstral

[Prism]

Don't get me wrong, several players this game have flopped like European soccer players when they get scumread, you are not alone. (Spiffeh, bork, Grey, I'm sure I have at some point)

but these players have also given significantly more to make themselves readable and to take the dart throwing out of the equation

[Prism]

Great! You're sick of it, time to do something about it. I'm scum shoving you and I suspect you can't and won't do shit about it except flop and aimlessly cry foul.

[Prism]

I just woke up from my nap so time to read bork again I guess, probably going to do Dunnstral after

[Prism]

I heard you were sick or something.

j&j shot did a number on me fri night - and i don't usually react that kinda way to vaccines. thanks for the well wishes.

My first reaction was "What type of alcohol is that?" send help

[Prism]

bork, sorry but I actually need to know if you targeted anyone with the same thing (power, artifact, whatever) you did sangres N1.

[Prism]

Spiffeh, how do you currently feel about bork?

I can point to 1 concrete issue Day 1 around the mastina wagon, while I mostly like it for tonal reasons. Fundamentally I like this slot atm, I liked the reaction to sangres/Tammy, and that claim in my mind him solidifies him being almost certainly town.

Recent posting imo has been stellar even if fakeable. Might collate stuff when I'm finished with D2/D3 but for now I'm just scrolling through and still liking him mostly for tone. There's a world where bork is scum trying to save mastina before deciding not to but it's tough to see that world without a Titus flip on the table and I don't think that'd be damning even if she were town.

Also still curious as to why you weren't hardshoving Dunnstral now that bork has gotten more attention/has reacted well (imo) given the strength of your read Day 1. This is literally the only issue I have with your slot atm.

[Prism]

I know your vote is still there, but you've been pushing for more from bork today, and, well, he's delivering. He can 100% rise to the challenge as scum, but do you think that's what's happening atm?

[Prism]

Okay, I finished with bork.

This is going to be really frustrating, but I don't think bork is scum and fundamentally trust the slot, and yeah it's for mostly tonal reasons. He's got progressions that make sense (Mainly on Titus, see reads wall getting followed up by 2731 and the recent doubting of her, his Cakez vote actually makes a lot of sense as you can see the cogs turning on him not thinking Titus defends Cakez as scum) but this isn't where the bulk of my read comes from.

Things I'm still not thrilled with on this slot: That post about the mastina votes weirding him out w/o pushing me/sangres further. Not revisiting Cakez without prompting. Completely phoning it in on reading me for the most part.

But there have been multiple times where bork has been the opposite of opportunistic, I'm going to spoiler some examples of some posts that pinged me as very town. He's not a brick, he can fake stuff as scum, but if I have to take a guess he's not.

Spoiler: Wall of quotes

I think I was out to lunch on Spiffeh in 801

860 is really town

Posts like this one seem very agendaless.

You are 100% not above playing hurt to engineer townreads, and the attitude around bork right now is vaguely familiar.

need to go to bed and i'm not getting really anywhere trying to gleam anything about quiet's substantive posts atm but the posts you linked here very much lack bite to them whereas what she just posted to me earlier tonight had it to the point where it gave me mood whiplash and i had to do a double take to make sure i didn't come across with more vitriol than i intended to before i realized i'd just not provided object context to a part of my post

i just don't think she does this as scum and in fact if she were she should secretly relish that what i'm posting doesn't make sense when interpreted about her and isn't really a reason for her to lose her cool
whereas if i'm just misrepping her to the point where she can't feel she can talk to me it does make sense for her to react how she did
and she didn't use this opportunity to vote me or anything she just boxed me out because she was frustrated with my attitude. this is like the perfect point in the game to vote me, too, wagonwise.

This was a giant +town flag to me, extremely natural, also followed up with my meta suggestion later to shut it down.

Piling onto DGB was completely unneeded, and this is angleshooty but very organic.

Actually I'm changing my mind again on Titus

I feel like DGB entered the game w/ the desire of voting Titus

And did it by way of going

"I think Mathblade is town" (not substantiated, which isn't bad in and of itself, but for a sheep vote it'd be interesting why someone goes there and not to like LLD who is town for a lot more of an objective reason to leash a vote to)
"Math, do you want to vote <person Math obviously doesn't want to vote>"
"No? I want Titus <where my vote is>"
"Oh of course, Titus, I see now"

VOTE: DGB

I think Titus is necessarily town with this scumflip too

How I thought of it was that I thought it was odd that DGB went right to Mathblade as a rock entering the game and wondered why that might be

UNVOTE:

I think Titus is town. A horrendous VCA she strongly believes in is probably a town tell for her.

I'm just not sure dgb makes this post as scum knowing that's where her vote is or instead maybe unvoting or i don't fucking know but this isn't it

help

how you feelin' bout layin' down something an MC from your youth sang about

I feel like Spiffeh has been vocally talking about wanting to vote DGB today but has patently avoided doing it, even in the face of one of the hardest scumreads I've seen this game (and certainly harder than he should be ostensibly scumreading me at this particular juncture based on what he's posted)
Like in the same post of "Hey I think this is a scumclaim from DGB (which is not contrary to anything he's previously stated; doesn't vote there)

but lemme tell you about bork here hint hint

"

When I think the town thing to here is to leave me until tomorrow if he really thinks we're both scum

this heavily imples DGB scum

This most recent post threw me when reading Spiffeh ISO, but here in context the progression makes a lot more sense.

These are some samples but I wanted to give you an idea of why I feel he's not really worried about his positioning this game, and what exactly makes him feel natural to me. There's more from Day 1 that gave me townpings but I was really hoping originally for something more concrete, but this is really hard given the Day 1 play around mastina is null at best and scumlean at worst imo.

[Prism]

I think if I had to pinpoint a reason for bork to be scum, it'd be that he's not coming down harder on me for not defending him given that I townread him. There's this idea of don't bite the hand that feeds and don't let the frustration show if that's what scumBork is hoping would happen.

The treatment of my slot does have me conflicted. The comment about "Prism could probably circles around me if they wanted" says he read Iceland and knows that I can be a UTR basically whenever I decide I want to be. Simultaneously, he's got good reason to believe me between the Trident/flavor and the mastina flip. He's not trying to take advantage of the Iceland meta to discredit me at all, and would really be putting all the eggs in that protection basket that reaped basically no payout for weeks on end.

[Prism]

hi i'm on p26 and just was curious why cakez is still alive

Can you be more specific as to why he shouldn't be?

[Prism]

I'm voting in Cakez/Titus/Dunn today. Am going to read Cakez when I get home but generally I'm okay with it.

[Prism]

Dunn's s Day 1 was steaming hot trash from reading last night btw but the low content gives me little optimism and I'm fine going with someone else/on a heavily contested slot

[Prism]

To be blunt the UTRs on me post Day 1 were stupid to begin with, I got why Pooky thought I was town but the whole wall he gave was 100% wrong lol

If you were to give the me of 3 months ago the gamethread to D2 and asked me to guess my own alignment I would have said red 100%

[Prism]

You have a full wall about it lol

[Prism]

I take it back it's late and I want to relax for once in my life

I'll make time tomorrow but honestly I'm fine having little to no agency today and I don't at all feel bad for AFK voting Dunn

[Prism]

I didn't even realize it was E-1 lmfao

Oh lawd

[Prism]

There is no tangible bork towncase oh boy are you about to be disappointed. He lightly defended the scum slot and isn't qualitatively one dimensional so it's not so easy. Usage was null but I did like the Farnsworth claim.

