Mafiascum.net

I was also kidding. Six days is a lot of time.

So.
MOHIS and Varsoon are Cop-cleared. Even if noone seems to believe me, I'm town. Therefore, it's Elyse.
(According to TWIE, scums must have a Roleblocker and it would be very strange if there were a Roleblocker+GF PR or something like that, so I'm simply ignoring the possibility that it's MOHIS or Varsoon. If we're wrong, we can do nothing about it.)

As for the TSO-Nightkill. I know it's a WIFOM. It makes sense from Elyse to frame me (also, I don't think TSO would ever have been lynched). Unfortunately, it makes sense from me too. Especially because I did something similar in one of my last scum games. (Although I don't think Elyse has heard of it at all.)

Examining the lynches.
Klingonette: Elyse ON (4th) – Aneninen Away
Dapper: Elyse ON (2nd) – Aneninen Away
Alchemist: Elyse ON (5th) – Aneninen Away (Dafuq was I doing here? As far as I remember I'd been scumreading Alchemist.)
Eagle: Elyse ON (3rd) – Aneninen Away (This is getting ridiculous...)
I Am Innocent: Elyse ON (5th) – Aneninen Away (I'll post more about this later)
PeregrineV: Elyse ON (3rd) – Aneninen ON (1st)
Garmr: Elyse ON (2nd) – Aneninen ON (3rd)
ZZZX: Elyse ON (2nd) – Aneninen ON (4th)

Fffffffft, this is terrible. However, Elyse was on all of the lynches and that's a point where I can start searching for something. Somehow I need to prove she's the scum, not me.

The worst thing I did was to post that I should be lynched before LyLo. I've been afraid of staying alive until LyLo all the time. Had I managed to post the spoiler of 3806 in time... but I got locked out of the Day while writing that. (You can check the time tags.) At that point I hoped we still have a Vig or something like that who could eliminate me.
Nevertheless, town cared very little about me and scums, I know, was planning to LyLo with me.
And I know it looks impossible to convince anyone now that I'm town. I'll still be trying it.

More will come later.

I know it's nearly impossible but I'll still try to do this.

(1) Elyse was never wagoned. That doesn't help. (On Day2 Garmr was voting for her for a long time, by the way.)

(2) Let's see her attitude towards Klingonette.

(2/1) Questioning Spifflop about his vote in 194.
(2/2) In 235 this: – And she votes for me instantly! Classic chainsaw!
(2/3) Jumping on Eagle in 273 (Hm-hm. Did my wagon lose momentum?)
(2/4) Agreed with Spifflop in 350 – He said Alchemist, Grapes and Klingonette would be good wagons. But Elyse stayed on Eagle!
(2/5) This in 372! – !!!!!!!!
(2/6) Then she voted for Klingonette in 413. Lack of reasoning there. (In 434 this: )
(2/7) Back to Eagle in 611, but that wagon was not working. Back to Klingonette again in 662.
(2/8) 794 and 820 are the rare occasions when she actually with Klingonette. Most of the time Elyse was talking her, talking her, but not talking her.
(2/9) Meanwhile... she had quite a lot of "spare scumreads". Like Eagle, Randomidget (in 885). She seemed to keep a lot of possibilities open in case of a counter-wagon got launched.
(2/10) Another interaction with Klingonette in 1122: – That's not the Elyse I know. Seems utterly fake, because she's much more subtle and polite in most cases. (Besides, yet again, she was talking at Klingonette, not talking to.)

I've seen – and experienced – that scums tend to see their buddies much scummier than they really are. That might have happened to Elyse too. Although, there's a more likely possibility. The scums may have lost control over the Klingonette-wagon and it would have been very suspicious if Elyse had jumped off after that hard-push.
The most relevant bits are (2/2) (2/5) and (2/8)

You may ask why I jumped off the Klingonette wagon. At that time we had another game together. She flipped scum there and her gameplay was different here. Therefore I thought she couldn't be scum here. (I mentioned it earlier, I merely recapitulated it.)

________

I'll go on later.

Most of those points are in my favor.

(3) Another thing which is worth investigating the other scums attitude towards Elyse.

