Team Mafia 2018: Game 3 - Random GIFs Game Over

[Archwing]

dunker, if you honestly think I'm scum right now, okay, but please refrain from voting for now so bulba doesn't quickhammer. Let bins get back and weigh in some more. please.

[Bins]

Ha ha. Implosion just told me to self-vote.

I have no idea! Scum has played very well.
If DV is scum, damn that claim was really lucky and well done, especially because we are low on PRs if he's lying!
If Archwing is scum, both UCV and you played very well. I had a gut townread on you all game.
If Bulba is scum, I also had a strong townread all game. Just all around I've seen good play here.
If Dunker is scum, AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH.

[Bins]

It's ~crazy~ and ~wild~ but I just want to vote Bulba because I can't figure out Arch and DV.

DV please make lots of town posts

[Bins]

Implosion is now telling me not to say what he's saying ahaaHAHAHA.

[Archwing]

Bins, I will join you on bulba today if you wanna go there. I'm positive he's the other scum. I promise.

[Bulbazak]

Bulba.

Pretend I am scum. Who is my partner?
Dunker, Bins, Bulba..

You're...kidding, right? I think I've been pretty clear that Dunker is the second scum.

Why would Deas track me out of the remaining players,

AND WHY WOULD I MAKE THE KILL?

. Honestly, that is a really big scumslip. I really don't give two shits about tracking the same target twice, that's whatever. What I am getting at, is that if I was scum, why would

I

make the night kill? I was the most suspect target yesterday aside from Radja. It really doesn't make sense.

I have my own thoughts on why he'd track you, and I think they're backed by my reread of d4, but I'd like to hear what he has to say first. As for why you'd make the kill? First, this is getting into the area of WIFOM, but second, I think I said why you might:

You seriously think me, the potential counter wagon to radja, everyone's secondary lynch target yesterday, would make the night kill?

After having already been tracked once? Yeah. The likelihood of being tracked again is smaller, and the chance your buddy gets tracked is higher.

Archwing's explanation has the whiff of bull crap to it. Man, the question of balance is bugging me, but I just can't see how it isn't Arch. All the evidence is literally pointing in that direction. It literally explains his play from d3 on, as well as UCV's play and Fitz vote.

then vote him

I've been going back and forth about it for awhile. I was wondering if I was just completely wrong and reading too much into things. It was a question of mechanics vs. actual reads, and whether my read there was any good, even though I was feeling really really strong and good about them. I could really see both of them as scum for completely different reasons based on two completely different ways to play the game, and I really didn't want to screw this up. I was waiting on certain responses for just those reasons.

Anyway, mastina has actually just responded to me, and I'll be sharing that in another post, but to summarize:

but deas essentially conf!towned themselves by being the only town PR claim yesterday.

So he was just lucky, or are you trying to infer that he knew he could get away with it?

if you don't want to believe i'm scum why are trying to convince yourself and others?
your mindset is not making sense to me

at that time, I was doing a smaller late-game reaction test, of sorts. I wanted to see if anyone would "take the bait" and follow me on a scum!dunker wagon. obviously that didn't go very far. I'm not trying to convince myself you're scum. I wanted to see if anyone else wanted to believe you were scum.

Okay, so I'm the only one thinking Dunker might be scum. I say to you "Hey, here's why. Can someone take a look at this?". You go "Sure.". Then after some more questionable Dunker plays you say that the more Dunker posts the more you doubt your townread. All of

that

was just supposed to be a reaction test? For what benefit? Everyone was pretty solid in their Dunker reads. I'm not sure how that would have accomplished much.

Like, out of LQ (game still active), Assembler/Mulch (scum), Sheep (scum), and creature (town)... how does UCV take scum here?

Well, we don't know the result of the first game, and Creature never takes scum unless he has to. Man, it sure would suck if your team drew 4 scum PMs. Wouldn't leave a lot of choice, would it?

Bulba has been setting up my mislynch since late yesterday and all of this day now. He's just slow-rolling it until another townie votes, and he'll quick hammer.

Riiight...Like I haven't been actively saying you're scum since d3 and expressing suspicion on the placement of the vote on the Fitz wagon since d2. Yep. Just been slow rolling and being very loud about the read. Every. Single. Day.
But hey...