The town case is he reached out his little fins and gently touched them to the valves of my heart. And then he said "they're not fins there's a k there in the name" but I said "shhh, it's okay, don't speak"

[Prism]

I'm not gonna lie I've been playing Assassin's Creed Origins all day, and this has been the most fun I've ever had playing a game in my life, I have neglected to even eat today and it's going to be a miracle if I do that let alone read some shit

hammer the cake man

i'm rebelling against myself this is a no effort revolution

[Prism]

I guess I can hammer the Cake man

UGHHHHHHHHH

[Prism]

VOTE: cakez

yolo LMAO

[Prism]

i'm dead i actually hit submit on that someone call my parents to come pick me up

drunk on video games

[Prism]

Spiffeh almost certainly is the poisoner based off the interactions with Bell. It's fine.

I don't feel great today but I'll have something useful to claim w/ the artifact later, want to wait

My working assumption is scum had a killing artifact N1 and used to double it.

[Prism]

Bell literally flipped mason lmfao, and while it wasn't obvious there were multiple hints both that it wasn't Pooky and that it was Bell

[Prism]

I'm actually going to save us all the time and the rabbit hole.

I have a mechanical clear on Spiffeh, scarf was a PT cop w/ negative effect that I am now in a PT by myself.

[Prism]

I agree with the above from Pooky FWIW, my PoE for artifact usage last night was notscience, MathBlade, Spiffeh. I figured Spiffeh was the most valuable clear in the event he was town, which he was.

BM would have been the automatic pick but the claim meant no

[Prism]

Scarf also wasn't circumventable by Trident like I theorized it might be, wording is "had access at any point in the game"

ie. Unless Spiffeh is traitor he is 100% town

[Prism]

That's not actually a direct modquote, please don't whack me penguin

[Prism]

SCUMREADS ON SPIFFEH WILL NO LONGER BE TOLERATED AT THIS TIME

[Prism]

It's the item voting stage, idk if we want to hand it to mechanical clear bound to be shot or not

[Prism]

I'd really say hold off on speedvoting artifact

Spiffeh is 100% a good choice but we need to decide stuff like MC/power distribution that might incentivize passing elsewhere

[Prism]

ie. If Spiffeh is 90% the scum nightkill, we don't hand it to Spiffeh lmao

[Prism]

Holy shit I completely missed that silence lmfao, she was who I wanted input from re: claims

Poor Tammy

I think Pooky is a good vote. I'm objectively good but I think we're all tired of me asking for artifacts after 3 days in a row.

[Prism]

It wasn't the snowglobe. Bell never silences her and he died with it in his inventory, ie. Likely unused

[Prism]

The key w/ the vote is just to distribute power such that scum has to make difficult decisions, eg. Killing Bell or killing me last night. I think the former was 100% the call because inventor masons like ???, but it cost them a clear on an elim target. We want to keep forcing rigged decisions like that, and I think that makes Pooky a good pick. I'm slightly afraid he burned the no bussing card but 90% of the time he's just town.

[Prism]

We're on even numbers so unless we're scared of scum doublekilling it is unfortunately optimal to just let him die even if he's town

[Prism]

It's actually pretty useful b/c of Tammy's role and that she has the PT

I think there are intermediate steps that are equally valid, like just claiming past artifact usage. Me/Spiffeh/bork are the only claimed artifact users right now.

[Prism]

I'd be happy with that. The artifacts we've seen have all been oneshot, so speaking in terms of past artifact usage doesn't out future power except for limited flavor ties.

You go last/maybe pick the order. Order isn't terribly important atm given that scum aren't likely to be caught by someone other than Tammy but *shrug*

[Prism]

(Keep in mind Tammy's PT becomes public so we will 100% get her results)

[Prism]

1. Stop claiming current artifact possession/nonpossession
2. notscience that isn't a past artifact usage claim

[Prism]

VOTE: Pooky

I'm just going to assume he didn't bus and I found his play town anyway so might as well spread the artifact joy

I'll go ahead and skip the order even though I suggested it b/c I'd rather just get it out of the way.

N0 started with trident, passed to Bork. N1/N2 no artifact usage. N3 used Scarf on Spiffeh, PT cop w/ "no PTs" result, negative effect that I am now in a personal PT for the rest of the game.

[Prism]

I think a major annoyance here is it's ambiguous in interpreting how a lot of slots voted now that it's S/S. For example, even though Math is, well, math, he probably values the qualitative play of Mastina over the mechanical power Cakez had. BM/bork could go either way. I probably would have just been annoyed at both of them, shoved mastina harder than I actually did, and then taken up the banner for Cakez the rest of the game calling to the heavens obvtown for scum counterwagon reasons.

Tammy came out better for the CC+wanting to swap over to Cakez and made a big baller move if she's scum, especially since she'd risk running into a REAL town artifact usage detector. Arguably that would set Cakez up well but that plan has disaster written all over it and I strongly doubt she's scum.

The only person voting neither wagon flipped town. Dunnstral wagon is our best clue, but Spiffeh's town. Titus jumped on only after Spiffeh specifically requested her to so ? The only other people on it were BM/Math. 3 people, hypothetically 2 can be scum, but only 1 is more likely, and 0 is possible though it'd be shocking.

The scumflip definitely helped me out because I was always working under the framework that he was probably town, even though I rationally knew he could be scum that wasn't really my framework for the game. Watching him flip town would have just been super annoying/disappointing, because that was always what I was working with anyway.

[Prism]

btw everyone say something nice to tammy so she stays engaged out of spite for the scumteam, meanest person to silence but definitely the most effective pick

my nice thing is ff7 fuckin blows LMAO

[Prism]

Strong contender for the cause? Doubt this will actually wind up being useful but you never know

[Prism]

nvm these seem fancreated goddamnit ok

[Prism]

At some point I gotta try again

One day

[Prism]

Correct, there is nothing else to the scarf. Power returns whether or not target has had access to a non-notes PT at any point in the game, negative effect is PT containing only myself for the rest of the game. The question I asked the mod yesterday was about resolution order for another PT cop/me being put in the PT, received answer that a samenight investigation on me would return a "Yes", and so claimed it then.

It is unclear when Cakez's theft would resolve but given that he was voted out the same day I got the scarf, I think it's very obvious why it did not get stolen lol

[Prism]

Another reason I outed it was the way I did it-"I'm no longer a good target for a PT cop"-wasn't just to guard myself but to lead scum to believe I was a neighborizer or something like that rather than a useful investigative.

I also asked bork yesterday about whether he targeted anyone else with the same power because the soft w/ sangres heavily implied a neighborhood and I wanted to know if I needed to worry about someone besides Bell/bork returning a false positive.