(3/1) Garmr. (30 matches for Elyse's name.) Very early scumread which seems to disappear to 166. He answered Elyse's post next in... 2294.

(3/2) I Am Innocent. (21 matches). NO interaction at all!

(3/3) PeregrineV. (6 matches). Contentless vote in 714 which is changed to Spifflop, responding to Elyse in 982. Nothing else. (He talked to me on his last Day relatively a lot. The other two scums never talked to me. Weird.)

I know it's not much, but there's something else. Clotilde.
Garmr mentioned the topic once (730 ).
PeregrineV never talked about it.
Nor I Am Innocent.
Elyse asked who the f-ck she was in 584, posted this in 2859: , this in 3179: .
There were so many players freaking out of Clotilde but none of the scums. Maybe one of them (I guess, Elyse herself, but maybe Klingonette?) informed everyone at the Mafia QT (it was working on Day1) that I often did gambits like that (and I sometimes lied even as a townie).

________

Three more little things to add.
Firstly, it's easy from my point of view: Elyse is scum because there are no other possibilities. Even if you don't believe me (although I hope you will), I can only see everything as a townie.
Secondly, I know I don't have much credit. Actually I never wanted to get any. Remember, in early-game I wanted to save some PR-aßes (even if I was wrong about them), later I told all of you that I should be removed before LyLo. Why on Gods Green Earth did I needed town-credit for THAT? Even worse, I was in a very similar situation in a recent game. A LyLo where I was the obv-scum and I was whining all the time like "I'm framed and it has been planned for Days, f-ck this shyt, blah, blah" – in the end I survived to flip scum. Now I'm town and frankly, I don't know what to do. I feel Online Karma.
Thirdly, however this is obvious: if you have questions, fire them away! (Elyse, it's absolutely not personal but from now on I'm ignoring your accusations. If anyone else wants me to respond your posts, I'll do.)

↑ Elyse wrote:Most of those points are in my favor.

This whole f-cking MyLo is in your favour. When did you start planning it?

Haha I think the problem is you didn't plan well enough. I mean I don't blame you. Three scum lynches in a row is tough but you started casting doubt on me at a time where it was very obvious you knew where the game was headed.

Don't worry, Elyse, I'll reach your recent posts too.
It takes some time, you know. You must have had plenty of time for planning this situation. I didn't have. Even if I have very little chance, I still have 5 days.

VOTE: Elyse

I don't think I need explain this vote.

I'm reading plenty of Elyse.

Tomorrow, assuming I have time, I'll post about the pre-TWIE-claim Elyse and the post-TWIE-claim one. I suppose that was a kind of turning point for the scum team.
Meanwhile, I'm just leaving this here. An older readlist from her. Knowing all the flips it's full of surprises.

↑ Elyse wrote:
Passionate Storm - town
Garmr - town
I Am Innocent - scummy but getting better
ZZZX (replaces inte) - scum
PeregrineV - who the hell knows, probably town
TheWayItEnds - town
T S O - town
Shiro - scum if EE isn't
My Other Head Is Scum - scum
Extrapolated Eagle - scum
Aneninen - town
randomidget - town
Errantparabola - could be scum but probably not with EE
Elyse - town
Varsoon - town

My guess is that the team is {EE, ZZZX, MOHIS, IAI} or {Shiro, ZZZX, errant, MOHIS} with possibly IAI in the second team and possible PerV in either.

I would be very down for a ZZZX or MOHIS lynch because I think they are scum regardless, but an EE scumflip is the most helpful because in my mind it would clear errant and Shiro and TSO for those who have doubts about him.

That AtE and self-deprecation tho

@Varsoon and MOHIS

Do I need to destruct Aneninen's walls or can we lynch him already

I'm lazy and would rather not do the work if I don't have to.

I dunno
I'm second guessing everything I ever thought
Basically, it comes down to this:

Do I trust my judgment over TSO's judgment?
Do I risk the game on my gut feeling over TSO's dying judgment?
Or, do I put my vote down where TSO said I should, and justify a loss in saying that this was of his design?
Ultimately, I think this is the moment where I make a decision based on whether or not I want to be cynical or let another player's vision for the game supersede my own.