Spoiler: Speaking of Setting Up Mislynches

Day 3:

New lynch/check order if I die (assuming Elena townflip):
Elena > Bins > T-Bone > Titus > Bulbazak > Radja/chesskid

Do not let Bulbazak live to LyLo.

There's a very specific reason for this that I can't talk about. I once again encourage people to think about why I claimed there was an exactly 50% chance Bulb was scum, about a week or so ago. Rethinking, it would've been more accurate to say 33%.

Lynch Keychain in the end if RC hardpushes town repeatedly. Same goes to chesskid. Both of their teams are capable of solving this game by the end.

If Elena scumflip, gut says:
Titus > T-Bone > xyzzy > chesskid > Radja > Bulbazak > Keychain > CDB

Obviously you'll only have 5 lynches, but when the massclaim hits you'll be able to remove names from both lists.

Never lynch under any circumstances: Dunkerdoodles, Archwing.

GL is back, thoughts from him incoming.

Seeing dino flip town fruit vendor gives this post more validity to me.

@Archwing: why do you have such a strong seeming townread on Bulba? We can't find an origin, especially after quoting the Math post that says he shouldn't live to LyLo.

I mean, if I've listed Bulb as hard conf town, then I've misrepped how I feel, and i'm sorry about that.

I'm not interested at all in lynching bulb today, and I do know that Math said he should not live to LyLo for... reasons? I dunno. But i super hard trust math's reads, I know he's a great player.

My team is pretty much all town reading bulb right now, so I guess I'm just not really interested in sorting that slot at this time?

Do I want bulba to continue with us tomorrow? yep. Should bulba die before lylo? probably, if we follow what math said.

"Bulba is super duper town guys! He's in my town bloc and everything! Oh, but we should probably kill him by the end, because conf. town Math says so."

Day 4:

ugh, I was just thinking about bulba's slot and I just remembered how Mathdino said not to carry him to lylo. fuck.
tbh right now I can't conftown anyone, but I think i'd wanna lynch within
{radja, keychain, dunker, deas}. gun to my head, the scumteam is in there.

Also, was that

really

supposed to be a reaction test?

Hmm...I really wonder why I'm alive at this point?

It's ~crazy~ and ~wild~ but I just want to vote Bulba because I can't figure out Arch and DV.

Please don't throw the game, Bins.

P-edit:

[Bulbazak]

I mean, to reiterate my p-edit: There's no way anyone can really think that is town.

[Bulbazak]

Mastina gave a quick reply of the following:

She said that if we compared this game to Ether's (Doc, Backup Doc, Neopolitain), Tracker is weaker than Neo, making a setup of Tracker, Doc, FV significantly weaker than that game. She said backup tracker would be the same as backup doc there, and looking at it that way, it kinda makes sense.

She then told me that even if I was to ignore that, play trumps role, and that I should stop doubting myself and just vote Arch.
She's going to give a more in-depth response when she gets home.

Vote Archwing

I'd still like an answer from DV, though.

[Archwing]

Inb4 I get called flailing scum.

[Archwing]

Well at least both the scum are voting me right now.

If You were town bulba you wouldn't have voted me, saying you're waiting from more from mastina. We're in lylo, and mislymching me is a loss. If mastina has more to say, town!you should not have just voted there.

[Archwing]

Bins and dunker, now is the time to conf yourselves.

[Bins]

Hello I am not hammering

[Archwing]

Creature:

Deas, or slot, never crumbled backup tracker. That should have happened. He also says that 15p is balanced with tracker doc and vendor. More town, less PR. Vendor acts as a named town / tracker result.

[Archwing]

He also says that backup, tracker, and doc with 1 scum left is kinda iffy scenario, and is essentially the same as ethers game

[Bins]

@Arch
- Please respond to Dunker's 4047 and why those aren't good reasons for you to make the kill.

Love, Implosion



Also, Bulba... why rush? Implo is HEAVY SUS.

[Bulbazak]

If You were town bulba you wouldn't have voted me, saying you're waiting from more from mastina. We're in lylo, and mislymching me is a loss. If mastina has more to say, town!you should not have just voted there.

All mastina said was that she would write a better response when she got home. I imagine I just got the cliff notes version, and she'll go into more detail later. And she outright told me to vote the scummier of the two, which was you.

Also, Bulba... why rush? Implo is HEAVY SUS.