[Prism]

Ask penguin, but my guess would be another PT cop/red herring of one, which is again half of why I immediately said "I am no longer a good target for a PT cop" after asking the resolutuon question Day 3 (and I telegraphed in advance I was asking this question)

[Prism]

Scum sample PM has a PT. Here's the two posts btw, telegraphy was more vague than I thought but the claim about resolution order was very explicit.

I would strongly recommend waiting for him to show up before using anything/directing Spiffeh to use anything on Bork.

I don't see an incentive to out the relative power or any specifics of the scarf at this time.

Alright, after a question to the mod regarding resolution order, and given that one likely exists due to trident mechanic: I am no longer a good target for a hypothetical PT cop. I will not discuss this further.

[Prism]

It is very unclear to me why I am so town to you. It was one thing to be present for the mastina wagon and see me push a scumflip. I'm shocked that Math is the only one calling it into question now that Cakez has flipped, and you shouldn't really have the same bias as a result of your late replace-in+strong Cakez scumread. My position and the dynamic of this game is significantly different than the one I had in 2181.

Giving town a Paragon as a free mechanical clear is not really my style as scum, but shooting uneliminable players, forcing a DGB vote if I know I can get away with it, and silencing those it would hurt most is 100% up my alley. The bit on your replace-in is extremely trivial to fake and the scum incentive to be performative is obvious.

[Prism]

Just remembered the point Titus brought up about Cakez never following through with metaing me; pretty +town for her imo.

[Prism]

I dunno. I have a serious first world problem with being a universal townread literally every single game regardless of alignment, and I'm always annoying about making people justify it. Sometimes it pays off, though.

[Prism]

A quick discussion, and the group has chosen someone to fetch the golden stick. Their representative moves toward Trailer, who wags his tail just a bit before allowing the spike to be unearthed. Prepared for the exchange, he brings along a regular stick and, upon retrieving the spike, throws that stick for Trailer to fetch. Bounding off happily, the dog leaves behind a crowd with a much less playful task ahead.

Can you be clear as to whether this is run of the mill morning vote flavor? (ie. Flavor vs. result of mechanical action).

I'm asking because Comb/Snowglobe votes were unflavored.

[Prism]

Wait, does that mean this was also just flavor and not anything mechanical? WHAT LMAO

With minimal coaxing, Trailer is convinced to sniff an outstretched hand and hardly notices when his scarf is removed. He is then promptly distracted by a thirteen-lined ground squirrel and gives chase. Would that the non-metallized people could find their attention drawn away from their grisly task so easily...

Spoiler: What the fuck

Btw, post morning mod should have an announcement.

Btw, post morning mod should have an announcement.

Btw, post morning mod should have an announcement.

Btw, post morning mod should have an announcement.

Btw, post morning mod should have an announcement.

Btw, post morning mod should have an announcement.

[Prism]

I forgot Cabd flavored the comb but WHAT ON EARTH BELL LMAO

[Prism]

Maybe but start of morning 4 is very different than after morning 3.

I mean whatever it was we're not finding out now/it's not important I guess but wack

[Prism]

Who do you think is scum if Bork is?
Who do you think is scum if Bork isn’t?

I tried to take this somewhat seriously but the real answer is "I don't fuckin' know" lmao

Bork town -> In order scum to town like BM, notsci, you, Dunn, Pooky, Titus, Tammy? All 3 of notsci/MB/Dunn have good reason to be town, Pooky is more for paranoia of burning the bussing card than for anything tangible. This got me to think more on Titus, originally she was lower town and I had her as "pretty dartthrow and probably worth reevaluating given the weird D1 progression on me/Cakez" but now I feel like she's probably town for it. She used VCA as a reason to stop pushing me and to push more on Cakez, the explanation wasn't great but the scum motivation would be ??? super bizarre.

Bork scum is something I might have to come to terms with and I don't even know where to start for the partner but BM is probably still the vote.

[Prism]

Gaps to give a better idea of that sorting using space to get a better idea of where the gaps are

Bork town world Scum to Town

battle mage


notsci
mathblade

dunn

pooky
titus

tammy

Spiffeh/me/bork not included

[Prism]

I might as well just throw the whole playerlist in rather than specify the worlds tbh, I haven't done any thinking at all to speculating the split

S->T
======
Battle Mage


notscience
borkjerkfin
MathBlade (Kind of tied with bork idk)

Dunn

Pooky
Titus


Tammy

[Prism]

Yeah Tammy we're not voting bork sorry lol, we just let him die since it's optimal even if he's town. Even numbers mean the poison is a free elimination.

Interesting:

Why do you have me as likely scum despite pushing Cakez as scum for three days straight and on D1 saying I scumread Cakez and Mastina on d1 and was just picking one?

How does that get me on the same level as Not Science?

I literally have not read you for alignment or kept track of your pushes for weeks lmao

In general that was because I think/thought you were town and a lot of bork moving down is the realization that someone has to be scum

[Prism]

though I guess it's useful to know where she stands on him

I also forgot we were in the afternoon phase, might vote BM later but we'll see if I get the motivation to actually tryhard again at some point

I'm about to make a 3 hour drive so might not be around until Monday

[Prism]

btw we don't even have to wait for the PT, if at any point you have info that contradicts claims vote yourself then vote the person, dunno if that'd violate penguin's rules though

[Prism]

You're right, though I suspect Penguin might insert the qualifier "valid" for votes. How extensive our messaging system should be from there is probably going to be left up to us, in thatdivising workarounds/playing an extensive game of 20 Questions is sufficiently inhibiting that it's not worth cracking down on.

[Prism]

Last shitpost before I drive

Tammy vote me if you're enjoying the vacation, drinking some nice wine, and figuratively laying out on the beach because you're stuck in the Midwest but that's okay

Vote Spiffeh if you hate the scumteam and you're stuck grading and Nacho is a gigantic loser who got nightkilled LMAO

[Prism]

I don't know if this would help assauge your paranoia MathBlade but me going deep would 100% be improvisation. Everything about Day 1 would have been to accumulate mechanical powed/towncred then burn it in exchange for 2 or ideally 3 miselims.

High risk/high visibility plays Day 1 are like that and I have a very, very long record of wanting shutouts and preferring to be the first scum flipped even though it never happens.

[Prism]

Also I didn't scumread Bork Day 1 and the Trident had extremely limited utility, not sure what you're getting at there. I would have worried about the Trident if it has been relevant for the PT cop but the wording of the scarf meant my theory didn't apply.

[Prism]

^ ie. What will you flip?

Character+role title

[Prism]

idea: we policy anyone with an SO, death to the normies

spiffeh already took care of bork now we vote notsci and someone vigs tammy

everyone left must post pictures of their 90s anime vhs collection under threat of death

[Prism]

On a more serious note I probably won't place a vote until Tuesday/Wednesday, I want to tryhard but will not be home until very late Monday evening.

[Prism]

Maybe, he's, uh, uh

checks wiki

HG Wells!!!

