Role Call I (Game Over)

[apthet]

Yes, popsofctown. I am your roommate. I didn't want to tell you before you were ready to hear it.

[popsofctown]

I am pretty disappointed that the SSS hydra has replaced out. Hydras are sort of inherently unfair but at least they replace out at a drastically lower rate because a single head can play the slot. But not in this case? Can you either get an unfair advantage over me in your games or damage the integrity of the games I play but not both, pretty please.
I don't have the answer to these ethical questions about the replace out but actual strategic replace-outs are definitely/obviously gross and bad human. I think I've only replaced out of 1 game because I needed to focus on my grades and had to drop down to 0 ongoing games of mafia. The idea that some people start to develop a replacement meta is.. blegh.

[popsofctown]

oh then we should get the neighbor roles so that cfj doesn't have to bother making a Private Topic I guess.

[popsofctown]

Saudade slots is scummy but after a post like 426 I'm willing to like, BoP a slot in lieu of lynching it.
Vecnis (sp?) slot is getting better.

I feel like apthet has managed to post an awful lot without really towntelling, Saudade slot scumread seems like the kind of scumread that's not that hard to redraw with one hand holding a red role card so I find it less town indicative than even little stuff other players are doing.

A50 slot still seems town I'm kinda ok with A50 deep wolfing me.

Cheeky hasn't posted in a day or 2 I don't know if it's literally proddable.

Iconeum seems to be going along to get along, simply voting for on the first proposal pings me. Such a low radar cross section, I'd even be happier with someone who voted For and obnoxiously criticized one of the assignments in spite of themselves.

[momo]

I actually really like pops reasoning for voting against?

What would you change?

[momo]

A50 slot still seems town I'm kinda ok with A50 deep wolfing me.

This is my thought process exactly...there's a chance a50 is scum (a few good reasons actually) but i just don't feel it rn

[popsofctown]

360 summarizes what I'd change, the main difference I've thought about since then is I would swap Iconeum and Hidden Happiness since I think Iconeum wouldn't have a problem viewing Timid as a French Vanilla Townie and Hidden Happiness is having trouble viewing it that way (in such a fashion that one can respectably agree to disagree about).

[Vecna]

Then maybe you should lobby for something else other than neighbor. I think the likelihood of Nero’s alignment will become more apparent and clear as he posts.

what would you give me?

Nero for inventor tbh

[Vecna]

Theme games aint competitive but a chill lounge so giving me the mute role is out of the question for me

Wut? pretty sure large games are by far the most competative on this forum. if not, ive been playing the wrong stuff.

[Vecna]

This right here is my biggest problem with you so far. You say that me giving Vecna a TR from my gut is a very towny thing to do, but in the same post you did the same thing. This seems like you're trying to draw a parallel and portray yourself as town. This is a red flag imo.

Let me explain more what I meant here. I think that someone who is going through the effort to convincingly construct a fake readslist with extensive evidence pulling from logic and meta and whatnot would naturally fall into the mindset of "my strongest reads should be the most justified by evidence." I think that going against that instinct requires scum to actively choose to make that decision. Possible but in my opinion seems unlikely. Having a gutread is not a town thing in itself. (I mean, theoretically they should be the easiest and most convenient for scum to fake.)

I think that contextually, the fact that your gutread also happened to be the strongest one makes me believe that your readslist is real: it seems to me like it doesn't necessarily follow the logic of the written word, if that makes sense. You made me believe that those reads were coming from your heart.

My thoughts on Vecna at the time of responding to your list really boiled down to one post that stuck out to me. Now, interestingly enough, he does happen to be a stronger townread for me too, but that's because of more recent posts.

Pretty sure aphet is town

[Vecna]

Scumteam:
Hidden Happiness (Shadoweh/MariaR hydra)
Titus (previously RC hydra)
Gamma Emerald?

Hard to read still;
Iconeum
Nero Cain
LUV (close to.prob town due to sincerity)
Cheekyteeky
A50 (close to town now, but has skills, I think)

prob town:
popsofctown
Oversoul
apthet
momo
Vecna
Saudade

Roughly how I feel now. Guess im alone on saudade but I feel most reasons for scumreads there....arent very good? maybe im wrong.

[Oversoul]

I'd not give Gladiator to momo, I think King goes to momo. Gladiator I would have given to Saudude

Why would you give Saudude the gladiator role? Please walk me through this line of reasoning when you get a chance.

I agree with Pop's 360 in regards to miller. At that point, I think momo was just spitballing, but miller going to someone we collectively have a strong townread on is probably better for

our

my

collective sanity. I also just think it is a waste to use it on someone that we do think is a strong town read. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't", I suppose.

I'd rather the neighborhood go to a townread player or at least someone who I think would use it. There's scenarios where you want to communicate night action results only in the neighborhood so an all town neighborhood can be good and NC is pretty null to me so far.

I'm actually not a hard read it's just that most players lack familiarity with me or are just downright horrible.

What would be the best way to learn to read you?

Ew, preflip associatives. Why do people do those? Especially day 1?

No one seems to see Vecna the same way as me huh. I wonder if I would read him differently with a different avatar. I hate that tv show.

I think a lot of people read scummy intentions in my posts due to my avatar. Untill they get to know my playstyle, abd realize I often throw out half assed or weird reasoning just to see how people react. Most of the times theres sone thoight to it though, bit im just being to lazy to make the argument in a proper manner.