Because I'm that confident that Arch is scum? My hangups on DV were mechanical and not based on play, and mastina essentially told me not to worry about that, that the setup does make sense, and to focus on outright scum hunting over mechanics spec. And after Arch going "Well, I have DV who should be 100% scum in my eyes, but I'll lynch this other person if you do Bins.", there should have been no doubt he was scum.

Tell Implosion that I'm not impatient as scum. If he doubts that, have him read Hunger Games II. I literally told my team not to quickhammer in Lylo in case there was some sort of governor, and to wait for town to hammer themselves.

[Dunkerdoodles]

Hello I am not hammering

[Dunkerdoodles]

i would hammer here, but i want to make sure

[Dunkerdoodles]

assuming both the pr claims are true we are guaranteed the win if we lynch just scum out of (me, bulba, arch)

an argument for arch!scum is mulch could just of been coaching him and ucv all game which i could easily see him doing.

[DeasVail]

Hey! I am here but at work so I might disappear suddenly. Catching up on the last couple of pages now.

[DeasVail]

I’m claiming now. This is to get assistance from the other town members in regards to balance in this 1v1.

I’m a Doctor. I never protected anyone correctly (SORRY). I crumbed this in on Day 1 638 - the first letter of each sentence spells out “Artz” which is doctor in German. I also heavily crumbed my protects after almost EVERY flip in the game and crumbed Doc a little more later on especially during the claim (hopefully if you reread this is obvious).

My protects were: Bulba (hence why I was like WHY DID BULBA NOT DIE), Chesskid (Which I INITIALLY HAD AS T-BONE AND SWITCHED LAST MINUTE, WHICH is why I was like “IM SO SORRY TBONE” and the reason I protected Chess was I thought if his reads were right he would die), next I protected Keychain (which is why I said “Why hasn’t Keychain died yet?”), finally last night I protected DV (very obviously why, even if I wasn’t sure of the claim).

THIS IS ALSO WHY I WANTED A MASSCLAIM THE DAY BEFORE LYLO. So I could get a good protect target (claims are useless to me in LYLO).

Anyways, I’m interested in this balance. Because Implosion still thinks Doc-Tracker+Backup-Fruit Vendor (essentially a neutral role) is balanced. Which is why I still believed DV’s claim. But now I have no idea.

Also, yell at me for the Radja lynch after.

I am so sorry that I ever doubted you!!!!!

[DeasVail]

@DV: Why did you track Arch again?

Because I super stubborn!

But really it was just me going back and forth on all the targets.

I wasn't going to track Dunker or Keychain because I thought they were town

I could have tracked Bins but deep deep down I knew she wasn't scum... okay maybe I actually did suspect Bins, but I thought that after Radja flipping town, scum would have been pretty paranoid about Bins getting tracked, given how hard she pushed the Radja lynch.

And really I don't think I was going to be able to let go of tracking within my pet scumteam prediction of you/Arch

So you or Arch? Well I thought that an argument could be made for or against either. Arch was the stronger suspect of mine, but he knew that, and I knew that he knew that, and he knew that I knew that he knew that... and okay endless spiral. So really it was a game of guessing which way they were going to guess that I'd go.

And at this point I thought it would be pretty stupid to put so much thought into it given that I gave it about a 60% (totally fabricated number) chance of me dying and so I just went with Archwing because "they wouldn't think I'd track him twice in a row!" even though I totally would but they weren't to know that.

Welcome to the inner sanctum of me!

[DeasVail]

Bulba.

Pretend I am scum. Who is my partner?
Dunker, Bins, Bulba..

Why would Deas track me out of the remaining players,

AND WHY WOULD I MAKE THE KILL?

. Honestly, that is a really big scumslip. I really don't give two shits about tracking the same target twice, that's whatever. What I am getting at, is that if I was scum, why would

I

make the night kill? I was the most suspect target yesterday aside from Radja. It really doesn't make sense.

"Why would Deas track me out of the remaining players"

If you think it doesn't make sense for me to track you, then doesn't that answer for us why you made the kill?

[Bulbazak]

I definitely noticed how strongly and consistently you were on Arch-scum when rereading d4. So it kinda made sense in that regard, but I still wanted to hear it.

[Bulbazak]

So got the detailed reply from mastina. And I'm really not sure how to paraphrase all that... tldr is that it is essentially the same as what I gave earlier, only she goes into more detail about why. I'll get to it tomorrow if we're still going. I should be more with it and awake by that point.