Surely he does not fakeclaim miller without some idea of who to flavorclaim, SURELY

[Prism]

Titus: did you get any notice this morning?

what's the deal with this btw

[Prism]

Okay, I'm taking that as a guilty on bork

Unfortunately though Tammy we still let him die but that's good to know lol

Also he has claimed 1x artifact usage (Farnsworth) with the Trident usage still unclear, dunno how that matches with your result

[Prism]

If scum has something to save him we vote him Day 5 but it's better to let poison get him regardless of alignment

[Prism]

Last shitpost before I drive

Tammy vote me if you're enjoying the vacation, drinking some nice wine, and figuratively laying out on the beach because you're stuck in the Midwest but that's okay

Vote Spiffeh if you hate the scumteam and you're stuck grading and Nacho is a gigantic loser who got nightkilled LMAO

never answered this btw tammy very important

[Prism]

BATTLE MAGE

CHARACTER NAME

ROLE NAME

[Prism]

"Come on! Not everything in here is dangerous. You got that cuddly little ferret from a cooking pot."

You are Pete the ferret, a

Vanilla Townie

aligned with the

Town

.

You have no powers beyond your brain and your vote, plus the use of any artifacts you possess during the game as outlined below:

Artifact Usage: If you receive an Artifact during the game, you will be told its flavor name, its Power, and its Negative Effect. You may use one Artifact per game phase as outlined in its Power description. During the Night phase, in lieu of using an Artifact in your possession, you may transfer an Artifact you hold to another player. If this action is blocked or otherwise prevented, the Artifact will remain in your possession. You will be sent an inventory listing of your Artifacts at the start of each Day phase and will receive an updated inventory if the contents change at any other point.

Town win condition: You win when all players who are aligned with the Mafia are Bronzed (or Canceled).

Please confirm by PM that you understand your role PM and the rules and information provided in the opening game thread posts. Include the confirmation phrase as well.

This is Pete the ferret. He is a VT.

I am HG Wells. I am a VT.

Bell was Leena, town mason.

Fill in the blanks for you

P-Edit: Okay, role name? Miller? Gunsmith miller? Gunsmith/cop miller?

[Prism]

prod dodge

Full artifact usage claim pls, see: guilty claimed by tammatha

[Prism]

Your claim literally could have been Artie Nielson, _____ miller and we would have moved onto the rest of your play dude, instead we've had to pull teeth across like 3 pages to get a 3/4 word claim and still don't have it which is absurd

[Prism]

Everyone can trash their reasons for townreading me, I give full permission because it's probably bad, the actual reason I'm town is I let yesterday happen when I am a relentless perfectionist/complete control freak as scum and that was 100% preventable

[Prism]

If Bork doesn’t flip with it then either Prism has it and lied or scum passed it on again (why useless artifact).

??? or he used it lmao

[Prism]

1. N3 existed

2. It was double novice and actually couldn't be used until N3 lmao

I was annoyed by the term since N0 was a thing but N3 was the first night possible

[Prism]

And it doesn’t say if artifacts aren’t listed if they are used?
It could flip artifact blah blah used.

My working assumption has been it only gives current artifact possession

[Prism]

Yep wording is "in possession of no artifacts", and LLD only flipped with comb

[Prism]

Spiffeh poisoned bork with another artifact, nothing to do with Snowglobe

[Prism]

I mean he might, I'm just saying him flipping without it absolutely does not mean I am mafia, it means it's passed or was used N3

[Prism]

Target player beginning N3

Power: If player is in a PT, cannot post in any of them for the next

day

phase. Can still read posts of others. (Announcement made in PT via mod, any actions must be PMd to mod)

Negative effect: Exactly the same as above but for yourself the following

night

[Prism]

ie. Nothing happens to your target if they're not in a PT

Still affects you if you're in a PT

[Prism]

So if he's mafia, I guess there is a good chance he'll flip with it even though usage isn't out of the question

[Prism]

Ehhhhh depending on when poison resolves he might be able to burn it B4

Ruff

[Prism]

N4

[Prism]

I considered that but it is 100% not the Trident

[Prism]

ie. Perhaps I'm mafia with bork and lying, but FMPOV it is not the trident

[Prism]

Not going to take issue with that given that I agree I got a garbage pass for most of the game and the reasons to townread me really require a lot more meta knowledge than anyone here has.

[Prism]

Selfvoting was the established signal that Tammy had info contradicting an artifact claim.

Idk what that is specifically, Bork only claimed N1 used Farnsworth, nothing claimed for N2/N3, but at this point just let him die

Spiffeh voting bork today is throwing away a free miselim for 0 reason. No. Vote someone else, vote bork if he lives, if he doesn't free elim.

[Prism]

Tomorrow is tryhard day for me now that I'm home, will be a long one but I'll push through. I'd rather not yeet anyone before that.

[Prism]

I would also be curious for the case on me, but MathBlade thinking there is ever a world in which they get nightkilled right now is classic.

[Prism]

Pretty happy with the MathBlade post, will probably respond to it at some point but I'm satisfied with the depth+coherency of it.

In many ways this game is ironic in the sense that with mastina flip, my play was 100% scum by meta but the narrative/actual reason why that would be the case no one would understand. The Cakez flip reversed it and suddenly the narrative is super easy but the meta is clearing.

Also concur on BM btw but that one's waiting until tomorrow.

[Prism]

Also the bit about lack of interaction when I reverse course on KTT is hilarious though, go back and trace that sequence over when you're awake. Super obviously town in an instant and LLD instantly realized what I did and why, scum motivation would be backing down after KTT rose from occasion, absolutely not a random flip or lacking in interactions lmao

[Prism]

Because it's a closed theme with almost certainly at least one protective lmao, LLD died when she claimed to have used one and we had just voted out the bulletproof bodyguard.

[Prism]

Like I can respond to that wall more in-depth tomorrow when I'm not in bed on my phone, if you wanted a more timely answer to that specifically sure w/e, but sangres is not a slot I am even remotely afraid of as scum and all 3 slots that are dead hard townread me. That's not a towntell because I shoot people who scumread me like clockwork, but I'm definitely not shooting people I am scared of.

The reason I am town, fundamentally, is that I am an obsessive control freak as scum and do not cede control of the game to the town on Day 3 and just hope the game doesn't mechanically solve. Any chance of losing is unacceptable to me as scum,

at all

[Prism]

There's plenty of issues to be raised with taking my word for my meta, but unfortunately I don't think that one liner is as clever as you think it is in that it reinforces the point

I'll try and sleep but the wall, while commendable in effort, is...quite terrible in reasoning, ex. the very first point about "one of prism/bork" was that Prism town did not imply Bork scum in the context of the discussion around the artifact. This was, and always will be, absurd and there's a reason sangres agreed. Other highlights include LLD being the one rageclaiming while I just said sure, voting in the 400s in Iceland, quoted 942 on Titus was 100% a serious push with depth, not simple shade, later acts like I have no serious pushes, previously mentioned issue w/ KTT narrative, not even close to first interaction w/ mastina, my defense of Cakez is indeed terrible but horrid interpretations abound...

[Prism]

Sorry but as much as the prospect of block quoting thrills me I'm going to sleep so I can get my vaccine in 4 hours.