Elyse, I feel like you're sweating here. It's as if you're appealing in these really, "Oh, hey, things are decided, we're all chummy on the winning side here" kinda ways. It makes me feel like you're the last scum about to slip by.

That said, TSO said to vote for Anen, and so I'm going to do it.
If Elyse wins, I guess it's earned, because her play was not so egregious that I would turn my back on what I consider to be a more informed read by a more involved player.

VOTE: Anen

PS: The kill on TSO to provide a subsequent townflip there actually makes me doubt Elyse as town even more and, ultimately, is a tactic I would expect from scum-Elyse, but I digress.

Game's over. Hammer it.
I didn't get to do my Skywalker schtick the whole game through.

I need to work now; I'll be back a couple of hours later.
Please, wait for me!

Quick post.
Varsoon, your reasoning is wrong. Not only because TSO was misreading me; you should form your reads.

Also... how can I phrase it... are you aware of the nature of the remaining scum's PR? And... when I flip town, erm, do you think I f-cked this game up on Day1?

More will come later.

You're probably getting that feeling because this game has been on autopilot since the cop clears came out and it's gone on as long as possible lol.

I'll be busy all day. Hopefully when I come back this will be over. Come on MOHIS. Be the hero!

Hero?

Lynching someone without any discussion is very far from being a hero, it's mere dumbness. As I said, I'm open to questions.

Elyse, why are you so nervous? It's still 90% that you're going to win this game for scum. If it hadn't been at least partially me who'd lost this for town, I wouldn't even care much.
Or wait... actually there IS something I can find and prove that you're scum. That'swhy you're in a hurry.

(4) Here comes our pre-TWIE Elyse.

(4/1) She voted for Dapper (2024), gave some, but not much reasoning almost 70 posts later (2093).
(4/2) This looks important. She mostly agreed with TSO's readlist. (2361, 2386) Not only can we see townies in TSO's list read as scum, but also something else. It's well-known how aggressive TSO is and I can imagine easily scums trying to be appeasing to him.
(4/3) 2424 is a blatant misrepresentation of Random's post. It's strange that noone seems to have noticed it.

(4/4) Voted for Alchemist in 2637. Indeed, Alchemist looked very scummy, but most of that post was about different things. – Soooooooo, there were quite a lot of low-content players at that point. She named one as town-ish, another one scummy and both of the actual scums null. I wonder, why...
(4/5) By the way, all those speculations about Gwen's Night Action. I only know I love to be speculative when I'm scum.
(4/6) 2690. ...and the point of that highlighted part was...? (It was at Twilight, when Alchemist had been hammered.)

(4/7) in 2772. In 2835 she voted for IAI: – Okaaaaay, but
(4/8) She started "seeing Errant as scum" in 2859 (looking for an alternative wagon?)
(4/9) In 2950 she was back to this: – Well-well-well... (Even if she had a respond to me in the same post, it's still hella-confusing.) Especially with 3086, where she was "on the fence". (Waiting whether the Random-wagon achieves anything...?) And there's the vote for Random in 3271. Wow.
(4/10) After Random's claim she unvotes in 3335 with this: (Typically a thing I like to do as scum.)
(4/11) Voted for Eagle in 3345, – Lazy jump on the lynch-wagon.
(4/12) There was the readlist in 3543. I've already shown that. Mind where the known scums on that list!
(4/13) And here's the turning point. 3675 – right after TWIE's claim: . Although he voted for IAI there, she moved on to ZZZX in 3692... and back to IAI in 3704. Don't get fooled: because of Errant's counterclaim at that point IAI's lynch was pretty much inevitable.
(4/14) I don't want to link everything but everyone should check ZZZX's posts nearby! His interactions with Elyse is important. Eg. his 3701:

________

I'll go on from this point, with the post-TWIE-claim Elyse.

My Other Head is Scum, and its associated heads have been prodded

(2): Elyse, Varsoon
(1): Aneninen

(1): My Other Head Is Scum

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

I'll let MoHiS weigh in.