Thor665 had a similar theory about avatars. It is why he never changed his. You probably do not know this, but I had a very cute super imposed toast picture when I first joined the site. It was the toast from the "shit we are toast" joke image of a piece of bread in a toaster. So cute. Absolutely adorable. People never trusted me. I was constantly getting pressure left and right and getting left in LyLo situations fairly frequently. I was almost never nightkilled.


Then I got an Ether(tm) avatar of Whimiscott. Absolutely cute. So adorable. People

still

actively suspected me all the time. I still never got nightkilled. On the other hand, you have people with creepy avatars like Internet Stranger who are lauded both for their town and scum play. :shrug: I think avatars

may

have some influence on general predisposition, but I think playstyle has a larger influence.

The way you describe your own playstyle reminds me of myself. I ask seemingly nonsensical questions, but for whatever reason, it helps me better understand other players. A lot of people think it's useless though.

Titus is pretty easy for people to read on top of that so I'd rather lynch someone more null like Vecna, Gamma or Iconeum.

Is that true? I remember Titus having a good scum game and generally being hard to read. Why do you think Vecna is null though?

I think miller and vanilla should be given to universal town reads. They can essentially function as named townies and that’s pretty strong.

That's all cool and dandy, but I would like to see you give your reads so I can have an idea of your provision linking theory to practice.

In due time. Wanna let the dust settle first.

What dust is there to settle?

VOTE: for

You were right that saying you were inactive this game is a thing. The distribution of the roles is fine for me, I have no reason to not accept that proposal.

Is Iconeum an alt?

I don't agree with the Oversoul read but I don't necessarily have any reasons to think he's town. I have no experience with him but my intuition tells me he is kind of a person who has a naturally scummy tone.

Who are you and how do you know so much about me

VOTE: for yeah i dont mind being powerless

This man is the most selfless per-

My tongue is my strongest weapon

Oh dear god

I played One Night Ultimate Werewolf with my roommate and some friends last night and tried to explain that the rulebook says the troublemaker "may" exchange two other player's alignments, so I refused to use the ability since it's anti-town, but I was actually town troublemaker. My roommate said that was very logical but what about something from my heart. I said the odds I was not a werewolf were currently 25% with current gamestate information. I was told once again that that was not from the heart. Then I was mislynched and lost.

It's gonna be ok. Just speak from the heart bud.

Momo, I think you may be overstating the importance/power of the inventor. I think the motion detector has the potential to be the most powerful role on Night 1.

I'm actually really annoyed that Iconeum went V/LA too.
VOTE: Iconeum

[popsofctown]

HEAL: whimsicott

[popsofctown]

HURT: Gamma Emerald

[popsofctown]

VOTE: callforjudgment

[Oversoul]

Vecna, do you have experience playing with Gamma Emerald?

[Hidden Happiness]

jay knee par purley frenchais tree bone, don't make me french. I like that switch though.

The only time I encountered Titus scum she was lynched immediately for being obvi, but I guess that was years ago? idk I don't think she's hard to read. Vecna is the person of those three I'd least lynch but I don't get anything from his simpleposting.

[Hidden Happiness]

My attempts to post are being hugely frustrated by mass power outages r/n and I'm getting annoyed of autologging out of this hydra -.-

[Vecna]

I manage to make a lot more thoughtful posts from my mobile on african internet without complaining, so kindly refrain from trying to label my posting as "simpleposting".

[Oversoul]

Vecna with the straight fire, ouch

[Almost50]

I kinda want neighbor but I'll defer

You can only have the Neighbor if you have someone specific you think you can read with good precision. Who do you think you

can

read well?

[popsofctown]

I don't like the way popsofctown shuts down the preflip associatives in 194. I think it fits with the archetype of scum that is focused on seeming to be rational, picking holes in arguments and lines of questioning here and there to look helpful. I also think that momo's theory is the focal point of the game at this point and his only response is to shut it down.

Links to townpops bitching at people that preflip associatives are not good mafia:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 2#p7739942

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... +#p7668605

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p10920972

Links to scumpops bitching at people that preflip associatives are not good mafia:

<I don't have any but it wouldn't stop being true so I promise it's just I haven't rolled scum enough times>

Links to townpops playing from the heart:

[Vecna]

Vecna, do you have experience playing with Gamma Emerald?

Also, I do, but its been really hit or miss for me to read his alignment. I used to be able to catch him fairly easily as scum, but he changed up his game and it has become a lot harder for me to tell his alignment.

And when Titus replaces into a scum-slot it usually becomes apparent really quickly. Regardless, I agreed with most of Momo's posts on RC. Its been so long since I saw an RC towngame that I probably dont even remember what that looks like though.

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Vote: Against willing to let the perfect be the enemy of the good here

Why

[Almost50]

From your current PoV "Can never be King" isn't a big deal but you can't predict if that's the same situation a few days down the road.

What makes you think we will have the same list of roles on subsequent days? King is on the D1 list. I'm almost sure it won't appear on D2. I dunno what

will

but -to my understanding- we get a

different

list of roles at the start of each game day.

The shortest way to explain why I think this is:

Here are the roles you get to allocate for Day 1!

This strongly hints we will have a different list on subsequent days, don't you think?