[Prism]

Also, you can do the research on the late vote theory since it seems to be of interest, or I can go ahead and tell you straight out you have the meta flipped and I am extremely hesitant to vote outside RVS as town, but seeing is believing

[Prism]

Spiffeh is mechanically clear. The scarf was a PT cop, Spiffeh is in no PTs.

[Prism]

The scarf implies it was me.

Ie. Spiffeh can only be scum with exactly me.

[Prism]

Do you think Tammy counterclaims her own partner Day 1?

[Prism]

It depends on how well you back it, but there's just no point: Spiffeh will be nightkilled either way, and you can revisit the question D5 if not.

I'm really disinterested in mafia at the moment and kind of just want out. I'll be around to tryhard after work but I'm just...not interested playing mafia lately and want to do other things. I'll try and finish strong but it is hard.

[Prism]

Like I've treated the last ~50 pages like it's my job to give stylistic, argumentative, and meta feedback rather than a puzzle to be solved, and it's so pointless and self-important as to be borderline trolling.

[Prism]

Alright, coffee and bite the bullet. Someone else come around because I don't want to work at this alone, Pooky/Spiffeh in particular.

[Prism]

Fuck it, no ISOs, we going all the way and just starting from complete scratch. I dunno how I'm going to do this but I imagine I'll post some tidbits for you, where you is basically everyone but BM/MB, to shake off bystander effect and engage with.

[Prism]

I'm basically assuming bork is scum AFK, if he's town completely phoning it in because he's upset he got poisoned I am going to be very, very upset.

Things like this look pretty good for MathBlade imo:

Random question for you Bork well two:

1) Is the character presented with the item a lady or a man or nonbinary?
2) What’s the negative consequence of the item?

1) I struggle to see how this is relevant to the game at large
2) contextually either minorly inconvenient or innocuous

Those aren’t direct answers.
There are lots of characters on the show. Surely a gender won’t give it away. I had a reason when I thought it was a soft but if you guess the wrong gender or something like that then the jig is up without exposing Prism in case they’re town.
And outing the negative consequences should be easy enough to do. Why won’t you?

[Prism]

(I straight up don't get the Tammy guilty given she's a usage detector. bork claimed usage N1+hasn't claimed N2/N3, but N3 trident usage makes sense so the possibility for guilty result is really only seeing bork not use an artifact N1. Usage number of 3 would be a great indicator but not hard guilty)

[Prism]

Remind me what did Bork claim he used?

N1: Farnsworth artifact on Nacho
N2: No claim
N3: No claim, but would make sense to use Trident.

It's unclear exactly how Tammy's role works but anything suggesting he used an artifact N2 would be very incriminating. This is because he started with Farnsworth and the Trident was unusable until N3, ie. would require a 2 artifact start or being passed another overnight.

[Prism]

Anything specific you'd like my input on Prism?

I haven't really tracked your current thinking well, but what do you think of BM/MathBlade?

Titus's early posts are still really bad but I'm waiting to see what happens with the wagons on her and how Cakez reacts.

[Prism]

Some thinking on Dunn/notsci would also be nice.

My inclination is just that Dunnstral is hard town for Day 1 w/ Cakez, I want to scumread notsci but it's more for how he interacts with players than anything about his reads so far.

[Prism]

Super town sequence for MB imo

Ok what's your point here? This is such a dumb thing to nitpick.

My point is that I feel like you're making mountains out of emotional molehills by calling that a meltdown, and that's a real real strong alarm bell to me.

So again, I ask you, what part of that post you quoted do you call a meltdown? Two mildly peeved posts, if even that level of annoyance is hardly a meltdown, but that's the word you used.

-k

He was literally saying he was excited to play the game but was accepting that he was going to be elimmed after like one person attacked him. It was ridiculous.

LLD Mala Prism Bell Titus Dunn are one person. Some have stated they’ve checked out til elim phase. That’s not one person.

Ok one person was an exaggeration

I think ur town dude just stop feeding people attacking you

[Prism]

I'm literally rereading the game from scratch, do you not understand this?

[Prism]

If you need something to do on me so badly go meta me or something.

The entire point of my confusion on Tammy isn't to save bork, because as I've been over it's better to let him die regardless. It's to make sure Tammy is correctly claiming her information so that if he

does

flip town she doesn't get policied for it.

[Prism]

Titus’s posts are still really bad (I agree).
But I’m waiting on the wagons (day is over wagons are dead)
And SirCakez’s reactions (Dude is dead scum)

THIS IS TALKING ABOUT

WHEN I GET TO THE POINT IN DAY 1

WHEN TITUS GETS WAGONED

AND THAT I WANT TO SEE HOW CAKEZ REACTS WHEN THAT HAPPENS

BECAUSE I KNOW IT HAPPENS, BUT I AM NOT THERE YET. I AM INSTEAD IN THE 300S

JESUS FUCKING CHRIST

[Prism]

DO YOU ACTUALLY FUCKING THINK I AM WAITING FOR CAKEZ TO DO SOMETHING RIGHT NOW, MARCH 30TH, LIKE HOLY SHIT

[Prism]

Alright, whatever, turbostupid, can't get tilted with so much left to go

[Prism]

I've been wary of MathBlade pushing Cakez being hardtown because their strategic view in The Mod is Mafia was very myopic, the one post onsite that I have remembered almost word for word years later is from this sequence:

Spoiler: Quote wall

This game should end with either a straight up blank or with only a Titus lynch. You [MathBlade] going deep is plan C not plan A. No need to kill grapes right now.

Me going deep is plan C? Thought that was plan A.

That's how I have been playing it.

Whatcha thinking the plan is?

Radiant Moonlight slot is inactive as fuck (well start of game)

Your two slots are widely suspected. The only two people who suspect me have claimed PR.

Literally one slot suspects our slot.

You should be bussing RM and maybe our slot too, but chances are that as a team either we either get a shutout or only have to lose the RM slot. In Plan C with both our slots gone, camn should never be lynched and you should be aiming to win in 5 way.

You should keep playing like you have been, it's more just the night kills to be concerned about. Ex. Grapes is a decent mislynch candidate, he's been inactive for huge stretches and done a lot of non-statements.

I am sure a lot has changed in 4 years but this was the single most disturbing post I've ever seen in a scum PT, I literally remember that first line years later, and for me represented the first time I realized that the site as a whole did not understand the scum alignment.

Looking at the Cakez/bork side of the interactions makes me feel a lot better so far.

[Prism]

Through post 500 I'm not really thrilled with Battle Mage. The interactions with Cakez aren't great, things like this are kind of just going through the motions:

Math I trust you to be my flavor guide this game

im not sure if he is in this game?

Huh?

flavor leaf

People don’t just offhand comment “Insert paragraph” I may be socially weird but that doesn’t happen.

It can be a comment when somebody doesn't want to write the full thing out but knows they can.

i do similar at work - when someone emails me a difficult question, I reply with "insert helpful answer here"

yo Cakez, come on the LLD bandwagon!

I would describe battle mage and bell as thirsty

i think someone already used that word? strange coincidence, unless you were just repeating?