Also-also, I have formed my own reads, but been mostly wrong this game, which has led me to doubt my judgment and put more trust in people I know are confirmed town by the moderator.

The whole 'game is on auto-pilot' thing makes me suspect Elyse more than Anen, as Anen was the set-up-to-go lynch in that scenario. Then again, dude could just be unlucky.

@Anen: What are you talking about in regards to the remaining scum PR?

After your unvote it doesn't seem to be important anymore.
I thought you might have an alignment changing PR, especially after your last post about the Skywalker schtick. In that case it would have made some sense to lynch me and use it on Elyse next. But since she's most probably Roleblocker...

I'm going on.

MOHIS. Where are you?

Ah.
No, I'm town. Role-changing is actually bastard, so it's not likely to be in this game.

(5) Post-TWIE Elyse seems to be relatively short and easy.

(5/1) In 3793 she said . No additional reasoning and the list ends with ZZZX, just in case.
(5/2) In her 3799 he posted this about TSO, reflecting to Garmr: – That was a part of a short discussion between TSO and her. It's worth reading it. Actually they cast doubts about both TSO and TWIE. In 3801 Elyse answered this to Garmr: Garmr's answer was: – If we check Elyse's gameplay we can see that she's jumped on players for much smaller reasons. Also, told me that I'd been .
(5/3) There's something interesting. In 3807 I voted for ZZZX and PeregrineV followed me in the very next post. Firstly, at that point ZZZX must have been their planned mislynch. But, in 3811 I launched the PeregrineV-wagon (and I guess this was the amongst the very few good things I'd ever done in this game). After TSO followed us, the deal was pretty much sealed, I guess. (Also, if I were scum, why on Gods' Green Earth would I have left the ZZZX-wagon when there had been a good chance for pushing it to lynch to launch a new wagon on a scumbuddy? To earn town credit? In situation?)
(5/4) Her 3850. The later part must have been about PeregrineV, and it was a great excuse for not voting for him. The first part is pigeon poop. The post she was referring to was (5/1) but that had been posted AFTER the IAI flip and Errant's claim! However, having seen the VC she put her vote on PeregrineV immediately with this comment:
(5/5) Her 3873. – Firstly, at that point she was generally townread. Secondly, quite a few players (including me) had been pointed out before that scums had had to have something against the Cop/Doc combination. (I'd guessed Godfather anyway.) Why would anyone ignore this obvious possibility? (And she did that more than once!)

(5/6) Here, there's another change. She voted on Garmr (right after TSO) in 3913 and in 3919 she started attacking me. (Remember, I used to be a townread of her before!) THIS must have been the Night when Garmr and she talked their plan out. Bus Garmr out and go for the ZZZX+Aneninen mislynches, because Elyse still had been townread by most of the players. Also, Elyse must be the Mafia Roleblocker, which was a crucial PR for them while TWIE was alive.
(5/7) THIS!!! TSO said in 3920: – Having ISO-ed Elyse I realized that the OPPOSITE had happened many times! TSO posted something and Elyse said she agreed!
(5/8) In the same post, she said this: – Somehow it sounds very fake.
(5/9) Now, we're interacting! 3933. There was this part: – It's not about the topic itself. It's about the fact that she tried to "plant the seeds of doubts in me about TSO"! Even if she'd been townreading him for a long time... DAFUQ?
(5/10) 3973. Feel free to read the whole interaction with me, because right now I'm quotin only a small part: – And she asked me why I'd wanted to be the mislynch before (and she was worried about it). It's clear she hoped after the ZZZX lynch I'd be the obvious next one.

(5/11) After ZZZX's lynch, Today. She agreed in 4007 a NoLynch wouldn't hurt. But as she gets some backing from Varsoon, she votes for me immediately, in 4015.
(5/12) And she brings out TSO's reads in 4017. Everyone knows it's a WIFOM, but yet again, it arrived after Varsoon had brought up the topic in his 4014. She was over-cautios here when it's clear it's a you or me situation.

________

Post-edit.
Varsoon, it was written in the advertisment there might be alignment changing roles.