Trying to leverage me/LLD both townleaning him into a play for the artifact was also still an extremely bizarre episode.

[Prism]

This sequence is EXTREMELY good for Dunnstral. Spiffeh is the first poster of the Afternoon (real voting) phase. He makes a short case on Dunnstral, votes there. Pooky votes Dunn+Bell votes MathBlade both basically without comment. Cakez is the next poster.

VOTE: dunnstral
Please be town Spiffeh

A Math wagon is really boring and unhelpful
Join this one instead!

I'm going to ignore the MB part of this for now but the fact Cakez is on this immediately on the vote opening up is super good. It basically eliminates any chance in my mind that the Dunn wagon was some dying desperado distance move

[Prism]

lol @ Detective Prism trying to meticulously recreate the timeline of events while Mathblade trolls him.

"You waiting for Cakeboi to come back from the dead and tell you what's going on?"

wild

yeah i mean if this game were a county fair or six flags i just keep coming back to uncle math's tilt-a-whirl ride again and again

[Prism]

lol @ Detective Prism trying to meticulously recreate the timeline of events while Mathblade trolls him.

"You waiting for Cakeboi to come back from the dead and tell you what's going on?"

wild

I know you scumread BM atm, I'm with you on assuming bork is scum for the moment, what are you thinking about Dunn/MB/notsci? Maybe Titus too?

[Prism]

I mean I didn't even realize BM was that close so I'm glad I made the time today but I don't mind working back over the game to make sure we have it on lock.

[Prism]

Yeah I'm through page 20 and I'm officially never voting Dunn, not even just a "I guess he's town" anymore

[Prism]

Page 22 is also really fuckin' good for MB

Furthermore I am sketched out that Bork never confirmed anything specific so we don’t know if Bork actually got it.

So this is just weird. I don’t like it and maintain my objection and if I am miselimmed while I am at work artifacts always go to townreads. Assume LLD is scum until/unless she proves a mason buddy as she is breaking the cardinal rules of how she operates. Her play today is absolute garbage and she should be ashamed.

I can't even remember a Bork post this game. He needs to get his butt in here.

Vig Cakez imho.

His stance around me and my posts reads as buddying yet paints me as having a meltdown.

People being nice to me doesn’t happen from town.

Actually
VOTE: Cakez

Hopefully this can become a thing.

Ignoring Math until he starts using his brain

I might just hammer BM tonight at this rate. This early game is really, really rough and I feel SIGNIFICANTLY better about the slots I was already leaning town on now.

[Prism]

I think Cakez enthuiasm for Titus/Dunn blood on D1 points to them being just town.

I can see MB being scum maybe but he's like been pretty solid.

I can see Notty being scum instead of BM.

Rereading BM's ISO and Cakez interactions with BM I could see maybe BM town? I'd have to re-read again.

I haven't even re-read Bork's ISO yet - have been swamped - will make time for it later it's not very long anyways.

Right now I think just burning all 3 of BM/notsci/Titus wins it, I also want to check on you but like, again almost certainly town and just need to doublecheck

It's legitimately possible I come away from this with everyone but BM

[Prism]

what would I even be SR'd for lol

Just look at your ISO it's fluffier then a teddy bear

wait that's it?

I'm DEAD this sequence is hilarious and amazing

SWITCH FLIPPED, TARGET LOCKED, ENGAGING TUNNEL SYSTEM, ACTION CANNOT BE CANCELLED OR OVERRIDEN

[Prism]

I just picture the NPC meme where it goes from neutral to angry

the friendly bear turns into an angry, violent, relentless heat seeking ICBM at a moment's notice

[Prism]

I really wish bork didn't excel at striking the correct tenor in interactions with his partners because the 600s where he's talking to Math are probably the best posting of bork's all game

[Prism]

Page 40 update, Feeling really good about Pooky town, feel a little bit less good on Math w/ later bork and mastina interactions but tracking the progressions of Math's reads is absolute insanity. Not quite to the Titus wagon yet but the dueling Dunn/MB wagons was a bizarre episode in hindsight.

T->S
=====
Spiffeh
Dunn
Tammy
Pooky

MathBlade
Titus

notsci

BM

Just assuming bork is scum at this point, again going to be super fucking annoyed if he's town phoning it in

Might call it a night soon, have more time tomorrow but this has been a good start.

[Prism]

This post is town as fuck

No it's not, it's NAI. I'd make that post to anyone regardless of my alignment. In fact it's probably a good example of something that I'd often call "belongs in Mafia Discussion" because I could transplant it there almost word for word without breaking site rules.

It's just a post I felt like making

Great post from Grey actually.

[Prism]

Mastina’s sircakez vote and shit is terrible.

My guess is BM/Titus/(Prism/Mastina/Bork)/??? Maybe quiet

Tammy Cakez and Bell and Spiffeh are obvious town.

this is why my life is hard lmao, math isn't scum for this post or anything but tracking this math's reads is a fucking nightmare

[Prism]

just for equality there's probably 3 scum in this lmfao

Pretty town
===========
Battle Mage
bork
sangres (Last three could really go in any order)
SirCakez

[Prism]

I'm sorry-you saw I started with a scum-utility artifact, and suddenly I'm town? What just happened?

Scum you doesn’t give it away + a combination of LLD outed mason. You’d give it to a buddy.

So if you’re scum you’re scum with Bork

Which is kinda stupid on so many fronts it solves itself

I still find this flip on my flavor extremely fucking bizarre in that the Trident had more scum utility than town, and have always thought it was done to take the opposite side of mastina, but at this point Math is such an enigma

[Prism]

I am stopping for the night but through the 1100s I am so fucking confused about how MathBlade is going to eventually wind up voting Cakez, townreading him, scumreading mastina, bashing mastina for even trying to go Cakez

[Prism]

Why is MathBlade characterizing my unvote on Titus as "the wagon was already dead" or w/e when I unvote at E-2, Math is hardshoving it still, and it gets to E-1 a few pages later while I fight with Grey trying to get people not to hammer

I need to sleep and stop reading but god I wish I used the PT cop on this slot even if I know Spiffeh was objectively a better choice

[Prism]

I'm unsure how to interpret Cakez's initial vote on Titus, it comes right after I suggest I'm open to the slot, but later he's really trying to force it through. Arguably is trying to salvage the best of a scumflip but idk. Titus's posts Day 1 are generally pretty bad imo but choosing to push me/Cakez, then dropping me and just focusing on Cakez of her own volition, is town to me.

Claiming VT.

Don't care if I get yeeted. This game is a town loss. There's no cohesion or ability to get it thanks to the stupid post restriction.

You have my solve. See you in 1-2 months.

hi scum Titus
she doesn't vomit this defeatist delusional crap as town
I'm sorry she is not feeling well right now but that does not make her town

Titus is sort of scummy but IDK

And this is how buddies talk about each other at this point where an elim is likely but not inevitable.

unlike spiffeh who eventually seems to have finally rolled town

still not seeing this
he's not blatantly scummy but the town vibes are very nonexistent there

[Prism]

I've been very spammy tonight so my apologies, but with the entire positioning around Titus I'm back at townleaning MathBlade, what a mess of a game though

VOTE: BM
VOTE: Dunn
VOTE: Mastina
VOTE: Titus << will rescind if she rescinds her defeatist shit

Someone’s gotta be brave enough to do the first vote. That’s where I wanna go.

Flash Battle Mage?

Uhhhhhh

Weren't you calling Titus scum before her defeatist shit?

Since then she's posted "playing is way too hard and the game is all stacked against the town, woe is us, there's no point in townies even trying." And now you're willing to unvote her?

Holy fuck.

You go right back into the scum pile if Titus is

scum

because this is fucking awful. In point of fact if Titus is scum I'd love to see your ass vigged tonight because damn it'd feel good to get another red flip.

And it's a large, you better believe there's some goddamn vigs.

I am waffling. I am willing to unvote her.. Maybe I am a sap for it because she’s my sister. Quite honestly I would love being vigged. Seeing LLD eat crow and then realize I helped build a massive town block she can use to carry this game would be awesome. She’d actually have to communicate with people and that would be worth it. All I do is what I think is best. If I die I die, I helped build what will likely have us win. And I am okay if I die after that and whoever vigged me would be an idiot.

I'm reading on my phone atm so quoting is limited but Grey trying to encourage a Titus hammer is troubling even if consistent with reads.

I need to fuckin sleep but I'm an obsessive

[Prism]

VOTE: Titus

I can’t sleep but I may be drunk on wifom but if Mastina and Titus are scum together and she doesn’t want Titus then Titus.

But what if she knows that I would revote Titis with that post .....

(Back and forth a lot)

Could do either

revotes titus w/ mastina actually facing pressure and votes

why do you do this to me mathblade

[Prism]

1600s from MathBlade are some of the worst posting I have ever seen in a game, the determination to call mastina scum and keep shoving how everyone needs to vote Titus is incredible. Swap to Cakez in the end is super bad and does not even remotely feel legitimate.

[Prism]

Page 98 and reading Titus/MathBlade/Pooky/Cakez Day 2 makes my head hurt. This is when me and Tammy just wanted to policy Math and I fully understand why. Math's posts slightly improve on Cakez while the middle school shit w/ Pooky kind of hurts how right he was overall.

[Prism]

So, I discovered TikTok today and I might need to replace out cuz I’m



Or just a sad bitch that’s sat here and drank all day and done nothin else :/

BUT

Titus - I am sorry, You were prophetic as shit and I should have listened to you yesterday because while I think mathblade is town, good gods if that dude comes within range I am hammering that motherfucker, I kinda feel like right now we’re in a SF movie and told we have just soooo much oxygen for everyone and one person has decided they don’t wanna share oxygen with everyone and they’re just gonna go ahead and hyperfucking ventilate and I’m mot above airlocking a motherfucker,

But seriously (Though I am totally serious about hammering that shit) yesterday you kinda got after me, and then claim d I was counter claiming cakez, when I wasn’t sure if even that’s what I was doing, But I know that sometimes when we’re town together and everything’s cool but sometimes it’s not and you like to take potshots at my playstyle and then I can’t tell if it’s scum you or town you doing it, But I would like to see all about cakez,

I’m having have had big motherfucking problems with Pooky and cakez interaction’s since yesterday, and I do not think both of them are town and while I think it’s some serious scum theater I could be wrong, but my one big question I ask myself is why did cakez spend all of yesterday saying I WILL END YOU POOKY!!! and then not know who to use his role on, take suggestions cuz he doesn’t know how to use his role, then use it on fucking quiet while still yelling “I WILL END YOU POOKY”?

Like does that make sense?

Does it make more sense than book trying to deflect fake paranoia on ffery yesterday at end of day over dumb bullshit? OH and then trying to false equivalency fake paranoia on me for ffery and do nothing else today? Yeah that makes sense y’all,

I don’t believe it’s impossible that w had due,in scum wagons yesterday, I think it’s entirely possible one of Pooky or cakes is scum,

I’ve lost my train of thought completely but I think that prism, math (gods help us all) bell, LLD sorta yeah I went back and read magic girls and he fake claim was different than here but good gods does she not have the same scum game twice and people are fucking stupid (and she says so so maybe now I’m adumbbitch for following or I’m just gonna go ahead and drink more wine), kinda like greyice but I think I always think he’s town so lol, kinda liked some battle,age posts too

So but really I wanna know why the fuck cakez did inventory on quiet when he’s been all up in pooky’s ass?

this post is such queen shit btw, a forgotten national treasure

[Prism]

Eyes glazing over, breaktime, Page 110 update

T->S
=====
Spiffeh
Dunn
Tammy
Pooky


Titus

MathBlade
BM
notsci

MB becomes more pro-Cakez vote as Day 2 goes on, still a nightmare slot to read. BM actually has decent interactions with Cakez and it looks like Cakez wants me to lead a wagon on that slot.

[Prism]

I'm not even sure what specific post you're referring to here but your reads Day 1 are such a fucking random.org disaster that I'm over it.

Day 1 at that point you're scumreading all of Titus, mastina, Cakez, Dunn, BM, myself, and it's not even clear at what point you flop on Cakez you just randomly fucking go from townreading to scumreading him and act like you said it several hundreds post back and I'm not going to find out.

The entire time in the 1600s you're posting shit about a mastina/Titus team but hardshoving Titus.

[Prism]

Literally anyone this game could have flipped scum and you have a post to point with great pride that you were right all along, but at the end of the day you happily spearheaded the Dunnstral vote with Cakez and didn't vote mastina because oh if Titus is town mastina is town so vote Titus, and it is super unclear why you even voted Cakez to begin with.

I'll probably be choosing between mastina and Titus today

Unless SirCakez really shits the bed in his posts the last ten pages I don't really want to go there today

KTT why the puke emojis?

I am kinda torn. I townread the entire Titus wagon except Cakez.

But my townreads are saying Titus is town.
If Titus is town then Mastina is probably town,
So then Cakez?

That’s where I am confused on but I don’t like the wagon on Cakez as it has majority of my PoE.
Also Cakez posting this page of buddying me is crap as it’s well known I have a predisposition towards scumreading Titus

You know what: Fuck it.

VOTE: SirCakez

This is the post. This comes with the Titus vote ACTUALLY dead, after eons of trying to shove that through and failing. The justification for not voting mastina the previous like 300 posts has been the worst, I'm sorry.

[Prism]

Right, and I like your Day 2! And I like that Cakez noticeably tries to get you off his back at several points Day 1!

But yes, in the same vein as me defending Cakez is terrible even if I am town, so is you hardshoving Titus and doing whatever gymnastics you can to avoid voting mastina and then flashwagoning Dunn with Cakez.

[Prism]

Also I'm sorry but if you want to cry about misrepresentation your entire fucking wall is wrong and the fact I'm not revisiting it and hardshoving you is a gift in and of itself, it's absolutely horrendous from start to finish and I've given at least 7 points for you to work through on your own.

Most recent example being 4343

[Prism]

[Prism]

You have posted things.
Given me things to work through, no?

You’ve posted things I disagree with.
What is there to work through?

You read things.
Either two things are happening
A> You’re trying to demonstrate you’re town to me.
B> You’re trying to make me look bad.

For A > Posting things that grossly take d1 out of context and don’t consider my mental state gives me nothing to work through.
For B> Nothing to work through as it is shade.

PROBLEMS WITH YOUR WALL ON ME

YOUR CASE ON ME

BEING REPEATEDLY, FATALLY, AND PERVASIVELY WRONG FROM START TO END

ARE YOUR FAULT

AND NEED TO BE WORKED THROUGH

IN THE SAME VEIN AS YOU'RE ALLUDING THAT MY BAD READ ON YOU NEEDS TO BE WORKED ON

[Prism]

VOTE: Prism

[Prism]

I have literally just worked through 110 pages of the game from scratch in ~12 hours, said I was taking a break before finishing the last 65.

I have made extensive points and references solidifying multiple townreads, but am still more ambiguous on your slot. Cry me a river.

Yeah, I am the person at this table doing nothing all game, for sure.

[Prism]

Post 1202 contains the first vote of the game with any levity behind it. It seems to possibly be a scum tell to wait and see where Prism can place a vote versus being aggressive with it. They see if they can get away with certain pushes. There doesn't become an issue until my wagon is dissolving.

Then Prism votes Titus. Prism backs off Titus then joins the Mastina wagon when SirCakez/Mastina wagons were dualing. See 1755 for the VC. Titus wagon was dying down. This is a wolfy hop on to the goon.

Why is MathBlade characterizing my unvote on Titus as "the wagon was already dead" or w/e when I unvote at E-2, Math is hardshoving it still, and it gets to E-1 a few pages later while I fight with Grey trying to get people not to hammer

I need to sleep and stop reading but god I wish I used the PT cop on this slot even if I know Spiffeh was objectively a better choice

This isn't even getting into the fact that you're claiming I never pushed anyone just because I'm not voting there (shit guess you never pushed mastina) while multiple players concurred with my stated reasoning from 942 to vote Titus and multiple players (Spiffeh) cited my reasons for pulling off as reason to reconsider.

This isn't even getting into the fact that I vote in my first or second post of every single scumgame outside of Iceland but have an extensive record of being hesitant to vote as town until I can dedicate real time/am more sure (Chara's Folly, Mini Normal 2181) but no chance you actually fucking do the meta you're so interested in yourself

[Prism]

god forbid someone call your garbage day 1 for what it is and get tilted off the face of the fucking planet when you can't read, can't keep track of mechanics despite it apparently being your strongsuit

[Prism]

Prism spouting shit is just boring me at this point.

SPOUTING SHIT LIKE

HEY YOUR ENTIRE WALL IS CONTEXTUALLY FUCKING WRONG AND I'VE GIVEN YOU A ROADMAP FOR WHY BUT YOU CAN'T EVEN REMOTELY CONSIDER REVISITING IT AND INSTEAD ARE JUST DETERMINED TO KEEP TILTING ME OFF THE FACE OF THE FUCKING PLANET

[Prism]

BUT GOD FORBID YOU MADE BAD POSTS

NEVER FUCKING HAPPENED

YOU CAN PUSH MASTINA WITHOUT VOTING BUT I CAN'T DO THE SAME FOR FUCKING TITUS

WAGON ON TITUS WAS VERY DEAD WHEN I UNVOTED AT E-2 AND IT'S AT E-1 TWO PAGES LATER AND I'M BEGGING PEOPLE NOT TO HAMMER

[Prism]

taking everything in my fucking power not to just policy mathblade

voting myself is literally stupid performance art but i once again want to fucking discus throw my laptop into a black hole

UNVOTE:

[Prism]

It's not me being tilted that makes me town

It's your wall being fucking moronic and you can't even bother to revisit it and actually crosscheck what's happening what's actually happening when you make stupid fucking assumptions, pushing scum w/o voting is town for you but pushing doesn't count w/o a vote apparently, and not even bothering to dig into the meta theory you're in love with and realizing it's completely fucking flipped that's fucking stupid

[Prism]

I've never smoked but it might be time for me to buy a pack at the gas station and smoke it in one sitting

[Prism]

tbh this might not have been so bad had I not just read pages 90-110 where mathblade takes credit for the mastina vote, sangres/KTT were nightkilled to prevent them townblocking with mathblade, and math is town because pooky is the mason and we're all going to feel stupid when we realize that pooky didn't get n1ed as the mason

mentally i was primed to explode even before math decided reading wasn't important

[Prism]

gonna just go back to work, take a hike by the river at lunch, read the last 65 pages, then vote somebody

[Prism]

Sorry for flying off the handle. I get that you want a harder stance on you. My point is that while I have scum incentive to stay ambiguous, I am not going to magically slot you as town for (imo) bad Day 1 posting when I am legitimately reading the game.

Me putting in effort does not make me town but acting like I'm doing nothing, contributing nothing of value, while I have been actively poring over the game with a finetooth comb nonstop was extremely tilting. This is especially true when you have not pursued or appear to have seriously considered my actual points before dismissing them.

[Prism]

I get that my wall of quotes is a lot, and I could do a better job of making it accessible. That said, the entire point of quoting interesting bits was to encourage other people to engage in jump in in a game that has largely stalled. Several players have done this (BM, Pooky, Spiffeh)

I have given multiple holistic updates of exactly where I am at. It should be very obvious that this will happen again at the end.

Tangibly I have been incredibly clear that any lingering paranoia around Dunn has completely evaporated, and the same is true of Pooky. While this is where several other players are already at, this represented evolution for me.

[Prism]

Here is one example of a post specifically to chew on on Titus.

I'm unsure how to interpret Cakez's initial vote on Titus, it comes right after I suggest I'm open to the slot, but later he's really trying to force it through. Arguably is trying to salvage the best of a scumflip but idk. Titus's posts Day 1 are generally pretty bad imo but choosing to push me/Cakez, then dropping me and just focusing on Cakez of her own volition, is town to me.

Claiming VT.

Don't care if I get yeeted. This game is a town loss. There's no cohesion or ability to get it thanks to the stupid post restriction.

You have my solve. See you in 1-2 months.

hi scum Titus
she doesn't vomit this defeatist delusional crap as town
I'm sorry she is not feeling well right now but that does not make her town

Titus is sort of scummy but IDK

And this is how buddies talk about each other at this point where an elim is likely but not inevitable.

unlike spiffeh who eventually seems to have finally rolled town

still not seeing this
he's not blatantly scummy but the town vibes are very nonexistent there

[Prism]

After hiking I'm actually just kind of onboard with flipping BM/notsci. I strongly encourage using the investigative on notsci/MathBlade but me/Titus are good alternatives.

I feel a lot better about moving Titus up in my list, not from reading but just reflecting on the persistence Cakez had in pushing that slot well into Day 2.

[Prism]

Pooky is hypothetically possible b/c that Cakez slapfight really was middle school but I don't think he should be an option until 3 way.